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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting New US Requirements For Traveling With GunsGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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Actually, it is Schedule C attached to a 1040. | |||
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My congressman wrote me a nice letter saying he opposes any ban on 5.56/223 ammo. They did not even read or understand the form letter from ar I sent them. He is a Republican. This is just sad. Now I will call and talk to a intern. Mike | |||
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that is correct. another possible side-effect is having your local government ask you to now have a business license (once they see there is a Schedule C on your return). I've had this happen to many clients that had almost nothing on the schedule C. | |||
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I know there are strong feelings about taking ones own guns to Africa and other Worldly places. I am one of those, but this current situation is totally over the top. Until this current procedure is overturned and eliminated I will not subject myself or my guns to further registration by our Federal Government. Believe me, this is exactly what this is all about. If this is not reversed, then I simply won't take "my" guns out of the Country, but will use guns provided at my destination. With the incompetence of those in charge of implementing and overseeing this new fiasco, I won't subject myself and my guns to the very real possibility of confiscation, possible detainment and criminal procedures that could very easily come to bear. Do as you wish of course, this is just my thoughts and decision on the subject. Good luck to those who choose to proceed and lets all keep up the fight to get this overturned. Larry Sellers SCI(International)Life Member R8 Blaser Sabatti "trash" Double Shooter | |||
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Same here, just a standard reply, not whatsoever related to the topic. Equally as sad. | |||
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Yub it is he said it wouldn;t be any big deal sorry I was in a hurry anyway we still need to defeat this When there's lead in the air, there's hope!!!! | |||
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It's all a bit confusing at best. Under the FAQ section it appears that shotguns & muzzle loaders don't require either an export license & unlike other firearms (pistols & rifles?) don't require having an EIN or filling out an AES form? I'm going to Scotland again this Sept/Oct with Kiri (Fallowbuck here on AR) & plan on taking a pair of shotguns I purchased just for this trip. Again, it seems confusing at best? Anyone have any further information on shotguns being somewhat "exempt"? Thanks, Jim | |||
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May be your congressman is busy with the inter instead of reading letter he gets!! Sounds like another form letter to pull the wool over the eyes!! | |||
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Pretty standard Saeed. I sent Two Senators and one Representative information concerning the Zim Elephant Ban when it first happened. One Democrat Senator we have since voted out sent an Auto reply, Thanks for the information". The Republican Senator sent a boiler plate on Animal Rights having nothing to do with the topic. I followed us with a letter expressing my unhappiness. The republican Representative sent me back a message detailing cuts and pasts of my message content and his opinion that Fish & Wildlife as an Agency is out of control. He vowed to work towards a solution. He is very very pro hunter and also helped wih the new firearm travel cluster. Cheers Jim ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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From the ICE quiz: ................... With less than three shotguns there is a license exception available. Note that the barrel of the shotgun MUST be 18 inches or longer. Anyone who falls into this category does NOT need to file an export license from the U.S. Department of Commerce's Bureau of Industry and Security. Anyone who falls into this category does NOT need to file the electronic export information in AESDirect. Prior to departing the U.S., you MUST verbally declare the items to U.S. Customs and Border Protection. Additional information can be found at the U.S. Department of Commerce's export regulations website." ............... So it looks like you will not need to file a electronic export information in AESDirect BUT Prior to departing the U.S., you MUST verbally declare the items to U.S. Customs and Border Protection. Ken DRSS, PP Chapter Life NRA Life SCI Life DSC | |||
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http://www.huntingtrophy.com/a...-export-of-firearms/ Coppersmith posted this information on their website. FAQ’s regarding AES requirements for the Export of Firearms What is the law: All persons who intend to travel from the United States to a foreign country with firearms and/or ammunition for either permanent or temporary exportation are subject to federal export licensing regulations. The export regulations for handguns, rifles, associated parts and components, and related ammunition are found in the International Traffic in Arms Regulations (ITAR). Before exporting firearms and/or ammunition with a valid license or qualifying license exemption, the traveler or an agent acting on the traveler’s behalf, must file the Electronic Export Information (EEI) using the Automated Export System (AES). What has changed: Customs and Border Protection (CBP) is the government agency responsible for all goods coming into and going out of the United States. Historically when personal effects traveled with a person, those goods were not of much interest to the government. (Unless there were goods coming into the country valued more than $2500.00) In 2012 the government became aware that firearms were exiting and entering the United States as accompanied baggage of hunters and there was no record of what left and what returned. In order to track firearms and to comply with the Department of State and the Department of Commerce regulations, Customs and Border Protection (CBP) is now enforcing those 2012 regulations. Why now: The Department of Commerce has done a major overhaul of the Export Regulations and those new regulations go into effect on May 1, 2015. CBP, the agency charged with enforcing those regulations, has begun telling hunters that their firearms may be seized or confiscated if the rules are not followed. What do I need to do: In order to comply with the regulations, you must file the Electronic Export Information in AES (Automated Export System) with CBP and receive in return an ITN (Internal Transaction Number). That ITN shows CBP that you have filed an AES and that when you return to the United States, you can prove that you had the gun when you left. How do I file an AES: There are two ways you can file in AES and obtain an ITN: # 1 You can file the information yourself with AESDirect.gov. There is no charge to file and the website will explain what you will need to do. #2 You can have Coppersmith, a licensed Freight Forwarder, file the AES for you for a minimal fee. We will file the information on your behalf, but you must supply a number of items including: A signed Export Power of Attorney, an EIN number, and a completed questionnaire detailing your trip and your firearm’s serial number(s). What is an EIN: The IRS assigns EIN (Employee Identification Numbers). Previously the exporter could use their Social Security Number instead of the EIN but because of identity theft the EIN is now required. Per the IRS.gov website, to get an EIN you must sign up as a Sole Proprietor and complete the registration. In the comment box you should write “For AES purposes only”. The process takes less than 15 minutes. What is the cost: You can file your own AES for no charge at www.AESDirect.gov. Or you can have Coppersmith, a licensed freight forwarder, or another qualified third party file the AES for you. You must provide a signed Export Power of Attorney, your EIN, and complete a questionnaire detailing your trip and the firearms you plan to take with you. The cost to file the AES for you is $50.00 Kathi kathi@wildtravel.net 708-425-3552 "The world is a book, and those who do not travel read only one page." | |||
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Bottom line: It seems that if you want to travel outside the U.S. with guns in the future, you will need to get an EIN. Without an EIN you can't establish an AES Account for youself (assuming you go down that route) and without an EIN a third party, like Coopersmith or Travel With Guns, can't obtain the needed ITN for you through their AES Account. (In a somewhat vague German accent.): "... Papers ... Papers! Vee need tu zee yur Papers! Papers, Bitte! Mach schnell!" | |||
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Or we can fight it, at some point we are going to have to draw a line in the sand. What the hell are our congressman and women for if they are not looking after the rights of the people. Big government is in total control and it looks like congress is the biggest part of the problem. "We the people" doesn't mean squat anymore. | |||
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Kathy, Thank you for the update. Having an EIN, I have created an account and could finish to get the ITN except for one thing. I cannot tell what commodity codes are supposed to be used for a single shot Ruger and a Browning bolt action. There are several codes that could apply, some of which are under the Dept of State and some under the Dept of Commerce. The law states that if an exemption is claimed using the wrong codes, the guns could be confiscated! What a mess.
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There needs to be clear demarcation between lawful gun owners, traveling sportsmen, and gun runners etc. There seems to be NO consideration that people engaged in lawful activities are subject to policies intended to stop gun-running. Given the responses by some lawmakers, even those who are technically on our side are not really in tune with how it affects hunters. | |||
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I got a call from my Senators office today requesting more information on the issue. This really surprised me due to the fact that the other responses I got from elected officials in my district only sent canned responses that had nothing whatsoever to do with the issue. Thanks to the great summaries provided in this thread I was able to construct an email back to the respective individual who told me that their office was unaware of it and would look into it. It's a small step and doesn't give me great hope, however, at least I took some action and I urge everyone who hasn't to do the same. Some may listen, whether or not it does any of us any good is to be seen. | |||
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You took some action and at least got "someone" thinking about it! If everyone that purchased a hunting license or enjoyed the shooting sports did this it would make a huge difference! Good work! . | |||
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Nothing will change until the right Senator or Congressman's brother, dad or son gets a rifle confiscated at the airport. Then, it will change. Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps. | |||
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Yup. | |||
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This topic has been mostly for us guys going to Africa but as I stated earlier, there are HUNDREDS of guys crossing the border to hunt in Mexico and Canada that are going to be affected. Fortunately or not, I am going all three places in the next 18 months and this is going to be a nightmare. There are no rifles to be borrowed in Mexico so that is not even an option. I'll cross the border a half dozen times going back and forth to the ranch. Getting Steve Turner to get me legal is not an option and will not work going to Mexico. Those of you so proud of getting your legal numbers are missing the point, you have already bowed down to the mighty feds. | |||
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^^^ I agree - but besides our efforts with our Congressmen what are we going to do about it? In spite of the wrongness of it, none of us want to sit in jail only to find out that the rule is still in effect. Changing it will probably take some time in any event. I think if you had a million man demonstration downtown in Washington DC it wouldn't change Obamas idea an inch. He isn't running for office and that is all he cares about anyway. On a separate note during my call to Customs they didnt sound thrilled about this and they still aren't really up to speed too. My travel agency said they think it only applies to those wishing to sell a gun overseas and sent some Fed language to that effect. While I disagree with that at this point, maybe something like that will be in the works. | |||
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You are absolutely correct. But, they have us "by the short and curlies." Unless enough pressure is put on the Feds. to either modify this regulation to make it workable and palatable to hunters/sportsmen, or to unwind it completely, what choice do we have? Either comply with "the law," (and I really hate to call this a "law" since it appears to be a bureaucratic regulation and/or an Executive Order ... not something that was voted on by our elected representatives and passed by Congress), or face prosecution and/or confiscation of your gun. | |||
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Originally posted by sevenmagltd: Those of you so proud of getting your legal numbers are missing the point, you have already bowed down to the mighty feds. Your post suggests that those of us who were forced to get the ITN numbers have done something wrong. I'll tell you one thing, they did have me "by the short and curlies" as I am leaving for Namibia in a week for an elephant safari. Do I like having to do this, Hell No, but you do what you have to do. I am not going to walk away from a great deal of money I have already spent and if you think I should, as Sam Elliot says, "you must be some sort of special stupid." | |||
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What Coppersmith Office is doing this so I can contact them? Remember, forgivness is easier to get than permission. | |||
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Spent some time in Coppersmiths office in Dallas...they are now geared up to handle in. Just call the office nearest to you...they had a conglomerate meeting...all should be up to snuff. You need a dedicated "AES" EIN for this purpose...easy to get on-line. I will post the specifics on the EIN when I have time at the office later. Imputing the data correctly to get an AES ITN is tedious even for Exporting Companies like Coppersmith. I think it is worthwhile having a professional handle it...at least until everyone gets completely up to snuff with it and HOPEFULLY...it will go away!!! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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I visited with the local customs agent here locally, a very small operation. He told me he has become aware of the new requirements, and was awaiting direction and more detailed instructions from the brass on how to, and the timing of total implementation of the law. He told me that if a guy wants to be safe, he should apply for the ITN #, but until further instructions are given to him, he would only check my completed 4457 and send me on my way, business as usual. I asked him if the agents in Atlanta, who I'd have to deal with coming back home are on the same page as he was, and he could only venture a guess and says "not sure, but I would assume so". Doesn't exactly give me the confidence I seek. For my own peace of mind I see no other alternative (unless something changes) than to get the EIN from AES, and proceed. Here are the instructions given to me by someone I would trust. You've gotta do this before anyone can get you the ITN #, like it or not. Maybe this will help somebody that is in the same predicament I'm in. 1. Apply for an EIN number. In order for us to file with AES, you are required to provide us with your EIN number. If you do not have one, follow the instructions below. Click the link below to start your application, or go to www.irs.gov and do a search for EIN: https://sa.www4.irs.gov/modiein/individual/index.jsp i) Click “Begin Application” ii) Put a check mark in “Sole Proprietor” – click “Continue” iii) Put a check mark in “Sole Proprietor” – click “Continue” iv) Read and click “Continue” v) Put a check mark in “Banking Purposes” – click “Continue” vi) Complete all required fields and put a check mark in “I am the sole proprietor” vii) These fields should automatically full in for you. Leave “Trade Name/Doings business as” blank. Add todays month and year as “Start Date” – Click “Continue” viii) Check mark “No” for all answers – click “Continue” ix) Check mark “Other” right at the bottom of the page – Click “Continue” x) Check mark “Other” and type “Fulfilling Federal Regulations” in space provided – Click “Continue” xi) Check mark “Receive letter online” – Click “Continue” xii) Review the Summary of Information and then click “Submit” xiii) Make a note of the EIN number assigned and click “Click Here For Your EIN Confirmation Letter” to print your records – click “Continue” to end the application | |||
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Lane in Red. Not 100% for sure on who is correct...so just presenting what I was told. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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For those of you who are so inclined, here is link (that I have previously posted) that you gives you a visual depiction of how to apply for your EIN online: http://simplifiedtradesolution...-ein-for-aes-filing/ As with most things in life, "use at your own risk." | |||
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According to your link...I was correct in checking the "starting new business" statement. For some reason Coppersmith suggested I write "for AES purposes only" instead of "for fullfilling government requirments only". I doubt there is really much difference here. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Lane, not sure who is 100% correct either, but I think you'll find that in the v. above, Banking Purposes is the only thing that fits description of what you're doing. As a matter of fact, this is the exact description: Banking purposes Select this option if the reason for applying for the EIN is strictly to satisfy banking requirements or local law. I'm probably going this route as I don't want the IRS to think this is any sort of business other than I'm trying to comply with their stupidazzzz new regs. There will be no business activity conducted under this entity/EIN. On item x, I think we are both saying virtually the same thing, in a different manner of words. It takes less than 5 minutes to fill out the EIN application. | |||
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I think you can can go back and amend it. Coppersmith stated that the business you were/are conducting was exporting???? Sot sure at this point and it is not really a "local law" but a national one???? Again...seems a gray area. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Here are your options. I agree Banking Purposes hardly fits. Why is the Sole Proprietor requesting an EIN? Choose one reason that best describes why you are applying for an EIN. Started a new business Select this option if you are beginning a new business. Hired employee(s) Select this option if you already have a business and need to hire employees. Banking purposes Select this option if the reason for applying for the EIN is strictly to satisfy banking requirements or local law. Changed type of organization Select this option if you are changing the type of organization you currently operate, such as changing from a sole proprietor to a partnership, changing from a partnership to a corporation, etc. Purchased active business Select this option if you are purchasing a business that is already in operation. There's a Help Topic on the right of this page. When you click the link which says "I don't see my reason for applying here, what should I do"? It gives you this..... I do not see my reason for applying here. What should I choose? If your main reason for applying is not on the list, please select the option you feel is closest to your main reason. Like you say.....not really very clearcut. | |||
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Agreed!  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Again ... just part of the asinine over-all structure of this new regulation ... and how one hand of the government, (State, Commerce, CBP, etc.), really doesn't give a "rat's ass" about what another hand of the government (IRS) is doing or requires. | |||
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I have been following this issue since the first post a few days ago. In response, I wrote a letter to my congressional delegation, as well as to my State Representative and to the Texas Attorney General. I just received a call from a senior staffer in Rep. Lamar Smith's office who had obviously taken the time to make himself aware of the issue. He let me know that Rep Smith strongly opposes the new rules and as chairman of the House Judiciary Committee has consistently opposed recognition of the UN treaty on arms trafficking. The staffer asked me to compose another letter to Smith's office that he will forward to a specific person in the ICE bureaucracy. He indicated that the ICE staffer is a contact he has who is a hold-over from the Bush administration. My letter will require a specific response from ICE to Smith's office. There is a lot of information here to work with to voice our concerns, but feel free to weigh in with any thoughts. | |||
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This entire requirement and process are both flawed from the start. First, the “new” Federal Regulations were put in place to better regulate the export and smuggling of military grade weapons, ammunition, hardware and equipment. IF, legally privately owned hunting, sporting and competitive sporting firearms are such a threat to the world, then why in hell did ICE wait 2-3 years before deciding to enforce them. Second, why are the AESDirect accounts and export documents hosted in the US Census Bureau arm of .gov when the regs are being written by ICE and they are being enforced by C&PB. The AESDirect site was set up for the use of commercial exporter/importers of ALL products. The use of it by private citizens has either intended or unintended consequences of our making unintentional mistakes in entering our information as well as potentially putting us in potential conflict/violation of another branch of .gov, the IRS. Third, what IF the IRS subsequently decides to enforce it’s currently posted info regarding EINs. The jeopardy we are being asked/required to put ourselves in COULD be viewed by the IRS in a hostile way that COULD potentially trigger an audit or as extreme as confiscation of our bank accounts for simply “suspicious activity” under the Feds “forfeiture” laws (of which the new AG nominee Loretta Lynch was an expert at in NY). Under these laws you have to prove your actions were legal AFTER they take your money. Damn, just damn…it is like we are purposely being set-up for failure. For those leaving soon, this is truly a shit sandwich we’ve all been served up and whatever method you decide to use or to decide to rent “over there”. Since my wife and I and my two nephews don’t leave until the end of June, I’m going to hold off doing anything for the time being. That said, I think the lesser of all these evils is, if you have time and can do it, is to do it the way Frostbit did it. It might mean an extra trip to a C&BP office, but since they didn’t seem to ask Frostbit for an EIN that solves the IRS bit. Then too, maybe, just maybe IF something goes side-ways on the outbound or return because of type-o or incorrect “item code” or sum such horseshit at least I can point my finger right back at the C&BP because THEY screwed it up and not me or someone or some business that screwed it up. For those who are thinking of hiring out getting an ITN, did you ask to get something in writing from them as to what happens IF they screw this up for ANY reason and you possibly get your shit taken and your ass hauled off to jail and are facing potentially Federal FELONY charges and IF convicted LOSE YOUR 2A RIGHTS FOR LIFE! I’m being Chicken Little I know…but I’ve also seen what this admin has done and seems hell bent on doing to keep “his” agenda going, damn the Constitution. | |||
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A whole lot of things have been, and are going on in my mind on this subject. I can also add that during my meeting with the local CBP guy, I specifically asked if he could get me the ITN # and he said he could not. Since I'm leaving April 21, my biggest hope is it gets delayed, or better yet tossed out. I'm sure not counting on any POS politician to help though. | |||
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Frostbit was pretty specific in that you have to get to the Export side of the C&BP office and it is not necessarily the same folks that do the 4457s. I somewhat confirmed this with my local C&BP office. The Officer I was talking to face to face told me practically the same thing. All of the info I subsequently emailed to her later that day, she said she was forwarding to the Export Div as well. As of today, I haven't heard back from either, but then, I know today is her day off and I've been wrapped up on other thins this week and haven't followed up with her either. If your local C&PB office has any questions have them contact the AK C&PB office and ask for Chief Fernandez (907) 271-6309 ext 204. That is the person who cracked this for Frostbit. | |||
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Gents: Looks like I've got a couple of more Senators to call and email. Senator Mike Lee (R-Utah) Senators David Vitter (R-La) James Inhofe (R-Okla) Senator Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn) Steven Daines (R-Mont) Just caught this on Brietbart.com Breitbart Art Thought this push is more centered around "internal" US gun control it sure won't hurt to try to get them into our current temp export issue at the same time. With the Senate focused on the 2016 budget, Senator Mike Lee (R-Utah) has proposed an amendment that would ban federally mandated gun control. Lee’s amendment would ban any future gun control from lawmakers that fails to garner “two-thirds of senators” in support. It would also ban regulations issued by agencies like the ATF. According to The Hill, Senators David Ritter (R-La) and James Inhofe (R-Okla) have also introduced their own amendment. More narrowly drawn, theirs focuses on the ATF by prohibiting that agency from “attempting to ban bullets that are primarily used by hunters and sportsmen.” Senator Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn) and Steven Daines (R-Mont) are also putting forth an amendment to protect antique guns that have ivory handles. This pro-gun push comes only weeks after the ATF dropped its efforts to ban the M855 round for AR-15 rifles. Breitbart News previously reported that the ban was being pushed under the guise of eliminating an “armor piercing” round, but the ATF’s standard for ascertaining “armor piercing” was–at best–ambiguous, and–at worst–so low as to open the door to a ban on almost all centerfire hunting rounds. On March 25, Gun Owners of America (GOA) said they believed there would be more “showdowns” on “gun-related” amendments through the end of the week than there would be “in the next 9 months combined.” GOA urged pro-Second Amendment citizens to contact their senators and urge them to support the pro-gun amendments. | |||
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JGR, Have you filed for your AES ITN yet? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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