quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:

quote:

Originally posted by Macifej:

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
That's Jeffeosso the person, not the moderator. Besides, when we need the Big Bore forum equivalent of "cleanup on Aisle 4" George is the one with the mop.

I was just thinking, wouldn't it be great if every time somebody put you on "Ignore" you got a PM letting you know? I'd love to know what my running total is by now.

Rich

This ain't a poll question. NO postings with your estimate please.

You're one of AR's best and most insightful sources of humor Rich!! Who would possibly want to ignore you.

PS - If you can read this, I'm not on your list of ignorers.

Haven't you noticed how ironic it is that a moderator would have an ignore list?

I notice everything JP ...

great -- m-o-d-e-r-a-t-o-r NOT s-a-i-n-t or n-i-c-e-g-u-y ///
trying to find a nice way to say "like i shive a git" .. that might be the nicest way

Gee guns on used racks in this economy? When times are tough, guns get sold, its as simple as that. If I was in the market for a 375 I would buy the Ruger African in a heart beat. Its a very well thought out package. Ditto if they would ever chamber it in 9.3 x 62.

quote:

Originally posted by George Semel:
Gee guns on used racks in this economy? When times are tough, guns get sold, its as simple as that. If I was in the market for a 375 I would buy the Ruger African in a heart beat. Its a very well thought out package. Ditto if they would ever chamber it in 9.3 x 62.

I've got a couple of perfectly adequate 9.3x62 rifles, but now they're making the African in .300 Winchester Mag.

I don't "need"one...
I don't "need"one...
I don't "need"one...

No Africans on the used rack, all stainless Alaskans in 375. Bad eccenomy, No, I dont thing these gun buyers purchase a brand new Alaskan take it home and get layed off two day later.

Something is going on here ....

Blued Steel and Walnut wrap themselves around a man's emotional center in a way that plastic and stainless just can't match. No way to really warm up to a plastic stock...

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:


I told Neil Duckworth of Mokore Safari I wanted to bring the Ruger on my hunt with his brother this last August. As he turned away and dismissed me generally and specific to the subject he said, "Bring the H&H."

I did. It still works. It works quite well.

That just tells me what I found out already. There are ignorant PHs, also. He didn't know what the Ruger was, and went to what he knows.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
Blued Steel and Walnut wrap themselves around a man's emotional center in a way that plastic and stainless just can't match. No way to really warm up to a plastic stock...

Rich

This is bullshit.
I just bought my first Dakota factory rifle , a Longbow in .338 Lapua, specifically because it had a McMillan synthetic stock.

quote:

Originally posted by fourbore:
I was at Cabela in Hartford CT and saw a NEW Ruger Alaskan 375 on the discount rack. With black rubber stock. Price $699 - closeout sale tag. This is the same rack as the grungy old H&R and Savage shotguns. Not behind the counter with the other NEW Rugers.

Trouble with the new Ruger big bores already! I have yet to see a single 416 Ruger. But the 375's are all over over the placed on the used rack, now even NEW guns are showing up on the used rack.

No trouble that I can see other than a bad economy. I sold off a H&H and a 375 Wby on a Dakota after I bought a Ruger 375. Notice I kept the Ruger

Actually fourbore, up here in Western Canada the Ruger Alaskans have been a great seller. The local gun shop said the Alaskan model has been one of their best sellers. Unfortunately brass is fairly hard to find.
I wish Ruger would chamber the Alaskan in a 9.3X62 as I am one of those who can warm up to plastic (or walnut for that matter) and "stainless". I can't say that I would be fond of the Hogue rubber stock though.

Coming from you RIP, I am not really surprised. A bit disappointed perhaps, but not surprised.

I prefer Damascus steel for knives, and well done color casehardening to any other finish where appropriate.

Rich

Which side of the fence are you on RE Breast Implants?

Most of you guys tinker with your guns after your purchase for the most part. Especially bolt guns if they are not made by some respected gunsmith. I have not bought a Ruger in 20 years.
If Ruger would make that African in blackened Stainless in a walnut stock, I just might and begin my tinkering and see how it pans out.
Another project to see what if?

quote:

Actually fourbore, up here in Western Canada the Ruger Alaskans have been a great seller.

lowwall,

I like the Alaskan concept, but I disagree with the choice of calibers. And why so many returns? And contrary to some opinons, a 375HH could be made around these same basic design parameters. You wish for more choices as well, the 9.3x62 is not exactly Ruger current thinking. Nor is the 404jeff ever likely in a package like this. How about 35 whelen, or better a 375 whelen? I take it then, no complaints about Alaskan quality up in BC? Ammo shortages, OK and any 375HH shortages?

Rich,

Based on catalog pics, the African looks great. (looks better vs Alaskan practical) I have not handled one yet. African is offered in more choices, but here oddly not any 40 or 45 choices. Do these names mean anything? I agree, the African does appear to be vintage Ruger styling at its best.

ezrider,

You understand the Alaskan and African are a different models. The African is also a light wt gun. Maybe swap an African stock on Alaskan action? That might work. Then you to could shorten the bbl on an African. No reason to wait, lots of cheap "problem??" guns on the used shelf. At $699, might want to ask about getting the new gun sent from Cabela's Hartford to Tx store?

Fourbore,

We have some cheap ones on the rack down here in the Cabela's Fort Worth as well. No stainless, just the blued short barreled hogue stock models.
I personally like the 23" tube (visual).
One of the best things about these rifles are their open sights. They are good quaility and NECG makes after market inserts (beads) for the front ramp.
I am curious if Ruger see's the 416 a bigger mistake than the 375 and that just stems from the very limited market.
There are just not that many people that want something larger than a 300 mag (North American hunters) and the bigger you go the less interest.
The folks on this forum are a rare breed.
I would believe the 416 Ruger Alaskan to be the perfect coastal bear gun for Alaska (especially for a guide as a backup) once it has had a once over by a good smith. I would think you could get Hornady Ammo in Alaska any time.
I would not trade my 416 Remington (MOd 70 ) or Kimber Oregon (416 Rigby) for a Ruger for Africa BUT those are nice custom guns. If I made a living hunting bears in Alaska in that weather?

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
If I made a living hunting bears in Alaska in that weather?

I think this is the situation where the Ruger will take away from sales of the 338, that is, where the rifle is bought to match actual game to be shot as opposed to a "toy"

And of course you are right about the market for bigger than 300 magnum being small, perhaps bigger than 338 Winchester.

Given the 375 Ruger rifle is now in 300 and 338 Win then surely a 300 and 338 Ruger must be in the pipe line.

If Wby chamber the Vanguard for the 375 Ruger I think it would sell in good numbers.

I don't know how anyone could buy the Ruger instead of this

http://www.winchesterguns.com/...eview.asp?mid=535116

I have a Winchester in 375. The M70 looks good and shoots good. The answer is simple, the Ruger is shorter and lighter. A different weapon.

You are a Winchester fan. care to speculate - will Winchester roll over and give up the safari/alaska carbine market up without a fight?

quote:

Originally posted by fourbore:

You are a Winchester fan. care to speculate - will Winchester roll over and give up the safari/alaska carbine market up without a fight?

They won't enter that market except as 338.

Why offer a 375 for 2/3rds of the price and especially when that extra 1/3rd is close to all profit.

Although as you know they did previously offer a Synthetic/Stainless.

Actually in the 375 bore market I don't think Winchester, Remington, Ruger and Weatherby directly compete.

If some of you don't like the Ruger Alaskan 375 concept then you dont have to buy one.
I bought mine from Buds Guns (LH Alaskan with iron sights in gray laminate stock) for just a hair over $600 (got very lucky on the price). For me, it is the perfect Alaska hunting rifle for bears. Find me a comparable H&H for the same price and I'll buy one as well.

Some of us dont care about going to Africa and finding ammo as we reload. If you love the H&H (and I do) shoot it and enjoy it. Some of you guys really have your head in the sand over this round/rifle. I for one am very pleased Ruger is at least trying by introducing new products. So it is really simple. Buy one and shoot it, or don't and enjoy what you already own.

quote:

Find me a comparable H&H for the same price and I'll buy one as well.

Thats what I want too.

All this price differential between H&H and Ruger would cause one to speculate that perhaps Ruger is trying to get them out at cost to try and gain market share.

I think the Alaskan model will sell, because it is appropriate for their hunting and very inexpensieve. The African is not likely to.

Like Snowwolfe posted, whichever one you like; buy it!

Rich

So...Why isn't the Ruger Hawkeye African appropriate for Africa? I hunt Africa, and have owned the Kawkeye African. Just because it isn't a rifle-snob piece, does that make it any less an African rifle? It is a good round in a good rifle.

OH...It doesn't cost enough!!! Now I understand.

because it is 100 years +/- behind the Holland.
There's nothing intrinsically "wrong" with it, there just isn't enough of a performance margin to induce very many H&H owners to trade in.

RE the 375 Ruger cartridge; it's competition in Alaska is the 338WM. It's competition in Africa is everything from the H&H on up thru the 416's and the 404Jeffery.

One of the advantages of a forum like AR is the ability to read about what other people who have the same interests as you do choose. The vast majority of posts here about a 375 caliber DG rifle are H&H.

Here's a deal for you. Start a thread and title it "Who has taken a 375 Ruger to Africa?". Ask that only people who have actually taken the Ruger 375 to Africa and taken Dangerous Game with it to post their results. ONLY those who have hunted DG in Africa.

Go for it...

Rich

I would never trade my pre-64 Mdl 70 375 H&H for one. That is a ridiculous argument, in my opinion.

Many new Africa bound hunters are looking for something effective and affordable. The 375 Ruger meets both criteria. I also happen to like the feel of the Kawkeye much more than my FN/Sako 375 Wby or Mdl 70.

If the 375 Ruger isn't the right seat for your ass, don't worry about it. It just may be exactly the right one for some other ass.

Maybe we should go back to black powder...??? Holland & Holland was making those long before the upstart 375 H&H wormed its way into our hearts.

quote:

Originally posted by luv2safari:
If the 375 Ruger isn't the right seat for your ass, don't worry about it. It just may be exactly the right one for some other ass.

LOL

Maybe we should go back to black powder...??? Holland & Holland was making those long before the upstart 375 H&H wormed its way into our hearts.

Progress is only good to a certain point. After that progress is redundant. Where the certain point is has the potential to be quite a gray area. That's why Idaho Sharpshooter has been designated to decide.

I like it when Rich decides stuff ... makes for an interesting read here ...

Personally, I don't see the point in toting a popgun like a .375 to Africa unless you're gonna shoot Baboons or something ...

I guess that settles the Ruger VS H&H discussion: a guy can afford to shell multiple thousands of dollars to hunt Africa, and about $1400 for the plane ticket, but needs to save a couple hundred dollars by buying the Ruger instead of a more expensive H&H.

I cannot refute THAT logic...

Rich

Some of us save like hell to go and scrimp to make it happen. You fruuin snobs like to look down your noses at us, however...

The difference in cost can mean that I can take an extra animal, but that doesn't mean shit to you, so I guess the logic escapes you.

If D'Arcy Echols was going to make you a rifle or Purdey was going to make you a rifle and your choice of calibres was limited to 375 H&H or 375 Ruger. Which one would you pick.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
If D'Arcy Echols was going to make you a rifle or Purdey was going to make you a rifle and your choice of calibres was limited to 375 H&H or 375 Ruger. Which one would you pick.

A 404 Jeff.

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
If D'Arcy Echols was going to make you a rifle or Purdey was going to make you a rifle and your choice of calibres was limited to 375 H&H or 375 Ruger. Which one would you pick.

A 404 Jeff.

......and your choice of calibres was limited to 375 H&H or 375 Ruger.....

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
Most of you guys tinker with your guns after your purchase for the most part. Especially bolt guns if they are not made by some respected gunsmith. I have not bought a Ruger in 20 years.
If Ruger would make that African in blackened Stainless in a walnut stock, I just might and begin my tinkering and see how it pans out.
Another project to see what if?

I have the SS Black and Walnut stock..

Started out with the Black SS Alaskan and purchased a Take off African stock.. It's the Shiz.. Handy little thing..

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
All this price differential between H&H and Ruger would cause one to speculate that perhaps Ruger is trying to get them out at cost to try and gain market share.

I think the Alaskan model will sell, because it is appropriate for their hunting and very inexpensieve. The African is not likely to.



Rich

Market share? What firearms manufacturer has the cash reserves to buy market share for a niche commodity in today's economy?
Please. You'd be laughed out of the boardroom for even mentioning it. It's stand or fall, sink or swim, these days. Your product can sell or it doesn't. Period. Screw up and your leadership caste goes to the guillotine and your brand is sold to the highest bidder (*cough*Winchester*cough)....

The only reason the 375 Ruger is cheaper is due to economy of scale. Tens of thousands of M77's are cheaper per unit than thousands of magnum 70's. Or do you believe that Ruger is "buying market share" for left handed .375's as well? It's economy of scale. Nothing else. If anything, Win is shaving the Safari Express razor thin to keep it in the ballpark of the African.

Why will Cabela's only offer $500 for a used African? Because they can buy a new one for less than $200 more. In fact, $500 sounds generous if they had any knowledge of your reloads/sticky bolt issue. Cabela's must like you, gohip.

Why is 375 Ruger on closeout at natchez? Same reason it is on sale at all the other volume distributors = the are making room for the Superformance line up. Call them, ask them. See if the Superformance 375 Ruger is on closeout for 40 bucks a box.

I wouldn't classify myself as a huge Ruger fan. Never have been. The old Mini 14 and the P89 are not good firearms in my book. The old M77 was a good but not great rifle. The Blackhawk, the Single Six, and their doubles were not in the same league as the similiar products from Colt, Smith and Browning.

But, I have taken a Ruger African to Africa and killed some animals DRT. Mine is accurate, handy and I bought the rifle and a nice Zeiss for right over a bill. Not bad. Shots near MOA all day long with the 270 SP/RP. What's not to like?

In the midst of a recession when other manufacturers are near stagnant, Ruger put out:

The LCP and LCR, now hastily copied by Smith as the Bodyguard 38 and 380.

Their 204, 375, 416, 480 chambers. Evolutionary to be sure, but solid performers with plenty of better atrributes than their peers.

The SR piston driven AR. A quality gun and a bold move for the home of the Mini 14. I guess somebody gave the "no sacred cows" speech up there.

The SR9 - the buried the P series travesty and moved on.

And they didn't have to revive their classics like Smith did, instead the 10/22, the MK 22's, and the rest are still rollling off the lines.

I don't know what their books look like but since their stock is up 20% in the last quarter in the midst of a recession, I am guessing they are doing all right.

And if you want to underwrite a DG hunt for me, I'll let you know how the Ruger does on buffalo!

BTW, how many pages did the "Demise of the 370 Sako" get?

quote:

Originally posted by Mike McGuire:

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:

quote:

Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
If D'Arcy Echols was going to make you a rifle or Purdey was going to make you a rifle and your choice of calibres was limited to 375 H&H or 375 Ruger. Which one would you pick.

A 404 Jeff.

......and your choice of calibres was limited to 375 H&H or 375 Ruger.....

I understood/understand and would not have such a custom rifle built in 375 H&H or 375 Ruger. Hence my answer.

Chet,

If; I did not like Ruger the company and the guns, I would not question the quality (alaskan return rate)or the products (caliber choice). I simply would not bother.

So I ask you straight out, why no 338win in an Alaskan? And why no 40 or 45 in an African model? I am 90% ready to buy an alaskan in 458, but I dont expect that. No 338 Alaskan - WTF!

In 25 words or less. I am a potential buyer. Seriously.

What's the overriding factor in those who praise the Rooger 375? Price! They bought it cause it was cheap, cheap, cheap, cheap, cheap. The salisbury steak of BG rifles. Yummm, if you can get past the gristle.

I mean, isn't that the overriding thing Rooger is noted for? Finding a way to cheapen their product. Think the boat paddle stock. Using cast parts, and\or welded up stamped steel, instead of machined steel. Touting non-reflective when in reality a deep, high gloss bluing job adds cost.

Rooger, the Craftsman hammer of the gun world...the most utilitarian tool that can get the job done. Nothing more.

And I do believe what Rich says about Rooger being po'd about not having their name on enough headstamps making them wannabes in the big boy marketplace. So if you throw enough outlandish designs and marketing hyperbole against the wall, some of it is bound to stick. But, funnily enough, so much turns out to be egg on their face. In my opinion, that is.

onehunlow,
Ruger is not about price, IT IS ABOUT VALUE. The No1 and RSM are not utilitarian guns. They are great guns. I would like to see the Alaskan become a great gun. The African has potential too.

The current gimmicks dont seem to be getting it done. "headstamp... wannabes" yes sadly, I think you are right.

Craftsman are great tools, lifetime warranty, made in the USA same as Ruger. Excellent analogy but for the wrong reason - you are wrong on that account.

quote:

Originally posted by fourbore:
onehunlow,
Ruger is not about price, IT IS ABOUT VALUE. The No1 and RSM are not utilitarian guns. They are great guns. I would like to see the Alaskan become a great gun. The African has potential too.

The current gimmicks dont seem to be getting it done. "headstamp... wannabes" yes sadly, I think you are right.

Craftsman are great tools, lifetime warranty, made in the USA same as Ruger. Excellent analogy but for the wrong reason - you are wrong on that account.

Are you sure about "Craftsman Tools" being made in America?

quote:

Are you sure about "Craftsman Tools" being made in America?

I believe so; all the current hand tools. My friend was pissed off royally a few year ago he got a set of those ratchet box end wrenches branded as Craftsman, "Made in Taiwan". He brought them back. Well, must have been a lot of complains, because now I have been looking and at least the Craftsman hand tools all say "Made in USA". That is not true of the Sears brand tools. I have not been looking at power tools lately.

quote:

And I do believe what Rich says about Rooger being po'd about not having their name on enough headstamps making them wannabes in the big boy marketplace. So if you throw enough outlandish designs and marketing hyperbole against the wall, some of it is bound to stick. But, funnily enough, so much turns out to be egg on their face. In my opinion, that is.

I don't agree with all that. For starters you would hardly call the 375 Ruger an outlandish design.