quote:

Now to see where the point of impact difference is between these and the 325/350 combo----

This is or was the question that Sean had concerning the 416 B&M, and the POI of the 225 #13 Tipped and the 325/350 #13 Combo HP/Solid.

Found out today. I did not think they would be in the ball park, but out to 50 yards at least, you are good to go on buffalo easy, with the rifle sighted Primary with the 225 BBW#13 NonCOn HP Talon Tip.

All this with my 416 B&M 18 inch gun. 225# 13 HP 2901 fps, 300 #13 HP 2434 fps, 325 #13 HP 2489 fps, and 350 #13 Solid 2368 fps.

This is at 50 yards, and If I could shoot better today, groups would be much better, but today, this is about as good as I could do. I also had some 300 #13 NonCon seat deep add tips, shot 3 of those too, they were off to the right and slightly higher than the 325/350s. You won't see that bullet on the website, it was one of those that just did not work out..... My poor design efforts, too long, not enough difference between 300 and 325, has to take up way to much case capacity, and just not worth the effort. It had a 5th band, and it did raise pressures. I did not like it, it won't be available or made. So you see, not everything gets the "GO"............ This .416 225 #13 gets the "GO" and big time in my book.

The 225 #13 HP sighted about 1 inch hi at 50, puts the 325HP/350Solid about 1-1.5 inches low and 1/2 inch or so right. In my book, well within POI for buffalo at 50 yds. Dropping in to 25 yards would be 1/2 that, and within reason for tighter shots on elephant with the solids, so I see POI as pretty decent! A bit of a surprise to me, I thought the 325/350s would be much lower........ But Not!



I went and loaded 6 more rounds, 3 each 325/350s and tried to shoot a better group the second time around, damned if I did not pull one off to the right or it would have been at least decent...... As it is, just crap! I know, Maybe I can get Shootaway to give me some Lessons?????

The key to good grouping is wearing a snowmobile helmet
(that's a good one if your remember that thread)

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
The key to good grouping is wearing a snowmobile helmet
(that's a good one if your remember that thread)

I am SCREWED..... No Snowmobiles in South Carolina??????

quote:

My poor design efforts, too long, not enough difference between 300 and 325, has to take up way to much case capacity, and just not worth the effort. It had a 5th band, and it did raise pressures. I did not like it, it won't be available or made.

Michael,

I’ve given this 3/1 (4-band) situation quite a lot of thought for some time now (surprise surprise) and I believe I may have a fairly simple solution – which is:
1st – Keep upper and base driving bands their current width (per caliber)
2nd – Cut the two remaining driving bands in half (basically remove upper half of each band while keeping the positioning of the bottom half – in the normal 3/1 configuration)
3rd – Add a 5th and 6th driving band (the remaining half of the two bands from #2) with the new driving band spacing from the 2nd item.
This will give additional bullet seating depth options while maintaining the same total gross band width engraving of the current 3/1 4-band bullets – so no net increase in pressure. Plus the very slightly wider distance between the upper driving bands should give a better case mouth crimping space, and will still give at least 2 bands within the B&M case necks. For all but shortest bullets they would now be 5/1 6-band bullets; shortest bullets would just be 6-band equal spaced bullets...

An additional thought… My rational for leaving the upper and base driving bands at current width by caliber is that they are the two primary stabilizing bands for the BBW#13 bullets especially where the rifle chamber’s freebore is sufficiently long so that all bands are within the freebore before rifling is engaged…(but not too long allowing the bullet to reach high enough velocity to abrade rather than engrave the driving bands)…

Anyway, that’s my thinking on the issue…

Jim

I need to clarify that 5th band. I did not request it, somehow Dan got a brain fart and added it as we were looking at something, don't recall what. That 5th band raised pressures to the point that I could not do much more with a 300 than was already doing with a 325. The whole issue was a mess to begin with, I went for TOO much weight for what I was really trying to get to. Ya see, Conventional thinking had crept back into my brain............

If there was some sort of issue with the bands, I would have or Dan would have already changed them. I see no issues at all with the current bands as they are. In fact, now they are rather distinctive of the BBW#13 design.

Now one could do as you suggest, cut the bands in half, and keep the same total amount of bearing surface, yes, and it would work and not be a problem..... I think. One thing about small bands at the top end is slippage as they first engage the rifling. If one had smaller bands on top.

I think leave things alone, working great as far as I am aware of and know of no real issues. The Nitros have wider spaces in between for crimping, and while standard width is more narrow than the nitros and levers too, it is still enough that it can be crimped, I do it all the time with the 500 MDM, which requires a crimp, and a compressed load.

And, that BBW#13 Look has just grown on me, just would not look right otherwise! LOL.....

Michael

I don't know where I am going to find a "Snowmobile" around here? Seems I need one if I am going to be able to shoot better!

quote:

I need to clarify that 5th band. I did not request it, somehow Dan got a brain fart and added it as we were looking at something, don't recall what.
Who knows the reason why – but it certainly answers the question with what happens by adding 5th driving band of equal width to the other 3 driving bands…
Now one could do as you suggest, cut the bands in half,
Yep, this was purely a verbal-visual remark. What I meant was to basically program the CNC machine to cut the 2nd and 3rd bands at ½ their current width with a slightly wider spacing between the bands, and add a 4th and 5th band of the same width and spacing as the 2nd and 3rd bands. Viola, the current 3/1 4-band bullet becomes a 5/1 6-band bullet…
and keep the same total amount of bearing surface, yes, and it would work and not be a problem..... I think.
This was/is my thinking that pressure is dictated by/directly related to the total bullet material to be engraved by the rifling; increase the the total material to be engraved = an increase in pressure – keep the total material the same = zero pressure change – reduce the total material to be engraved = a reduction in pressure…
One thing about small bands at the top end is slippage as they first engage the rifling. If one had smaller bands on top.
I believe that keeping the 1st (upper) driving band at the current width will eliminate the potential for band abrading with brass bullets if the ‘freebore’ is one-caliber in length or less. And remember, you’ve suffered no band abrading issues with the multi-narrow driving bands of the NF CPS or FPS copper monometal bullets – regardless of how fast you’ve run them…

The band abrading issues that ‘buffalo’ and ‘Tanz’ suffered was with 500 AR with the original 1.25” freebore – basically a +2-caliber freebore and they suffered this abrading issue with both brass and copper monometal driving band bullets. Hopefully we’ll have new information in the near future from ‘buffalo’ regarding his 500 AR with the shorter freebore…

And, that BBW#13 Look has just grown on me, just would not look right otherwise! LOL.....
Yeah I like them too… Guess I just don’t mind putz’in with things… Heck look at what I had Dan do with his sleek MTH bullets…. LOL…

Michael

I figured I’d just throw my comments into the quote…so there they are…

Guess I’ll wait until I blow through my stash of .423 and .500 caliber CEB bullets and then do an order with Dan to check this out…

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
I don't know where I am going to find a "Snowmobile" around here? Seems I need one if I am going to be able to shoot better!

Snowmobile helmet and a snow/camo stocked B&M rifle, south of the Mason Dixon Line.

quote:

I believe that keeping the 1st (upper) driving band at the current width will eliminate the potential for band abrading with brass bullets if the ‘freebore’ is one-caliber in length or less. And remember, you’ve suffered no band abrading issues with the multi-narrow driving bands of the NF CPS or FPS copper monometal bullets – regardless of how fast you’ve run them…

Yes, I concur....... Early on with the bands I found that we needed two bands in the front, minimum, purely for accuracy. While one band was ok in some cartridges, in others accuracy suffered terrible. Neck tension of course part of the reason for moving bands forward as well. In barrel strains & Pressure Tests, could tell no appreciable difference in 3 or 4 bands, Once bands increased beyond 4 bands you could see the difference. There is one thing I would like to see on the North Fork bullets, is one band at the top to start engraving that is as wide as one of the BBW#13 Bands, then smaller bands in between, and there is a wider band at the bottom for driving. Once Dan and I tried a straight BBW#13 with bands in the middle, none at the bottom, accuracy was for crap, back to the bottom band, all in a hole. Good stuff........

Coyote

quote:

Snowmobile helmet and a snow/camo stocked B&M rifle, south of the Mason Dixon Line.

I will be prepared for all contingencies! LOL............. The only reason I need a Snowmobile helmet is to help with my shooting abilities..... This is the rumor I heard anyway!

Remember what ALGORE says about global warming? Since he is such an azzclown, I think everyone should have a snowmobile, helmet and snowcamo B&M rifle!

Michael

Thanks for the POI test. It came out better than I had hoped. My thinking is that you you were out wandering the bush hunting PG or bait for example , and came a cross a Big Nasty that needed handled you could have a few solids on hand and know that they were acceptably sighted in- say with a 10 rd slide you keep 3 BBW#313 solids and maybe a NonCon in the rear of the slide-just in case. Your test makes this look like a very viable program. when I get some of the 225s I will run the poi's at 100yds and see but it looks good to go as is.

Thanks again for checking for me

Sean

I was very surprised at how the POI turned out. At least, with this wonderful little 18 inch gun of mine the POI of different BBW#13s is well within reason inside 50 yards for SURE. I tested 400 BBW#13 Solids and 370 #13 NonCons today in that same gun, and the 400/370 Combo was nearly the same as the 350/325 Combo. So all 416 caliber BBW#13s regardless of weight are within reasonable POI at 50 yds. One can do exactly what you said, out hunting plains game, sighted in with the 225 at 1/2 to 1 inch high at 50, and all the heavier 416 #13s fall into close enough POI to work with.

At 100 they will be twice as far from POI as they are now at 50. But, you are not going to have to defend yourself from buffalo or elephant at 100 yards anyway! And if its a big trophy bull, you are not going to shoot at 100 either! So don't get too wrapped up with POI at 100 yds!



Mike

Man, I am going to be "Set To Jet" with SNOW B&Ms................... I am not sure went Brent gets back, he just left yesterday for Zimbabwe, but the stocks will be done when he returns! Damn, I wish he would hurry!!!!!!

Hey, guys, working on the website, trying to get the leather and shirts on a page!

Also talked with Brian a bit ago, and there are a lot of B&Ms in the works up there! Some are even mine.. HEH HEH...............

Was talking to JD a bit ago as well.....all afternoon.......and many of you have asked about the SSK Industries website, and how it is getting a little......... long in the tooth you might say! Well I have been bitching, Brian has been bitching, and now JD is going to turn the website over to Momma here, yeah, new face on the SSK Website is coming, and overdue for sure. They are busy with it now and will be for a couple of weeks I imagine before changes go into place. And Yes, I am sure there will be a B&M section somewhere, but I leave that to JD and Momma. Thats their problem.......

I have something to show you, I might just save what I have on the website now and finish tomorrow. I have the leather goods on, slings and slides, but not the shirts yet..... No, not published yet, just added.

Michael

If you guys recall when I was putting Orgs rifle together for him, he wanted a red dot of some sort, I ended up putting a Bushnell Trophy on it for him, and damn, it worked great. So good in fact, I went over to Midway, bought two more for myself. Well, I hardly ever can just go to Midway, and get what I wanted, or needed, have to do a little shopping you see. I noticed this small red dot, Bushnell, little round thing, fits on weaver rail, comes with mount on it. For $90.00 and change, I had to take a look at it to see what it was about.

I have had it for probably a couple of months now, but today decided to put it on the second 50 B&M Super Short built. You will see on this gun the famous SSK T'SOB, the ORIGINAL slotted rail base!!!! In the beginning I had all the B&Ms set up with this, to add as much versatility as possible to mount any sort of sight you wanted, red dot, forward scope, rear scope, and at that time I was using those ghost ring XS rear sights. I Moved away from these and don't add the T'SOB any longer, I suppose just personal preference. So far, I am pretty impressed with this little inexpensive sight. Battery life should be at least as good as the bigger Trophy, which was two weeks continuous on. No, its not the 5 yrs of an Aimpoint or Trijicon, but it is 1/5th the price too. If it holds up, we will see......

Mike

Man, I am going to be "Set To Jet" with SNOW B&Ms................... I am not sure went Brent gets back, he just left yesterday for Zimbabwe, but the stocks will be done when he returns! Damn, I wish he would hurry!!!!!!



Hey man wait till you see what I had them do to the other 3 stocks you sent. I think you will be impressed, not sure I am going to send them back to you!

Brent

You have internet??? I assume so, and you must be on the ground, excellent. Hey, my damn stocks, you and Paul must make a plan when you get back for a visit....... Spoke with Brian yesterday, has B&M gun parts laying all over the place, hopefully he gets the right parts with your gun???? LOL.......

Man, I am excited about the stocks I tell you!

OK, report back when you shoot something!!!!!!!

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
Brent

You have internet??? I assume so, and you must be on the ground, excellent. Hey, my damn stocks, you and Paul must make a plan when you get back for a visit....... Spoke with Brian yesterday, has B&M gun parts laying all over the place, hopefully he gets the right parts with your gun???? LOL.......

Man, I am excited about the stocks I tell you!

OK, report back when you shoot something!!!!!!!

Michael

Yes I am still in Pretoria visiting friends and dog kennels for a couple of days. Heading to Bulawayo on fri. Have severl projectsmtomcheck on then head to the bush midmto late next week.
Have an order in to my buddy for 4 qts of the goos stuff. Will that be enough?

Brent

Yep, 4 qts of pie will do....... I will give you and Paul the cheap stuff....HEH HEH HEH.....

Have fun, above all, stay safe and show us some dead critters! Let the mighty 500 talk a few times! Want to hear what it has to say! No issues with ammo????

Speaking of dead critters, I got two crates of dead critters today, piled them all up in the garage to sort them out.......... B&M Critters.................




Of course my trusty Assistant Mercedes found some things in the pile she liked a lot.... Was talk of a "Necklace".........

Time to expand the compound for more trophies!
Necklace? Maybe she can be the artist to make B&M African trophy jewelry and furniture.
Zebra bracelets?
Kudu walking stick?
Matching warthog six shooter handles?
Zebra and other PG hat bands?
Elephant hair keychains?
Make her money for her next safari

Michael-

As you know, I also bought one of those single mount Bushnell red-dots from Midway. Not mounted yet and I will await your durability report before making a decision, but am very interested in what you find as you wring it out on the large bore. If it holds up, these may be one of the best buys in the marketplace!

For those of us with aging eyes v. iron sights, the small re-dots are a real improvement, and in some cases the only option short of a full sized scope. I've used the EOTech and Burris FastFire on large bore rifles and handguns without issue. However, these were substantially more $$ than the little Bushnell. Good luck with the testing.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Time to expand the compound for more trophies!
Necklace? Maybe she can be the artist to make B&M African trophy jewelry and furniture.
Zebra bracelets?
Kudu walking stick?
Matching warthog six shooter handles?
Zebra and other PG hat bands?
Elephant hair keychains?
Make her money for her next safari

Michael,

You may need a much larger booth at the 2014 DSC Convention so that Trusty Assistant Mercedes can sell her merchandise, otherwise you may have no place to sit…

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
You may need a much larger booth at the 2014 DSC Convention so that Trusty Assistant Mercedes can sell her merchandise, otherwise you may have no place to sit…

Oh she has been picking through things you can count on that. Several skulls came in as well, and a tooth or two was loose, quickly found those, gonna make a "tooth necklace" with them. Believe me, would not surprise me if she found a bone she would try to fit through her nose!!!!! Thats my Girl! And yes, the entrepreneur comes out in her during times like this!!!!!


Mike

As you know, for $90 or so, I had to see what that was about. So far, its really great on that 50 B&M Super Short, only about 50 rounds so far, but that is more than a 1.5X5 Leupold can take already! They are so light, I doubt there would ever be an issue with it.

I did forget one thing. Our buddy Todd, does not like things with batteries. Well, on a DGR he has an excellent point, that I can hardly disagree with. Of course, the high end items like Aimpoint turn them on, leave them for 5 yrs and they are still going. Not much to worry about if you put a new battery in before safari, turn it on in camp and leave it. Same with the Trijicon RMR I have been working with for Sakada, 17000 hours on a CR2032. Now that Bushnell Trophy I left it on continuous for 2 weeks, and it was good, another CR2032. I bet this one will go longer, just a tiny dot, no bigger than 4 MOA max I think. I believe I should turn it on tomorrow and see. If I can remember.

Now, the thing I was trying to get to is this. With the sights set up on this rifle as it is, I can see both rear, and front sight through the little Bushnell. No worries, major failure of red dot, I still got instant irons. Solves that issue.

I hunted with a Aimpoint in 2005. I did great with it, until I was in brush. My eyes these days cannot see the animal so good, especially smaller things like impala, warthogs and such, I have one hell of a time seeing the angle at which something is standing, I am even having that issue with a scope too and these smaller animals. If its in the open, the red dot is great I think. I have not used one on buffalo and bigger critters, maybe I should try that out this year, sure makes for an easy rifle to carry! I am just concerned about my ability to see as clear is all. I should get one out and do some field work on the farm with it.

I like it, I like it better that it costs $90 instead of $500, and I want to see what we loose for the money?? Might be a neat little trick?

Michael

I'll probably get tar and feathered for this but a 308 B&M could give 300 win mag performance in a short action. Just needs a rechamber of a 300 WSM. Food for thought. There must be some field mice and crows to dispense of in NC
323 B&M could give the 8mm Rem Mag a run for the money too on a rechamber.
Imagine a 6.5 lb cross canyon mountain rifle.

Some random thoughts on battery powered optical devices:

The U.S. military has been using battery powered optics in the field since the Vietnam war without battery issues.

I have been using battery powered optics on large bore rifles and handguns since approximately 1980 (Aimpoint) with only one issue - the poorly designed on-off switch on the first generation Leupold Illuminated Reticle scopes circa 2000.

U.S. SpecOps "rule the night" due to battery powered optics.

All batteries run out of juice. Battery capacity today far exceeds those of even 20 years ago. I always carry spare batteries for all my devices when I go on safari (don't you?). And I always start with a fresh battery in all optics.

I do not worry about batteries going dead while hunting. There are a lot more serious things to be concerned about when hunting DG.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
I'll probably get tar and feathered for this but a 308 B&M could give 300 win mag performance in a short action. Just needs a rechamber of a 300 WSM. Food for thought. There must be some field mice and crows to dispense of in NC
323 B&M could give the 8mm Rem Mag a run for the money too on a rechamber.
Imagine a 6.5 lb cross canyon mountain rifle.

Hum….

A 308 B&M would have virtually the same powder capacity as the 308 Norma Magnum– but still about 7grs powder capacity short of the 300 WinMag…

A 323 B&M would have virtually the same powder capacity as the 308 Norma Magnum necked up to .323 caliber – but still about 10grs powder capacity short of the 8mm RemMag…

However, a 338 B&M would within 2grs of the powder capacity of the 338 WinMag. So I ran both through QL and using 24” barrel, 210gr TTSX bullet (G1 .482 BC), and 68.0grs Hybrid 100V gave 2820fps @ 57235 psi for the WinMag and 2840fps @ 58465 psi for the B&M; stepping the B&M down to 67.5grs Hybrid 100V gave 2821fps @ 56996 psi… Yes this would be a good B&M cartridge to develop…figure on gaining or losing 25fps per inch for longer/shorter barrels…

Jim
Tthe question to me would be-

Whats the difference between a 325 B-M and a 325 WSM.

I believe on the website Michael states his belief that he was running out of neckspace and bullet room at 9.3--an I know he has/had a 338 WSM

Strictly being a hand load proposition and keeping the original barrels I was thinking it could get close to their factory loaded larger cousins in a light rifle especially with the light ultimate stocks.
The 323 version would be the most efficient obviously.

quote:

Originally posted by Cross L:
Jim
The question to me would be-

Whats the difference between a 325 B-M and a 325 WSM.

I believe on the website Michael states his belief that he was running out of neckspace and bullet room at 9.3--an I know he has/had a 338 WSM

Hey Cross,

I just created a 323 B&M to identify the differences – and they are as follows:
323 B&M - 2.24" case length – 0.316” neck length - 25º shoulder angle – 86.48grs Overflow H2O Capacity
325 WSM - 2.10” case length – 0.308” neck length – 35º shoulder angle – 81.80grs Overflow H2O Capacity

I believe Michael is using a 0.250” neck length on his B&M cartridges – the draft 323 & 338 B&Ms use just slightly under a full caliber length neck.

And no I've not verified that a 323 B&M reamer having a 25º shoulder angle would clean up a 325 WSM chamber with its 35º shoulder angle.

Yes there definitely is an issue with the 2.240”/57mm B&M case length in calibers <9.3mm relative to the longer bullet lengths of smaller calibers. But if using monometal bullets, or higher end bonded bullets (Swift, NF, etc.), I don’t believe the 250gr (0.313 SD) bullets are need/required to readily kill African plains game or North American ungulates. I believe the 185gr to 210gr monometal bullets will work as well if not better…

My comparison between the draft 338 B&M and the 338 WinMag used the 1.500” long 210gr Barnes TTSX monometal bullets (G1 0.482 BC) – but one could easily use the 1.390” long 185gr Barnes TTSX monometal bullet (G1 0.432 BC) and still kill anything that you’d want to hunt…

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Strictly being a hand load proposition and keeping the original barrels I was thinking it could get close to their factory loaded larger cousins in a light rifle especially with the light ultimate stocks.
The 323 version would be the most efficient obviously.

Boomy,

Truthfully, if you're staying with the .323 caliber and using non-custom monometal bullets then you're just as well off staying with the factory 325 WSM chambering and custom loading the COAL to maximize use of the M70 WSM magazine length.

Just my 2¢.

Guys, the B&M Case at 2.24-2.25 is just too long to work a WSM action when caliber drops below .366. I looked at .358 and the majority of the bullets available, conventionals yes, were just too long to fit in the magazine, I think you might could work with some 225s and 200s but every step down in caliber the story worsens. One is far better off, more versatile, in staying with a shorter WSM case. Now with our current NonCons it could be a different story, but severely limited to those probably, I have not even looked at it, as I have very little interest in anything less than 9.3, and honestly, with the new .416 225 #13 HP, and 458 250#13 HP, I have even less interest in even the 9.3. Not to mention as bore size drops, so does efficiency, and barrels start having to be longer, and getting further away from the B&M concept. I don't see any future B&Ms under the 9.3 any time soon.

Michael

quote:

I know he has/had a 338 WSM

Sean

Correct, in fact, I have two of them. The minute a WSM hit the market, I did a 338 WSM and have had it many years. Later I did another in wood with SSK. Nice little 338 caliber rifle. Both have 22 inch barrels and both shoot incredibly well. Never have taken either to the field, and probably never will, they are still bigger and longer than 9.3 B&M so I don't see much real use for them anymore, with the exception of when I need a test rifle, and the same goes for that 338 Ultra I have as well, that is a big gun.......

Michael

Michael is absolutely correct in that bullet length is an issue in the .338 caliber relative to a short magnum cartridge.

However I believe the more important issue is the design of the bullet which typically are for use in existing longer cases and in the more aerodynamic shapes just may not afford a proper seating area on the bullet to keep the COAL within the M70 WSM magazine.

I have zero .338 caliber bullets to measure and determine whether they'd properly seat and fit within the M70 WSM magazine which makes this a purely mental 'what if' scenario on my part. Heck I can't even verify if the 210gr TTSX bullet that I used in my example above can even be properly seated in either a B&M or the WSM case due to the bullet Ogive...

Oh yes - I should say - with my mental 'what ifs' I've been using a max-COAL of 3.0" for a 338 B&M or 338 WSM cartridge which is fine for the M70 WSM action but eliminates the shorter-short actions...

Ok, time for my 2nd cup of coffee - brain is running on slow...

Why I do, What I do...........................

quote:

Subject; 1 Eland Down


Hi Micheal

I took m 50 out of the safe and this is what happend. The scope battery went down and i had to take it off. I shot this bull at 85 meters open sights with one the 365 noncon
Hollow points it ran 10 meters and went down. The shot was straight on the sholder bone went through the one sholder and through the other sholder as well. I Recoverd the bullet under the skin on the other side of the sholder. I am very very confidant that what comes in front of that rifle will go down. The people that went with did not have alot of faith in my 50 but what they saw yesterday made them believers. Hope all is well in the US. I will be sending you some more results in the weeks to come.
Keep well and send my regards to your family.

Org

And we just got through talking about "Batteries", Todd, if you are out there........... Hey, Org should have used his spare battery Sean gave him!!!!!! LOL............... Oh well, this is yet another reason I like QRW Rings and Bases!

Michael

Magnificent--

Very nice Eland Org...

Quick question all - does anyone have a .338 caliber 185gr or 210 gr Barnes TTSX bullet that they could measure the length from the upper edge of the upper seating groove to the tip for me? Thanks...

Org

Very nice buddy!

Thanks Steve

Org

We are very proud of Org, his eland, and of course the 50 B&M Alaskan. To the best of my knowledge, this is the first African Animal taken with a 50 B&M Alaskan. No easy chore, eland!

quote:

Originally posted by coyote wacker:

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
I don't know where I am going to find a "Snowmobile" around here? Seems I need one if I am going to be able to shoot better!

Snowmobile helmet and a snow/camo stocked B&M rifle, south of the Mason Dixon Line.

Yeah........ SmartAss, look what I woke up to this morning right here in good ole South Carolina! I told you so..... This is why I need the Snow Camo Stock...........

Michael,

It is a pleasure to share with you a touch of the north county.

The big difference between you get a "dusting" of snow and us up here. Yours will be gone by noon, up here it will be May.

Here's a picture of the gang at breakfast.

OK, this is a South Carolina SnowMobile!!!!!!!


Now you can very plainly see why I need a Snow/Camo Stock on my rifles!!!!!

Coyote

For sure, a little dusting of snow sends us into.........

We wish ours would last until noon, its starting to melt out now, and its only 9:30 am! LOL.....

I do understand however, since my origins are from the North Carolina Mts, I can get a sense of
what you are saying, not quite as extreme I am sure........