Todd

I am sorry for taking so long getting back to you here. It's been a hectic day today, and I have been covered up from one end to the other! My apology!

Thanks for the kind words, we strive pretty hard to be independent, but it's hard when you are working with such good bullets not to have some bias, and I admit, I have bias when it comes to the BBW#13s, and the North Forks as well. I try, but it causes me to sweat sometimes! HEH....

You are not the only one pissed at barnes since the BS marketing campaign they launched trying to feed us a load of shit and telling us that it's actually Peanut Butter! Yeah right!

We don't need barnes solids anyway, so they can do what they please.

I told you, the TSX is a hell of a bullet. Terminal performance in a "conventional" it's difficult to beat, accuracy now with the bands is incredible, it's a good bullet. I concur, the X was ahead of it's time especially in terminal performance.

Performance of the NonCon. Yep, most of the shots were proper, frontal or broadside heart, lungs shoulders and such. Yes, most of those blades were in the chest cavity, correct. I did stomach shoot one buffalo bull, dead square through the stomach with the 500 MDM, I did not mean to, but I did anyway! The bullet caused a good bit of trauma, and he pulled up short 75 to 100 yards from where the battle started. The main bullet passed completely through and exited. This was a very sick buffalo, I was able to get that very angling shot you are talking about as he turned to run I hit him at an angle, bullet passing through to the far shoulder and exiting. He went 15-20 yards and piled up stone cold.

The further the main bullet travels, the further the blades get from center. There were blades in the chest cavity of that stomach shot buffalo, but from the second angling shot, not the stomach shot. The liver did have some tiny holes from the stomach shot, but could find no blades, nor am I sure it was from blades? It is true, that the blades after I would say 4-5 inches of penetration are close to center, an inch or two from center, as the bullet moves forward the blades move from center. On a broadside deer that Sam shot last year, there were blades exiting the deer some 12 inches from center. The one thing about the NonCon you can count on, time after time, is penetration of the main bullet. It will continue on long after any conventional has come to rest, and I mean any conventional, Swift, North Fork, and even the TSX. It will continue on a straight path, it will crunch bone like nothing else, and it will go like nothing else. I would take shots with it, that I would not take with any conventional, but never the first shot! Rarely have I ever seen a reason to take a rear end shot as a first shot on anything, in my years of shooting I have yet to do so. Second shots, oh hell yes, many many times. Rear raking shots with a NonCon, oh yes, no issue at all, and unless you go completely through the stomach from the rear, then blades are going to get in the chest cavity, maybe not all, but some for sure, and of course the center bullet will keep driving forward.

For the followup second shots--regardless of the expanding or conventional bullet, use the BBW#13 Solid! That's a better choice on those rear end shots.

Point of Shoulder? Below is my POS Buffalo! POS? No man, not that, Point of Shoulder--

He was standing 25 30 yards and it was point of shoulder shot that broke his entire left side down, it was useless and probably helped me quite a bit when he decided to attempt to get on his feet 5-6 yards in front of me, then a couple to the nose put him back down exactly in the position you see him in now. He had one hell of a time getting to his feet with the entire left side shattered to pieces, and it was pieces too.

Here is the buffalo and below the actual bullet and a couple of blades.







I have zero issues with that performance.

Now, it takes no convincing me to test your 500 TSX for barrel strain at all. I would be more than happy to do so. However, there is a hitch right now. First of all, last week I switched to the new and so called improved updated pressure trace system. Plug and play right? Wrong! I tried to plug and play Saturday to no avail! So I am starting work tomorrow trying to get the new system up and running, and giving readings close to the data base I already have, mostly concerned with chamber pressures of established loads. I think I may have some ideas and I was getting some electrical noise introduced into the system, and I hope like hell to sort it out, soon as possible, I have work to do with it and need it running proper. So currently until I sort the system out, get it calibrated, and running correct numbers, I am out of the pressure trace business!

Another thing, it's not quite as simple as just loading up a few rounds and running them through to get barrel strain. Todays numbers will not be yesterdays numbers! Almost anytime you hook up the trace and working with such sensitive equipment you will not get the same number you got yesterday, normally within 2000 PSI or so with chamber pressures running from 45000 to 65000 PSI. Well 2000 PSI or so difference is nothing really in that aspect, however barrel strain numbers run very low, from 11000 to 13000 up to 15000 or so. 2000 PSI difference at barrel strain will make a bullet either really good, or really bad. So you have to run an entire series in one hook up, one shooting session, all the bullets you are going to test. But, what I can do is test a small run of bullets that session, including the 500 Woodleigh Soft, our benchmark bullet and compare those readings that day to that, along with the BBW#13 and North Forks. So I can solve that issue. And, who knows, the numbers might come in close any given day. So yes, I will be happy to do that for you, once I get the system up and running. Another issue I might face is that while I still have that strain gage hooked up on the same rifle to collect barrel strains, I am not sure it's still intact. I have protected it, but this rifle has been used and shot a hell of a lot since we did the barrel strains some time ago. Hopefully the strain gage is still good to go?

While I am happy to test them for you, I have some obstacles to over come before I can do so. I will need about 6 bullets minimum for the test, and while normally I would just buy a box for it, I don't intend on using them for anything, so I might beg you out of 6 of them to work with when the time comes if you don't mind.

Do not think I am trying to con you into a BBW#13 NonCon, I am not, but you ask, I am going to show you! Your TSX is a fine bullet and will do anything you need to do. Personally I like the NonCon better, I think it has great advantages and it works with the Solid, so it's a matching system. And I like penetration and trauma inflicted. But I have used Swift and Woodleighs as well, and they are good bullets too in that capacity. We are truly blessed as shooters and hunters today with the best bullets that we have ever had access to. It's hard to over come those conventional teachings too. I even catch myself from time to time!

By the way, earlier today I posted some of Saturdays work with the BBW#13 Carnivore, designed for thin skinned dangerous game, it has value to doubles as well as real rifles, like Winchester M70s!






Michael

Hey Michael, thanks for the reply. One of the things I like about your style that I try to do also is to have evidence to back up my statements instead of just pulling them out of... well you get the idea!

I don't currently have a .458 rifle but if you'll let me know when you get everything sorted out, I'll get a box for you as I realize all this testing on your own dime has to be expensive! No hurry on my part though however, I was really just inquiring about your plans for future testing on the full sized TSX.

From your buffalo and the other experiences you relate here, it does seem that the Non-Cons are fine bullets. Just as the TSX was ahead of it's time and therefore experienced resistance to acceptance because of it's different method of achieving results, I am personally experiencing that same resistance to the Non-Con. But that is my issue and certainly not an indictment against the bullet. I certainly don't mean to come off as putting it down, just asking questions about how it does it's work.

You are correct in that we live in great times concerning the selections we have available to us. I understand the issues you raise concerning the difficulties getting valid results at this time in comparison to the previous results, so don't go to the efforts on my behalf as that really isn't necessary.

So I'll just say once again, thanks for the research you've don on this and thanks for your objectivity. Good shooting and hunting to you!

Cheers,

Todd

Top of the evening Todd!

That is right, 500 NE, I don't know why I was thinking 458? Anyway, I can find some 458 TSX out there, no worries about buying any. I will check the barrel strains when I sort the system out, hopefully not too long!

No worries, it took me a long time as well to sort the NonCon out in my own mind, I suspect that our upbringing is much the same, and had I not worked with them so much I probably would still be resistant as well. That's ok too, as time moves forward, more of them get into the field we can all learn from that. I think I have laid the ground work and the test work so that they can move forward, and going to the field with test work behind you is better than going to the field in the dark! As I have stated in the past, if you have penetration, one can not fail. We have penetration.

You are welcome, but no thanks needed, I would be doing much of it anyway.

Good shooting, and Good Hunting to you as well!

Michael

Hello gain Guys:

Every time I get around to read these very interesting posts (because of work commitments I can't post as often as I would like) I find out that many more interesting stuff has been written and many new posts has been added so I have to play catch up and read all of them before I can post again, keep it coming guys.


Michael:


I can’t wait to read of the results and your input on the testing of the TSX bullets. Mean while I have a question about your solid and the non cons and if they do shoot to the same point of impact and in all or most calibers, specifically 470, 450/400 and 9.3 x74.

I know that you most likely have answered this question before, probably in other posts but as I mentioned I have a lot of reading to catch up on here, mean while if you can answer it, or point me in the direction where to the post that you answered it in, I would appreciate it.

Best regards


Malek
Good hunting/shooting and God's best

Malek

quote:

Mean while I have a question about your solid and the non cons and if they do shoot to the same point of impact and in all or most calibers, specifically 470, 450/400 and 9.3 x74.

Since this is doubles, and you mention double cartridges, I assume you are talking regulation of 2 barrels on one rifle frame! I don't even own a double, so I really can't answer you. Sam has a truck load of doubles, and in almost all of them the BBW#13s regulate very well. I think he has one for sure I recall that won't regulate much with anything. The rest yes, the ones we have worked with. Most everyone else tells me they do regulate in their rifles as well. So I have to go with that in the majority of doubles the BBW#13s do regulate.

Now, if you want to talk real rifles , Winchester M70s, then without doubt the BBW#13 Solids and their matching NonCons with the same load go in the same hole at 50 yards with every rifle I have worked with, every big bore caliber and every different weight within caliber. If not the exact same hole, then so close you can't tell. The NonCon runs almost, within 25 fps or so, of the solid with the same load. The NonCon runs slightly less pressure than the solid merely because of it's lighter weight, less pressure to push it. So one can run the NonCon a bit faster than the solid, which still maintains close to the same POI at 50. This is what I have been doing, running the NonCon a bit faster, and POI running an 1/2 to 1 inch higher than the solid at 50 yards. More than close enough to work with in the field. You may not have that luxury in the two barreled rifles. Maybe, maybe not.

Hope that comes close to answering your question?

Michael

Just got word that my buddy Jim who is in Zim elephant hunting killed a mid 50s bull yesterday. He was using his Army Navy 450NE double and BBW#13 480 grain solids. Took a side brain shot as the bull spooked and ran. One shot end of story for now.

Sam

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Just got word that my buddy Jim who is in Zim elephant hunting killed a mid 50s bull yesterday. He was using his Army Navy 450NE double and BBW#13 480 grain solids. Took a side brain shot as the bull spooked and ran. One shot end of story for now.

Sam

Sam,
I hope you'll be able to say the same of me and CEB#13s out of my Verney-Carron 600NE in two weeks time.

Just in from Zim. My friend Jim shot another bull elephant with a #13 solid. He's pushing 70 lbs.

465 H&H might be right about shooting 2 or 3 elephants with one shot. PH said you better be careful with a #13 in a group. Jim said insurance shot exited the back.

I wonder if I should "download"

Elephant pills... CEB#13 900grain .620 solids ...

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
I wonder if I should "download"

Doc,

I sure hope that you run across one of those great big bulls, with a very big head! Why you say?

You may be the only man in history that will blow an elephants head "Clean Off"!

What a mess that would be, use your imagination for a second!

Guys, elephants and buffalo are dropping like flies to the mighty BBW#13 Solids! There are several cases now, Aaron with his 577 Nitro, our man Lionhunter with the .458 480 BBW#13 in his 458 Lott, Now Jim's two big elephants with the same .458 480 BBW#13, me with the 500gr .500 BBW#13, and I know of another one not reported with 500 Nitro and the 570 BBW#13 and still waiting for the article to be written before posting that report, at the mans request. Doc, I have zero doubt if you do you part in this matter, your bullet will damn sure do it's part! That bullet of yours, it's a hammer from the Gods! It will not fail you!

Michael

CCMDoc,

Do I see nickel 600 cases? Hmmm

Sam

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
CCMDoc,

Do I see nickel 600 cases? Hmmm

Sam

Good eyes, Sam.

They are Bell brass with Purdey headstamp

Solids in nickel and Non cons in brass. Wonder where you got that idea!

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Solids in nickel and Non cons in brass. Wonder where you got that idea!

A "Rose" by any other name ...

Loaded some 470s w/ CEB #13 500gr solids. Shot a few just to get the feel of the gun. Looking forward to the paper test.

Will post results. Rain in forecast so may be a few days.

Also, have the non cov to load up & shoot.

Is that a Texas Suppository?
(Texas heart shot... elephant medicine... I guess if I have to explain it its a bad joke aye)

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
Elephant pills... CEB#13 900grain .620 solids ...

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
I wonder if I should "download"

Doc,

I sure hope that you run across one of those great big bulls, with a very big head! Why you say?

You may be the only man in history that will blow an elephants head "Clean Off"!

What a mess that would be, use your imagination for a second!

Guys, elephants and buffalo are dropping like flies to the mighty BBW#13 Solids! There are several cases now, Aaron with his 577 Nitro, our man Lionhunter with the .458 480 BBW#13 in his 458 Lott, Now Jim's two big elephants with the same .458 480 BBW#13, me with the 500gr .500 BBW#13, and I know of another one not reported with 500 Nitro and the 570 BBW#13 and still waiting for the article to be written before posting that report, at the mans request. Doc, I have zero doubt if you do you part in this matter, your bullet will damn sure do it's part! That bullet of yours, it's a hammer from the Gods! It will not fail you!

Michael

Michael,

Don't forget the bull and cow I shot last year with the 500 grain .475 CEB #13 from my 470 Searcy.

465H&H

quote:

Michael,

Don't forget the bull and cow I shot last year with the 500 grain .475 CEB #13 from my 470 Searcy.

465H&H

Oh for sure, never forget. In fact, if I recall correct, you were #2 to use the BBW#13, Copper, and still the 2 band version. Sam being the first with the 577. Then I sorta loose track, but I think mine was the 3rd, Aaron 4th, Mo, fellow I know 5th, Lionhunter 6th, and Jim, Sams buddy 7th and a total of close to 10 that I know of, and I might be forgetting some, or some I don't know of. What I do know of is 100% track record. I am sure I am leaving something out or have something misplaced. But for sure, have not forgot you and the two you did. Actually, I did forget it was two! HEH........



Michael

I just thought of this, seems all the elephants taken thus far with the BBW#13s, with the exception of Lionhunter and myself, were taken with double rifles! Lionhunter with a 480 BBW#13 Solid in his 458 Lott, mine with 500 BBW#13 Solid in my 500 MDM. Hmmmmmm?

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:


I just thought of this, seems all the elephants taken thus far with the BBW#13s, with the exception of Lionhunter and myself, were taken with double rifles! Lionhunter with a 480 BBW#13 Solid in his 458 Lott, mine with 500 BBW#13 Solid in my 500 MDM. Hmmmmmm?

Michael

Michael,

It is time for you to get with the program and get a double!

465H&H

465H&H,

I've been working on Michael to get a double but they are just too heavy and long for him. I think if we could get one of those cheap 500 NE doubles and cut the barrels to 18 inches and have it regulated he might come on board. He tried taping two model 71's together but even Gorilla tape wouldn't hold.

Sam

Sam, start him out with your little 9.3X74R. Talk about short, light, and handy, that's the gun.

Dave,

Michael has shot one of my 45-70 doubles and the 450-400,470,500 and 577. He liked the 500 and 577 the best. He just wants them to weigh about 7 lbs. I think it would be fun to watch him shoot a 7 lb 577.

Sam

quote:

Just got word that my buddy Jim who is in Zim elephant hunting killed a mid 50s bull yesterday. He was using his Army Navy 450NE double and BBW#13 480 grain solids. Took a side brain shot as the bull spooked and ran. One shot end of story for now.

quote:

Just in from Zim. My friend Jim shot another bull elephant with a #13 solid. He's pushing 70 lbs.
Sam

Ok Sam-

Sorry for the delay. By the way, I have known Sam for close to 12 years now and he is the Man! He told me the guy he met down in South Carolina is just as gun tech crazy as he is. Thanks guys for the work.

I went to Zim to hunt with my friend Richard Cooke. I carried my Army & Navy 450 NE loaded with 480 gr. #13 BBW FROM Michael in front of foam and 81 grains RL 15.

I have had pressure problems in the past with Woodleighs and worried about continuing to shoot this beautiful old gun with a full load. Using Sam's bullet took care of that. Thanks Sam and Michael.

We looked at over 200 adult bulls in 15 days, walking away early on from a few monsters that put me in serious remorse. After 10 days a mid 50's bull was back on the plate, as we were holding out for bigger early. We found an old guy that pushed 55+ with a nice big smooth track and thick to the end ivory. He winded us and provided a moving side brain at 30 yards with the #13, end of story.

We had found out there was another bull on quota from a cancelled hunt. That was part of the reason to move on the first bull when we did. If we saw a monster? Who says Good Guys don't get a break? After three different days of fighting a fire to try to save a hunting area and two days after ele #1, we ran into a very old bull, "a Giant" who looked in his last years and had big, black, long ivory. He was a once in a lifetime type of elephant which we stalked and shot. Still waiting on an email, but hoping he may make 70#.

THE SIDE BRAIN AND THE HEART LUNG ANCHOR SHOT EXITED the elephant. He fell semi-upright and we lined up the exit hole. We spent some time digging and trying to find that bullet, with no luck.

Needless to say Richard was talking about getting his hands on some 500NE ammo with #13's asap. He also said something about that 450 caliber packing quite a wallop, Heh Heh.

Thanks guys for your "bullet of the future."

Jim

quote:

THE SIDE BRAIN AND THE HEART LUNG ANCHOR SHOT EXITED the elephant. He fell semi-upright and we lined up the exit hole. We spent some time digging and trying to find that bullet, with no luck.

Great report and congrats!
With so many excellent reports of the bullet performance on elephant and buff I don't know why anyone would use anything else. That bullet you lost could have landed in the neighboring country

ZZZ,

Glad you had a great trip and the bullets performed as they should have. Your Army Navy 450 double is one of my favorites and you are lucky I let you buy it. That gun should be in my safe. You need to post photos of you great elephants. One is truely a monster. You should also post photo of the beautiful rifle.

Sam

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:
Michael,

It is time for you to get with the program and get a double!

465H&H

465HH

I don't know buddy! Ya see, I have this issue with patience, I just don't have any. I am also a bit nutty about some things, perhaps a little "Obsessive Compulsive". I fully understand the double rifle, it's purpose in life, what it is for, it's strengths and weakness. I comprehend every bit of that concept. But what I would have horrible issues with is one of those things not shooting to exact POI at 50 yds. 2 inches would drive me totally insane! Then there is the issue of Irons. I really would hate to scope a double, personally and carry it in the field, besides the extra weight, it just would not look right. Problem is, past 25 yds, irons are useless to me. Can't see! Then there is the issue of overweight and too long. Then I was raised on bolts and levers, this break open thing I just don't get, I would become confused, elephant would eat me while trying to figure out how to work the gun, I would just look stupid as hell! I reckon some tricks an old dog just can't learn!

Anyway, when I take a double hankering, I just make Sam bring down some of his! I tell you one thing I love about a double rifle, is when you break open that action and that big brass just goes slinging behind you over your shoulder, I love that, then I love to watch Sam run after it and say ugly words, that is fun!


Michael

Michael:

A little Chapuis 9.3X74R double would meet all your needs. Talk about short, light, and handy, Thay handle like a nice side-by-side 20 gauge shotgun. I think you would like it.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
Michael:

A little Chapuis 9.3X74R double would meet all your needs. Talk about short, light, and handy, Thay handle like a nice side-by-side 20 gauge shotgun. I think you would like it.

Yeah, I think that would be very nice little gun as well. I have actually seen those, somewhere, can't remember, but I have been around the block a time or two. They are very nice.

Problem is, I got these B&M things, and I have many of these that need to go to the field, that I have never taken before for being so tied up in this or that, or testing bullets on trips and such as that. Anything else would never get used, I have a lifetime of hunting adventures to do with my own little things, without introducing anything else in the mix! My goal is to get all the B&Ms plenty of field experience, even the Super Shorts, so this will keep me busy for many years to come, maybe even the rest of my way too short of a hunting years!

I do appreciate the thoughts however!

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
Michael:

A little Chapuis 9.3X74R double would meet all your needs. Talk about short, light, and handy, Thay handle like a nice side-by-side 20 gauge shotgun. I think you would like it.

Oh, and one more thing, I reckon that little double dosed up with a couple of 280 BBW#13 Solids, or 255 BBW#13 NonCons, would do about anything on the planet you would ever want to do as well!

M

Hey Don't forget our boy CCMDoc is on the African plains right now! Him and his Dad are hunting and it appears they are shooting as well! Look at what I got today via email!


I am told this is with a 375 caliber something or other, and the 270 BBW#13 NonCon I believe. No details yet of course. I leave that to Doc when he returns!




This one explains itself!





I don't know about you guys, I can't wait to hear this report!

Michael

quote:

375 caliber something or other,

375 Flanged Magnum

quote:

Originally posted by Kebco:

quote:

375 caliber something or other,

375 Flanged Magnum

Thank you Kebco---You guys must keep me straight on some of this double terminology!

Nice Kitty too!!!!!!!!!!

Michael

A few more of Doc, just sent in!

Michael did you ever get your strain guage's worked out? I was just wondering if any comparison has been made yet between the woodleigh softs and matching weights in TSX's?
Thank You,
Mac

Hi Mac

Pressure trace, strain gage, yes and no. I thought I was having an issue with PT 1, so I purchased the new PT II. We cannot get PT II up and running, and just sent it back to RSI for them to take a look at. In the meantime, I kept messing with PT 1, and all I had was a bad connection on the back of the module. So right now, PT 1 is up and running, I plan on started pressure data tomorrow or Friday latest on the new 475 B&M loads. Soon as I get that done, then I need to send PT 1 back to RSI for a new connection on the module. Hopefully we get PT II up and running in between. I think it's going to end up being a software sort of issue and not a hardware on that.

Our boy Mike, 450NE sent some TSX last week. So I have a few I can test. The issue is, we will not get the same numbers as we currently have. Every time you make a hookup because of that days environmental, electrical, or just the PSI gods, you get slightly different readings. Doing chamber pressure a few hundred, or even a couple 1000 PSI is not a big issue from one time to the next. Doing barrel strains, a few hundred throws the entire numbers out from the time before, make one bullet good, others bad and so forth. So you can't get a proper handle on things, unless you run several different bullets, same hookup and day, to get a proper comparison. But I can do that, say I do a run of 5 or so different bullets, of course including the 500 Woodleigh Soft, which is our benchmark bullet, along with the TSXs, and some BBW#13s and North Forks, then this would give a good comparison, on it's own.

Now if one takes and does several of these different days, different hookups, you start to see a trend. The position in the lineup may change up or down a few notches one way or the other, but in the end, they come out ranking close to the same. While you cannot compare last weeks strain tests, to this weeks strain tests, if you have 10 strain tests over a few months, trends begin to show up overall. Get the jest of it??

I will see if I can get a strain test put together in the next week or so and include the heavier TSX for you guys.

No thanks needed, my pleasure.

Michael

Awesome....I know u have a large stash if different bullets but if u ever need any others for comparison let us know. I am more than willing to send bullets for all the data you have provided. Thanks
Mac

Michael, In your testing so far have you seen anything that would indicate that the problems of barrel strain might be exacerbated in smaller calibers? For instance in a 9.3x74R which will typically have thinner barrel walls. Some of the stories I have heard regarding over stressed rifling and barrel strain have been about calibers smaller than 450.

Hey Mac! How ya doing? Good to hear from you!

Mac, seems that some folks want another barrel strain tests with some other bullets, I am happy to put one together with anything that I have not done already, which now seems to be a 500 Barnes TSX and a 500 Hornady DGS. 450NE sent some 450 Barnes TSX, so I can include those. If anyone wants to send 6 Barnes TSX 500 gr 458s, then I will put a strain test together and include them. Any other bullet that someone would like to compare, I would be happy to.

I have been running 3 at a time for a test. As long as the peaks, lines and numbers look good, no anomalies it is good to go. But in case of an electrical, or environmental disturbance of some sort, I like to have 3 more to run, should I need them. If not, then the whole test could be moot, because of running one hookup per test.



Bob

It is hard to say in the smaller calibers, such as 9.3. Based on the two strains we have done in both 474 and 458 calibers, the rankings of some bullets remain pretty much the same, test after test, and in both calibers. Always to the good in these tests are the BBW#13s, and the North Forks. While making assumptions is not what we like to do here, in those regards and that in mind, I can't see any reason that the BBW#13s and North Forks in 9.3 caliber would not make a good showing in barrel strain tests in both 9.3 and 375 calibers. Barrel strain, to me, seems rather easy to figure out. Can't be too many factors involved in true barrel strain. One of course is "Bearing Surface" Less is better. Another is the actual diameter as compared to the bore, again, Less is better, to a point, and that depends first on bearing surface, or the amount of bearing surface. If there is a lot of bearing surface, then to reduce barrel strain you have but one real option, and that is to reduce size compared to bore. In other words, if it's a .458 bore, lot's of bearing surface, then size down to .457 caliber. At .457 there is really no issues at all in a .458 bore. Some going down to as much as .456 I don't care for that much. The other way to reduce barrel strain, is a soft bullet, which sometimes may or may not work right, either in terminals, or possibly even cause more of an issue by slugging up as it goes down the bore. Now this soft bullet thing is more of a theory than fact, and something I take upon myself as an opinion, or even possibly an unanswered question I have of my own, and nothing to take to the bank. Bearing surface, and diameter, absolute factors!

Maybe sometime I can hook up and do a 9.3 strain.

Michael