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This! ^^^^ | |||
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digress dʌɪˈgrɛs/ verb verb: digress; 3rd person present: digresses; past tense: digressed; past participle: digressed; gerund or present participle: digressing 1. leave the main subject temporarily in speech or writing. "I have digressed a little from my original plan" synonyms: deviate, go off at a tangent, diverge, turn aside, turn away, depart, drift, stray, ramble, wander, meander, maunder; More get off the subject, stray from the subject, stray from the point, deviate from the topic, get sidetracked, lose the thread; raredivagate "I have digressed a little from my original plan" antonyms: keep/stick to the point Origin You see now, this is what happens when shit [any shit, even pig shit] hits the fan. Its all over the place!!   | |||
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Steve: Although we're both apparently retired, "old" attitudes like that and an unwillingness to try to deal with real problems might explain why there aren't more young people getting involved in our sport. If we don't change that, who's going to buy your books? No client hunters going to Africa=No need for professional hunters to guide them. If the trend continues, I suppose either of our opinions will become moot.  "I'm not fluent in the language of violence, but I know enough to get around in places where it's spoken." Tanzania 2012: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/8331015971 Saskatoon, Canada 2013: http://forums.accuratereloadin...4121043/m/7171030391 Las Pampas, Argentina 2014: http://forums.accuratereloadin...4107165/m/1991059791 | |||
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I guess that's one version...the other that the rest of the world learns in history class is that you tried to attack Canada and we chased you, with your tails tucked, all the way back to Washington, burned the whitehouse and then came back home after a job well done. We'd have stayed but we heard Obama was going to president one day. Going home seemed prudent | |||
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I find it rather interesting that some folks who know neither Andrew nor the chap that calls himself PigSlayer quickly pick one as 'pure as the driven snow' and the other chap worthy of only the vilest contempt as shown by name calling ... infantile displays of BS flag raisings ... etc... Let Andrew have his say .. sheesh ! Then form some kind of conclusion if you must ... | |||
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Pullicords Sorry mate. I don't follow your logic at all. The organisations you mention (or at least one of them & presumably both) do already have ethics committees etc but they're not & never will be holders of any legal powers & are therefore restricted to withholding booth space & nothing else as 'punishment' ........ & as Andrew isn't a member of either organisation & doesn't attend the conventions they can't do anything at all. Bringing the next generation into sport hunting & indeed my book sales are entirely different matters. That said: I repeat my belief that Andrew is completely innocent of these ridiculous accusations. Andrew is far too much of a gentleman to behave in such a manner & I wouldn't hesitate to trust him with my life, wife, dog & home.  | |||
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No matter who won or lost you'd probably have been better off without independence.......... Look who it's bought you as President!  | |||
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You'd trust him with your dog....that's a big call mate......  ------------------------------ A mate of mine has just told me he's shagging his girlfriend and her twin. I said "How can you tell them apart?" He said "Her brother's got a moustache!" | |||
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Not too sure about my rifles though! | |||
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Steve- I'm sorry you can't follow my logic. Both organizations can, do, and have (on rare occasions) acted on behalf of members that were victimized by other members. Even if Andrew isn't involved with either organization, the issue of legal/ethical wrongdoing is real and goes beyond what's been alleged (and by whom) in this post. If outfitters or clients could always be relied upon by their word and a handshake, contracts wouldn't be written would they? Of course what a few know and far too many don't, is that the contracts usually aren't worth the paper they're written on. Perhaps there are more people out there that prefer it stays that way, but (judging from the contacts I've made in a relatively short period of time) I disagree. Safari clubs and professional hunting organizations can do much to change that fact that people are often ripped off or slandered with little or no recourse. If that's of none of your concern, so be it. If DSC and SCI don't give a shit, fine-only let's make that clear to those who attend their conventions and book hunts in the mistaken belief that the organizations "ethical standards" apply when it comes to ripping off or doing other harm to members, if they don't. Word gets around my friend, and in this day it gets circulated world wide in a very short period of time. If word gets out about an outfitter, PH, hunter, or hunting organization that he/she or it can't be trusted, all their friends in the world might vouch for them but the word "gentleman" will mean nothing. I know this, you know it, and young people of today know it far better than either of us. While I certainly have no reason to doubt your assertions about Andrew and view many of the claims by the OP as suspicious, internet arguments between parties aren't going to solve the disagreements. No matter how good a guy Andrew is, anyone reading posts like this about him will have to wonder if there's fire underneath smoke. Its not fair to Andrew and I'd like to see an alternative available, but if I did a Google Search on his name and saw multiple negative posts similar to this, I'd just move on to another outfitter. So would many other potential clients and why shouldn't they? Its their money and time that would be lost and they'd have no recourse if ripped off! Andrew shouldn't lose business because of some anonymous poster's allegations, but that's going to happen with the current state of affairs. Clients shouldn't be deterred from doing business with ethical operators over BS, but without some means of clearing up serious allegations, how are you going to stop it? (Sorry, but just because "Steve" or someone else vouches for his qualifications as a "gentleman", that's not going to cut it for most people.) All of this discussion comes down to a rather simple issue: Establishing some sort of formal code of ethical conduct among hunters and hunting organizations is in our own best interest. Arbitrating disputes between members may not be something DSC or SCI has to do, but its in their best interest to do so. Even if suspensions or revocations of membership and banning convention attendance are negligible punishments, they're better than nothing and they serve notice to potential clients that this person is not to be trusted. (Kinda like getting the word out in the "old days" that someone wasn't a gentleman, eh???) If members of DSC, SCI or similar organizations don't believe trust and ethical conduct are important enough values that they should be dealt with in this manner, well I guess I'm not going to be able to change their minds. Others though will see these words and take notice. Why would anyone want to join an organization that demonstrates such a lack of values? Can we take their word about conservation projects, political action, youth sponsorships, or other ways they spend our money?  "I'm not fluent in the language of violence, but I know enough to get around in places where it's spoken." Tanzania 2012: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/8331015971 Saskatoon, Canada 2013: http://forums.accuratereloadin...4121043/m/7171030391 Las Pampas, Argentina 2014: http://forums.accuratereloadin...4107165/m/1991059791 | |||
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Pullicords SCI ethics cttee have been an industry joke for donkey´s years but the only way it'll be fixed is for the membership to pull them into line & I'll bet a pound to a pinch of the brown stuff that'll never happen........ BUT that has bugger all to do with the case in hand because Andrew isn't a member & doesn't want or need booth space. Which is why I don't follow your logic. | |||
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...heck...I am going down to Andrews place here next year...ain´t no farkin´ pigshit will stop me... DRSS: HQ Scandinavia. Chapters in Sweden & Norway | |||
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I just see the problem as being beyond Andrew and this anonymous poster. Its that simple and it should be addressed, regardless of what does or doesn't occur in this instance. I apologize if I've diverted the thread from little more than an on-line pissing match. Those who want to, should feel free to have at it! "I'm not fluent in the language of violence, but I know enough to get around in places where it's spoken." Tanzania 2012: http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/8331015971 Saskatoon, Canada 2013: http://forums.accuratereloadin...4121043/m/7171030391 Las Pampas, Argentina 2014: http://forums.accuratereloadin...4107165/m/1991059791 | |||
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I agree it's waaaaay beyond this issue & that's an issue for a separate thread but don't hold your breath on getting any resolution to it because it's been debated ad nauseum umpteen times & bugger all has changed. | |||
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Thats really oneof the functions of The Hunting Report. A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
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All to true considering Obama, but the nice thing about it is that assuming enough pain is spread around in his second term, we won't have to continue dealing with him after 2016 strictly due to his being a member of a certain family! Although the Kennedy's did try to give that one a go, and no doubt the Clintons will try as well!  | |||
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I have been corresponding with Andrew for about 2 years now, and while I will probably never do a hunt in Africa, if I ever decided to do a hunt, I believe Andrew would do the best job he could. Something about the OP's post simply does not ring true in regards to Andrew's character. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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No you didn't Todd. The Queen and her people left you lot in disgust, after they tried and tried, for many years, to teach you the basic elements of speaking English. They found you were not up to it, so they left in utter sorro!  And by the sounds of things, you lot still have not learnt to speak it! Cheers Steve! Raise the Union Flag for Great Britain. You know, that country which ruled the world before the bloody Yanks took over and ruined it!  | |||
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Is that the way the "rest of the world learned it"? A bit of revisionist history if there ever was such! It's true lost the battle of Queenston Heights and initially Detroit, but you might want to brush up on the Battle of Lake Erie on Sep 10, 1813, which gave America control over the lake for the duration of the war. "We have met the enemy and they are ours" ring a bell? Of course, a few days later, after we kicked the shit out of the British at Detroit, Harrison kicked the crap out of the Brits at the Battle of the Thames where Tecumseh was killed. Then of course, the American forces forced Prevost to retreat into Canada at the Battle of Lake Champlain, even though the Americans were outnumbered 3 to 1! Of course, we received our National Anthem from the ass whoopin (there's some of that bastardized English language again) given to the Brits at Fort McHenry! Let's see, Battle of New Orleans, fought after the peace treaty was signed but before news reached the battle field, 5000 Americans against 7500 Brits, dish out 2036 Red Coat casualties to our 21! Yep, sure sounds like you Canadians made us tuck tail and run alright! Back to the OP, I don't know either of these guys, Pigshit or Andrew, but I know OF Andrew and what I know OF the man would suggest that this entire thread is a load of crap, not worthy of a response from him, other than what he has made already. Andrew offered to address this as long as Pig did so in a straight forward manner! Evidently, that was too much of a commitment for Pig to make, preferring unsubstantiated slander instead. With the initial reports from Pig being that all was great with Andrew, then claiming otherwise due to "reporting under duress", sounds like Sheephunter isn't the only one guilty of revisionist history! | |||
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What you seem to not understand Saeed, is that getting the prim and proper types to view us with disgust is simply a tactic we employ with great pride! We like being contrarians. Some of us even like being rednecks! The more disgust, the better! | |||
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Her Royal Majesty Queen Victoria is NOT pleased! May I suggest you send your current ruler to Liverpool where he can at least learn a bit of Geordie to enlighten his people. | |||
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Liverpool, or anyone else that will take him, can have him! We won't even fight you on that one! Call that one a "freebee" !  | |||
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Bloody hell Todd! Do you really think any country will have YOUR reject? You can keep him my friend! Just tell him to stay out of other people's business. He is doing a grand job of destroying a great country! | |||
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[/QUOTE]Bloody hell Todd! Do you really think any country will have YOUR reject? [/QUOTE] Likely not. But does anyone want ours? PLEASE!? | |||
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What the world needs is a large island where we can dump all our dodgy politicians and just leave 'em all there to fester. I guess it's probably too late to send 'em all to Australia is it? Sorry Matt. Only joking. | |||
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No Steve. We really do not want to pollute another island with rejects. Just look what happened to Australia What we need is to take all these politicians, and put them on an ice berg in Antarctica. Then tow it slowly to the equator, and anchor it | |||
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That would be the US. We have damn sure made ourselves an island... Jeff | |||
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Bloody great idea!  | |||
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 ------------------------------ A mate of mine has just told me he's shagging his girlfriend and her twin. I said "How can you tell them apart?" He said "Her brother's got a moustache!" | |||
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We will accept them and then organise a giant cull - no trophy fees... we do that stuff best!! Truthfully we have our share of shit politicians. A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
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I'm sure there's more than a few people in the world that'd be happy to contribute to a fund that would put a bounty on the heads of said dodgy politicians! | |||
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Steve: What about the Jeep and your guns?  | |||
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Surely the guns but I don't even trust my wife with my old Jeep! LOL! Getting back on subject, if Andrew is guilty of anything, I'd bet it'd be of being too much of a nice guy & trying to give someone too cheap a deal & not being enough of a hard nosed businessman which quite honestly is what one needs to be in this business. There's always some bugger who wants something for nothing or next to nothing & if one is to survive in the industry & make a success of your business & pay the bills on time, you need to be able to work to a strict set of business rules & contracts etc & make sure everyone, including or perhaps especially the client sticks to those rules, agreed contracts & payments completely. Andrew is invariably polite & a man of impeccable manners & I'm sure he sometimes struggles to do things like ask for agreed payments at agreed times etc. I on the other hand am not and have even flatly refused to bring the outgoing charter in until a (flaky) client found his 'mislaid' travellers cheques so he could pay the outstanding trophy fees as per the agreed contract. As he was on a use it or lose it flight, it was amazing how quickly the mislaid items were located. Everyone, both clients & operators need to realise there's no such thing as a free lunch and you don't get what you don't pay for. If you want a Cadillac, a Rolls Royce or a Westley Richards, you won't get it for the price of a Ford or a CZ and if you can only afford a Ford or a CZ, you shouldn't whine & bleat when it doesn't perform like a Cadillac, a Rolls Royce or a Westley Richards. | |||
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I wonder if we had the same client?? A day spent in the bush is a day added to your life Hunt Australia - Website Hunt Australia - Facebook Hunt Australia - TV | |||
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This particular one who incidentally goes by a variety of names, had screwed a large number of operators and several taxidermists in Africa before he came to us but fortunately we were able to suss him out ahead of time. Not that I'm suggesting this was the case here....... it does (unfortunately) happen occasionally though. | |||
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What ever happen the MR Pigslayer? Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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Does anyone know who pigslayer actually is? | |||
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What an entertaining bunch you lot are! Obviously Safari season is coming to an end!  "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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Pigslayer also makes numerous references to Karl Human Taxidermy. I have used the services of Karl Human Taxidermy on past African trips & apart from the usual 12 months wait, I have found the service very professional. | |||
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So, NAKI, tell us what is so entertaining in a total unknown coming on to the site and trash talking an individual that many feel is a genuinely good person? Do you have a reasonable answer for that? Or are you of the mind set that in spite of past dealings with hunters on Andrew's part, all of a sudden he decides to screw over this one individual? Enquiring minds want to know NAKI? Do you really/honestly believe that after many years in the business and many satisfied clients, suddenly one morning Andrew wakes up and randomly picks out one individual and says to himself, "I am gonna screw this bitch over"? Personally I don't think that is the case. What do YOU honestly think NAKI????????? Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting Hunting Reports - Africa ANDREW MCLAREN'S UNETHICAL AND FRAUDULENT SAFARIS
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