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I think this applies to everything a person pulls a trigger on. ______________________ Always remember you're unique, just like everyone else. | |||
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I feel vindicated! According to Cal, DSC banned MS eight years ago for his videos. So why the brouhaha over SCI following suit? Those of you who castigated me, might ask for a slice of that crow. You got taken in by PT Barnum jr. Rich DRSS | |||
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Saeed, it's time to drop the rumor-mongering, tinfoil hat, conspiracy rap. What tricks? More importantly, what evidence? Like him or not, this is a man's livelihood and reputation you're dealing with. Your experience and integrity carry weight on this forum that is ill-placed in this matter. I respectfully suggest you consider applying the scientific principle of 'Occam's Razor' to your overwrought suspicions, whereby the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Sullivan doesn't employ any tricks; as I described in my previous post, he simply follows up a wounded buffalo in a fashion that is fundamentally different from most other PHs. And consequently the results are fundamentally different to your own. Why is that so difficult to fathom? Kim Merkel Double .470 NE Whitworth Express .375 H&H Griffin & Howe .275 Rigby Winchester M70 (pre-64) .30-06 & .270 "Cogito ergo venor" René Descartes on African Safari | |||
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May be if SCI banned him 8 years ago there would not have been all this hoopla. Bt, as we have seen, SCI tends to turn a blind eye to all sorts of unacceptable shinanigans. As we have seen their disasterous behaviour regarding Out Of Africa. And let us not forget the number of Professional Hunter Of The Year SCI award winners who have turned out to be total crooks. | |||
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Rich, Not to steal your thunder but that is yesterday's news and common knowledge. Perhaps you just were not made aware when that occurred. I think the "brouhaha" is because many of us on AR belong to SCI and believe that as a member of SCI they should have an opportunity to address accusations, as this is central to any disciplinary fairness. That process should also allow for appeal if the action is unjust or unsupported by evidence. I am not a member of DSC but if I were and I was not pleased with their disciplinary process, I as a member would speak out. Shawn Joyce Diizche Safari Adventures P.O. Box 1445 Lincoln, CA 95648 E-mail: shawn.joyce@diizchesafariadventures.net Cell: (916) 804-3318 Shoot Straight, Live the Dream, and Keep Turning the Pages to Your Next Adventure!™ Website- www.DiizcheSafariAdventures.com Blog- http://diizchesafari.blogspot.com/ Twitter- http://twitter.com/DiizcheSafari YouTube- http://www.youtube.com/user/shawncjoyce Facebook- http://on.fb.me/gYytdn Instagram: diizchesafari_official | |||
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Kim, My own experience, as well as the experience of the PHs I have hunted with, and those I have had the pleasure of meeting, tells me that Marks claims CANNOT be true. So why should we, and it seems there quite a few of us, who don't believe him, keep our mouths shut? He has brought this upon himself, and he better learn to live with it. Why would two of the most important safari clubs ban him? I think there is more to this banning than meets the eye. I know it has to do with his videos, and in turn of how he has arrived at all these charges. I was looking forward to his explanation, hoping we might get at least something logical we can understand. His answer did nothing of the sort, appart from painting everyone else as cowards, and him claiming to be the only person in the bush with any balls. A rather sad reflection on an individual's personality. | |||
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I think we owe Saeed more respect than you are giving... Why is that so difficult to fathom...  Sorry, couldn't help, myself... Cheers, Brian "If you can't go all out, don't go..." | |||
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I too welcome Mr Sullivan as a new member. I recognize his views and opinions, but I don't share them. I've seen his videos and for me his MO and style is rather a threat to the honour of our sport, than a credit. That said, I accept that he truly believes the opposite. | |||
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I have only seen some short clips of MS online back some time and did not like what I saw then. I take it from various comments here that the trailers are probably a reflection of the full length videos. Where does MS get the notion that DG hunting has to be toenail to toenail stuff. To most, DG hunting is no different than hunting any other game other than size and of course the danger these animals are capable of presenting but in most cases don't. Africa and its game certainly has a certain romance and beckoning that attracts hunters, most seeking a good stalk and clean take of any of her animals as a shot presents itself. By MS reckoning Bell, Taylor, Hunter, Selby and many others before them and after them were all just shooters with no modicum of hunting about them. They shot for a living, animal control and just plain sport but in all I read of them each to a man took animals as the best shot presented itself. So MS has written one letter to this forum and suddenly all his so called sins have fallen by the wayside and he is a straight up good guy, with many on this forum demanding apologies from doubters. Lets not forget that most convicted lifers are capable of, and many have, written true and convincing accounts of their innocence. In all cases we have to decide our judgement with all the other evidence available. The video I've seen and some of the statements in the MS letter do nothing to convince me much. | |||
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Rich, You've earned the crow on that one. I have no idea what happened 8 years ago with DSC. SCI however owes Mark an explanation. He has supported them too well and for too long. At the very least he diserves to know why! Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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What happened to judging a man by his actions and not his words? | |||
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eagle27 writes--- "...suddenly all his so called sins have fallen by the wayside and he is a straight up good guy, with many on this forum demanding apologies..." I wouldn't go that far eagle27. The AR members are merely asking for some transparency from SCI and an explanation as to why he was banned from exhibiting. DO we all have a hunch why? I would certainly say so. But it's in everybody's best interest within the hunting world to know EXACTLY why. What are the charges? What is the evidence? And thus we'll all understand the penalty. The way it is now, the penalty and sentence have been handed down, but the exact charges, the crime and evidence have been witheld. What kinda rigamarole system is that? And then as Saeed states, and like many including myself who've traveled to East Africa have heard, there are these unbelievable Sullivan stories...having over shot quota, unlicensed killing sprees of lions and buffaloes, buying off game scouts and tribal chiefs to remain hush hush, and on and on the rumors persist. I call them "unbelievable" because as of today the sources from someone in the know. and the evidence have not surfaced. Rumors people. Unsubstantiated hearsay is all it is. Anything is probable in Africa. It is a continent rife with corruption and corruption is pervasive in the safari world. Nyama,the dollar and diamonds can almost buy one "anything." Access, silence and freedom from criminal prosecution just to name three of that so-called "anything." I for one want to see this evidence laid out on the table. Those that know the truth, I ask them not to take it to your grave. Former Liberian strongman Charles Taylor is on trial right now at The Hague for war crimes that date back to 1992. He is accused of fueling his war with neighboring Sierra Leone, by selling "blood diamonds." As high as the evidence had piled up against this dictator, I'm glad this 62 year-old man is finally getting his day in court. This is a story I reported on back during my days as a CNN Correspondent in Africa in 1993. It's 2010 now. Now back to the relevance with MS. These Sullivan rumors have been out there for two decades. This week Mark embarks on his 20th year of hunting in Africa. SCI or someone out there should man up, step up and tell the truth to the hunting community. That's all I want, the TRUTH? Has this man broken any laws? If there is no proof, no evidence, no affidavits, no eyewitnesses, no sworn testimony...leave the man alone and quit spreading untruths. I for one disagree with the way he hunts. It's not my thing, but I've seen everyone of his DVD's and support his right to a fair trial, openness and innocence until the evidence has proven wrongdoing. I have neither absolved him nor accused him of any sins. | |||
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I guess I have a different view to these videos etc. While I don't care to hunt in this manner, there is some awful good footage of what could happen if it all went bad. I don't have the time to PH for 35 years to be able to fend off a charge. To me there is value in seeing one on video prior to the actual event occurring. Sort of correspondence school if you will. I am a mere piker wih only 8 buff accounted for. Jeff | |||
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Finally, someone who has found the true value in Mark Sullivan films. The films are a fine study of body language of Cape buffalo. If you watch any one of the films the benefit is there because they are all the same, with different names. Cape buffalo all have habits that tell you what they are about to do. Since all his encounters with buffalo are all of wounded and followed up buffalo (in the hundreds  ) by studying them you will find common traits they exhibit just before they charge, or run away. These are valuable clues that may save your bacon if pressed into the same situation yourself. The second value, and there are only two, is showing you what you shouldn't copy! This kicking dirt in the face of a hippo, or making sudden moves in front of a wounded cape buffalo to get him to charge putting yourself, and others around you in unnecessary danger, and is not the best idea anyone ever had. The buffalo is already killed but simply doesn’t know it yet. The only thing he is now experiencing is pain, and fear! Put the poor thing down for Christ’s sake! ....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1 DRSS Charter member "If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982 Hands of Old Elmer Keith  | |||
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agreed... Rich DRSS | |||
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Well, I have so far avoided making any comment on this subject. But I will say two things: (1) Mark Sullivan is one hell of a shot with a double rifle; and, (2) I take issue with respect to the following quote: "If you lack courage that is something I cannot help you with. But to condemn me because I have the courage you lack is unfair and unjust." I can think of many hunters (just to name the famous ones) who routinely shot elephant, buffalo, rhino, etc. from distances exceeding ten feet and those men did not "lack courage". Damn far from it. Harris, Baker, Bell, Burton, Selous, Hunter, Percival, Roosevelt, Selby, Hemingway, Ruark, Sanchez-Arino, Harlan, Boddington, Prothero, Watts, &c. Read Judge G's story about his day with the lions. He sure the hell doesn't lack courage, and I'm pretty sure he has shot dangerous game at distances over ten feet a time or two. Like many others on AR, I think Mark Sullivan deserves an explanation from SCI; that's the American way. Would I choose Mark Sullivan as my PH? No. Paul Smith SCI Life Member NRA Life Member DSC Member Life Member of the "I Can't Wait to Get Back to Africa" Club DRSS I had the privilege to fire E. Hemingway's WR .577NE, E. Keith's WR .470NE, & F. Jamieson's WJJ .500 Jeffery I strongly recommend avoidance of "The Zambezi Safari & Travel Co., Ltd." and "Pisces Sportfishing-Cabo San Lucas" "A failed policy of national defense is its own punishment" Otto von Bismarck | |||
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And the battle of the ego's continue. Very entertaining. | |||
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.......And I take issue with the above statement! It takes very little skill to pop a cape buffalo in the brain from 10 feet, of from 10 yards! The rest below I agree with completely!
IMO, what Mr. Sullivan exibits in not courage, but as has been said "LOOK AT ME SHOWMANSHIP". In an article in a gun magazine a few years ago it was noted that someone had told him they thought he looked like Tom Selleck on the show "Magnum P.I." so he went out and bought a red Farrari to tool around Pheonix where he lived at the time. Does that give you some insight into his thinking about how he wants to be percieved? Really it is too bad, because I think without the gigantic ego, he is a very good PH, and knows Cape buffalo very well, and produces some very good trophies for his clients, if they can just beat him to the trigger.  ....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1 DRSS Charter member "If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982 Hands of Old Elmer Keith | |||
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But the good Judge did not powow with the lions beforehand, nor rile them up! You are right that the Judge is not lacking in courage. Rumor has it that the only reason he and PVT were not on the menu that day was due to the lion's exercise of professional courtesy - the lions were somehow aware that the Judge was a lawyer...... SCI Life Member DSC Life Member | |||
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So very typical of these lengthy threads on AR, they invariably morph into something else. I have just read straight through all four pages and have followed quietly along on the other MS topics. Whew!! I can't see where SCI owes the 55000 members across the planet an explanation for Mark's dismissal. Aren't the B.O.D. and officers elected at the approval of the members (life) and charged with taking care of the membership business? If an officer of board member is found to be guilty of some infraction and dismissed, then the membership is entitled to know why. Not much different than a President of the United States impeached for for a dallyance in the White House kitchen cupboard. The public has a right to know, agreed? If Ms. Lewinski was fired by the admninistration, it is up to her to say why and under what circumstances. Then it all becomes sensationalize news. SCI owes Mark Sullivan a complete and itemized explanation. If he wishes to take it to the membership after that is divulged, it is his perogative. The cat fights within the NRA or the Sheep Foundation are notorious, but poor news, and yet, eventually the story unfolds. I do applaud his entry onto the AR forums. I saw one of his videos and returned it. Entertaing? In a macabre kind of way, yes. Would I hunt with him? Nope, much to alpah male for my alpha male tastes. Courage? Yes, I suppose so, but an undeniable amount of extreme self confidence. Hell, I've only killed one cape buffalo, and I only managed to get the Robert Ruark stare. Still, it eas exciting and gratifying. All those videous make "interesting" viewing, and make more money than some of us on AR would like to admit. If I go into the mouth of the beast around Yellowstone Park and intentionally place myself in some fashion into a confrontation with a grizzly bear, things are going to happen. The bear runs, or I depend on high grade chili pepper to end the cdonfrontation, or I shoot the irrascible son of a bitch........maybe with a double rifle at 10 ft or 10 yards. Never mind the ESA and the radio collars. Not the point. If I do it enough times with a trusty camerman behind me, I'm going to get some great footage of a charging usus horribilus. If I do it enough times through the years, I'm going to get my head ripped off.......end of movie. I know very well how to get in the red zone of a Yellowstone grzzly. Got give Mark credit for knowing how far to push the limit. | |||
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Mark, just saw this....welcome. You wouldn't remember, nor would I expect you to, but we met on more than one occasion, first with my son in Reno and second with my wife in Dallas. Additionally, I spoke with you a couple of times via telephone on one matter or another. Regardless, I have said in previous posts and will state again, there are all types....and I would not hesitate for a second to hunt with you. You have always been a gentleman when we've met/spoke and that speaks volumes to me. You will never please everyone but you've been aware of that for some time, no doubt. Thanks for your straightforward post and for keeping me entertained via your books/videos....not everyone's taste, but I enjoy them. Gary DRSS NRA Lifer SCI DSC | |||
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Welcome to AR, Mr. Sullivan. I am very glad indeed that you posted. You hunt your way, and I'll hunt mine. They are not the same. No reason why they should be. PLEASE do not let this be your last post. I would very much enjoy descriptions of your hunts, since the need (and it was a need, insofar as some of us here are concerned) to explain yourself is now entirely satisfied. Again, welcome. And good hunting. | |||
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Mark, Thank you for taking the time towrite the leter and answer some of the questions here. Although I still dont buy into all of it we will agree to disagree. As to the SCI issue I have a couple of problems. 1 The "ethics" committee is sworn to secrecy and bound by the current bylaws. As such even if the wanted to say something they are not allowed to. I know at least one gent on the committee who takes his job very seriously and refuses to discuss anything even with other board members and personal friends on the local chapter. 2 It appears you have not been privy to any claim of misconduct against you if there is one. The bylaws also state that there needs to be charges brought and that they need to be addressed at a closed door hearing with the accused. 3 This one is my real problem. Considering OOA and some of the past hunters of the year etc any and all chrages should be public to the membership. Any and all of these hearings should be open door. There needs to be total transparency in these events to remove any doubts of collusion and conspiracy. Considering the things I have seen swept under the rug at times by the upper management of the club I have to wonder. Although at times it is these people who are on the block. The ethics committe should be non partial and non politically appointed. All decisions made by the committe should ot be able to be questioned by anyone other than a full 2/3 majority of the membership. This process should be so squeaky clean that no one can find fault. All too often these things are motivated by less than altuistic values and are based on money, power, jealousy etc. I think that every accusation, the resultant investigation and the final decision should be public to the membership. It is my belief that this will protect not only the accused but also the membership. There needs to be total transparency. There also needs to be a reprimad process if charges are found to be frivolous or false. To clarify that is false not just a wrong opinion of what happened. Everyone sees things from diiferent experience and perspective points so differences will certainly occur. Now that I have got that off my chest I think I will go and shoot some moose out of a plane.  Happiness is a warm gun | |||
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Don't forget to let the moose decides how he should die  | |||
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This is not the first time I have read this explanation. But having watched the video with the lion that was wounded by the Spanish client, I have to wonder why MS's "fight to the death/confrontational" style is limited to buffalo and hippo in the open, but does not extend to wounded lions in the long grass.  I would have thought that he would have dove right in after the cat. But as MS said: "If you lack courage that is something I cannot help you with." I guess there is a big difference between approaching a mortally wounded cape buffalo(that is lying in the open) on your terms, and wading into the long grass where the fight might be on the animals terms. I haven't watched all of MS's videos, but in the "charges" that I have seen it was clear he held the cards, much like a matador. I wish I could have asked him about this, but he made one post then hopped onto a plane to Tanzania. It's odd that he didn't begin posting on the day that he registered as a member. Maybe he didn't want to answer our questions? Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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If I was getting ready to head to Tanzania to guide for my busiest season yet the last thing I'm worrying about is responding to people who I don't even know about something that has nothing to do with what is most important....getting ready for my hunt! Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Brett you usually seem pretty level headed, but I can't say that at this time. MS seemed to be worried enough about what we here on AR think to go to the trouble to compose a long "open letter". Don't kid yourself, controversy and image are important to him. He registered and then waited three days to make his first post. I have no doubt that he left the day after his post. It is clear that he wanted to stir up sympathies among SCI members here on AR, while staying away from the controversial content in his public image. I don't know if you have met the man, but people seem to have very different impressions of him. When I see the difference in tone between his "open letter" here on AR and his tone when he was taking unwarranted pot-shots at some good men I now understand the the reason for the disparity. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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Just a random question: Why are there no trophy pics on MS website newer than 2003? I presume he hunts every year? | |||
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Anything is possible and I don't pretend to know what he thinks, but I do seem to remember a bunch of people on AR calling Mark up and inviting him to come on and respond to these threads. I think that's slightly different than what you've discribed. I might question how "desprit" he really was to get on here to straighten us out. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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 "Science only goes so far then God takes over." | |||
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Thwere is a simple answer to your question. Mark may be alot of things but he ain't stupid. 465H&H | |||
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As I said:
Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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What Jason said! Plus one. I always wondered what a bull fight would be without the picadores and horsemen. Gruesome... Rich | |||
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I brought this back to the surface, Mark is due back in a day or three. He may want to see what his thread stirred up. Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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Sort of like kicking dirt in a hippos face! STAY IN THE FIGHT! | |||
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He must have had a short season if he is back that soon. | |||
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Larry, I may be wrong, I was on my way to the airport for that sheep hunt when we spoke, I thought he told me the second or the third. of Sept. hell it might have been October or November for all I remember. Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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I don't think he is as busy as he claims. I wonder why? | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting African Big Game Hunting An Open Letter from Mark Sullivan
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