quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Winchester ain't likely to chamber anything in the new M70 that says Ruger on the casehead.
Rich

really? you seriously believe this? after winnie chambering the RUMs at the same time they introduced the WSMs? Or chambering the 416 rem, when they had their OWN 416 waiting in the wings?

Common Rich, you have just agreeded that the ruger is at least as good as the HH ... give it a rest

Winchester (olin) posts loads they have tested and the ruger makes book, bud. stop with the pisie dust, you are wrong

same pressure as the 300wsm/rum .. and 4% higher than the 375hh .. so what? aint likely that someone will take a questionable steel classic preWWI action and chamber in the ruger, without heat treating... 110 in houston is just as hot as 110 in africa

quote:

Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
I would be very suprised to see Wby chamber the Ruger and for two reasons. They won't do it in the Vanguard because they don't do the H&H in it.

Mike, Howa already does
http://www.legacysports.com/pr...a/howa_375ruger.html

while it doesn't have the weatherby rollmark on it, the rifle already is selling, chambered, in 375 ruger

NEWSFLASH - you just might actually take into account what you are throwing out with the bathwater

ruger doesn't make the ammo -- they partnered with hornady ...

let's see, what has hornday done that rocks?
17hmr
204 ruger
7x64 brenneke
308 marlin
450 marlin
375, 416, 423, 458, 475, 510 soft and solid AFFORDABLE bullets
376 steyr
375 ruger
450/400 brass and ammo
404 brass and ammo
454/45LC brass!!
458 lott brass and ammo
magnum basic brass
470 ne brass and ammo
480 ruger
500 ne brass and ammo
affordable dies for most of the above
Custom dies, including 550gibbs

Well, my Hillbilly buddy shot my .375 Ruger yesterday in the hills, and is now planning on rebarreling his Argentine Mauser to the Ruger cartridge. He liked the short action and overall rifle length for the thick woods we hunt in. Guess Hornady will be selling one more guy some brass!

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
I would be very suprised to see Wby chamber the Ruger and for two reasons. They won't do it in the Vanguard because they don't do the H&H in it.

Mike, Howa already does
http://www.legacysports.com/pr...a/howa_375ruger.html

while it doesn't have the weatherby rollmark on it, the rifle already is selling, chambered, in 375 ruger

Jeffe,

I had seen previously that Howa did it but I still don't think it will appear in the Vanguard. Of course I dom't know what that would mean in America but in Australia the Vanguard completely owns the Howa market.

If Wby did the 375 Ruger in the Vanguard they would lose sales of the H&H in the Synthetic Mark V. 257 and 300 Wby is a little different and for those they limit the Vanguard to 24", which is obvioulsy to protect the Mark V market.

Although personally I think the 375 Ruger can do fine even it was only in the Ruger rifle.

I for one hope the 375 Ruger does very well and at the expense of the 338 rather than the H&H, that is, lots of extra 375 bore rifles being sold means more bullets.

Mike,
we sort of agree .. i don't think the ruger will displace HH sales .. those are probably different BUYERS .. The market is the same, as .375 bullets are considered big stuff to most that have never fired one . Walmart sells the howa/weatherby in 300 win in walmart here ... I could see the 375 going right to that market.. i don't see the comparison with the 338 .. that's always been kinda niche ..

what it WILL displace is the 375 RUM, and anyone that would have bought a 375 weatherby over an HH ..

Savage is already ALL over the 204 ruger ... want to bet that their "AFrican" shows up again, with the 375 and 416 rugers in them, rather than 425 African express? its just a barrel bore difference for them!

Howa is a big seller, for not being one of the big players, here..

But, guys .. if you will remember, remington now owns DPMS, HR, and Marlin, and is in effect already chambering guns in 204 ruger, 308 marlin, and 450 marlin ... its not a big step for them to go ahead and chamber for the 375 or 416, is it? The corporation is already doing it!

Rich,
in your gun closet, right now .. do you have a 375 "improved" or a plain old 375HH ??
If improved, and you think it makes a higher velocity than the HH, I reckon its within 1-2 grains of the 375 ruger ...

hate to say it, buddy, but you are already DOING the 375 ruger thing, man ...

Both!
And a second H&H Improved project sitting on the bench.
If it's a 375R or golf, "hand me my five iron Bubba".
It's just vulgar...

Rich
H&H 375 or NO 375!!

Most of you guys have no need for a .375 anything in the lesser 48 states. If you go to Africa and take one you are still backed up by a ph with a bigger gun. I understand need has nothing to do with want, as my gun safes are full of stuff I dont need as well.

That being said, Up here your life, or the life of your hunting partner could depend on the back up rifle. Show me a quicker handling, more rust resistant, complete with factory iron sights, built in scope mounts, priced as low as the Ruger 375 and I'll buy it.
If my son gets drawn for a Kodiak brown bear tag this year my Ruger Alaskan is what will be backing him up.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Both!
And a second H&H Improved project sitting on the bench.
If it's a 375R or golf, "hand me my five iron Bubba".
It's just vulgar...

Rich
H&H 375 or NO 375!!

so, you have two not-a-375-h&h-s?
and a 375 hh?
I just gotta ask, you DO realize there's only the belt differening between the two, right? that is, between the RUGER and the 375Improved ..

NEITHER are HH's LOL ... now, that' just too dang funny!

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

i don't see the comparison with the 338 .. that's always been kinda niche ..

May be different in America, I don't know....but I see 375 Ruger replacing the 338 as the biggest gun in the standard 270/300 Win type/pricing rifle.

A lot of the rifles where 338 was the biggest chambering, such as the Howa, will probably add 375 Ruger, provided they can use the same barrel contour.

quote:

what it WILL displace is the 375 RUM, and anyone that would have bought a 375 weatherby over an HH

Can't agree with you there. 375 Wbys are either rechambered H&H, Wby or gunsmith built from an action and being able to use H&H brass or ammo is a big feature. 375 RUM is for those who want 300 magnum ballistics with a 375 bullet but for who the 378 Wby was to costly in both guns and brass/ammo

It will be interesting in 5 years or so to look back at this thread

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
OK like I said, I don't have a dog in this fight, and don't give one hoot in hell about a 375 anything. Would not have a 375 dirty my hands! But I do have a question, and this may already be answered as I am late in the game on this thread as it states something about 375 and holds little interest for me.

If you have two rifles, both 20 inch barrels, one 375HH, one 375 Ruger. In 20 inches of tube are they equal velocities?

Michael

Ruger should be a little faster, due to larger case capacity.

Did somebody assassinate the old Three Kings, 378Wby, 375RUM, and 375 Wby?

Or, did you mean king of the dwarves and forget the dwarf part?

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Did somebody assassinate the old Three Kings, 378Wby, 375RUM, and 375 Wby?

Or, did you mean king of the dwarves and forget the dwarf part?

Rich

I believe King of the Dwarves was, and still is, the 9.5x57 Mannlicher Schoenauer; the Queen was the dear H&H' .375 Velopex.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Did somebody assassinate the old Three Kings, 378Wby, 375RUM, and 375 Wby?

Or, did you mean king of the dwarves and forget the dwarf part?

Rich

Rich,
really? so, being 97gr is AWESOME, makes one a king, yet being 95gr, makes one a dwarf, but benig 89 makes you the kind again?
375 weatherby vs ruger vs HH

and NOW you are praising the 375 RUM, when you slam it in other threads?

Too random for me, man.

Mike, I meant if a guy was considering making a new 375 weatherby.. cheap howa factory gun, right there, and no profaning the 375HH !!

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

Mike, I meant if a guy was considering making a new 375 weatherby.. cheap howa factory gun, right there, and no profaning the 375HH !!

Jeffe, you are probably correct. Where the Ruger 375 will do well is when the shooter can't have the sort of rifle he thinks should be chambered in the H&H.

Actually I think the Howa and Vanguard and probably Savage would be rfles where if chambered in both Ruger and H&H the 375 Ruger would be chosen most often.

With reference to you comments in your last post to Rich on case capacity with Ruger and 375 Wby...I think a lot of people are under the impression the 375 Ruger is just short a couple of grains of the H&H rather than just a couple of grains short of the 375 Wby/AI. This is probably happening because the promotion is continually saying it will equal the 375 but most people don't read the rest....and do it with only a 20" barrel.

Mike
the ruger is just a hair behind the 375 weatherby .. an improved HH case .. you might be right, some folks might not know that

It boils down to: I got a nice CZ in 375 H&H with a trigger that is 3.5lbs unset and 1lb even set. Ruger can't offer me that. I got an Ackley Improved on an FN Commercial Mauser 98 that will glide past 2700 with the 300gr loads I developed twelve years ago. If I want more oomph than the standard 375 I would buy a 375 Rum or build a 375-416 Rigby. Actually, I would just walk two steps past the rack of 375's and pick out my 416 Rigby.

The ruger has nothing to offer me...

Rich

Ok, Let's make everyone happy and shorten the 375 Ruger by .23" and make the 376 Ruger

What will this do?
Well the Steyr gets top loads of 300 @ 2450 with 80 grains capacity but most do 300 @ 2400
This will be the same 2.35" length as the Steyr but will have 90 grains capacity and therefore 5 grains capacity inferior to the 375 HH to stop the pissing of 375 HH people but would be able to do 300 @ 2500 and still able to fit in a 98 mauser. So... smaller than the 06 length actions and able to do nominal 375 HH performance.

376 Steyr 2.35" 80 grains 300 @ 2400
376 Ruger 2.35" 90 grains 300 @ 2500
375 HH 2.85" 95 grains 300 @ 2500+
375 Ruger 2.58" 100 grains 300 @ 2500+

Use shortened 375 Ruger dies.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
but will have 90 grains capacity and therefore 5 grains capacity inferior to the 375 HH to stop the pissing of 375 HH people

One of the great things about 378s is you are just a spectator

378 weatherby? heck, even if you are the shooter, you are a passenger!

Jeffe,

do you own a 375 Ruger?

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
It boils down to: I got a nice CZ in 375 H&H with a trigger that is 3.5lbs unset and 1lb even set. Ruger can't offer me that.

you are right, ruger can't offer you a CZ rifle .. but CZ does ...http://cz-usa.com/products/view/express-rifle/ AND rugers can be had with a singleset.. but comes with a 3 position safety box stock .. AND, other than CZ, sell more 375HH than ANYONE in the last 5 years ...

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
I got .....NOT 375HH

not 375 HH

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:

. If I want more oomph than the standard 375 I would buy a 375 Rum or build a 375-416 Rigby.

no, sir, you have a 375 improved already .. and it obvious you WANT something more than a standard 375HH, as 2 of your 3 rifles are improved .. if there's nothing to improve, then why own it?

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Actually, I would just walk two steps past the rack of 375's and pick out my 416 Rigby.

still a medium

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:

The ruger has nothing to offer me...

Rich

that you haven't already compensated for by building/buying TWO NOT-375-HH rifles..

you just hate ruger, and thereby hornady, for letting a cat loose in your sandbox, rich

Just figured out that to clean up a 376 chamber you need to shorten the ruger to 2.365" so you have to add 15 thou to compensate for the longer Ruger neck.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Ok, Let's make everyone happy and shorten the 375 Ruger by .23" and make the 376 Ruger

What will this do?
Well the Steyr gets top loads of 300 @ 2450 with 80 grains capacity but most do 300 @ 2400
This will be the same 2.35" length as the Steyr but will have 90 grains capacity and therefore 5 grains capacity inferior to the 375 HH to stop the pissing of 375 HH people but would be able to do 300 @ 2500 and still able to fit in a 98 mauser. So... smaller than the 06 length actions and able to do nominal 375 HH performance.

376 Steyr 2.35" 80 grains 300 @ 2400
376 Ruger 2.35" 90 grains 300 @ 2500
375 HH 2.85" 95 grains 300 @ 2500+
375 Ruger 2.58" 100 grains 300 @ 2500+

Use shortened 375 Ruger dies.

can't shorten the dies, that reduces base diameter .. boomy, not a great answer to anything

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
AND, other than CZ, sell more 375HH than ANYONE in the last 5 years

That is very interesting Jeffe. I would assume the Ruger sales include the Number 1. Actually I would imagine 375 H&H would make up a fair percentage of Ruger 1 sales. Although a bloke on an Australian forum just got a Number 1 and in 375 Ruger. Similar I guess to getting a Mark V in 300 Wby instead of 300 Win. Same branding and bigger case capacity

the loss of .215" of body length is about 2 thou worth of body diameter so I figure it would be tight but doable but I have been wrong many times before =)

The actual casehead of the Ruger measures .5295" right?

All this to gain 50 to 100 fps over the 376 Steyr is silly but so is the argument between the performance of the HH and Ruger

If you cant kill it with a 376 Steyr you cant kill it with an HH or Ruger or Wby or 378

the 376 gets 375 Flanged performance and the 375 HH was the bolt answer to the 375 Flanged.

Is the 375 Flanged or 376 not enough to kill anything?

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
can't shorten the dies, that reduces base diameter .. boomy, not a great answer to anything

Mike
winchester's been out of the game for nearly that long

remingtons are HIGH dollar, except the recently readded markX actions ... and those aren't selling great, hence the discount

CZ sells a bunch

browning, weatherby, and savage don't offer the HH

leaving ruger RSM and #1 to fill the breach... the number of sauer/merkel/colt rifles sold in 375HH is just barely north of zero ....

i am dead certain remm sold more 375 rum than HH over the last 10 years

Jeffe,

I know for a fact that there are more 375 RUMs that forums would indicate.

375 H&H is a surprising selling in Mark Vs, both in cheap Synthetic and well as the custom stuff. The vice president marketing Brad Ruddell has a Safari in 375 H&H.

In Australia Sako and Rem 700s are good 375 H&H sellers.

IS that a:
Yes I own a Ruger in 375R
or a
NO, I don't own a Ruger in 375R
?

I got the two improved rifles in trades. I would never have spent a dollar to build one. The unfinished one is for sale. Ackley fit the barrel and chambered it for a now deceased friend. I got it and the completed one from his widow in a lot of six rifles.

I have always figured that the standard 375 H&H will get the job done. I just have always been a fan of wretched excess and big, Big, B-I-G bore rifles.

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by Gatehouse:

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Winchester ain't likely to chamber anything in the new M70 that says Ruger on the casehead.

As of 4pm this afternoon I have fired my ninth 375R. All customer returns. None of them have met the ammo box velocities, and several of which featured a marked tendency to jam while trying to get a fast second shot off.

Rich

Get your chrono checked out. My 375 Ruger gets the velocities intended, and feeds great form rapid fire.

Ruger (and just about everyone else) figured out how to make a bottleneck cartridge feed and fire, a looong time ago.

I checked my chrono out with different cartridges and I still couldn't get close to advertised velocity out of two different rifles, the alaskan & the african. The bolt would stick after every shot and one of them simply would not feed no matter how you worked the bolt. I know this to be true, some of the 375 rugers are performing and some are not.

I'm not a 375 ruger hater. I also had a 375 h&h that wouldn't feed until I worked on the feed rails, but i atleast didn't have to deal with the bolt locking up after firing factory and weak hand load

I suspect that the .375 Ruger will appeal to the market that does not already own a .375 calibre rifle and is out to buy one for the first time. For those who are not nostalgic over the H&H the Ruger variant does make a lot of sense. If I did not already have a CZ .375 H&H rifle, dies and hundreds of cases I would seriously consider buying the Ruger Hawkeye.

If the bolt is sticking with light loads, something is out of square in the action, like the bolt face....

quote:

If the bolt is sticking with light loads, something is out of square in the action, like the bolt face....

Perhaps explaining all the used, 375Rugers on the rack? Damn, getting any one to admit anything on this forum is like pulling teeth.

Then we got one guy, keeping a note book on what every forum member says and throwing those words back at every percieved inconsistancy. What is that? Like my wife: "two years ago you said..."

The only short coming I see in the Ruger cartridge is its short neck. If you seat a 300 gr bullet to a factory length, that bullet takes up quite a bit of case capacity. I have a 375 Wea variant witha longer neck, allowing the case to a more complete fill capacity with powder with less projectile volume taking case capacity.
I suppose it is a moot point if you can achieve a specific velocity goal with the Ruger.
My Wea (375) actually chrono's a 300 gr NP at 2800 FPS out of a 24" barrel (Factory fodder) Win mod 70 classic stainless modified.
Regardless; this 375 market may be saturated in North America. I would seldom see any 375 + caliber cartridges on the shelf at most shops.
Interest may be waning (all big bores).


EZ

are the 270. 12ga, and 22LR in trouble?
EVERY TIME i got to the gun store or pawn shop, i see several of these calibers in the rack .. it doesn't seem to make a difference which maker, only that people keep selling this back, used, and at a loss from what they paid on them!!

I mean, seriously, 10:1, if you combine the three, to everything else used .. when's the last time you saw a 358 winchester model 70 featherweight on a used gun rack? NEVER? it must be a PERFECT cartridge ....

I am frightened, especially for the 22LR .. it always (except during the obama-/hoarderscare) has hundreds of thousands of bullets just laying around on the shelves, and probably as many used for sale as new .. and it seems that the maker just keep trying upteen vairants to try and get them sold, even pistols!

heck, you can get a used 270 or 12ga in over/under, bolt, semi, pump, sidebyside or singleshot ... you can even get a PISTOL in 270, g's .. all there, used, in great condition ...

yeah, used guns must be indicative of a cartrdige being junk ...

and those that you might trade for, and have no dollars in? My goodness, someone GAVE you a rifle, and you didn't give them anything of value to YOU for it? it has to be junk, by defintion, its worthless!

oh NO, said chickenlittle, every time one sees a used gun on the shelf, it MUST be the caliber's fault!

As for why all the Ruger375 returns: Yes, I though it might be the cartridge fault. Recoil, velocity, accuracy, ammo, something? This preconceived, ie prejudged, opinion was due to my disdain for the 375 Ruger ctg. And, I still dont want one.

But; by keeping the wax out of my ears, I am now leaning toward the idea Ruger has a QC problem. Not a 1 in 10 problem like CZ(?), but; perhaps 1 in 50 problem? Just a guess. Everybody screws up, look at that Toyota 95mph out of control on the Kalifornia highway.

At least the 375Ruger is NOT rebated. Not a little or a lot. Can we at least agree that is a good thing? Or would that step on somebody else sacred toes.

HH neck is less than a caliber length too.

the bullet will take up the exact same amount of capacity beit short or long neck.

If the Ruger and the HH had the exact same capacity how can the same bullet shaft take up different amounts of capacity?

If you load the bullets out longer that is an entirely diff story.

Chamber the Ruger in an HH length action and you can gain more capacity.

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
The only short coming I see in the Ruger cartridge is its short neck. If you seat a 300 gr bullet to a factory length, that bullet takes up quite a bit of case capacity. I have a 375 Wea variant witha longer neck, allowing the case to a more complete fill capacity with powder with less projectile volume taking case capacity.
I suppose it is a moot point if you can achieve a specific velocity goal with the Ruger.
My Wea (375) actually chrono's a 300 gr NP at 2800 FPS out of a 24" barrel (Factory fodder) Win mod 70 classic stainless modified.
Regardless; this 375 market may be saturated in North America. I would seldom see any 375 + caliber cartridges on the shelf at most shops.
Interest may be waning (all big bores).


EZ

I would suggest that anyone who is caught up over the capacity differences of the Ruger and H&H, short necks , net case capacity etc should just get a 378 or do what Saeed does and have 375 RUM or 375/404 Improved. Then you can have 2700 f/s with 300 grainers while using reduced loads

quote:

I would suggest that anyone who is caught up over the capacity differences of the Ruger and H&H, short necks , net case capacity etc should just get a 378 or do what Saeed does and have 375 RUM or 375/404 Improved. Then you can have 2700 f/s with 300 grainers while using reduced loads

Yes, Mike, exactly! Then we would be talking something different A dozen eggs is a dozen eggs: two rows of six or three rows of four.

There is no new magic cartridge required too build a handy 20" bbl carbine. I just remembered another magic ctg! The 350Rem Mag and the great little short bolt carbine.