The load I was using in my 50 B&M was light compared to Michael's standards. 350 grain at about 2400 FPS out of an 18 inch barrel. 5 of the 6 petals exited the deer. Very good performance and did just what was thought they would do on game.

Sam

OK now, next--Sam took a few of our CEB BBW #13s-two bands, in copper and poked some holes in the end of them. Once again, we need a #13 Hollow Point to match up proper with the solids. So I think early on we have that sorted out easy!

Sam made 3 different designs, a Shallow hollow point, 6 blades, with the HP .350 or so deep. A deeper HP at about .5 inches deep, 6 blades, and a cup point. These are .510 caliber BBW #13s.

I don't have 500 Nitro, but I have 510 Wells. Loaded up 105/RL 15. I thought it should be around 2200 fps, but got some surprises, I forgot that these are the 2 band bullets and got a little more velocity than I expected. The deep HP ran 510 grs, and I think maybe a little light to match same POI with the 570 at 50 yds. The .350 HP weighed 530 grs, and I think it will match POI of the #13 Solid at 50 yds, and the cup point at 550 grs.

Here is the 510 gr HP BBW #13



The blades are longer on this bullet, hollow point deeper. The blade shear, but they continue to shear along the same wound cavity as the main slug. Typical copper Non Con. Lot's of trauma, lot's of damage. Most of the trauma inflicted has passed by the time the bullet passed the 10 inch witness cards. Good trauma at 4 inches.



I have used this sort of HP in the field a lot, excellent results, dead buffalo where they stand. Incredible penetration as you can see--32 inches for any expanding or non con bullet is amazing. The North Fork Cup Points I had done for the 50 B&M will get this far, but rarely anything else. Straight line penetration also. Keep in mind, the finest biggest fasted Swift A Frame from any 458 or 470 or anything else will go to 24-26 inches MAX, Woodleighs to 20-22 inches! This did 32 inches!

Michael

Now let's move to the Cup Point bullet. It weighed 550 grs, no blades or petals. I was a little surprised, it did not expand at all, but completely sheared off the nose where the HP was.



This shear was not a nice even shear across the top, but tapered to the rear leaving a pointy type center on the bullet. This caused it to loose stability at 18 inches veering off course to 26 inches.




It produced MASSIVE TRAUMA up front at the 4 inch witness card, about as much as I have seen. But it tapered off and was drilling a hole at 10 inches, so trauma did not last long. I think it exploded just before or right at the 4 inch card.




Sam and I think one might could take this design, undercut at the base of the HP on a 13 degree angle, when the top exploded and shears causing extreme trauma, then what comes out is a BBW #13 Solid! WOW--That would be incredible eh?

Michael

Con,
Nice HP Spitzer bullet and it seems to work very well! Interestingly it’s not too dissimilar to the .500 caliber HP Spitzer bullet prototypes that Sam worked up for me; Michael’s test results back on page 92.

Sam,
Two deer…you need to post the photos!

Michael,
Don’t discount the 510gr CEB BBW #13 HP yet, very good results and it’d likely be a perfect match to a 535gr BBW #13 solid (remember 535gr is/was factory loading for 500 Jeffery).

Jim,

I still have not figured out how to post photos and besides they were just does, no big racks. I sent the other photos to Michael but they were a little too messy to post. Non con's are amazing bullets.

Sam

I saved what I think is best for last! The more shallow HP. This one had a .350 depth, or close. I got a big surprise, never had a copper HP do this. But this one with it's .350 hollow point sheared exactly like a brass HP would do, star pattern, 6 blades shearing off at 2-3 inches, then penetrating away from center. My theory is this, the shorter blades exploding off the main part of the bullet because of more mass behind pushing them. They are shorter, so less peeling effect, copper is more malleable than brass, so if those blades get a chance to peel, then they tend to "hang" longer instead of shearing off in a consistent manner. Now, with short blades, they do not peel, but get back to a point of breaking off quicker and moving away from center-- I think Sam found the solution! Now I get some credit, as I mentioned the shallow HP to Sam a week ago or more, but I do have to admit that my reason was to keep weight closer to the solid! HEH HEH!

I also run out of witness cards, so I had to use a laminated target I had on the range. I have to get busy and make a new bunch of witness cards. I have plenty of material, just have not had time to do so.





Trauma carried on further than the other two bullets, showing good trauma at 10 inches.

Also, notice the INCREDIBLE penetration, and it was 100% dead straight line, and nose forward in the test medium! Because the blades sheared even across, left a nice big flat surface for penetration!

These are the most incredible bullets I have ever been involved with--The Non Cons!!!!!

I see the time coming quickly, I will have no need or use of many of our wonderful conventional bullets we have worked so hard for in the past 20 years, Swift, Woodleigh, Hornady, Speer, Nosler, and even Barnes--They don't shear anymore, so they are not non cons in my opinion! The Non Cons are more effective, deeper penetration, more trauma inflicted, there just seems to be no downside to the copper and brass non cons. Yep, it's settled, anyone want some Swifts, Woodleighs, Hornady, Speer, Nosler or Barnes conventional bullets? I think I am going to have a "Bargain Basement Sale" before too long and replace everything with "Non Cons".

Michael

Now I must duplicate these posts down on doubles, I am afraid that some of those guys would have a heart attack climbing to the upstairs here on Big Bore!


M

Those are pretty expressive pictures.
Makes us want to know about brass HP in 416
for the Rigby and Ruger crowd.

Please keep the bullets short for those of use using traditional twist 16.5". 300-350 grains would be fine, expecially if using only two or three bands. The Rigby will already push a 350 grain TSX Barnes at 2800, so I'm thinking that a slick non-com ought to do 2850-2900. And to have buffalo-magnitude penetration would be a new stage of a 'perfect bullet'. One lung/heart multistabbed and the second lung with 'only' a blunt solid devastation channel.

We'll stay tuned.

(PS: I'm not on 'speed', I just cut my first teeth with a 270 where 2850-2900 was a great little 150 grain load back in the Nosler days. It worked well on Uganda cob, Hartebeest, Roan, Waterbuck. And 338s were a nice step up thirty years ago, maintaining that same hunting trajectory with more authority. But doing double or triple the damage with a 416 with the same trajectory would be another level of hunting.)

Hey Tanzan

You are in luck! You see, after some extensive tests, my short 416 B&M, and learning I have 1:14 twist barrels, and I can't stabilize 400s proper, then I have also chosen the 350 weight bullet. So the 416s will most likely come in that. I currently have a 330 gr Brass HP Non Con 416, Sam shot a deer couple of weeks ago with that, same devastation. So good in fact his friend that is going with him next week, is going to use that same 330 gr Brass Non Con on lion and buffalo! So hopefully we will get some excellent reports from that.

Right now I lean towards a Brass BBW #13 solid at 360 grs, and a hollow point at 330-340 to match up with the solid--these should be same POI at 50 easy. We can go much lighter than we would normally consider with a "conventional" because of the superior penetration.

I have an excellent brass 458 HP at 425 grs, normal penetration to 26-27 inches, dead straight, along with 6 petals that do a lot of damage. Our best 500 gr 458 Swift A can only do 24 inches.

With Non Cons--Velocity is good--more velocity, deeper penetration, and more trauma. Far different than "conventionals" as we know!

Damned "Miracle BUllets" Bullets For the Future!

I think it won't be too much longer we will be getting even more Non Con reports from the field. I know someone else in the field with some too.

Sam and company will leave next week--so BBW #13s in .585 caliber will be in the field, along with other brass non cons--450 .500 caliber North Forks FPS will be in the field also in a 50 B&M, along with a 350 gr Brass Non Cons. I think when Sam and company return there will be lot's of bullet reports to view! I predict right now that all will be very Positive, very enlightening, and excellent reports! How can I predict that? Because we have done our test work before going to the field! We know what is going to happen!

There's some new bullets in town! And they don't compromise!

Michael

When can I get my hands on some of those 530 CEB BBW #13's? I can't imagine ever shooting anything else out of my 500ar unless I'm hunting elephants or steel pipe.

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Jim,

I still have not figured out how to post photos and besides they were just does, no big racks. I sent the other photos to Michael but they were a little too messy to post. Non con's are amazing bullets.

Sam

LOL…10-4 Sam…doe’s are good eating and you can’t eat those horns anyway.

Be safe on your African trip! Do us proud with those #13’s!!!

Michael / Sam,

Looks like the 510gr HP and the 530gr HP are both winners right out of the box.

It definitely will be interesting to see what the 550gr CP will do if Sam can 13º undercut the HP base…. Hum…so what would it be called…the BBW #13 HP #13? Or perhaps the BBW #13 HP UC13?? Or maybe the BBW #13D HP???

quote:

Originally posted by ptaylor:
When can I get my hands on some of those 530 CEB BBW #13's? I can't imagine ever shooting anything else out of my 500ar unless I'm hunting elephants or steel pipe.

ptaylor

Won't be long. The schedule is running like this. While Sam and crew are in Africa, hammering elephant, buffalo, lion and what have you, I am having him a run of .474 caliber, 500gr CEB BBW#13 Solids run with 4 bands. At the same time running some extras with the hollow point in them, I am hoping for 460-470 grs so they match up with POI at 50 yds, I think they will. When Sam gets back we test these in the double for barrel strain, the HPs for terminals, and if they are good to go, we are good to go with some production runs. When that time comes I will be getting 250 of the CEB BBW #13 solids to start sending out to folks in various calibers--.510 top of the list. Also have ordered an additional 100 HPs in each caliber to do the same with. At that time they will be on the shelves at Cutting Edge Bullets and I reckon a fellow can get as many as you want at that time.

Sam leaves next week, out for a couple of weeks, test when he returns, I am gone over Thanksgiving, and I suppose that December we will start rolling some bullets out. That's what it looks like now.

Michael

I have pretty much decided that when I go to the field it's Non Cons all the way. I see no reason to take a step backwards again. These damned bullets have changed the way I think, and they will change the way you think too once you see them at work. I had pretty much the same effect on the Australian buffalo and the 470 Copper SSK HP, 6 blades. It hammered 13 buffalo to the ground where they stood. But this bullet has a deep cavity, long blades, thus they are trying to hang on, and do not shear like the brass, but shear along the path of the main bullet in the center of the wound channel. Now this is fine, still a good thing, but after the test work with the brass non cons, and seeing that those tiny blades do in fact penetrate in flesh like they do in the test work, then I have to believe that 6 secondary little missiles are doing some damage and causing great trauma to target. All the while, the main projectile keeps on going, penetrating deeper than any conventional, and doing more tissue damage, touching tissue that would not be touched with a conventional! No downside, no compromise, and that is a damned rare thing with what we do! Or at least no downside I have found or I can see!

Barnes had this in the early days of the X. Remember, all the petals would shear off a large portion of the time. Remember how we all, me included, condemned that! I did. I suppose they annealed the copper so it would not shear as readily and now it's hard to get them to shear, they are back to being a conventional bullet now. None of us understood what was really happening with them, not even Barnes I suspect.

I have many $1000s of dollars worth of Swifts, Barnes, Woodleighs and so forth on the shelf right now, I wish all that was in Non Cons and BBW #13s and North Fork FPS and CPS. That's what I will be using from now on, nothing else, in any caliber I am shooting! At least until I find something better HEH HEH!

North Fork needs to get off their duff and make the CPS officially an "Expanding" Non Con, like the ones I made sure expanded for the .500s, the 450 and the 375 for my rifles. And the upcoming 425 and 350 for the 475 B&Ms! Expanding Cup Point Solids! They have a real winner in that, penetration incredible and expansion. But on some of the larger CPS they don't expand as much as they should, North Fork--Make them Expand, and join our band of merry little Non Conventional Expanding Solid Bullets! HEH HEH.

Well luck to the rest of you, my CPS .500s and .474s do expand and will be hammers in the field, and a good choice. We will have them, the brass HPs and now the BBW #13 HPs--copper or brass. Hammers, absolute Hammers!

Incredible such a simple thing can turn into such a big deal!

Michael

OK new prototype CEB BBW #13s--4 bands today! These are 500 gr .500 caliber-See the 4 bands compared to the 8 bands. Shooting the 8 band bullet a couple of weeks ago with my normal load of 70/IMR 4198 gave me 2180 fps with this in the 50 B&M--but it also gave me 67000 PSI. 67000 does not scare me, but I think the pressures will drop with the 4 band, while performance is maintained????? We will see tomorrow!




And also the new 4 band copper CEB BBW #13 in .500 caliber 425 grs. This bullet is for the 50 B&M Alaskan, and will work through the Marlin action.




They look really good to me!

Dang Michael...it looks like that 536gr BBW #13 HB bullet is about 1.800" in length!!! The 500gr and 425gr BBW #13 4-band bullets are going to be winners!

They look great! I wish I could be there when you test them. Capo and Boomy should love that long hollow base I made!

Capo beat me to the punch!

Sam

OK, Sam, go ahead and tell them what the big HB is for!

Hopefully its to shut Corbin the $%^& up about those piss ant 6.5 bullets!

Those big LONG LONG 536 gr Hollow Base bullets were built especially for our boy Corbin! After tomorrow--the 500 MDM will be the king of penetration, not some piss ant 6.5 rat shooter! Sam and I both are right up to our eyeballs with this, and we "aim" to sort this out, once and for all. Look out Corbin--here it comes!!!!!!!!!!

If they turn sideways don't tell anyone!!!!!!!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
OK, Sam, go ahead and tell them what the big HB is for!

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Hopefully its to shut Corbin the $%^& up about those piss ant 6.5 bullets!

Sam,

Yep, they should do it!

I’m sure you and Michael have already discussed it…but on the off chance it hasn’t yet come up in conversation… I’d take that wonderfully designed CEB 500gr .500 BBW #13 FN 4b (4-band) bullet and use it as the basis of two new bullets…a BBW #13 HP 4b bullet using a .350” depth grooved HP (just proven with your 530gr .510 BBW #13 HP 2b prototype bullet)…then an equally weighted BBW #13 HB 4b bullet. I’m thinking they’d weigh somewhere between 475gr to 480gr and loaded with the same powder charge should result in the same trajectory/point of impact. The HP should perform very similar to your 530gr .510 BBW #13 HP prototype bullet and the HB bullet should match the straight-line penetration of the unmodified CEB 500gr .500 BBW #13 4b FN bullet. I believe they’d be the ultimate combo!!!

Anyway, that’s my peanut gallery comments!!!

Yesterday was a very rewarding test day for me! While I am not 100% finished with the entire test, it's settled and decisions made from what I did yesterday. I still have some pressure work to do this weekend, but the heavy lifting is over.

I sent both Cutting Edge Bullets and Sam an email yesterday titled this;

"Houston We Are A Go"

For some reason I felt that was very appropriate and fitting.

I did not have time to do all the data recording, photos, and prepare a report for you yesterday. I was late on the range, and still recording data yesterday at 6 pm. Hell I was in the bed snoozing by 7:30 last night! This morning I have the data recorded, I have the photos for the report done, I have them on photobucket and here we go.

I really feel compelled this morning to go through the whole spill and show you changes made to get a better bullet as we progress along. So I am starting with the first prototypes in .500 caliber a couple of weeks ago, until final prototypes tested yesterday. Of course there was a lot of correspondence, and work done way before the first prototypes arrived, but it takes a lot to get to where you want to be at.

What we are going to be looking at is the .500 caliber Brass 500 gr CEB BBW #13 Solids and the 425 Copper CEB BBW #13s that I want for my .500 caliber rifles. The 500 Brass is for the 50 B&M and the 500 MDM, and the 425 Copper is specifically designed for the 50 B&M Alaskan lever guns, and in particular the ones built on the Marlin action. There is a lot of work done just to design the bullet, getting the right nose to mouth length, so it will work in the rifle, meplat size so it feeds and functions and maintains penetration performance at the same time, and many other factors long before the bullet is made. These things take time end of story. Of course, I have little patience too!

I had ordered the first prototype run with 8 bands, this was even before we did the tests with the 2 band double rifles. Doing the pressure traces with the double rifle 2 band bullets taught me a lot.

Also in doing a lot of the test work we did with sharp edge meplats and more rounded edge meplats, we learned we really need that nice rounded edge for optimum penetration. This was one of the first changes I made to the the Final Prototype, along with getting meplat size down from 70% to 67%.



This is not a great photo, but I think you can very easily see what I am talking about.

This slightly sharper edge, along with the 70% meplat did not give us optimum penetration, along with a very important issue of feed and function.



In addition to that, in my 50 B&M I run 500s and 510s with 70/IMR 4198. This is a high pressure load, giving 66000 PSI with the 510s and 2130 fps, and with this 500 gr Brass CEB BBW#13 and the 8 bands gave 67000 PSI. Of course velocity was phenomenal with the 500 gr bullet at 2180 fps from the little short rifle with an 18 inch barrel, I was not so willing to sacrifice that performance. Now learning from the 2 band pressure traces, I had a theory that if I took 4 of the bands out of the equation, and did some tweaking, I would be able to reduce pressures some, and still maintain performance. Getting a more rounded meplat would increase penetration, and giving the bullet a bevel base would be easier to seat when loading.

With the 4 bands I was hoping to at least get down to or just below 65000 PSI, which was my expectation.




And much the same tweaking given to the 425 gr Copper Version also.



Now on some bullets you see the permanent marker? My boy Sam taught me that the last time he was here. Amazing little tricks you can pick up along the way, eh?

HEH

Well, just how did all this turn out?

Tune in Next MONTH--I will let you know!




Michael

OK OK--Enough already-I was kidding!

Well first I was extremely happy with the outcome of pressure with the same exact load!

I loaded up two different seating depths to see what effect that would have on pressures.




The seated long load is not very appealing to me, seated deep just looks right, and does feed better, no bumps along the way.

The seated long version give me 59581 PSI at 2188 fps.

The seated deep version give me 60646 PSI at 2196 fps.

Not much difference in the two. I will be using the seated deep version!

But WOW--What a reduction in pressures from 67000 PSI with the 8 band bullet-It exceeded by a good margin what I had expected from 8 bands to the current 4 band version, 7000 PSI! This gives me a good margin when in Zimababwe or other late season 110 degree days! No reduction in performance at all either, no drop in powder charge, just going from 8 to 4 bands. Which I might mention will be the same configuration for the double rifle bullets with 4 bands in copper. This leads me to believe that we are going to be in really good shape with the double rifle bullets in both pressures and barrel strain. Just to make very sure, I retested pressures with the 8 band bullet and they give me 66518 PSI, so these numbers hold up.

OK, all well and good, but if they don't penetrate straight, and deep, it's all moot anyway, right?





Well it seems to me that all the stars and moon lined up to be with us on this one! I really can't ask for better performance than this. But it had crap to do with the stars and the moon! It had to do with good old fashion hard work, but even more than that, a bullet maker that is willing to go the extra mile to get it 100% right! Today that is hard to come by! You won't get this out of the "Big Dogs" on the block, you will get what they give you and you will like it or kiss their ass if you don't! Thank You Cutting Edge Bullets! Wonderful Job!

Sometimes it is good not to compromise and to continue to strive to get as good as you can get!

Michael

Why not just make it a 3 band?

I have more work to do with the 425 Copper CEB BBW #13. I used the 50 B&M to test penetration with, because I have a strain gage attached to one, I wanted pressure data as well. This is still being done and I have to get the 8 band pressures. I actually tested the 8 band in a lever gun and not the 50 B&M.

Penetration is a bit more with the 50 B&M than the 50 BMAK because of velocity. At 2000 fps muzzle the bullet penetrates 42-44 inches, excellent for the lever guns.

I have a 426 gr Copper HP from SSK/Lehigh same powder charge, 74 gr IMR 4198 it gives 2310 fps and over 61000 PSI. This 4 band 425 give me 2338 fps and 55839 PSI. Big difference. But still have to test it against the 8 band version for direct comparisons.

The only change I am making to the current 4 band 425 is to reduce the meplat to 67%.



Michael

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Why not just make it a 3 band?

Oh for gods sakes--Don't you know I am sick of prototypes!!!!!

NO 4 Bands--That's IT!

LOL

M

HEE HEE HEE

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
HEE HEE HEE

Yeah keep that up--One of us is going to take an "ass whupping"

PAGE 104!

Whew, makes me tired!

Hey couple of things before I am off to do other things this morning! Yesterday I gave Cutting Edge the "GO" for 1000 pieces of 500 gr Brass CEB BBW #13 Solids and 1000 pieces of 425 Copper CEB BBW #13 Solids! In addition to that, I ordered 250 each of them in "Hollow Point" versions!

Yep, 6 bladed HPs! For the brass versions I ordered a .400 deep cavity and for the copper versions I ordered a .300 deep cavity. We all know what the brass will do, no issues there. But with the .300 deep cavity the copper should perform the exact same way as the brass, shear and move away from center of the wound channel! We will see, and if it works on a 425 gr .500 caliber version, then it will work on the heavier big copper bullets we are going to build for the double rifles, and other versions as well! I will have plenty to test with!

Something else I am going to tell you. I mentioned that what has got us here is the willingness of some bullet makers to work hard and close with us. To date that has been North Fork Technologies and Cutting Edge Bullets. Lehigh would also, but communications is lacking on that front, and when tweaking and changing and doing the things we do, communications is a MUST!

Now that we have some really excellent bullets how did we get there?

From my standpoint here, I have been working very hard with both North Fork Tech and Cutting Edge Bullets to get what I consider the best bullet designs we can get. Both companies have been very willing to work with me and to make changes when I deemed them needed for whatever reason. Both have expertise in areas I don't have, and combining what I thought was good, what Sam thought was good, and their expertise in the matters at hand, we are where we are now.

Today, I can't see any reason in the world for me to go to the field with any other kind of bullet other that what I can get from these two bullet makers! I have used the other extensively in the field, and have just recently used the Non Cons in the field, but I have tested all of them. The Non Cons, the North Fork Solids, the BBW #13s are the best there is, why settle for less? I won't be anymore. I will use these bullets in the field and they will all be successful.

Now it's not only because they are superior products, that is at the top of the list of course, however the fact of the matter is that both North Fork and Cutting Edge have gone the distance with me, been EXTREMELY good to work with, have worked hard to get things right and did not mind going back for 2cd or more prototypes to make sure we got there. Well, that buys a lot of loyalty in my book. I don't think Hornady, Barnes, or the other big dogs will give you the time of day, much less work with you to get a better bullet? So F*%* em! Sam and I have a better bullet than any of them can come up with, you do too if you want them. Do what you want, for me it's North Fork and Cutting Edge, the rest can do something else.

I promise right now, that Sam is hitting the African Continent with the most effective 577 Nitro bullet that has ever existed in the history of 577 Nitro! There has never been a load or bullet in that cartridge more effective for the job at hand! In addition he is taking his 50 B&M loaded with the new 450 gr North Fork FPS for backup, there has never been a more effective small gun to hit Africa, other than MINE OF COURSE--That have already been there a few times--But not with our current run of bullets mind you! Sam's other load is a 350 Brass Non Con-we saw how effective that was on page 103! Part of Sam's crew is hunting lion and buffalo with a 416 Remington, loaded with that 330 gr Brass Non Con--lion and buffalo will explode! Sam is hitting the ground will a full arsenal of bullets that is going to open eyes and expand horizons! My turn next year I reckon!

By the way, I think Dan from CEB is lurking around here somewhere! Dan, quit lurking about in the dark, sign up, sign in, and start contributing, whether you like it or not, you are already here!

Michael

One more thing before I have to go!

I missed the 1st Birthday of this Thread! It was November 3, 2009!!

1 Year ago.................

M

Sam

WE DID IT!!!!! I just got through looking at my data on 6.5 and 9.3. All I am showing is 71 inches with that 156 FMJ 6.5 caliber bullet and it was 1.5 inches off course!!!!! On the 9.3 I am showing the 320 Woodleigh to 73 inches!! That is what I have on recorded data!

Now feast your eyes on this Corbin!!!





I did not check the data on 6.5 and 9.3 until just now. I did not think we had made it! Somehow (probably Corbin raving about) I thought the 6.5 was deeper, but NOT!!!!!

OK...................Official the 500 MDM is king of the "Mix"!

Sam


Michael

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
One more thing before I have to go!

I missed the 1st Birthday of this Thread! It was November 3, 2009!!

1 Year ago.................

M

Happy Birthday "TBP"...and the 103 pages worth of information!!!

i wonder how fast we can get a 425 grain .505 going [As in Gibbs]? 4 banded spitzer and 4 banded solid?
(Or a 425 grain .510 [Jeffrey or ASquare])
I'm betting that 2800+fps is still achievable. [Probably not in a cartridge that could be barreled and fit for a little Ruger Alaskan.]

Michael,

If it was only 71 inches with the 6.5 then we almost beat that with the 725 grain 577. Glad to know we have finally beat that little tiny arrow bullet with something big.

Sam

Randall,

The 500 AR would fit perfectly in the Ruger Alaskan as it's designed for standard action length; it uses a shortened Rigby case with .510 caliber bullets. Or my upcoming 50 MDM using 375 Ruger Basic Brass with .500 caliber bullets as its also a standard action length cartridge.

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Michael,

If it was only 71 inches with the 6.5 then we almost beat that with the 725 grain 577. Glad to know we have finally beat that little tiny arrow bullet with something big.

Sam

I think Corbin had both of us "Brain Washed" with penetration of those bullets? Until I looked at the data I had on them just a bit ago, I was thinking it was more the whole time, but that's not what the data says!!!!! You know I keep pretty good records!

Yep, whupped that little pill with something worth a damn!

Finally!

Yes, 577 was right there too, but it was there dead straight-I show the 6.5 was 1.5 inches off. HEH.

I take straight and .585 caliber any day!

M

Glad we finally beat that little 6.5. I was getting ready to put fletching on a 3 foot brass rod.

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
HEE HEE HEE

Yeah keep that up--One of us is going to take an "ass whupping"

Remember my guns are bigger than yours and have 2 barrels so I think we know who will get the whupping!