quote:

As to more BS that was posted, I do have a letters into Mrs. Bown at SOAZ, SCI, Don Heath,and the hunt report btw, I also just forwarded Robbies letter quoting Mr. Sadango, and I have them in my file so cut the crap, but thanks for letting me know she is out of town.

Ray,
why did you delete the part of your post where you stated you contacted Sally? I don't know you from Adam, but it would appear that you are being dishonest and covering here.

1) Director General of Natioanl Parks is Vitalis CHADENGA...I have never heard of a Sadanga in Parks.

2) Just because Parks have issued a permit doesn't make it 'legal'. At least two South African PH's have arrived on my dads farm clutching a Permit (NP 10) from Parks giving them permission to shoot game that a) they are not legally entitled to and b) doesn't occur there.

3) Ray...sorry I do not recall writing any letters to say that a hunt in Dudelys concession with another operator was legal

Dudley and I are hardly 'mates' but even if I hated him (which I don't) he got his area fairly before the politics crept in - and I will NEVER condone a back door attempt to cut into another operators area.

lastly, you of all people should know not to send an unsuspecting client to go poaching...especially posting it on the net when we are all free to climb in

But I must thank you for bringing these activities into the light...I can assure you Mr Chadenga will face a few very searching questions of what permits he is issuing to who (especially as the Minister / Dr Madzikanda) regard this as their private preserve...

quote:

3) Ray...sorry I do not recall writing any letters to say that a hunt in Dudelys concession with another operator was legal

Don,
Did you receive a letter from Ray asking about this?

505...not that I recall everything...but I do have a good filing system...and nope...no copies of any incoming or outgoing letters in the last 18 months.

quote:

quote:
As to more BS that was posted, I do have a letters into Mrs. Bown at SOAZ, SCI, Don Heath,and the hunt report btw, I also just forwarded Robbies letter quoting Mr. Sadango, and I have them in my file so cut the crap, but thanks for letting me know she is out of town.

quote:

quote:
3) Ray...sorry I do not recall writing any letters to say that a hunt in Dudelys concession with another operator was legal

Don,
Did you receive a letter from Ray asking about this?

quote:

505...not that I recall everything...but I do have a good filing system...and nope...no copies of any incoming or outgoing letters in the last 18 months.

Ray, I am afraid it may be to late for you to reclaim any shred of trustworthiness you may have had before this shameful display. If it hadn't already been made so clear that you are so set in your ways, I would give you the same advice I give my 7 year old, that it would be wise for you to listen to your Cricket. But, since it is clear to me what kind of "merchant" you are, I have lost interest in your part of this. However, I do find it very interesting continuing to wonder about those who have defended you.

hell Brad, i don't recall anyone defending him. of course after 5 pages of posts, who can say. i feel sure though that he will get to the bottom of this since he has queried Don, Sally, and Mr. Sadanga( or was that President Magabe- who will be there for the hunt). 2 things i have learned from this- never do business with Ray and spell check has a tough time with African names.

This thread confirms, beyond all doubt, many suspicions that I have held for years.

Ray,

I know a guy who might be interested in this hunt, but he will pay with traveler's checks.

Is that okay with you?

Now ...we are all waiting for ray to do 'the cowboy thing', be a man, and step up and appologise for trying to sell a hunt to a US citizen which would have been illegal (for said Citizen) and fairly imoral since it would have been directly funding ZANU PF, promoting unsustainable hunting etc.

I know that the animals were shot anyway...and I know who did it...a rekoning will come...ask Dawie and the gang, and, from personal experience, I assure you a Zimbabwean jail is FAR less pleasant than anything the south africans could dream up (And it's a decade since I last had first hand experience of a Zim Cell other than visiting friends and 20 years since I had an extended vacation in the 'Harare Hilton')

quote:

I had an extended vacation in the 'Harare Hilton')

I wonder if that was inclusive in Ray's offer?

quote:

Originally posted by 505 gibbs:

quote:

I had an extended vacation in the 'Harare Hilton')

I wonder if that was inclusive in Ray's offer?

Yeah, but food is extra during your "Hilton" stay. On the upside beatings and third world diseases are "complimentary"!

Brett

quote:

I would say this entire 4 pages of posts could be summed up in that statement.

Nah, it is windy, blustery, cold and threatening rain. Good entertainment for me on this Sunday afternoon, until football starts!

Robbie Kruger sounds familiar, did he ever run leopard with hounds?

I wonder if shooting buffalo this way is the way an agent gets his "history" of "over a hundred buffalo".

quote:

Originally posted by NitroX:
I wonder if shooting buffalo this way is the way an agent gets his "history" of "over a hundred buffalo".

No, he counts the ones his clients have shot as his own.

George

In the dark ages of the internet (before AR) I occasionaly went on a site selling hunts called 'huntAmerica.com'...and I remember Ray posting about comming out to Africa on his first hunt.

It wasn't that long ago a decade perhaps ...but I have a couple of real slooths looking up those old posts...

Ray- come out from hiding or I will post the time and place of your first African Hunt - in your own words

People that have Parks permits. But some may reportedly not be legal. How is anyone to know which ones are and which are not?

Who portrays themselves as the final arbiter?

Will...Who decides? In your case, the US Government. And whiich is why selling a hunt to US citizen that is quite cleraly in contravention of the US Presidential order is imoral.

quote:

Originally posted by Ganyana:
In the dark ages of the internet (before AR) I occasionaly went on a site selling hunts called 'huntAmerica.com'...and I remember Ray posting about comming out to Africa on his first hunt.

It wasn't that long ago a decade perhaps ...but I have a couple of real slooths looking up those old posts...

Ray- come out from hiding or I will post the time and place of your first African Hunt - in your own words

I remember it as being 1997 or so. To listen to him, he's been doing this since Elmer Keith was a pup.

George

That was probably when he shot the 50 something inch buffalo............

quote:

Ray- come out from hiding or I will post the time and place of your first African Hunt - in your own words

Does "Hunt America" have editing options? If so, I am sure Ray will see these last posts and hurry over to that site and edit those earlier posts out. Remember the "PVT vs SheepHunter" thread!

I have seen repeated references to the PVT/Sheephunter incident. Can you provide a brief summary?

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I have seen repeated references to the PVT/Sheephunter incident. Can you provide a brief summary?

Six of one and half a dozen of the other. Unprovoked and awful charges (to quote Kipling) and probably errors from both sides and shed loads of misinformed, vitriolic bollocks from a hell of a lot of people who weren't there, had never heard of the area and have no idea whatsoever of Masailand, the Masai and their culture.

Other than that, it was a well reasoned and polite debate.

Probably best left buried.

Larry:

I am afraid I would not do the thread justice with a brief recap. I can only suggest you search it and read it. I mentioned it because Ray went back and edited some and deleted many of his posts in order to make himself look better and to cover up his claims and comments, IIRC. There seems to be a trend with Ray, his offerings, and his claims. Unfortunately, it is not a positive trend, IMO.

Interesting. Thank you.

The title of this thread would give any reasonably knowledgeable hunter cause to be concerned.

quote:

Originally posted by RCG:
Larry:

I am afraid I would not do the thread justice with a brief recap. I can only suggest you search it and read it. I mentioned it because Ray went back and edited some and deleted many of his posts in order to make himself look better and to cover up his claims and comments, IIRC. There seems to be a trend with Ray, his offerings, and his claims. Unfortunately, it is not a positive trend, IMO.

Seems I cannot find that thread, or it's been deleted.

quote:

Originally posted by Jack D Bold: Seems I cannot find that thread, or it's been deleted.

Jack, the original hunt report post was on 28 October 2005, and I am sure there are copies floating around that were saved for posterity. It was an ugly thread to say the least.

quote:

Originally posted by Jack D Bold:

quote:

Originally posted by RCG:
Larry:

I am afraid I would not do the thread justice with a brief recap. I can only suggest you search it and read it. I mentioned it because Ray went back and edited some and deleted many of his posts in order to make himself look better and to cover up his claims and comments, IIRC. There seems to be a trend with Ray, his offerings, and his claims. Unfortunately, it is not a positive trend, IMO.

Seems I cannot find that thread, or it's been deleted.

The thread was deleted. I do remember that it grew very long with accusations and counter accusations and forced Ray to announce one of many of his retirements from the board.

"Checker's speach" yet again??

Any Body see Ray laying around anywhere
Larry
Could not find the HANGMAN Graemlin.
Larry

I do know for a fact that Ray Ray sent at least two hunters to Zim last year, as they were stuck into MY and MY WIFES "exclusive" camp in Cirissa by HHK.

It was just lovely.........a couple of Idaho mink farmers.....foul mouthed old man and son.....acted just like Ray Ray.....made for a few lovely evenings around the campfire.

Tex,

What a bummer. I know exactly what it is like to share an "exclusive" camp with a few others. Screwed me right into the ceiling. I just have a very short fuse when an outfitter misleads expectations.

This thread is mostly about Ray, but your unfortunate hunt looks to be an HHK issue, right?

quote:

Tex,

What a bummer. I know exactly what it is like to share an "exclusive" camp with a few others. Screwed me right into the ceiling. I just have a very short fuse when an outfitter misleads expectations.

This thread is mostly about Ray, but your unfortunate hunt looks to be an HHK issue, right?

Jack,

It sure was.

Wouldn't have been terrible for me but my wife was along and they were not the most socially acceptable types of mink farmers.........

quote:

they were not the most socially acceptable types of mink farmers.........

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Tex,

What a bummer. I know exactly what it is like to share an "exclusive" camp with a few others. Screwed me right into the ceiling. I just have a very short fuse when an outfitter misleads expectations.

This thread is mostly about Ray, but your unfortunate hunt looks to be an HHK issue, right?

Jack,

It sure was.

Wouldn't have been terrible for me but my wife was along and they were not the most socially acceptable types of mink farmers.........

Did you book through an agent or direct with HHK?

Agent.

The agent did me real good though, when he found outhe refunded some of my money and took Grahamie Kingston to task. I know it did no good with that scum but there ya' are.

What, no threats to sic Doug Chester, Esq., on anyone yet? Ray, you're really slipping.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:
I do know for a fact that Ray Ray sent at least two hunters to Zim last year, as they were stuck into MY and MY WIFES "exclusive" camp in Cirissa by HHK.

It was just lovely.........a couple of Idaho mink farmers.....foul mouthed old man and son.....acted just like Ray Ray.....made for a few lovely evenings around the campfire.

Exactly how was this Ray's fault, did he book all parties? And just how does Ray act?

Just askin......................