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$70,000 Scam involving Blair Worldwide Hunting.
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This is all the more reason Blair should refund his commission; he sold what was deemed a fraud by the legal system.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
http://forums.accuratereloadin...821061151#2821061151

 
Posts: 7351 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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Did the courts in fact find him to be a fraud or did the clients win because Heathington never showed up for the trial?
 
Posts: 10654 | Location: Orlando, FL | Registered: 26 January 2006Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
Did the courts in fact find him to be a fraud or did the clients win because Heathington never showed up for the trial?


Good point Larry, but if he didn't show up for the trial, he likely didn't show up for the hunt.

In any event, Blair should have refunded his commission.

Why would anyone book with Blair when there are so many other booking agents who would not screw you like this? And with such arrogance I might add.

Blair, we will keep this topic in the forefront until you are out of business.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
http://forums.accuratereloadin...821061151#2821061151

 
Posts: 7351 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
Did the courts in fact find him to be a fraud or did the clients win because Heathington never showed up for the trial?


Oh my, are we picking a nit or what??


Aim for the exit hole
 
Posts: 4348 | Location: middle tenn | Registered: 09 December 2009Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
This is all the more reason Blair should refund his commission; he sold what was deemed a fraud by the legal system.


Even worse is that he KNEW Heathington was a crook and still sold the hunt......THAT is inexcusable.
 
Posts: 2717 | Location: NH | Registered: 03 February 2009Reply With Quote
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Picture of 505 gibbs
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quote:
Did the courts in fact find him to be a fraud or did the clients win because Heathington never showed up for the trial?

It is my understanding they got a default judgement.
 
Posts: 4958 | Registered: 30 July 2007Reply With Quote
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Actually Wasbeeman, this is not nitpicking at all. There are light years between a default judgement and being convicted of fraud.

I am not in BWW"s camp at all. Just trying to find out what really happened .
 
Posts: 10654 | Location: Orlando, FL | Registered: 26 January 2006Reply With Quote
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Oh, does that mean he is only a little bit of a fraud??? IMO you're trying to define "is".


Aim for the exit hole
 
Posts: 4348 | Location: middle tenn | Registered: 09 December 2009Reply With Quote
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No. A default judgment means you lose because you didn't mount a defense. It is not even in the same universe of being convicted of fraud.

Once again, I think BWW has serious issues. I am simply trying to find out what really happened. If they were in fact convicted of fraud that is far more serious than a default judgment.
 
Posts: 10654 | Location: Orlando, FL | Registered: 26 January 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of 505 gibbs
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BWW wasn't convicted of anything, Larry Heathington was.
 
Posts: 4958 | Registered: 30 July 2007Reply With Quote
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Picture of billrquimby
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I'm not a lawyer, but I suspect Heathington was not charged with fraud and that the default judgment came in a civil court where the victim sought money for damages.

If Heathington had been charged with the crime of fraud, wouldn't there be a warrant issued for his arrest for failure to appear?

Bill Quimby
 
Posts: 2633 | Location: tucson and greer arizona | Registered: 02 February 2006Reply With Quote
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Bill, in WA State prepayment for services to be delivered is legally considered an unsecured loan and failure to deliver the services is a default on the loan. I reckon all states are substantially the same.

I suspect for it to be fraud you would have to prove there was never intention to deliver the product sold.

Either way if Heathington has no assets to attach the money is gone. That really is all the matters at this point.


Howard
Moses Lake, Washington USA
hwhomes@outlook.com
 
Posts: 2325 | Location: Moses Lake WA | Registered: 17 October 2000Reply With Quote
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Is Blair still in business?
 
Posts: 801 | Location: Plover, Wi | Registered: 04 October 2009Reply With Quote
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He is on the exhibitor list for the SCI convention in Feb. I wonder how many hunters will stop by his booth to book a hunt. I will check it out when I am there.
 
Posts: 503 | Registered: 27 May 2007Reply With Quote
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OOOOOH! That could be interesting! Big Grin
 
Posts: 801 | Location: Plover, Wi | Registered: 04 October 2009Reply With Quote
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Picture of billrquimby
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quote:
Originally posted by Howard:
Bill, in WA State prepayment for services to be delivered is legally considered an unsecured loan and failure to deliver the services is a default on the loan. I reckon all states are substantially the same.

I suspect for it to be fraud you would have to prove there was never intention to deliver the product sold.

Either way if Heathington has no assets to attach the money is gone. That really is all the matters at this point.



Howard:'

That was my point. Although some here already have convicted Heathington of a crime, to my knowledge he has not yet been formally charged with a single criminal act. It makes me wonder why not.

Judging only by what I've read here, there seems to be enough evidence out there to indict him of several crimes -- but then I was only a reporter in a much earlier life, and never a lawyer.

Bill Quimby
 
Posts: 2633 | Location: tucson and greer arizona | Registered: 02 February 2006Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by billrquimby:

Howard:'
Judging only by what I've read here, there seems to be enough evidence out there to indict him of several crimes -
Bill Quimby


It's a good thing for us all that internet evidence isn't evidence out in the real world. Wink


Howard
Moses Lake, Washington USA
hwhomes@outlook.com
 
Posts: 2325 | Location: Moses Lake WA | Registered: 17 October 2000Reply With Quote
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Picture of drummondlindsey
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quote:
Originally posted by Howard:
quote:
Originally posted by billrquimby:

Howard:'
Judging only by what I've read here, there seems to be enough evidence out there to indict him of several crimes -
Bill Quimby


It's a good thing for us all that internet evidence isn't evidence out in the real world. Wink


I'm just glad that Jeff Blair and Larry Heathington came on here and made their statements. There is plenty there to be able to form an educated opinion about their integrity and business practices. In the "court of public opinion" it looks bleak for those two.

Anyway, hated to see this thread buried on the second page.
 
Posts: 2032 | Location: Windsor, CO | Registered: 06 December 2005Reply With Quote
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This really needs to be on page 1 with the other agent's lack of service thread on the Africa hunting forum
 
Posts: 296 | Registered: 06 March 2010Reply With Quote
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Doing my duty for God and country and bringin' it to the top.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
http://forums.accuratereloadin...821061151#2821061151

 
Posts: 7351 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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Howard, one serious question: Are you a paid shill for Blair or are you so destitute socially that you stir up shit like this so's people will talk to you? Wink


Aim for the exit hole
 
Posts: 4348 | Location: middle tenn | Registered: 09 December 2009Reply With Quote
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Anyone else get an email from Blair with "Christmas gift ideas"? Wonder if they pulled the email list from DSC?
 
Posts: 8750 | Location: Republic of Texas | Registered: 24 April 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Charles_Helm:
Anyone else get an email from Blair with "Christmas gift ideas"? Wonder if they pulled the email list from DSC?


Here is my idea for a Christmas present:

Let's make sure this stays on the very top on Christmas Day.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
http://forums.accuratereloadin...821061151#2821061151

 
Posts: 7351 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Charles_Helm:
Anyone else get an email from Blair with "Christmas gift ideas"? Wonder if they pulled the email list from DSC?


Yep, I got it today!


Graybird

"Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning."
 
Posts: 3711 | Location: Okie in Falcon, CO | Registered: 01 July 2004Reply With Quote
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BWW periodically calls my cell phone hawking their hunts. I have no idea how they got my cell #, and have asked them to stop contacting me every time they call. The last time I got pissed, used some language I probably shouldn't have, and told them to have some dignity, and quit trying to market their hunts like a siding salesman! Hope they finally got the message.........
 
Posts: 26 | Location: Glenrock, WY | Registered: 07 January 2009Reply With Quote
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I got a postcard in the mail today from BWW!!! Glad to know they spent some money on me and absolutely no f'in way they'll ever recover it!!!


Graybird

"Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning."
 
Posts: 3711 | Location: Okie in Falcon, CO | Registered: 01 July 2004Reply With Quote
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If you want them to stop contacting you next time just ask them about this hunt that started this thread. I did and have not received a phone call, email or letter again from them. Plus the fact that they will not answer any questions about this puts them in a very bad light. Guess they should have checked this outfitter out properly before selling his hunt but I guess they were out for the bucks, pun intended.


Good Hunting,

 
Posts: 3143 | Location: Duluth, GA | Registered: 30 September 2005Reply With Quote
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BTT
 
Posts: 10654 | Location: Orlando, FL | Registered: 26 January 2006Reply With Quote
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Picture of Oday450
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Just received an unsolicited email from Blair regarding Sheep and Bear. Responded with a please remove request listing this topic and link as the reason. This was the first, and hopefully the last, time they have used my personal email address. Makes me wonder where they found it.


"Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult."
 
Posts: 1308 | Location: The People's Republic of Maryland, USA | Registered: 05 August 2006Reply With Quote
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just got the same thing
 
Posts: 13146 | Location: faribault mn | Registered: 16 November 2004Reply With Quote
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Me three...I would like to know where they got my email address.
 
Posts: 483 | Location: Mostly USA | Registered: 25 March 2011Reply With Quote
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Having read this entire thread its our duty to make sure the dirtbags dont pull this crap on anyone else. A fried and I were looking into booking a hunt and am so happy I saw this. My buddy had gotten a couple cold calls from Blair and this just saved us a ton. Thanks guys!!!


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
http://forums.accuratereloadin...821061151#2821061151
 
Posts: 1 | Location: Spokane,Wa | Registered: 11 June 2005Reply With Quote
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I have never contacted blair looking for a hunt, and find it strange that i got an email from them earlier in the week trying to sell me a hunt.
 
Posts: 167 | Location: Mckinney, TX | Registered: 15 January 2010Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Ongwe:
Me three...I would like to know where they got my email address.


My best guess is they buy them from SCI or hunting magazines you subscribe to.
 
Posts: 1484 | Location: Central Texas | Registered: 01 October 2010Reply With Quote
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Picture of billrquimby
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quote:
My best guess is they buy them from SCI or hunting magazines you subscribe to.


SCI had a policy against selling its membership list when I still was there, and I doubt that it has changed. There are various businesses and agencies that do sell their contact lists, though, including our state's game department.

Bill Quimby
 
Posts: 2633 | Location: tucson and greer arizona | Registered: 02 February 2006Reply With Quote
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quote:
I have never contacted blair looking for a hunt, and find it strange that i got an email from them earlier in the week trying to sell me a hunt.



Yeah, I received a postcard in the mail from them yesterday, and an email from them today.....I have my suspicions of where they get their contact lists, but at least they have stopped calling me (it only took 2 times to get my point across!).


Never follow a bad move with a stupid move.
 
Posts: 217 | Location: Clute, TX USA | Registered: 23 June 2006Reply With Quote
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Just received a call from a Blair's salesperson wanting to know if they could help me with my hunting trips.

I asked about the reports concerning a Mexico sheep hunt and was referred here to get the true story and Mr. Blair's rebuttal.

Interesting, to say the least.


JudgeG ... just counting time 'til I am again finding balm in Gilead chilled out somewhere in the Selous.
 
Posts: 7342 | Location: GA | Registered: 27 February 2001Reply With Quote
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How are they getting emails and phone numbers?
 
Posts: 2032 | Location: Windsor, CO | Registered: 06 December 2005Reply With Quote
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Some states sell mailing lists taken from hunter applications. Maybe someone can shed some light on how that works.

I am kinda hoping they call me. Blair won't take my calls anymore...


"You only gotta do one thing well to make it in this world" - J Joplin
 
Posts: 1129 | Registered: 10 September 2008Reply With Quote
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There are numerous companies that specialize in assisting business in targeted marketing. Mailing list, demographics etc are all available for a price.

Ultimately isn't that what a booking agent does? Markets the guide/outfitter to his targeted audience?

Far as the states lists go. Virtually everything the government does is a matter of public record and is available through the freedom of information act.

Also many states now seem to be using third party vendors for selling and processing their licensees and tags and those vendors probably sell their lists.


Howard
Moses Lake, Washington USA
hwhomes@outlook.com
 
Posts: 2325 | Location: Moses Lake WA | Registered: 17 October 2000Reply With Quote
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