Congratulations!!

Wouldn't celebrate until the $$ is in hand.

Hein is in for a rough year as I have him in my sights, and believe HCR is going to hammer him as well.

FO: Can you elaborate on the HCR situation? And as a few of you stated, I'm not declaring total victory until cash in hand. jorge

My understanding is Hein owes HCR several completed actions that have been previously paid for.

Like everyone else who has commented.... HCR has not been able to get in touch with Hein since late March. Hein isn't returning phone calls, e-mails, nor responding to certified mail.

Too all who have mentioned. Jorge and I fully understand that we have nothing yet other then a signed piece of paper.

We fully understand that as Hein has been unable to produce product to date nor has the money to pay back at this time that things are unlikely to change between now and Oct 15?

We both view this as an important stepping stone on the way to final resolution nothing more.

It does make more sense to go this way then continue to push for some type of court settlement.

quote:

Originally posted by FOsteology:
My understanding is Hein owes HCR several completed actions that have been previously paid for.

Like everyone else who has commented.... HCR has not been able to get in touch with Hein since late March. Hein isn't returning phone calls, e-mails, nor responding to certified mail.

I would imagine that as soon as litigation started his attorney advised him that he should not respond to any form of communication whatsoever.

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:
Congratulations, now let this evil thread die.

Terry

Your comment puzzles me. What is evil about this?

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
I would imagine that as soon as litigation started his attorney advised him that he should not respond to any form of communication whatsoever.

Who said HCR has started litigation? Someone mentioned that it was likely...........once again it seems all Hein needs to do is produce product. It is my understanding that Hein has delivered product to HCR already. If he stopped why? It supports my theory that his whole problem is laziness and lack of a good work ethic.

quote:

Originally posted by Howard:
Jorge and I have a signed agreement in place whereby Hein agrees to pay us in full including principle, interest and attorney fees by October 15, 2008.

I'm glad something worked out, but like it's been said this piece of paper is from the same lying, cheating son of a bitch that you have been fighting with for over a year.

Howard

I should have been more clear. Nobody said HCR
(Hill County Rifles) started litigation. What I meant was when you folks started litigation I am sure his attorney told him not to respond to anyone unless it came through him, the attorney.

quote:

Originally posted by Trax:
Did notJorge,you, others? already have an agreement with WFH that you would get a receiver or rifle for your money?
what assurance does this new agreement give?
Even when one puts a blowtorch to some folks bellies, they still dont pay.

It gives as a signed confession of default and a summary order of judgment that allows us to immediately attach any and all business and personal possessions.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
Howard

I should have been more clear. Nobody said HCR
(Hill County Rifles) started litigation. What I meant was when you folks started litigation I am sure his attorney told him not to respond to anyone unless it came through him, the attorney.

Are you sure you are an attorney? Good grief........if one of my customers sues me for whatever reason I should immediately stop all communication with my hundreds of other customers and direct them to your office? Sorry man but I wouldn't be able to fire you fast enough.

Come on Howard, now you are talking out of your ass.

If I have a client who is being sued and there is evidence that there are more folks out there that may want to sue him for the same thing I am telling the guy to keep his mouth shut and to direct all inquiries to me.

Good thing you aren't an attorney.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
Come on Howard, now you are talking out of your ass.

If I have a client who is being sued and there is evidence that there are more folks out there that want to sue him for the same thing I am telling the guy to keep his mouth shut.

Good thing you aren't an attorney.

That is NOT what you said initially.....and the fact one customer is suing him is no excuse to not respond to other customers reasonable requests for updates on their orders...............and I have never claimed to be an attorney.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
Come on Howard, now you are talking out of your ass.

Just trying to reach your level Counselor Blue.

This is what I said initially. Basically the same thing.

quote:

I would imagine that as soon as litigation started his attorney advised him that he should not respond to any form of communication whatsoever.

Anyway, what is important is that you have something akin to a default judgment that you can use to levy on Mr. Hein's assets if he doesn't pay you.

As for 500 Grains,and other attorneys here, I am quite sure most would agree with me that if they had a client in litigation they would advise him/her not to speak to others about the subject matter of that litigation.

Jorge,
I am glad you are supposed to retrieve your money back. You and I were both in the same boat with this guy and I guess I was lucky and pitched a fit earlier than you did about his delivery times. I am pretty sure he will pay up because when I stood my ground he agreed to refund my deposit and he did return it when he said he would.
Maybe this will be a wake up call to him and other custom smiths this type of conduct will no longer be accepted by customers.
I suspect he realizes how much this subject was discussed and will pay up fast in an effort to rebuild his name.
The entire situation soured me on the idea of ordering any more custom rifles.

This guy was getting deposits up front, and obviously was getting a volume of orders. Why the cash crunch? It would lead one to suspect he was using the deposits for other debts. Makes one suspect drugs/alcohol/gambling. Maybe not. Maybe health related costs, but it does make you wonder.

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:
This is what I said initially. Basically the same thing.

quote:

I would imagine that as soon as litigation started his attorney advised him that he should not respond to any form of communication whatsoever.

Anyway, what is important is that you have something akin to a default judgment that you can use to levy on Mr. Hein's assets if he doesn't pay you.

As for 500 Grains,and other attorneys here, I am quite sure most would agree with me that if they had a client in litigation they would advise him/her not to speak to others about the subject matter of that litigation.

The default judgement is stipulated in the agreement. If he fails to pay, he goes to live under a bridge....jorge

quote:

Originally posted by 450/400 Jeffrey's:
This guy was getting deposits up front, and obviously was getting a volume of orders. Why the cash crunch? It would lead one to suspect he was using the deposits for other debts. Makes one suspect drugs/alcohol/gambling. Maybe not. Maybe health related costs, but it does make you wonder.

Those deposits get eaten up in a hurry if you constantly manage to find reasons to not work yet pay yourself a full salary.

Howard,

Well put. My curiocity is to what factors draw this guy away from a potentially thriving enterprise. Can this guy be a loser without outside influence?

Well, it's been a while since I took the "over" on Jorge's 4/15 date. Needless to say I was correct on that one.

I hope I'm wrong on this one for everyone that is involveds sake, but I'll take the "over" on this one too. I smell bankruptcy.

BTW, to repeat, I hope I'm wrong here, but if he can't pay you now, and he's not putting out any significant product, what leads you to believe he'll pay you in October?

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
BTW, to repeat, I hope I'm wrong here, but if he can't pay you now, and he's not putting out any significant product, what leads you to believe he'll pay you in October?

Gato: We sued him (and his wife) directly as he failed to incorporate properly as an LLC. Accordingly, we can take his toothbrush if he defaults. jorge

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
BTW, to repeat, I hope I'm wrong here, but if he can't pay you now, and he's not putting out any significant product, what leads you to believe he'll pay you in October?

Gato: We sued him (and his wife) directly as he failed to incorporate properly as an LLC. Accordingly, we can take his toothbrush if he defaults. jorge

Is it written in the agreement that you get paid before he can file for bankruptcy?

If I recall correctly the Supremecy clause of the U.S. Constitution provides that most federal laws preempt state laws. Therefore I would presume that a federal bankrupcy action would trump a state court default judgment collection.

I am sorry ya'll had to go through this ordeal and I hope it ends well.

I think from now on one of my top questions to any rifle builder I talk with will be, "HAVE YOU EVER BEEN SUED?"

quote:

Originally posted by Doc:
I think from now on one of my top questions to any rifle builder I talk with will be, "HAVE YOU EVER BEEN SUED?"

you might also need to ask if they actually paid what the court ordered they do.

Howard,Jorge&others,
keep the blowtorch to their belly!
Theys need to learn that if they want to play lumberjack, they need to learn to carry their end of the log,
and that they should learn to not Fck with the honest&sincere,come badass, billy the mountain!
The damage is long done, now its time to just have some fun.
Now dont get me wrong, I like custom rfle builders, but not enough to be Fckd around by them, as in the past, Guess some of it was my fault,cause I was too nice,too understanding,too trusting.
Theres just so much good potential for work orders for those that are willing/able? to do the right thing.
What I find is that they get caught up too early in visions of glory for themselves,and forget or never had any idea, what is required to have a good reputation and successfull business/career.
Folk are often more truelly successful due to ongoing sound word of mouth, rather than a cheap handshake and fancy-promiseful website.
The only time success comes before work, is in the dictionary!

BTT

Has anyone else had any contact with Hein? Any luck in getting product or money?

Wonder if Hill Country has managed to make contact?

Ugly, ugly, ugly.

jorge, if you really want his toothbrush, I hope you get it.

And I hope it makes you feel like a winner.

Hello?

Life is really tough, and then you die.

If you're lucky, all your friends die before you do, and that's not much fun either.

Once again, I ask administration to create a "I've Been Abused By Gunsmith/Rifle Builder/Etc., Etc., Etc." board.

Because, well, this board should be for sharing gunsmithing information and techniques.

It's not the Consumer Affairs Board.

If jorge chooses not to patronize riflesmiths in the future, that's his choice.

And he, and his cohorts, should excuse themselves from the Gunsmithing board.

If you're a 'smith, you belong here. If you're client to a rifle builder, feel free to share you victories.

We love photographs of beautiful rifles.

If you've been done wrong, take it the Chaplain.

Maybe that's what we should call the new board.

Take It To The Chaplain.

flaco

N.B. Or, "How To Hire a Lawyer to Get His Toothbrush?"

All I see is a bunch of guys who have defined themselves as losers.

El Flaco! Wow! I hear soothing music and bird chirping in the background while viewing a lovely pastorial scene. . . .Oops sorry, it was just my desk top screen saver! I'd love to debate that with you, however I have go. I have to go watch "PollyAnna" before I head off to work.

flaco,

those boys have done exactly what they should have done. what the hell do you think contract law is all about anyway?

are you saying you wouldn't have used the law as a remedy in this case had you been the aggrieved party? Yet, I bet the first legal pickle you find yourself in the lawyer gets the call before anyone else.

cheers to Jorge, et al for taking a bad businessman to task!

quote:

Originally posted by flaco:

Because, well, this board should be for sharing gunsmithing information and techniques.

It's not the Consumer Affairs Board.

Damn, I didn't know you had bought this site from Saeed.....times must be tougher than I thought in Dubai?

Oh wait, you haven't purchased this site, you say?

Hmmmmm, then what gave you the impression that you can decide for the rest of us what we should post or read where? Hmmmmmm.......

flaco has obviously never been on the short end of a gun project gone wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by dempsey:
flaco has obviously never been on the short end of a gun project gone wrong.

He's added nothing to this thread.

quote:

flaco has obviously never been on the short end of a gun project gone wrong.

Probably not. But he has definitely been on the short end of intelligence and more than likely other things as well.

quote:

Originally posted by adrook:

quote:

Originally posted by dempsey:
flaco has obviously never been on the short end of a gun project gone wrong.

He's added nothing to this thread.

Neither have most of the other replies but what the hell, everybody loves a good wreak.

bump