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| One of Us |
Governments do what governments do. But rarely in secret or unknown ahead of time if you are listening. Blame the government all you want, but Ibi with the help of Baldry directing the money directly to Ibi spent/stole/lost/pissed away the deposit and cannot repay it. They used that money to pay others deposits back to them. Shell game is what this is. The government did not take CME's money, Ibi did. So how is the government at fault???? By canceling a concession? Happens yearly. Part of the risk of being a safari operator. However, the chance of the government canceling a concession is not a risk the CME assumed. His deal was with Baldry and Ibi, not the government. Someone suggested calling the Zambian consulate. Really??? It is not a government matter. I get it that Baldry is a PH just trying to make a living in a tough place. However you view him, he advertised and booked this hunt. He directed the money to Ibi, who should have held it as part of the payment for the hunt - without spending it and holding it until he and Baldry delivered the hunt. Didn't happen. Of course you cannot sue him. Of course US law does not apply. Hello, this is of course true and a risk everyone takes that hunts in Africa or Europe or Canada or wherever they are not a resident. The government created the situation, but the problem was created by people that cannot be trusted with deposits for promised services rendered. Who is going to buy a hunt from the mysterious Ibi? Hence, Baldry, a known PH, a known operator uses his reputation to sell hunts on Ibi's concession. CME trusted Baldry. CME acted in great faith by sending that money to a guy he has never met, all on Baldry's word. Honestly, I have zero dog in this fight. I know none of the parties. Heck, I don't know you Saeed other than by the internet. So, do I care? A bit. I hate seeing a guy get hosed and miss out on a trip that he could have taken elsewhere had this been handled professionally and honestly. As to hunting in Zambia - other than the DuPloy's or Thor - I would struggle look at anything offered there AND I would demand the deposit be held in escrow by a trusted USA based agent who would stand up for the entire process being legit. If you want to act as an agent, then you get the risk associated there. I have booked many hunts with agents and had three go bad. The agent stood up for it. Baldry claims he is no agent. That is obvious at this point. However, if you want commissions, this goes with it. | |||
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I bet the UAE has similar agency laws. Technically, I bet we can establish jurisdiction in a Federal Court. Again, I bow to practicality. I will never do business w anyone who wants more then half down, and is not present (agent) in the United Sates. I feel sorry for CNE. He was taken advantage of very egregiously. Major lessons learned: Do not agree to a majority of funds spent until service rendered; Escrow; Do not do business through agents not located in the United States; And Stay away from Zambia. This is not the first time this has happened in Zambia. This: Who is going to buy a hunt from the mysterious Ibi? Hence, Baldry, a known PH, a known operator uses his reputation to sell hunts on Ibi's concession. CME trusted Baldry. CME acted in great faith by sending that money to a guy he has never met, all on Baldry's word. | |||
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Exactly . . . and worse, when the proverbial shit hits the fan Baldry tells Corey his fight is with Ibi. Just does not have the ring of honorable behavior. Mike | |||
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What is wrong with you guys? "Federal court"? We are NOT talking about some convoluted stupid American laws here. This happened in AFRICA! You and your courts and laws mean NOTHING! "...Major lessons learned: Do not agree to a majority of funds spent until service rendered; Escrow; Do not do business through agents not located in the United States; And Stay away from Zambia. This is not the first time this has happened in Zambia..." Totally pointless advice! By the way, are you a lawyer?? | |||
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Steve, In my previous posts I do not recall having portrayed Andrew as being totally exonerated from culpability in this fiasco though I do recall saying he was morally bound to pressurize Ibi for his (Andrew's) clients to be refunded and that an unspecified number apparently received full payments. CME regrettably received the short end of the stick as he was probably the last in the line who booked/paid Ibi for the scheduled hunt and Ibi had by now run out funds (supposedly). Do you honestly believe that Andrew is sitting comfy sipping gin and bitters in the setting sun, all the while being slandered? | |||
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Do you honestly believe that if Andrew was actively pursuing every available option for getting Corey repaid that Corey would have felt compelled to make a post calling Andrew out for a lack of effort when Andrew was hypocritically piling on another outfitter over a screwed client? Mike | |||
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If you took the time to identify the "mysterious" Ibi you will discover that he is not that mysterious and Baldry has very likely done business with Ibi in the past without hitches which in itself is reason enough for any man to be trustful of the other. Sending FULL payment for a hunt up front is a folly in anyone's sane mind. I still fail to understand why the Zambian Embassy in Washington DC or US Embassy in Lusaka have not been approached on this subject as both are there to handle the interests of its citizens AS WELL. | |||
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A Federal Court works wonders in America but not in Africa. I know of one case where a TZ outfitter was approached by the Feds at an SCI Convention and given a choice of two options. No need to tell you which one he chose. | |||
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Thank goodness for that! Lawyers are robbing Americans right, left, and center! American society is in the state it is in all because of the stupid suing culture! America needs to get rid of 99% of the human parasites! Life would be much better for everyone then!  | |||
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Andrew was hypocritically piling on another outfitter over a screwed client?[/QUOTE] And here is your main reason for just being and ass clown on this thread or any that has andrew in it. One of your hero's was talked bad about and being the fan boy you are you go after others. I hate cme is out all his money but pretty sure andrew is not living his dream life over this either. | |||
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. . . the thread Andrew dumped on another outfitter and Corey responded to his hypocrisy had to do with a hunt booked by Sam Farrow and Baldry's suggestion that the agent committed fraud and should be reported to federal authorities. Maybe the folks involved here ought to be reported to the feds?  Mike | |||
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Weird threat after about three pages Must be some masochistic trend here | |||
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Why don’t you report them to the Feds! | |||
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Absolutely. A total 100% fraud. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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And here is your main reason for just being and ass clown on this thread or any that has andrew in it. One of your hero's was talked bad about and being the fan boy you are you go after others. I hate cme is out all his money but pretty sure andrew is not living his dream life over this either.[/QUOTE] ----------------------------------------------------------------- Wait, Wait, WAIT one gall-darn minute here. Some of you guys have a completely revisionist memory as to how this thread came about. Andrew has a Loooooonnnnnngggggg history on AR of calling out other outfitters in an attempt to make himself look good at the other guy's expense. In fact, around the time this blew up in Andrew's face, Arjun posted an Aussie buff / bantang hunt. Andrew immediately jumped on Arjun and chastised him for "overcharging clients for hunting domesticated animals that were allowed to run feral". As soon as this thread got going, Andrew deleted his comments, knowing it was exactly what got him into hot water in the first place ... shitting on a fellow outfitter. I wish I had saved that post but it's gone. I know others saw it as well so let's see if Andrew now denies the post. THIS thread came about due to the Farrow thread whereby the outfitter was being called out for fuckery. When Andrew threw in his 2 cents, CME called him out for his own fuckery. Andrew's response was to start the "Calling out Mike Jines" thread. This thread was directly in response to that, using the same "Callling out ..." phraseology. Now some of you Baldry fangirls are offended and sticking up for ya boy? Fucking laughable.  | |||
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----------------------------------------------------------------- Wait, Wait, WAIT one gall-darn minute here. Some of you guys have a completely revisionist memory as to how this thread came about. Andrew has a Loooooonnnnnngggggg history on AR of calling out other outfitters in an attempt to make himself look good at the other guy's expense. In fact, around the time this blew up in Andrew's face, Arjun posted an Aussie buff / bantang hunt. Andrew immediately jumped on Arjun and chastised him for "overcharging clients for hunting domesticated animals that were allowed to run feral". As soon as this thread got going, Andrew deleted his comments, knowing it was exactly what got him into hot water in the first place ... shitting on a fellow outfitter. I wish I had saved that post but it's gone. I know others saw it as well so let's see if Andrew now denies the post. THIS thread came about due to the Farrow thread whereby the outfitter was being called out for fuckery. When Andrew threw in his 2 cents, CME called him out for his own fuckery. Andrew's response was to start the "Calling out Mike Jines" thread. This thread was directly in response to that, using the same "Callling out ..." phraseology. Now some of you Baldry fangirls are offended and sticking up for ya boy? Fucking laughable. [/QUOTE]Not a fan of anyone in this world really. I am not a follower like many on here. You guys all know why some are doing it and it is all over him saying stuff about one Ph a bunch of guys hunt with over deposit for animals. This site has plenty of name calling and guys saying stuff people dont like. Call out who ever you like I could care less. I am not a fan of a few going after one guy who had no way of stopping what happened. The guy who is owed the money does not have a much to say as some of you who really have nothing to do with the issue other they being the ass clowns a lot of you are. | |||
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Silence tells us that Ibi has not sent any money nor has Andrew... | |||
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Andrew did NOT take the money! I honestly have no idea why you continue having a go at a man who had done nothing wrong! In fact, he probably lost as much or more than the client, for a stupid fiasco started by the government! | |||
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Having read this story from page 1. I have a hard time believing that Fairgame would direct a client to an Outfitter that books him for an $ 80,000 hunt and not get a drink out of that cup...... I guess its possible...... Hang on TITE !! | |||
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Thanks for keeping this thread alive dogcat. | |||
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The Easter Bunny has popped out of its burrow. | |||
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I don't intend to let it go. This is similar to the thread on Blair Hunting International. Saeed and I have a disagreement due to our perspective. I fully understand that you believe the government is to blame. I see it that Baldry and Ibi are to blame and they are accountable. The government did not take the money - Ibi did at Andrew's direct instruction. In my world, Andrew and Ibi are the problem here. They spent money that was a deposit... now can't pay it back. | |||
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Can you show me how Andrew spent any money received from Ibi? He would have been paid IF THE HUNT WENT AHEAD! The hunt got cancelled! I am sure Andrew is also out of pocket from this fiasco. Ibi has proven he is crook, no doubt about that. | |||
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You don’t think Andrew got paid anything up front on a $80,000 hunt? No booking fee, no “finders”fee, nothing?? Possible but I don’t believe in the Easter bunny…..  Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… | |||
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| One of Us |
The odds of Corey seeing meaningful money out of Andrew and Ibi is about as likely at this point as the Easter Bunny delivering cash to Corey in his Easter basket. I get a kick out of how the person who marketed and sold the hunt, set the hunt up with Idi, set Corey up with Ibi, then when the hunt goes tits up, tells Corey his recourse is with Ibi and good luck, is somehow blameless in this whole fiasco. Defies logic. Mike | |||
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Ibi,by Andrew's admission, said that the other hunters got their deposits back. Obviously, Ibi spent it or he would have refunded it. | |||
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M Jines, as a lawyer and a respected member of this forum making useful contributions on subjects like the big tuskers fiasco, I am surprised that you continue your attacks on Fairgame without any evidence other than conjecture that he benefited in any way financially from Corey's debacle. I must thank you though, because as a result of your malicious posts I decided that as soon as my wife passed away and I was free to travel I would contact Andrew and book a hunt with him. This has now come to pass and I have booked a hunt in the Bangwuela swamp for early September. I will pay in advance of course as this is just one of the many risks we take to hunt in unstable countries. I am not a Texas millionaire, just a retired farmer but somone has to stand up for the little guy when he is down. I will of course report in full on my hunt, the good and the bad and I will also try and find out as much as I can about Ibi and report on this too. | |||
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Good luck to you. Hope it all works out. Caveat emptor. Some of us take the view that when someone markets and sells a hunt, picks the concession area and the operator, hooks the client with the operator to make the payments, that person has an obligation to leave no stone unturned in getting the client's money back in whole and as quickly as possible. Recall that the entire situation with Corey only came to light when Corey grew frustrated with Andrew's lack of action after months to get the money back and Andrew jumping on another outfitter over a hunt gone bad. The combination of the hypocrisy and the lack of effort to get Corey his money pushed Corey over the top. And it also bears remembering that we are not talking about an $8000 deposit, we are talking about $80,000. I am reasonably confident that virtually anyone that found themselves in the same situation as Corey . . . the outfitter that sold you a hunt, planned to be the PH on the hunt, selected the area and the operator, hooked you up with the operator, either explicitly or implicitly led you to believe that giving the operator $80,000 would be okay, then wishes you good luck in getting the money back . . . would be just as pissed off and angry at both Ibi and Andrew since but for Andrew, Cory would have never dealt with Ibi . . . and appreciative of efforts to keep the heat turned up to try to ensure that the money is refunded. Mike | |||
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Great to see someone who could see through the hate of some. I would book a trip with andrew and have no worries at all. I just dont have the funds to zamibia as of now. I hope to see some great pictures and read all about your trip It still is amazing how some ass clowns on here just cant get over themselves and how perfect they are. | |||
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That answer did not address Saeed's question, which was specifically.......... "Can you show me how Andrew spent any money received from Ibi?" ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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So sorry about your wife's passing. My thoughts and prayers are with you. ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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Same for me. Peace and prayers, sir. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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Can you or Saeed show where he did not? ____________________________________________ "Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett. | |||
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Respected? All I ever see from that person is a drivel | |||
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No I cannot. But I am working on the following assumptions. He recommended a hunt to the client at Ibi's place. He was going to be the professional hunter conducting the hunt. Client agrees with Ibi on terms and money was paid. Andrew only gets paid WHEN THE HUNT IS DONE! The money has been sent directly to Ibi. Ibi IS responssible for paying it back. Not Andrew. | |||
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| One of Us |
To the best of my knowledge, booking fees (agent commissions), finder's fees are all payable once the hunt has been concluded. We have multiple booking agents on this site who could confirm exactly how these moneys get disbursed. | |||
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Can they confirm how Ibi distributed funds? ____________________________________________ "Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett. | |||
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I would love to see this thread die a deserved death. I think Andrew is equally a victim from what I've heard. I don't like folks making scapegoats. | |||
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| One Of Us |
I have been watching this one since the beginning... it seems to me if I were FAIRGAME and wished to save my reputation, I would have already offered up the most fantastic, all inclusive, full bag hunt for Corey and a proper companion in place of his father... NO CHARGE, in his BEST available concessions, and then work out the final funding with IBI....??!! If that isn't on the table, I would have already contacted the US Embassy, and the Zambia Ambassador to US and started the process to locate any available assets and starting the foreclosure auction process to generate funds....no MR Nice Guy in just putting liens on assets...ie vehicles and homes, ranches... In my international corporate career, we had no problems in collecting from errant customers...who lost significant cash discounts and long-term contract rebates when payments were delayed at all... to start with.... HUMMMM?? WE NEVER TALKED WITH LAWYERS EITHER!! 470EDDY | |||
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. . . spoken like someone not out $80K. Mike | |||
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