we have our own carts... now how bout our own bore...

h+h has its snooty 465...

lets make our own 395!

it is the biggest practical gap in the bores...

split the diff between the 375 and 416 and viola! the 395

most cals have 10 or less thou separating them...this one has about 20 on either side!

we have the best bullet smiths here...

we have enough gun nuts...

we have a barrel of gunsmiths (pun intended)

possible carts are the 395-06, 395 wsm, 395-375h+h and 395 ruger

mike at north fork will make custom dia orders for 20 box minimum order (50 per box)http://www.northforkbullets.com/pricing.htm (best bullets bar-none)

the most expensive part is the tooling for a custom barrel, after that it will be like the cost of a reg barrel.

yes most ideas seem stupid at first but hey...

we argue over the most miniscule of minutia...this is something really different and is not all that similar to anything else...something realy new and not almost 99% identicle to something else.

what say the nay choir...

Boomy, YOU go right ahead with this. All it takes is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Hog Killer

I think it would do better if you named it the 396 Take the Rigby case a shorten the neck, then neck it to 394. Give the cartridge a loaded length of 3.550 That will give you more options for actions to use, IE: standard military Mausers for starters, get into the more expensive actions later or as people request such things. My question is, why not give it a shot? What else have you got to do? watch tv. Go for it. Name it the .396 Standard
African Magnum. Get rifle or two built and go have some fun. That's what it's all about.
Timan

quote:

Originally posted by Hog Killer:
Boomy, YOU go right ahead with this. All it takes is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

Hog Killer

Lots of $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$!

Having gone this route on my 606 Mammoth,I can offer some suggestions. PacNor barrels tooled up for my project for only $500. Krieger wanted $1500. RCBS wanted $900 for my first set of dies and Lee was only $300. If you really want to do this up right then some custom brass with the correct markings would be nice. You’ll probably need to buy at least 1000 pieces and it could run $2.00-4.00 each. Manson is excellent to work with on reamers. Your chamber reamer and headspace gauges will be around $300. I am not sure how you could get enough people to commit to get it done. Then there is the choosing of a name. Usually one guy has to foot the bill and hope he sells enough to pay for it. Good luck on your project, Marshall

You say your are proposing something completely different-but you are not. Just what exactly are you going to be doing that is not done with the .400 Whelen, .411 Hawk, or any of the .375-'06 calibers? Nothing. In real world terms, all you are doing is making a very expensive example of a cartridge that ahs been around for close to 80+ years (.400 Whelen, which if made to the original drawings has all the shoulder you need).

So if for vanity reasons you want something different with your name on it-then by all means go ahead. Not a thing in the world wrong with that. But in real world terms you are just a monkey scrwing a football. Lots of noise and gyrations, but not accomplishing much.

BTW-how many custom guns have you had built in the past year? I see you proposing "unsual" rifle ideas and getting excited every few weeks. Just wondering how much of this is you killing time each day and how much is planning that actually gets put into use. ANd please don't read that wrong, there is nothing worng with thinking of new things and getting excited. I am just curious as to what you have done about it all.

Boom Stick,
Thanks for doing the leg work.

I'll be needing two barrels when you get it worked out:

1) .395/.375 Ruger AKA ".395 Ripper"

and

2) .395/.338 Lapua Magnum AKA ".395 Lapua RIPoff" (or maybe simply the ".395 Aagaard"): Very Similar to Timan's .396 African Standard Magnum ...

Lessee ".396 Standard African Magnum": .396 SAM

That would be sweet.
It is simply the .338 Lapua Magnum necked up to .395.

That will work in a .375 H&H length action, or long-nose seat the bullets to fill a Rigby length box, like I do the RIPoff line of cartridges: .375, .423, .458.

One more for the RIPoff line.

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld
BTW-how many custom guns have you had built in the past year? I see you proposing "unsual" rifle ideas and getting excited every few weeks. Just wondering how much of this is you killing time each day and how much is planning that actually gets put into use. ANd please don't read that wrong, there is nothing worng with thinking of new things and getting excited. I am just curious as to what you have done about it all.

I've been wondering the same thing.

Well and good but Holland & Holland announced the 400 H&H previously, so your only .005" off that. The .40 bore also let's you shoot pistol bullets for plinking.

I still say go with the .400 R-AR (Ruger-AR)


EDIT: I didn't know the 400H&H is .411, thanks RIP. To me that makes my 400 R-AR an even better idea for it's uniquness.

quote:

Originally posted by craigster:

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld
BTW-how many custom guns have you had built in the past year? I see you proposing "unsual" rifle ideas and getting excited every few weeks. Just wondering how much of this is you killing time each day and how much is planning that actually gets put into use. ANd please don't read that wrong, there is nothing worng with thinking of new things and getting excited. I am just curious as to what you have done about it all.

I've been wondering the same thing.

I think it's called tool room taste and sand cast budget!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

Originally posted by craigster:

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld
BTW-how many custom guns have you had built in the past year? I see you proposing "unsual" rifle ideas and getting excited every few weeks. Just wondering how much of this is you killing time each day and how much is planning that actually gets put into use. ANd please don't read that wrong, there is nothing worng with thinking of new things and getting excited. I am just curious as to what you have done about it all.

I've been wondering the same thing.

I think it's called tool room taste and sand cast budget!

I think it's more like pipe dreams.

I thought the 600 overkill was accurates favorite cailber.

Some bad poop above.
The .400 H&H is actually a .411 caliber bullet.

In 2003 a poster here reported slugging the bore of a petite Martini rifle of .38-40 chambering and found a .395-.396 groove diameter.

Somebody out there has made the rifle barrel and the bullets for this "new" caliber long ago.

I have been wanting one for years.

If you search old posts here you will find facetious references to .395 and .396 H&H's going back to 2001 by the likes of Mike375.

I certainly don't want to get involved with any group efforts to the end of reviving the barrels for old .38-40 Martini's, but it is really not so "far out" an idea.

.395 Boom Stick (30-06 case)
.395 Ripper (.375 Ruger case)
.395 Aagaard (.338 Lapua case)
.396 Standard African Magnum (SAM)
.396 Son of Sam (SOS)

Actually the .411 bore has some sweetness in being able to shoot 210 grain .410 bullets.....and even the 300 grain Hornady .411 bullets.

But the .423 (404J) by 375 Ruger can handle 44 mag bullets after being squeezed thru a sizing die. These run 180 to 300 grains and would put the kaibosh on a whitetail right pronto.....say at 2,800'/sec!

I truly don't think the world is interested in adding another bore size!!!

Lay off the Boomer boys...America was built by people saying "what if we...?". Most of his stuff is "think outside the box" in action, but what's wrong with that?

Four months ago I got some mis-marked 505 Gibbs cylindrical brass from a poster here, I just wanted to see what it looked like. Six weeks later, the fact that I have Gibbs Basic Brass gets me the loan of a gorgeous Jim Wisner-built 505 to do loadwork for...simply because I have the cylindrical cases to offer for practice ammunition (save the 505 headstamp brass for Africa next year) by a friend. That cylindrical 505 Gibbs brass has turned into the 550 Gibbs Magnum I post about here, and a 510/475/458 and perhaps even a 416 version of the Gibbs for a family of five wildcats.

One of the Big Three Diemakers has shown enough interest in the project to offer me FREE dies "...because we like to encourage experimenters, and it might, just MIGHT, have some commercial applications down the road...". Dies are in the mail, reamers are in the mail, and I am designing a good RFN 725-750gr mould to allow me to shoot as much as I can find time to do so; and it looks as if I have found a gunmaker to convert my BSS to 550 Gibbs, perhaps a flanged version.

R Neal Shirley got the dream of his own big bore caliber from miking a cylindrical 460 Wby case (IIRC) two years ago, and took that dream of a .550" caliber super magnum to split the huge gap between the .50's and the .577's all the way to announcing that CZ is going to produce Safari Magnums in that caliber in 2007. The pressure lab is working out the details, and those of us fortunate enough to make the SHOT Show in Orlando, FL, will be able to fondle one in person. Neal started with a question "what if...?", and went from there.

Boomie could ask about the .395" and somebody at an ammunition/rifle company conference might say "guess what I read on the AR forum? Maybe we shoud take a look at having our own boutique caliber and cartridge...". George Gibbs did rather well with a piddly .005" bullet diameter back in 1905 as I recall. Despite the .505" caliber people are still lining up to buy 505 Gibbs chambered rifles.

And besides, it's practically Christmas! No gratuitous slams until January 2nd!!!

Rich
DRSS

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

But the .423 (404J) by 375 Ruger can handle 44 mag bullets after being squeezed thru a sizing die. These run 180 to 300 grains and would put the kaibosh on a whitetail right pronto.....say at 2,800'/sec

Yes: .423/.375 Ruger would be very versatile. This "air cartridge" is known as the .404 Aagaard and has been released to the gun trade by RIP (Rate-of-twist Internationale Permanente).

Boom Stick Arms, Inc. (BS) has also been generous enough to release the other marvelous "air cartridge" known as the .411 Pondoro.

RIP and BS a partnership for the future!

Yah!! Tippecanoe and Tyler too!!!

Rich

thanks for the support and the bashing...

yes i have holland and holland taste on a handi rifle budget but i think S O M E of my ideas are at least somewhat reasonable and one or two have been good i think...

i am happy to cheer on those who trailblaze and take the road less traveled. the pointers and criticism i get here helps a lot...this forum SHOULD be a sounboard for ideas and hey, some come to fruition! yes i have some dummy rounds made and some dreams of other rifle projects but at least you will never say about me "hey theres a guy who lacks enthusiasm" or "what a boring unimaginitive guy"

i know what i am and am not afraid to stick my prarie dog head out of the hole for fear someone is going to shoot it off.

like rich said...this is the grapevine of the gun industry...ideas can be floated here and then come to fruition. how do you think rounds like the 375 ruger come about...they listen to internet chat about hating belts and wanting standard length actions.

by the time i am in my 50s like most here are i will have my safe full of wildcat frankenstein guns and my traditional ones...the wildcat ones just make for better banter and i like to think of myself as a wildcat hobyist...not an expert...thats why i have you guys

i, like most of you who have wives (if they havent left you yet) who think you have an irrational love of hunting shooting or that next great gun idea this is an outlet and support group...or is it a gun junkie enabling group

anyway...the biggest hole in the cals today IS inbetween the 416 and the 375. i do love the 411 but this idea has some merrit...dont let it get lost on yer opinion of me or how many guns i have or how i can barely pay the bills. but i do love my a.t.f. (alcohol, tobacco and firearms) thank god for america and the internet

i should just start a thread for making fun of me just to help some of you out...

come on...all hat no cattle?
all case no powder?

at least my pipedreams have rifling and a 1 in 10 twist
(that was not an invitation to bash anyone elses twist theories and beliefs)

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

I think it's called tool room taste and sand cast budget!

Vapo, did you mean to type "sand castle budget"?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with, what ifing, but doing something about the what ifs, will get much more interest.

Hog Killer

no hog killer, i am sure he meant sand cast...

but stay on topic please...

what about this new bore? the message not the messenger...

this has got to be more interesting than the insult thread about twist

quote:

Originally posted by BiggestGun:
Having gone this route on my 606 Mammoth,I can offer some suggestions. PacNor barrels tooled up for my project for only $500. Krieger wanted $1500. RCBS wanted $900 for my first set of dies and Lee was only $300. If you really want to do this up right then some custom brass with the correct markings would be nice. You’ll probably need to buy at least 1000 pieces and it could run $2.00-4.00 each. Manson is excellent to work with on reamers. Your chamber reamer and headspace gauges will be around $300. I am not sure how you could get enough people to commit to get it done. Then there is the choosing of a name. Usually one guy has to foot the bill and hope he sells enough to pay for it. Good luck on your project, Marshall

great post! thank you...

p.s. we have family friends who live in redding. cant count how many times i have been up there over 30 years

Actually Boom Stick....there is another hole in the caliber lineup and it's one that a lot of people could use.....it's the 29 caliber.....

There's a slug of folks with 30 calibers and a lot of folks with 28 calibers.....but no one makes a (lets call it this for giggles) .294 vapolope! (If you prefer we could call it a .294 BS!)

Since we have no gun strictly for shooting donkeys (say dims) this could be it. I can see it now on the front page of Guns and Ammo..."New .294 Vapokickyourass comes to fruition"

It could be preceeded by the necked down 308 case called the 294 donkeydoo, then the 30-06 case necked down and expanded to 294 jackyerass and then the 300 win mag necked down to the .294 asskicker.

The 294 vapokickyerass is the necked down 375 Ruger of course.

Now the whole world has read this and I suspect we'll see something in the 29 caliber soon. Maybe they will sell stock in the company and we can all buy some and get in on the huge profits they will make.
what ya say Boomer?

OH...I forgot.....
I agree...this thread is far far more interesting than 15 pages of twist rate!

Well boom, a 330 grn .395 bullet would be .302 SD. That's a good starting point.
And a 400 grn would be .366!

And I thought this was going to be about a person...

How about spending money on hunting instead of on more ridiculous wildcats?

500 grns-
I would make a rather large wager that the only money that ever gets spent on this reinventing what was done 80 years ago is the bandwidth Saeed pays for so these monkey-screwing-a-football pipe dream mental gyrations. If people paid for the bandwidth they ate up I can assure you that you would not see such high "Posts:" numbers at the bottm of certain people's message.

ANd to correct what was incorrectly stated here-dumb ideas did not make this country what it is. People thinking outside the box and ACTING on it is what built this country. Some one masturbating over their own new idea each week does not create anything other than a right arm that is larger than the left.

To be very blunt this idea is one of, if not the absolute, worst idea I have ever read on this board.

Boomstick-why don't you please tell us exactly how much you have budgeted to spend on this and what is the project schedule?

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld:
500 grns-
I would make a rather large wager that the only money that ever gets spent on this reinventing what was done 80 years ago is the bandwidth Saeed pays for so these monkey-screwing-a-football pipe dream mental gyrations. If people paid for the bandwidth they ate up I can assure you that you would not see such high "Posts:" numbers at the bottm of certain people's message.

ANd to correct what was incorrectly stated here-dumb ideas did not make this country what it is. People thinking outside the box and ACTING on it is what built this country. Some one masturbating over their own new idea each week does not create anything other than a right arm that is larger than the left.

To be very blunt this idea is one of, if not the absolute, worst idea I have ever read on this board.

Boomstick-why don't you please tell us exactly how much you have budgeted to spend on this and what is the project schedule?

A couple of thoughts if I may;
Marc, it's none of your God Damn business how Saeed wants to spend his money. If this thread is offensive to him he can step in and say so and even ban posters wasting space. In fact this is not at all worse than the 15 pages of pure bullshit on twist rates and supercavitation. Who appointed you as spokesman for what can be posted and not?

This has to be among the most arrogant posts I've read on these forums. If you don't like the thread just ignore it. It's all in fun and those that like to do these things and post here don't need assholes like you stepping in name calling and destroying their fun.

I didn't post once on the twist rate thread for that reason. You seem to think you're better than others to act like you have. Get a life!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Actually Boom Stick....there is another hole in the caliber lineup and it's one that a lot of people could use.....it's the 29 caliber.....

There's a slug of folks with 30 calibers and a lot of folks with 28 calibers.....but no one makes a (lets call it this for giggles) .294 vapolope! (If you prefer we could call it a .294 BS!)

Since we have no gun strictly for shooting donkeys (say dims) this could be it. I can see it now on the front page of Guns and Ammo..."New .294 Vapokickyourass comes to fruition"

It could be preceeded by the necked down 308 case called the 294 donkeydoo, then the 30-06 case necked down and expanded to 294 jackyerass and then the 300 win mag necked down to the .294 asskicker.

The 294 vapokickyerass is the necked down 375 Ruger of course.

Now the whole world has read this and I suspect we'll see something in the 29 caliber soon. Maybe they will sell stock in the company and we can all buy some and get in on the huge profits they will make.
what ya say Boomer?

Sorry Vapo, you're about 6 years behind the times. John Barness already did it, the B-29.
His work/story "B-29: The Ultimate Wildcat" is in Handloader Magazine #203 (Feb 2000).

quote:

Originally posted by duikerman:

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld:
500 grns-
I would make a rather large wager that the only money that ever gets spent on this reinventing what was done 80 years ago is the bandwidth Saeed pays for so these monkey-screwing-a-football pipe dream mental gyrations. If people paid for the bandwidth they ate up I can assure you that you would not see such high "Posts:" numbers at the bottm of certain people's message.

ANd to correct what was incorrectly stated here-dumb ideas did not make this country what it is. People thinking outside the box and ACTING on it is what built this country. Some one masturbating over their own new idea each week does not create anything other than a right arm that is larger than the left.

To be very blunt this idea is one of, if not the absolute, worst idea I have ever read on this board.

Boomstick-why don't you please tell us exactly how much you have budgeted to spend on this and what is the project schedule?

A couple of thoughts if I may;
Marc, it's none of your God Damn business how Saeed wants to spend his money. If this thread is offensive to him he can step in and say so and even ban posters wasting space. In fact this is not at all worse than the 15 pages of pure bullshit on twist rates and supercavitation. Who appointed you as spokesman for what can be posted and not?

This has to be among the most arrogant posts I've read on these forums. If you don't like the thread just ignore it. It's all in fun and those that like to do these things and post here don't need assholes like you stepping in name calling and destroying their fun.

I didn't post once on the twist rate thread for that reason. You seem to think you're better than others to act like you have. Get a life!

It's comforting to know we have a self appointed post Nazi among us.

quote:

Originally posted by duikerman:
......it's none of your God Damn business ......don't need assholes like you stepping in name calling and destroying their fun.

I didn't post once on the twist rate thread for that reason. You seem to think you're better than others to act like you have. Get a life!

Do I see the pot calling the kettle black here?

duikerman, which side of yourself are you showwing to the world with the above posting?

Hog Killer

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld:
Some one masturbating over their own new idea each week does not create anything other than a right arm that is larger than the left.





Boomstick-why don't you please tell us exactly how much you have budgeted to spend on this and what is the project schedule?

even better

hey, maybe we DO need an insult board...

insulting people on a keyboard without the respect of knowing a person or being able to talk face to face is #$%*@ up...

the only person i think i have ever insulted personaly is murph in the political forum once and if you know of who i speak i am sure you want to shake my hand.

so if you have finger turrets synddrome...please go to the twist thread and if you think this bore is interesting or has merrit...please post. i can take idea criticism but the personal insults are uncalled for. but i am sure asking some here to be civil is like waiting for

quote:

hey, maybe we DO need an insult board...

They already have it.
It is called the "Political Forum"
AKA the "Ignorance Crater"

Hey Craigster,

when you mess with the bull, don't cry if you get gored...

Y'see Boomie is one of the regulars here, and when you are rude to folks who have not ever done you harm, sometimes people figure that's how you go thru life, jerking other people around and expecting to get jerked around in return; so that's how they treat you.

Personally, and it is just me talking here, Stokeld has done himself a tremendous amount of harm as regards his business. Anyone who saw his rude, rather chickenshit flame job on Boomie probably came to the conclusion that he is some cracker jerk with no manners, and will not do business with him or recommend him to others because of the post. Others may admire his bold stand...

Sort-of like the twist thing going on between 500 grains and JeffeOsso. People side one way or the other, and Jeffe may not do any gunsmith work for either of dan's friends. He may gain business from others who figure he made the challenge and dan is ducking him...by his own admission here. Sooo, take a stand if you will, but be prepared to deal with the fallout.

Back in my brawling days I used to tell people "...I always try to give a man a choice, and then hold him responsible for the consequence of his actions...". These days I am much more mellow, I just suggest kindly as I can that they walk away while they can. Works for me!

JMHO, your mileage may vary...

Rich
DRSS

marc and craigster,

forgot to mention that I do, in fact, pay for part of this bandwidth...every time I fill up my Dodge Cummins Turbo at the pump!

Rich
DRSS

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
marc and craigster,

forgot to mention that I do, in fact, pay for part of this bandwidth...every time I fill up my Dodge Cummins Turbo at the pump!

Rich
DRSS

good one...

Am I the "Nazi" referenced above? I never said Saeed should or should not pay for anything or any one should stop posting or change their posts. I simply made the statement that if folks had to pay their own way I thought we would see different things posted.

I am not using soem made up screen name and some cryptic reference to my home address. I am one of the few here who is man enough to NOT hide behind their computer screen.

Boomstick-I don't know if it is me you think wrote soemthing insulting about you or if it was one of the others who chimed in. To the contrary, I encouraged free thinking. I also encourage people to listen to other's experience, knowledge, and thoughts, as opposed to getting so excited over their own ideas.

BoomStick-I will make a deal with you, and I am 100% serious here. If you get a barrel, dies, reamer, throater, brass, and bullets made for the .395, then I will barrel up your action for free (just the .395, not any of the other ideas you have had). I mean it-provide me with the action, barrel, loaded dummy round, reamer, throater, and I will donate the labor on this 80 year old idea you think is your brand new notion. Seriously, I will do it. I will not test fire it though-I will leave that up to you. I will also do other work needed to make a sporter if it is a military action (bolt handle, drill and tap, etc., but not square bridging or anything like that).

Marc, here I am dreaming about how I can get I get riflesmith to work on a rifle project for a funky old 404 within my limited means and you go and offer to work for free on a lead balloon! Sounds like a caliber invented by the French Army to me.

If I invent the .420 Wink do I get the same offer?

quote:

Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld:
500 grns-
I would make a rather large wager that the only money that ever gets spent on this reinventing what was done 80 years ago is the bandwidth Saeed pays for so these monkey-screwing-a-football pipe dream mental gyrations. If people paid for the bandwidth they ate up I can assure you that you would not see such high "Posts:" numbers at the bottm of certain people's message.

ANd to correct what was incorrectly stated here-dumb ideas did not make this country what it is. People thinking outside the box and ACTING on it is what built this country. Some one masturbating over their own new idea each week does not create anything other than a right arm that is larger than the left.

To be very blunt this idea is one of, if not the absolute, worst idea I have ever read on this board.

Boomstick-why don't you please tell us exactly how much you have budgeted to spend on this and what is the project schedule?

How much of a wager? For $10,000 this project could happen. I think I would agree with 500 grains; better to go shoot a buffalo instead.