well, CCM, since you brought up מוהל one can add that the 600 grainer seems dedicated to ΠΡΙΑΠΟΣ

416,
I am glad I "Babblefish"'ed that rather than ask my wife, who is Greek, to translate it. I'm sure she would have had a good laugh at my expense.

Michael,
seems to me that this particular design would cause tremendous if not explosive internal damage as the front "blew up" while the remainder penetrated deeply.
Obviously this is not a paying job and you just work for tips ...

I don't even know what to say! That's a first!

I ain't gonna lie, I thought all the same things too!

HEH HEH!

I hope George don't shut us down now??????

Talk about "Bullet Porn"

M

Doc

Yep, actually and truly, we are thinking if it was possible to Blow the nose off, in petals/blades, causing tremendous trauma, and was hoping that we could be left with the remaining slug as a BBW #13 Profile--For deeper penetration of the remaining slug. As you can see the undercuts resemble a #13!

Maybe? Don't know, we will find out this week. I am afraid what might happen is an uneven shear, or a more pointy shear which will not facilitate penetration, but cause it to veer. Or a smaller meplat than what we planned. This is a little tricky, and might take some trial and error to get it just right.

My son was on range cleanup duty today! He did well, except for pulling too hard on the water hose, busting my water pipe down range! This means I am dry down range. Until repaired, hopefully tomorrow afternoon, terminals are shut down.

Michael

Well the tests wont lie and yo uwill ahve some answers. The a scenario that might not be easily tested but certainly happens in the field is an angling shot. In my mind, I picture the head of the bullet shearing off to one side, serving as a ramp on which the remaining bullet shaft rides and veers much more than would otherwise happen had it not existed.

Looking forward to hearing of the results.

Paul

An angling shot is really hard to duplicate here in the "lab", but what you are talking about most certainly can happen. In fact I have seen it happen. Back in 2008 I shot an oryx with the 50 B&M, 470 Copper Non Con, 6 blades. Severe angle from the rear. Velocity only about 2150 fps at the time, and at that velocity the blades do not shear in the 50, but open up. 4 of the blades opened perfectly on one side, two blades did not. Bullet drove from rear angle far back on the rib cage to the far shoulder. Straight as far as I could tell? Of course the oryx was stone cold on the spot. Of course there was no shearing. Now I used the same bullet in Australia on those buffalo from the 500 MDM at 2400 fps, if it was impact under 50-60 yds the blades sheared every time. I shot every angle you can imagine, but there was a lot of shooting going on, and not a lot of postmortems! Anything can happen in the field, things that are hard to figure sometimes in the lab, so we do the best we can.

Right now I postponed the tests with the .510s, I have BBW #13 HPs on the way, should be here maybe today, maybe tomorrow, so instead of doing the .510s first, I wanted to try our new bullets, 3 bands topside, 1 bottom band, copper .300 deep cavity, brass .400 deep cavity. Lot's of work to do with these, terminals of course, but POIs in different rifles, different velocities and so forth. In general laying the ground work to go to other calibers with the same systems--BBW #13 solid, and slightly lighter BBW #13 HP. If I get the same POIs at 50 with these, and I suspect very strongly I will, then I personally am for staying with the lighter weight HP, at least for right now until I learn different. In the past with all these bullets POI has been the same at 50 yds, and I have never had an issue, even with velocity vastly different between the solid and the HP. In the same 500 MDM in Australia I used a 510 solid and a 470 HP, a 455 Solid, and the bullet with the cuts in the meplat. 4 different bullets, the lighter bullets at 2400 fps, the 510 solid at 2200 fps. The 450 weight bullets were about a 1/2 inch lower than the 470 and 510, which the 470 and 510 were in the same hole. Same with the 50 B&Ms, used that same combo, lower velocity, same POI. I am almost 99% sure the BBWs will be same POI too. No reason for them not to be. Same bearing surface, same bands, same everything, except the HP. If this does sort out, then you have both for your doubles, HP up front for buff, followed by the solid.

Michael

The peanut gallery says: wholly palus batman

Hmmmm, "blowing off the Nose". . . .

Nah. . . . not gunna say it. . . . .

I got a very nice package today, well, actually 3 packages! FULL OF BULLETS!




The first real production run of a CEB BBW #13!




This is of course my 500 gr CEB BBW #13 brass--with the 4 bands equally spaced. I did not catch Dan in time to make the band change on these, however these are working great for me in both the 50 B&M and the 500 MDM without issues.

Do take notice of the packaging, all big bores will come 18 per box, that's what that foam divider holds with big bore slugs!






I guess it's a good thing they come in a box, nicely packaged. That keeps me from dumping them in the floor and rolling in them naked! Just too much of a mission to take 1000 of them out of the box and then put them back in, takes all the fun out of it! Damn!!!!!!!! Oh well, I do like the box and the foam divider, and 18 is a good number I reckon per box!

Dan wants to change the box later on, I suppose when he prints a new run, and have our big solid streaking downrange on it--YES!

Now along these lines, I think today it is official, the 500 MDM is the most powerful cartridge ever put in a Winchester M70! I am talking working rifle, 3 rds down and feed and function, not talking about someone taking a Win M70 making a single shot out of it with a big cartridge! A real working rifle, that one can take to the field and depend upon!

Today these very same 500 gr CEB BBW #13s--102/RL 10X for 2617 fps at 62670 PSI, and case study agrees! 2617 fps with a 500 gr bullet, in an 8.5 lb rifle with a 21 inch barrel! That amazes me! In case you forgot what one of the 500 MDMs looks like.



But wait, I ain't through yet--How about a 450 gr North Fork CPS with 105/RL 10X for 2748 fps at 59372 PSI, case study agrees! 2748 fps with a 450!

Unless someone knows of something with more, then the 500 MDM is King of the Winchester M70s!

Michael

Very good looking bullets

They do look good! However they look a lot better next to the new 460 gr CEB BBW #13 Hollow Points!
The new Band Configuration--3 top/1 bottom all shoot 1 hole at 50 yds, I can't do any better than that!








And also the new 425 gr Copper BBW #13 Solid and the 395 gr BBW #13 Hollow Point.





Accuracy of the 3/1 Bands is great, terminals of the hollow points is fantastic, and pressures remained the same or lower with moving the bands to the top. Very Excellent.

Michael

Michael,

The new CEB BBW #13’s and #13 HP all look great…the new 3U/1L band configuration looks like a winner.

Now how about Sam’s “mushroom head” HPs?? Have you shot any yet?? Do they lose their “head” and the remaining #13 bullet shape perform as intended??? The peanut gallery wants to know!!!

Those are absolutely gorgeous and seem to have "show" AND "go".

Now, when do I get my .620s? Am I going to have to send my cousin Vito over?
He is sort of an orthopedic surgeon - works mainly on knees

Micheal458, are those availible in 416 caliber?

quote:

Originally posted by jwp475:
Micheal458, are those available in 416 caliber?

I believe Michael’s been put away for the evening but here's a quote from one of his posts on page 105:

quote:

upcoming bullets in 458 and 416, 375,9.3 in the B&Ms

…so I believe the CEB BBW #13s, both HP and FN, will be available in the not too distant future for the 416...though I imagine they’ll be close to 350gr rather than 400gr in weight.

I had a big day planned out yesterday, everything laid out, terminals along with pressure traces, with both the 500 MDM and the 50 B&M. Well, I had some issues long before I got close to the 500 MDM work.

You know how you are ALWAYS told as a hand loader, when changing components always start out lower than where you were before??? Who the hell does that? OK, Guilty as charged! JHC--I don't have time for that crap!

Well, yesterday I had 3 terminals for the 50 B&M--395 gr BBW #13 Copper HP--450 SSK/Lehigh Brass HP--460 CEB BBW #13 Brass HP. Along with the terminals, pressure traces on each load. With the 395 74/IMR 4198, the 450 SSK/Lehigh 70/IMR 4198, and the 460 #13 HP 70/IMR 4198. Basically the same load on the 450-460 as the 500 Solids! Then my next mission was to do some 50 yd POI tests with both the 460 HP and the 500 Solid, so I had several solids loaded for that. Well, having plenty of them, I decided to run a pressure trace just for giggles--Thank goodness! Problem is Pressures went up 5000-6000 PSI from the other day???? Even at 65000 the 500s were very slightly sticky--the 50 B&M I have run many times up to 70000 and not even stick???? What the hell?

OK, started thinking what I had done! After going back to the lab--I sized the brass, and started putting 215s in--I could not even feel the primer go in--Loose Primer pockets! OK, this 50 B&M brass has been fired for the last 3 years, lord knows how many times it has been fired, used for tests, you name it--I lost count long ago, but I would not be surprised if it had not been shot 50 times each or even more! I know that sounds crazy, but it's true. We hate to part with brass don't we? OK, I broke down and tossed the entire lot in the trash!

Then I got a whole bag of new brass out and started priming. Then it occurred to me, I had to open a new lot of Federal 215 Primers! Then, even worse, I had started on a new 8 lb keg of IMR 4198 at the same time? OK, old worn out brass, new primers, new keg of powder? Hmmmmmm? Might be something to this?????

Loaded up a test run of 69/IMR 4198 and the 500 #13--2216 fps 64000 PSI--New brass, not sticky, no issues, except that is a lot of velocity for a 500 gr bullet in a 18 inch gun. 68/IRM 4198, back down to 2190 fps and 55000 PSI, much better than the old brass, primers, powder! Before I had 70/IMR 4198 for 2190 fps at 60000 PSI---New powder, Primer, Brass I equaled the velocity with 68/IMR 4198, and pressures dropped! 66/IMR 4198= 2140 fps and 52000 PSI. So back in the running! And even better to boot. But it took a lot of shooting and test to get back to that point!

Jest of the matter--We probably really should check things out when we make major changes, like I did--brass should have been tossed a long time ago, too well used. New Primers--New Keg of Powder! All could have spelled some issues had I not already been working 5000-7000 PSI under what I deem max.

So yes, it really can happen from time to time. I promise I am not careful enough when it comes to these sort of things, and probably won't be that concerned about it in the future to be honest, but that's me, don't do what I do, do what I say do. I have too much going on sometimes eh?

Jim, nope, have not got to the "mushroom headed HPs of Sams--had they been .500 yes, but being .510 I have to use the Wells for that, and just have not had time to load and set them up--I put all priority on the new .500s.

Paul, almost there, still have some work I must do before moving forward. I want to make 100% sure we are good to go--almost there. When Sam returns we test the barrel strain with the new 3U/1L bands and I think we will be there.

JWP, not yet in 416, but not long, same story as the .620s, still have some work to do, but getting closer by the day. I will be doing a 458 and 416 in brass, exactly like the .500s are, probably 450 in 458 and 350-360 in 416. Thinking of 360 solid and 320-330 HP. But I have POIs to work with on the .500s first before taking to other calibers. On my end, I will have every B&M cartridge fitted with these, and in the weights I need for them, which will work will with other 474s, 458s, 416s, and 9.3s as well.

BUT--have to go through the test processes to be sure of things first. Terminals are there, now it's POIs-Accuracy-pressures, those sorts of things! WOrking on them all!

I will have some reports a bit later this morning. Still working data from yesterday!

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
I had a big day planned out yesterday, everything laid out, terminals along with pressure traces, with both the 500 MDM and the 50 B&M. Well, I had some issues long before I got close to the 500 MDM work.

You know how you are ALWAYS told as a hand loader, when changing components always start out lower than where you were before??? Who the hell does that? OK, Guilty as charged! JHC--I don't have time for that crap!
…….
I will have some reports a bit later this morning. Still working data from yesterday!

Michael

Oops…good reminder for all of us!

And…dang…I don’t know if the 13s look better in the raw or loaded up.

They just have that “look” about them…clean and deadly!

LOL...should have known Sam would do the "mushroom heads" for a NE rather than bolt trash.

Gees, busy today too. News is this. I am very pleased that although I was too late to catch the 500 gr CEB BBW#13 in moving the bands to the top, I am happy that I got the rest of that changed. The 4 spaced even bands are not doing so well in the accuracy dept, but with the 3 bands up top everything changes.

They will actually shoot better than what you see below. This was the last shooting of a very very long day on the range yesterday with the 460 BBW Brass HP. I used two rifles.





The two smaller copper bullets, 425 BBW #13 and the 395 HP shoot excellent also. 3 Bands top, 1 band bottom is the trick, and pressures low. Now when Sam returns we do the barrel strain with the 470 Nitro and if that holds we are ready.

I am still shooting for POIs and continuing to test. I am busy shooting up my stock, so far have run 22 boxes out this week! Several yesterday!

The problem I am having with the 4 bands that are even is in the 50 B&M, too much bullet jump from case to barrel issues. I seated out further this morning, accuracy was better of course, but still need those bands up top to get things started off right in the beginning, so that is solved even before it was an issue--except for the 45 or so boxes I still have. I have already ordered another 250 of the 500s--of course bands up top.

Almost there guys, almost!

M

Terminals

I have a couple done. First-our Copper BBW #13 HP. We have the exact right formula for the petals or blades shearing exactly like a brass bullet now! .300 deep cavity-six blades and they shear in a star pattern around center and penetrate away from center-just as the brass does.

I think they hold on maybe an inch more than what the brass does. Which is fine. Both are excellent, and as we saw from Sams deer the other week, the petals do a lot of damage inside the body cavity, and even exit! Which is amazing!







With this .300 deep cavity in the copper I think is the ticket! This means the copper HPs for the double rifles are going to work very very good--buffalo slammers!

Do notice the amount of penetration on this very light for caliber bullet!!!!!! Remember, a 500 gr Woodleigh 458 at Lott velocity will only penetrate 20 inches in this same mix, A 500 gr Nosler Partition could only do 19 inches from the Lott! So remember what you are looking at!

NOw, I must get back on the range quickly

Michael

The 460gr BBW #13 HP is definitely a keeper! As well the 395gr BBW #13 HP…definitely good performance and penetration…25” with 315gr remaining weight is truly a yeehaw moment.

I never got to posting the other bullets--will do so in the morning, main computer is shut down. I did end up doing some shooting this afternoon, about a 100 rounds worth. The 395 BBW HP and the 425 BBW 13 Solid-both copper, same POI at 50 yds. Used the same load--70/IMR 4198, light load actually, 2300 fps. Same POI with two rifles, post targets in the morning. The Maple 50 shot the 500 #13 and 460 HP about an inch apart high and low, same exact windage--but the solid was a 100 fps slower than the 460 HP-not the same load--66 and 68 IMR 4198. I got the 500 with 4 even bands to shoot today, had to seat it long, which is exactly what I figured I would have to do with it--seated deep it just has too much jump from case to barrel and no bands in the top to straighten it. 3 bands at the top solves a lot more problems than I anticipated. Lot's of grip on the case now, no movement of the bullet. So these are solved now, and it looks like POI is not going to be an issue at all--not at DG ranges.

I am going to continue to shoot through the weekend and need to do some work with the 500 MDM rifles with these bullets too.

More to come.........Stay Tuned!

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
The 460gr BBW #13 HP is definitely a keeper! As well the 395gr BBW #13 HP…definitely good performance and penetration…25” with 315gr remaining weight is truly a yeehaw moment.

Wait until I post the 460 tomorrow--extreme performance.

What I am so pleased about with the coppers is the way the petals shear--I am convinced that shearing and moving away from center does more damage, and inflicts more trauma, than the petals shearing and staying in the wound cavity.

With deeper cavities---.400--.500 inches petals want to hang tighter, peel back and shear within the wound channel. By shortening the depth of the hollow point to .300, the petals shear up front, like brass, and move away from center.

I was pleased that worked as planned as well! That is a nice step in the right direction for the copper double rifle combos!

Later

Michael

quote:

so I believe the CEB BBW #13s, both HP and FN, will be available in the not too distant future for the 416...though I imagine they’ll be close to 350gr rather than 400gr in weight.

Just right

OK the other day I received an order from Lehigh that was 5 months in the making! It was only 500 450 gr brass HPs! But there were some communication issues there. But I did get them, and they performed very well, as expected.

And now, of course my favorite because it matches up with the solid








This is a buffalo SLAMMER!!!!!!! No buffalo that ever walked can handle any of this!

It's the bullets boys--the bullets!

Now, some of you will be happy to hear--a 450 gr BBW #13 .458 Caliber brass solid has been ordered, along with it's matching HP. A 350 gr 416 caliber BBW #13 Solid has been ordered, along with it's matching HP also. Remember, the HP will be slightly less--but should be same POI at DG ranges--50 yds is what I consider DG ranges! I will be ready with both of these being tested in B&M cartridges and rifles--strain gages attached to test pressures--the works! So we enter a new era and see if we can take this to the next step.

Michael

quote:

a 450 gr BBW #13 .458 Caliber brass solid has been ordered, along with it's matching HP.

Why am I suddenly so intrigued by that statement?
Keep on doing it, Michael
Best
plain ol eljefe (from AHN)

eljefe

Welcome to AR--our little home this side of the pond! Very happy to see you here!

Yes, I wonder why you have an interest in the upcoming 458s--HEH HEH!

After you read the entire 106 pages then you will know we have put forth some effort here to learn something about bullets!

I am of the opinion that the bullet actually does the work, not the cartridge or the rifles, those are other issues--it's terminal performance of the bullet that is important. I figure if we can "enhance" the way the bullet operates--then that will enhance our cartridges and rifles!

What use is a cartridge, if the bullet does not do it's job? What good is a rifle if the bullet does not do what it's supposed to do? It boils down to the bullet!

Welcome and glad to see you!

Michael

OK before I am off to the lab and loading, and checking things out, and maybe range work later, I am going to show you how bad a shot I am! I am going to show you the good, bad and the ugly. I have been shooting for so many months at 25 yds doing pressure traces, terminals, lord knows what else, I swear I have forgot how to shoot at 50! You can get away with a lot at 25, 50 will bust you! Of course, I expedite a lot--to get better productivity and more tests done. At 25 you can do this, at 50 it busts you!

First I am going to start with the .500s copper. This is to show POI at 50 yds with the 395 Copper BBW #13 Hollow Point as opposed to the 425 BBW #13 Solid--exact same bearing surface, same load 70/IMR 4198, not far from the same velocity actually in two different rifles. I promise you that if it's not in the same holes--it's my piss poor shooting that is the issue. I don't see any problems with these hitting at the same or close to the same POI at 50 yds. This will carry over to other rifles, calibers, I am pretty sure. Which means to me at buffalo distances there is not going to be much of a problem with POI.

The 500 gr BBW #13 SOlid--4 even bands which was shooting pretty lousy the other day. Seating it out longer, giving less bullet jump helped tremendously with the accuracy issue of not having the top bands guide the bullet into the barrel. With the 3 bands up top, there are no issues, even with a long bullet jump to barrel as you can see with the hollow point 3 bands topside. Of course this issue has been solved, and ALL bullets now come with 3 bands top/1 bottom.

This is the maple 50 B&M--the two bullets are not the same load-the 500 gr is 66/IMR 4198 for 2130 fps and the 460 HP is 68/IMR 4198 for 2218 fps. There is a little more gap between top and bottom than there would be if they were the same load out. R/L is perfect. So even this is good.



Now I have to show you this--just trying to get a decent group at 50 yds--I wonder what the hell that one is off to the right and low? DAMN!!!!!!! As you note-- I signed off on it!

Well, try as hard as I can to tighten things up, I still let one slip out. I think the bullets are going to shoot accurately and are not an issue. Michael is the one that needs to tighten up the act some!

Now something else I need to mention before I forget it. You guys know I have been working with and testing the little 1X4 Leupold VX ONE scopes on these two 50s. The turkish 50 has a heavy duplex in it, the maple has that nifty little circle duplex turkey thing they call it. Well, I have not broken them yet--but at 50 yds they just don't seem to be as clear to me????? Might be my eyes I just really can't say, and another thing, I am having some issues with dialing the damned things in and staying where I keep them, I THINK--again I just can't quite put my finger on it yet, so don't rush out and buy any of these yet. They are holding up well, as stated I have not broke them yet! But honestly, I think I like the VX 2 1X4 a little better.

Just FYI on that whilst I thought of it.

Something else, you guys that handload! Do you have a OLD CAN of powder on your shelves? Maybe an old can of powder that has not been cared for, stored properly? But you hate to throw it away? But you also wonder about it, especially when you pour it out and you have particles like smoke drifting around it? The tell tell sign that it has seen better days right?

Well I have some of that! I can't quite recall where it come from, I think it was given to me at some point. But since I had the pressure trace hooked up I conducted a little test of that. Anyone interested in the outcome? Speak up now, don't let me think I am here alone?

Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
Something else, you guys that handload! Do you have a OLD CAN of powder on your shelves? Maybe an old can of powder that has not been cared for, stored properly? But you hate to throw it away? But you also wonder about it, especially when you pour it out and you have particles like smoke drifting around it? The tell tell sign that it has seen better days right?

Well I have some of that! I can't quite recall where it come from, I think it was given to me at some point. But since I had the pressure trace hooked up I conducted a little test of that. Anyone interested in the outcome? Speak up now, don't let me think I am here alone?

Michael

Well???

I have some that's at least a couple decades old and a bit "dusty and brown" ...

Paul, ok, I will tell you!

Of course ya'll know I like IMR 4198 for the 50 B&M. And we all know this week I had the BS with the new keg of IMR 4198, new case of 215 Primers, and shot out brass! Well during all this I have these 3 OLD cans of IMR 4198! Loading the 50s, had a strain gage on one, hey, lets see what happens? Dusty, nasty smelling stuff! Very Old.





So, I picked a medium load--using the new 425 Copper BBW #13. 70/IMR 4198 Old and New!
I only shot 3 rounds of each.

425 BBW #13--70/IMR 4198 OLD POWDER

2279 fps--2272 fps ES-7 Average 2276 fps 53090 PSI

With the NEW POWDER

2246 fps--2222 fps ES-23 Average 2230 fps 49845 PSI


Really and truly, yes there is a difference, but it's not much. It actually shot well, I think myself (can't tell you what to do of course) I will shoot the stuff up, but use lighter loads, and only practice type loads--I would not take the stuff on a hunt or use it in a serious way.

Also--that's a very minor test, and only one type of powder only. Other powders might react totally crazy??? Who Knows?

Just FYI--It struck me curious at the moment. You know I am the curious type!

Michael

Hey, I just noticed something. You see that 8 lb keg of powder in the photo! Well, that was the Old 8 lb keg! And it gave 2240 or so fps with that 425 at 70/IMR 4198.

I shot the new 8 lbs yesterday--it is back up to 2280 or so! Hmmmm--Gotta watch this stuff!

M

Hey, Look what come on the UPS today? I don't know what this could be, I don't shoot "Shotguns", this sorta looks like a "shotgun bullet" of some sort? Gees, there's a lot of them too?

Well, I am about full of it today! I do have some news for you, had to go see my heart doctor this morning! Really, got some pretty sad news! Doctor Nemo (I call him that--he always wants me to eat damned fish), says that I am going to die! Yep, I am a dead man walking! Probably only have another 30, maybe 40 years left! Depends on the smoking, drinking, chasing women, eating red meat that sort of thing. So, looks like I am going to have to slow down some, so tonight I am going to take my "young" wife to eat out,but leave the girlfriend at home, figure on Jap Cusine, love the Sake you know. Eat a couple of pounds of fillet, gallon or so of Sake, have a couple of packs of smokes along, just take it easy on myself for a change.





HEH HEH HEH HEH!!!!!! YIPPIE HA!!!

Had ya'll going for a minute, didn't I? HEH--I can bet one or two was jumping up and down happy--HEH HEH HEH!!!!!!!!

Damn right, going to drink whole milk jug full of Sake here in a little while! You know, those large ones? I don't share either!

OK, before I leave, got a nice little surprise from one of the 500 MDMs. This with a normal load seated where I like it for this cartridge. I knew it had to be the bullet jump and the missing band on the 50 B&M causing the issues! Of course thinking of that Sake later caused me to not have them all in 1 hole. Hmmmm, maybe I should try after the Sake? I always shoot better after a few beers, should work with Sake too I reckon?




Later
Michael

Sake Is Very Good! The more you have, the better it is!

God Almighty! This is a quite bunch! What's with you guys? Not a peep?

I don't want to hear you have something better to do than this? That won't work with me! I have 20 things going on at once, surely to god you can do a couple of things and reply to this?

Holy Cow!

M

HEHHEH--lot's of sake! Now I have to go entertain "the girls" YIPPIE--better be something on here in the morning to entertain me!!!!!!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
OK, before I leave, got a nice little surprise from one of the 500 MDMs. This with a normal load seated where I like it for this cartridge. I knew it had to be the bullet jump and the missing band on the 50 B&M causing the issues! Of course thinking of that Sake later caused me to not have them all in 1 hole. Hmmmm, maybe I should try after the Sake? I always shoot better after a few beers, should work with Sake too I reckon?




Later
Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
Sake Is Very Good! The more you have, the better it is!

God Almighty! This is a quite bunch! What's with you guys? Not a peep?

I don't want to hear you have something better to do than this? That won't work with me! I have 20 things going on at once, surely to god you can do a couple of things and reply to this?

Holy Cow!

M

HEHHEH--lot's of sake! Now I have to go entertain "the girls" YIPPIE--better be something on here in the morning to entertain me!!!!!!!!!!

Geez Michael...some of us have been out in the world and only now getting home to the computer!!!

Hey...I thought you said the accuracy sucked on the 500 MDM unless you seating the bullet long! That picture looks like a perfect match between old style #13 bullet with 4-equally spaced bands and the old style long neck 500 MDM case!!! Oops just checked...that's the new short neck 500 MDM case!! But the bullet does look like it'd be perfect for the long neck 500 MDM case.

Michael-Sake, waigu beef and a pretty girl friend? whoah, and a 50 MDM grouping like that? I think you ought to see your doctor soon-in about 20 years

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
Hey, Look what come on the UPS today? I don't know what this could be, I don't shoot "Shotguns", this sorta looks like a "shotgun bullet" of some sort? Gees, there's a lot of them too?

What are you going to do with these Michael?