I made a mandrel to turn down those RMC cases so they will fit the NEF/RGB chamber. Clamps through the flash hole. This way you can use all the case options. I'd like a few of those primers Ed if you can get them.-Rob

Maybe RIP through his friend can. Only way I can get them
is to buy 8ga Industrial cases already primed.
I have only a few in the 8ga cases here,
after all the testing yesterday and today.
I hope we can pry them loose from WIN/REM.
They did a load of RL-19 ok today, 600gr slug.
For most moderate to light weights of 12ga
slug the RL-15 a absolute best. Whether fired off with
this primer or regular primers and starter powder.
But industrial primer not adequate enough
for real slow HBMG, and WC-860 ball,as I got
click bangs, and no huge blast. Don't we just
love the squibs..Ed

Ed,
My contact is "firearms R&D"
and has no excuse for getting ammo components
but said he would call the ammo guy at
Lonoke, Arkansas.
It is not encouraging.
That primer is still not good enough for slowest
powders, eh?
15 grains of Blue Dot and a standard 209
must be better than a CCI-35.
But you gotta be willin'.

No hang fires for me, thanks. Saw it happen with some old .50BMG primers to a guy at a .50BMG match. Have no interest in finding out if a NEF would hold together. ED- will it light off Rl-25 reliably? Thats probably the best powder for the NEFerized 12GaFH. I have not tried even faster powders yet, but as i remember you reccomended Retumbo.-Rob

Rob- No it won't ignite RE-25 reliably either, Tried it 3
times, and it won't do AA8700, Retumbo,VV170.


I reccomended Retumbo just as next fastest up from HBMG in
the sequence of loads using Blue Dot starter, but from results
you and Rip are getting with HBMG and RE-25 you can go
to RE-25 in RMC cases(and our cases if someone put in
shotgun primers), just make sure of no airspace in any
cases by using wads.


I always felt that if some company would make powders like 7383
available it would be great. 7383 ignites fine with regular
shotgun primers in 12ga, but it is surplus and only a few of
us have it.It is a powder that has a lot of the deterrent inside
the of the material, not all near the outside like 99% of
all other powders whether spherical, tubular, or flake.
This allows easier ignition, but yet the deterrent still can
control the speed. Well the new RE-17 just out for 2 days
is setup like that. The surface of the RE-17 grains is
more porous than RE15, so that fact allows better ignition
even though a slower powder, and along with fact that company
got most deterent inside it still regulates speed.
Today I fired with regular REM and WIN primers in
plastic and RMC cases, a whole bunch of loads of RE-17,
with no hesitation or squibs or misfires. Loads ranged from
437 gr slugs to 750gr slugs today. All loads burnt clean
and I got in RMC case one of RG's 715gr jkt slugs to 2300
with 160 gr of RE-17.....Whoopee....Ed

Ed
Are RE 15, RE 17 and RE 25 powders made by Alliant and really called Reloader 15, Reloader 17 and Reloader 25. If so I see that there is a Reloader 19 and Reloader 22 as well. I was wondering if the 19 or 22 might work. ADI AR2209 is somewhere between Reloader 15 and Reloader 19. And ADI AR2213SC is somewhere between Reloader 19 and Reloader 22.

Yes the RE stands for Reloader, all from the same
company. BUT, RE15-19-22-25 have to have starter
powders in 12ga use, with regular 209 primers.
Only the RE17, so far has worked without
starter, only needing the primer. This powder
was just delivered to the market 4 days ago.

Ok, Today so far I shot regular primer with RE-17
and 1040 gr slug in 12GA FH NEF, and it does great.
I fired loads in8ga plastic,in my 8GA FH built on new NEF long
heavy barrel that was a 10 ga and it is great. No hesitation,
it fires off as good in 8ga as the 4759. Remember
I couldn't get good ignition in 8g with 4227, but this
RE-17 is magic.In 8 ga all it would hold under the
wadcup with 770 gr slug is 200 gr with the
wadcup pressed down or compressed real hard,
and it really bellers.2400 plus.Going by case
expansion about 20k pressure. Which don't bother
those one piece compression molded super strong
8ga REM cases. You must have real tight proper
roll crimp in plastic cases and good tight
taper crimp or rolled in crimp in groove
in the brass cases. In RMC brass I size it so slugs
have to be shoved in with press.

And this RE-17 doesn't break up the kernels when powder
gets to a certain point, like the 7383 does, causing burning
rate to speed up more than what it was designed for.
I tested 7383 in my 700, and when up to 35-40k it's
pressure went up fast, much more than linear progression.
I still like 7383 at shotgun pressures and I really like
RE-17.Just pour case full and shoot with lighter slugs.
RIP if you get me a few more of your monsters I'll test them.Ed

What would happen if you was to say grind a course powder into a fine powder, would it still have the same burn rate and would that allow you to pyshicaly fit more powder into a casing ?

Just curious.

Yes that would increase the powder speed
quite a bit, like make rifle powder into shotgun powder, and the speed wouldn't
be safe or uniform. Ed

Murphy has been at me so much the past week I'm so sore just about can't walk...two wipeouts...two broken 5/8" endmills...two muffed MB's.

I tossed the first one, then dug it out of the trash after I though I might try another form...then I got half that one almost finished and he "stuck" me again...

Here is half of one and don't look too hard...I didn't get the final finish inside cuts and I didn't bother to polish.





It has about 4 sq in of vent area...it's a little big as I used 5/8" drills and endmills.

I have another ready to set up in the mill...another form...this time an octagon...might be interesting visually...won't know until???

Even mistakes are worth the time and effort I always thought...although it would be nice to be "almost" perfect sometimes.

Enjoy your toys.

VER IST MINE PANZER? I THINK I HAVE LOST IT! AH! THERE IST THE MUZZEL BRAKE! DANKE!

That's what I'm talkin' 'bout...petal to the metal...balls to the wall...WFO...maximum effort...get'r'done or don't come back...come to this party and no one walks away without help or crawling...hair, teeth and eyeballs everywhere. We're talking one shot, GODZILLA whack'n', don't sweat the small stuff, pure de ol', down and dirty, skin you're peepee, crawlin' in the muck, KILL IT TWICE FOR ME THEN MAKE SURE TWICE AGAIN, good ol' American fun...

Hahahahahahahah


Not to put too fine a point on it...

Enjoy your toys

Ed,
I'll send you some slugs when I can properly size them to .730".
I have a bunch cast that are about .734" and of harder alloy than my first batch.
I will also get some RL-17 for use with the lighter slugs.
I need H50BMG with the 3.25-ouncers.
Pictures of the Remington 8ga-3.25" industrial ammo with
3-ounce lead slug:



2-ounce and 3-ounce zinc slugs:



I have a feeling the 12GaFH-3.85" with brass and lead Darwins would do better at busting rocks!

Rip. There is a chance that the RL-17
may work to get moderate velocities with
your super heavy slug. I will find out
when you get them here. If you have just a
few of softer ones from first batch send
them as I have a die here I made to size
them to .729-.730". I'm really curious to
see how the 17 works on everything.It did
ok with a 1040gr brass. ED

Ed...Have you tried AA2700 or AA2520 with or without a starter load by any chance using Fed 209 primers???

Ed...would a 100 gr RE-17 with 1050 gr lead slugs in a 3.5" plastic be in the ball park???

I'm getting close to starting load development and was running my LD5...1050 gr lead, 3.5" Win Plastic case, 350 gr H2O weighed capacity, 4.00 COAL, 220 gr AA2700 showed about 1900 fs and 27KCUP...the pressure was about 10KCUP below a similar load of RL-15 but the velocity was about 2200 fs for the RL-15.

Recoil is close to 200 ft lbs without a MB...Jezzzz

The numbers don't seem to be quite right. Can anyone check these figures on QL???

I have RL-17 on order but don't know when it will get here.

Hey Rip...who gets to shoot these 8ga industrial slugs, what kind of shooter do they use and WHAT kind of of machine are they trying to kill??? Definitely Terminator Tools. Hahahahahaha

Thanks

Enjoy your toys

I shoot 8ga, but not the fast powder industrial loads.
I now use 4759 and RL-17. I get 8ga cases and reload.

Those ball powders won't ignite reliably with shotgun
primer in 12ga size cases, or bmg size.
I don't use starter powders on ball powder
like AR2520,2700 - W748-760- BLC2-H335 etc.
To hard to regulate a proper increase in velocity in
relation to powder increases. And there is no need
to with all the IMR and Alliant tubular powders out there.

Your ballistics program--OK You can't use water capacity,
that large as the slug is way down in the case so that
capacity is actually much less , Like the place where on top of
a brass case would be on the slug is at the 2.85 to 2.95"
length of the case. The rest of case is above slug and forms
the crimp. And you must actually figur less case capacity for
program as part of space below slug will be wads, as with
a plastic 3.5" case, 1050 gr slug you will run about 110gr
of RL17 and rest wads up to slug. Also you can't
run that fast of powder at 220gr in plastic. Not even
in RMC cases. Top load in RMC 3.5" brass so far , 1040g
with 130gr of RL-17. Got to test more. If you put in 220gr
in RMC with 1050gr you'd be higher than what program says.
Top load so far in RMC with RG's 715 gr jkt is 160 gr of
RL-17. RG's jkt slug is good one for RMC brass.

Our big gunshop(JAYS) gets all its powder, of all brands, hauled in
by a Hodgdon truck, and it was on the shelf Monday the
day that Alliant said it was to be released. Hodgdon appears to
be biggest mfg and for its competition the biggest distributor.
But competition is in name only as both have ball powders made
by Olin/Primex which is tied into Hodgdon.That is right Alliant
now has 5 in their Power Pro series ball powders, matching WIN and
Hodgdon different ball powders.And The RE-17 is made for Alliant
by Chemie in Switzerland.And planning on 2 more to go with......
the.......... 2........... they ............have.........
To much to hope for ---AS ALLIANT ALSO HAS A 50 CAL POWDER
MADE LIKE RL-17 THAT IF I HAD THE INDUSTRIAL SHOTGUN PRIMERS I WOULD
USE IT ALSO.BIG REASON I WANT THEM........ So cats out of the bag. Ed

I made this here muzzle brake for my varmint gun a while back .....

Thanks Ed...I see I posted the full case capacity...the actual capacity with seated slug was around 290 gr H2O. The slug is a truncated cone design with a roll crimp...the slug nose stuck out about 1/4" so the COAL is closer to 3.75", but the case volume is in the neighbor hood of 230 gr H20 with seated slug.

I just wanted some kind of comparison between my LD5 and QL as a check. I checked the numbers against what a 700 Nitro case came up with, basically a 320 gr volume(very close to the plastic 3.4" case volum) 22" bbl, 3.75" COAL, 230 gr net volume and came up with 185 gr RL-15/2000fs/36500 CUP. I think I remember now, you saying that ball powders weren't usefull in this application. I will follow your recommendations.

It's amazing how Bruce Hodgdon et al, started off with a railcar load of powder and ended up being "the" powdermen extraordinaire.

Macifej...nice "knobbynose"...did it work? Bet that added a bit of extra weight out at the end. Is that the 1 liter or two liter Schweppes bottle??? What I would do for better machinery!!!...and maybe a little less hamfisted, junkyard dog, get-a-bigger-hammer 'tude...

Emjoy your toys

Thanks Ed...I see I posted the full case capacity...the actual capacity with seated slug was around 290 gr H2O. The slug is a truncated cone design with a roll crimp...the slug nose stuck out about 1/4" so the COAL is closer to 3.75", but the case volume is in the neighbor hood of 230 gr H20 with seated slug.

I just wanted some kind of comparison between my LD5 and QL as a check. I checked the numbers against what a 700 Nitro case came up with, basically a 320 gr volume(very close to the plastic 3.4" case volum) 22" bbl, 3.75" COAL, 230 gr net volume and came up with 185 gr RL-15/2000fs/36500 CUP. I think I remember now, you saying that ball powders weren't usefull in this application. I will follow your recommendations.

I've wondered why the large caliber/large case cartridges work with a say a magnum rifle primer and this 12GaFH platform using brass cases and shotgun primers doesn't...as far a the 700 Nitro Express, 750 Gatling etc cases go or did they use a different size primer like the 50 BMG does???

Is there that much difference between a 209 shotgun primer and magnum rifle primer as far a flame production is concerned???

It's amazing how Bruce Hodgdon et al, started off with a railcar load of powder and ended up being "the" powdermen extraordinaire.

Macifej...nice "knobbynose"...did it work? Bet that added a bit of extra weight out at the end. Is that the 1 liter or two liter Schweppes bottle??? What I would do for better machinery!!!...and maybe a little less hamfisted, junkyard dog, get-a-bigger-hammer 'tude...

Thanks again for your information!!!

Enjoy your toys

Shotgun regular primers are a little stronger than rifle
primers, but not enough to light off the harder to start
powders in large diameter brass and plastic cases.
Like BMG,12ga, 700NE. Bigger diameter needs stronger primer
Example is the 700NE, in the factory loads are
either loaded with fast easy to start powders or most are
using starter powders. Bertram made the lastest run of
700 NE cases to take BMG primers as guys were having so much
trouble with misfires and didn't want to do starter powders,
but use the softest cup BMG primer out there, so that
shotgun hammers have strength to fire them.
Now in my 585HE, large rifle primer, I can fire off any
slow bmg, 20mm, 25mm powder, charcoal, pine stumps, because
the diameter of the charge match the primer power..Ed

quote:

Originally posted by Macifej:
I made this here muzzle brake for my varmint gun a while back .....

Bloody hell

quote:

Macifej...nice "knobbynose"...did it work? Bet that added a bit of extra weight out at the end. Is that the 1 liter or two liter Schweppes bottle??? What I would do for better machinery!!!...and maybe a little less hamfisted, junkyard dog, get-a-bigger-hammer 'tude...

FOOBAR - that there be a 2 Liter Bottle-O-Schweppes Agua de Lemon ...the brake was roughed out on a 20" x 60" engine lathe so nothing advanced equipment wise. Weighs 14 lbs as you see it but could be taken down to 8 or so by contouring. Does it work ...?? No clue ..it's not threaded or crowned. If someone wants to to finish it and install it on their rifle let me know ...I might send it over to you gratis for the right project. BTB that finish is as machined after sitting for four years ...

Ho...MAN...that's major get down anything needing that knob hanging out there...could have used something like that a few times...none of my toys will handle something that size and I'd get a hernia lifting it.

Thanks for the info Ed...this 12GaFH is the largest case capacity I've played with so far...the rest are just magnum size so Fed 215 handle the spark.

Another MB design...last one for a while...I think it gives a different look...whether it's very effective is questionable...

It weighs 1.43 lbs, 5.25" long...barrel and brake weigh 6.02 lbs, vent area roughly 5 sq in. I put the slots on the top instead on on the side because I wanted the gas jets to push down the barrel...I will also make a round one with the slots on the sides sometime just to try out. Squirrel season is here so I will be in the dispatching service rather than the machining service...

FOOBAR,
That brake should nicely decrease the ground blast when shooting chipmunks from the prone position with slugs.
Shouldn't use sabots or any wads at all.
Your ground squirrel load will have to be a case full of powder and a slug.

Here is the Remington MasterBlaster 8ga:







And the Winchester Western "tool":



And the Winchester Western "RingBlaster":



Winchester has a rifled barrel extension that screws onto the end of their smoothbores.
I don't know if the Remington MasterBlaster is rifled or smoothbore ...

Ed:
Maybe you could screw on a rifled section for your 8ga smoothbore NEF-er.
The part you need is available from Winchester.
I never heard of an 8-Bore Paradox Gun for ball and shot before I read that at the Winchester Western web site.

Now those are narly looking shooters, Rip... something to set up in the front yard to keep the religion peddlers away on Sat and Sun. It needs to be belt fed I think. Hahahahaha

Yeah...I'm wondering how/what I will do/use to fill the empty space between the powder and slug base...maybe some of the foam wads will work???

These last two MB's were more of an machining exersize and for visual stimulation than a real use item...something to do to answer a few questions.

The "OCTYBRAKE" needs some finalizing, the threaded end end isn't quite esthetically pleasing, I need to chuck it up and finish milling the flats to get rid of the large, round diameter.

I have a couple more designs in mind I might try just for kicks, but I think I will end up with something more conventional with vent holes no more than .375"...maybe a hex or 12 sided. My imagination keeps the troops laughing, for sure.

Enjoy your toys...

Foobar- Tilt the head and make some angled Port brakes. I have a couple of Mcmillian FishGill models that look pretty cool. Keep up the good work. Now go shoot some Darwins through that thing. I want to hear more Range reports from others!-Rob

Rob, Ed, FOOBAR,
How about just seating the bullet all the way down into the case until powder is contacted?
When powder charge gets great enough, the bullet nose will show, and crimping may commence.

That would eliminate all the wads and such.
One might be able to pour a bit of melted wax or bullet lube over the top of the bullet nose inside the case to seal it for transport.

Kaboom?

I am ready to start with 170 grains of H50BMG and some more of Rob's brass Darwins, eased by a muzzle brake. Crimped with nose showing, but am thinking of using some Dacron until the case is 100% full of powder.

Surely a 90% case full of powder will work without filler, but could not a ball of Dacron fluff be used to lock the powder in place under the bullet crimped with nose above case mouth?

That ought to shred on through the muzzle brake without creating any problems, other than a blizzard from the muzzle, eh?

And some more industrial 8ga loads from Winchester:



These might be sabot slugs, for use with Winchester's screw-on-paradox-rifled barrel?:

2-7/8 oz. pointy zinc slug:



3 oz. zinc clinker buster:



For some applications, zinc is the lesser evil than lead?

Roll crimping clear plastic hulls with a red paper wrapper inside?
Those industrial hulls do have a bit of a belt in addition to a rim.
Ed just sizes them down or blows them out to standard rimmed configuration, IIRC.
Is that belt just to make them difficult to use in an antique 8 Gauge fowler?

YEAH...fishgills...just what I had in mind for the next project...I'm talking WAYCOOL!!!

I have one of those square column table top mill/drills and had to put a jacking system on the side so I could re-register the head everytime I went "sideways" and made a dial indicator holder to swing the indicator...I was going nutz trying to keep registration over any distance X, Y, and Z.

I finally bought a tilting table to make it milling some things slightly easier. I have plans to make a jig for my index so I don't have to to ANY head tilting....but then I would need to make a tilting center holder also...isn't this machining stuff fun...figuring out the setup is more fun than making the chips fly...

Good idea Rip...most of the 3" case loads with 750 gr slugs I worked up only use about 60-80 gr of powder, so I get away with a BPGS or a nitro overpowder and a star crimp to use up case length...100 plus grains of pop might just fill a 3.5" plastic enough for an 8 pt...won't know until...I might also try doing what Ed did with his plastic wads sans "fingers". Can't see why a fiber/felt/plastic wad won't act like a slug and just whizz right through. Maybe glueing the wad onto the slug base might help, but I would guess the gas pressure might do that anyway.??? I didn't have any problems even shooting the Lyman 525 gr in a "fingered" WAA12 wads shot in the Mossy vented barrel, but those were SMALL holes and not many of them.

I don't see why those industrial slugs wouldn't work for game use...probably not any worse than "lead poisoning"...might not work too well on something like a buffalo's boss but who know's??? Anyone have a thought...8 ga, 3 oz slug...sounds mean to me. Hahahahahah

Yes the belt is too keep them out of light
barreled guns.I have chamber so it fires both with
belt turned. I turn belts to .935" and chamber is
.938". Factory kiln case won't go in. But yet
my turned ones do as well as regular.

Winchester added the rifled extension to the blaster
when they made the zinc slug with long nose sticking
out front. Slugs ended up rear end heavy, and wanted to
tumble so they added rifled piece to stabilize zinc slug,
for longer ranges in the long rotary kilns.The rifled
section was an add to the original smoothbore kiln guns.

I fired one kiln load in the NEF yesterday, It was a WIN
zinc load and I removed all of protuding nose so slug weighed
1000gr. It was the square nose one RIP showed above.
Turned case base down to fit chamber.The
Win load was older, red, paper cased shell, with hairy primer
and original powder,wads, roll crimp, etc.Loaded hot.
I setup 3 other zinc slugs same way(1000gr) and fired them
in my reloads in REM cases, regular primer, with 180gr RL-17.
Both loads recoiled and bellered the same.The 95 gr
of flattened irregular spherical powder in the WIN
factory load is some hairy stuff. It has got to be
some of the WIN 600 series DB ball powder.I fired the WIN
kiln case in NEF, just one shot only for test, and point of info,
to compare with my RE-17 loads.
Don't anybody else do it.

The zinc slug would penetrate ok as it is as hard as
heat treated lead. Drill out hollow base to stabilize
in smoothbore. You all may wonder why I did the 8ga in
smooth. Well rifled is a pain to get and expensive to get.
My whole NEF is half(stock,bore job)of 8bore rifled barrel, if I
could get them to make one. I figure if a 225 dollar gun
and a bore/reaming job gets me a 10,000 ft lb 8ga,
that's great. And I will have a mold for Lyman style slugs
for it done by summer, and they shoot ok in smoothbore.
I made 3 slugs Lyman style from REM lead kiln slugs on lathe,
and they fly straight, no wobble, straight into the backstop.Ed

YEAH...fishgills...just what I had in mind for the next project...I'm talking WAYCOOL!!!

I have one of those square column table top mill/drills and had to put a jacking system on the side so I could re-register the head everytime I went "sideways" and made a dial indicator holder to swing the indicator...I was going nutz trying to keep registration over any distance X, Y, and Z.

I finally bought a tilting table to make it milling some things slightly easier. I have plans to make a jig for my index so I don't have to to ANY head tilting....but then I would need to make a tilting center holder also...isn't this machining stuff fun...figuring out the setup is more fun than making the chips fly...

Good idea Rip...most of the 3" case loads with 750 gr slugs I worked up only use about 60-80 gr of powder, so I get away with a BPGS or a nitro overpowder and a star crimp to use up case length...100 plus grains of pop might just fill a 3.5" plastic enough for an 8 pt...won't know until...I might also try doing what Ed did with his plastic wads sans "fingers". Can't see why a fiber/felt/plastic wad won't act like a slug and just whizz right through. Maybe glueing the wad onto the slug base might help, but I would guess the gas pressure might do that anyway.??? I didn't have any problems even shooting the Lyman 525 gr in a "fingered" WAA12 wads shot in the Mossy vented barrel, but those were SMALL holes and not many of them.

I don't see why those industrial slugs wouldn't work for game use...probably not any worse than "lead poisoning"...might not work too well on something like a buffalo's boss but who know's??? Anyone have a thought...8 ga, 3 oz slug...sounds mean to me. Hahahahahah

I weighed all the pieces and parts less sights...almost 12 lbs so I need to dig up a couple three more pounds somewhere...the forearm will add about 1.5 lbs bare and after I weld on the mount I will at some lead, plus another hole in the stock for lead shot.

It's starting to come together...I will get to work on the stock tomorrow...and start putting together some loads in the next day or so. Got 2" of snow/hail yesterday and last night...but warm will return...someday.

Enjoy your toys.

My sizer for the 12GaFH does a decent taper crimp. Never tried a RMC case in it to see if it will size em down enough. A turned RMC case should be perfect. I've made a FL crimping die that works properly. I also had some brass cases that blew the necks off while fireforming. I cut them back to 3.5 inches on a bandsaw and used them as is for 190-220gr loads with no filler. Kinda like a .38 special in a .357 chamber. In the FL cases, The bullets were too loose in the case when seated below the rim for my tastes. Dont see a problem with it though. I wanted to avoid any use of filler but a little dacron will be OK in a brake of this construction.
Foobar- We are all awaiting your first results. Go get em!-Rob

I couldn't stand it any longer, so I cobbled together some pieces and parts and and popped off a few...hummmm...a few changes are in order. The rifle weighed in a 9.55 lbs...here it is...



Standard Winchester "punknballs" hardly registered on the recoil scale...the 730 gr Dixie Slugs copy wasn't much more, hardly any muzzle rize and recoil straight back...

The next few were the 1040 gr BearBusters from Greg Sappington...55 gr IMR 4759 previously chronoed at 1230 fs. Had to fiddle with the wad column a bit...the first loads were roll crimped and these I 8pt crimped in 3" Rem cases. Started with a BPGS and one .125 nitro card, the next with only the BPGS and the last was .125 nitro card only...8pt crimp came out perfect.

Recoil was in the 80 plus ftlb range without MB and 50 w/MB...felt about like my 10#, 416 Taylor with 400 gr bullets at 2300 fs without MB.

About 12-15" muzzle rise...this laminates stock is so slick in the grip it's not much good for holding onto, so I will correct that and it will go on another shooter. I started sanding out the walnut stock, but got tired of that quick... ...needing a S&M fix.

The powder dusted only the first 3 vents, the rest were just slightly dusted, so this brake can be shortened probably...realistically I think 0.375" holes and slots would work just as well...maybe one set of 0.500" first as a "quickdump" feature.


I'm thinking about how to set up the next "sharkgill" brake and how I will do the slots...I'm thinking about cutting the slots at a angle backwards to see if or how much the gas jets will pull on the rifle...Anyone have any ideas on that on the amount of angle or will I just have to experiment....??? ...I'm thinking start at 15°...???

The top slots do keep the muzzle rise down...I will test how much as time goes by.

Heart Dr. appt on Wed so I will pick up a recoil pad for the walnut stock, stick it on the NEF frame, order a walnut forearm and check on RL-17 availability, also...I can work on loads and the stock at the same time.

At least I have plenty of Red Dot, Blue Dot, Rl-15-19,-22 and -25, a few hundred cast slugs in various weights and a couple hundred 3.5" plastics to play inbetween the sage rat extermination.

Foobar-The Mcmillan slots were 20 degrees as I remember. Dont have it with me right now so cant measure till next week. I doubt there is some magic formula. It will definately look cool though. Glad you got her shooting. Try some of those Darwins. I think you'll be impressed. 190-200grs is a good place to start and doesnt need any filler.-Rob

I was digging around and found some H50BMG I disremembered I had...15 gr BlueDot starter powder and away I go...

I weighed those Darwins you sent at 1095 gr...But I'm saving them for the "REAL THING". Still need to make a set of dies before I get wild with the brass cases. If I can get fancy with the crossfeed I can make the sizer do double duty...sizer AND taper crimper...maybe...a guy can always dream and try.

That big ol' MB isn't doing much in the way of recoil reduction with the small amount of powder I'm using with the 3" cases, I don't suspect...but it might when I get into the 100 plus grain weight.

Someone posted a load of ** IMR4227, 3.5" plastic, star crimp, at 1300 fs and 15KPSI in the NEF and 1400fs using an RMC case so I think my 55 gr load of 4759 has a ways to go and a 900 gr double Brenneke at 1600 fs...(ED, I think)...so I will try some of Gregs 880's and see what...happens.

Sometime between stock work, rat killing reloading and load workup I have to get that "Jaws" brake made and turn out some pointed conical brass slugs to try...

Gonna be a busy summer.

Enjoy your toys.

quote:

Originally posted by FOOBAR:I'm thinking about how to set up the next "sharkgill" brake and how I will do the slots...I'm thinking about cutting the slots at a angle backwards to see if or how much the gas jets will pull on the rifle...Anyone have any ideas on that on the amount of angle or will I just have to experiment....???...I'm thinking start at 15°...???

The top slots do keep the muzzle rise down...I will test how much as time goes by.

Idealy no leading edge of the ports should have sharp edges nor the side ports be at 90° to the flight path of the round. The ideal would be 30° side ports facing back towards the Breach. Top ports for down pressure are fine at 90° but again try to eliminate any sharp edges on the forward section of the ports. Here is an img of a port setup I intend to try to emulate for the barrel when I get it.

Hoooeeee...thatsabiggadoohicky... Yeah...that might work. Not sure how I could do all those curves accurately with my equipment...maybe with CNC equipment...but I saved the picture...think I saw that one before somewhere.

I can get the angled ports but not sure I can rotate my index well enough with it's little handle...might have to figure out another way to get that particular rotation.

I have three different plans for cutting the ports which I'll tryout in AL first...one way cut straight across making the bottom of the cut flat and square...the second cutting in from the side making the vents rounded on the bottoms...I did a couple out of AL that way...and the third a plunge cut similar to the way I did the top cuts on the "Octybrake"

I don't have a dividing head or H/V rotary table otherwise it would be easy to get that rotary cut done AND the rest of the job would be much easier also. Fate has dictated I get only part of the toys to play with...and only some of the brainpower...

Thanks for the picture, Gibs...it added an extra dimension to the thought process. I'm guessing those slots are about 1/2" wide???? and no top holes. With the size of the NEF barrel there might be room for a row of 3/8" holes...Now I gotta figure out how to draw that narly thing with my cheap AutoCad knockoff. Hahahahahaha

Enjoy your toys.

NP's Foobar, and yes you did see it before, on page 34/35. I posted it way back then.

I'm not to sure how I'll go either when I get mine done, as my MB will be an integral part of the barrel with full bore + rifling right the way through (I hope).

Whoever does it needs a LONG milling table AND an accurate rotary table and/or CNC.

I'm wondering how the bullet will react with the interrupted rifling??? Will it affect accuracy or not??? Something to think about.

Good Luck on your project.

Foobar-On the stock-stay with thumbhole just scrape and
sand off all the sprayed on shiny finish crap.
Get down to the wood laminate.
Use course sand paper.Don't want shiny finish. Then stain
use a water based walnut stain. It will raise the grain
a little and give a surface 3 times easier to grip.

On an integral brake with big holes like expansion brakes
have, like Vias, you should have hole through brake
little bigger than groove diameter. It is not like
the small holes that are in many barrels that use
higher pressures to reduce recoil and muzzle jump.
If built for expansion with big holes, you need
extra diameter for gases to expand.Ed