quote:

how long does a lb of 2520 last with the 70-75 loads?

since a pound is 7000 grains, loads of 70-75 grains will get you about 93-100 rounds. If you think that you need 5000 primers instead of 1000, then you need 8-lb powder cans. I only do 200 rounds a year, so a 1000 primer purchase last year has me resting comfortably.

Thanks much 416tanzan. Dont know that i will be shooting that much, we just keep running into these periodic shortages here. Prob as much to hoarding as anything but there you are.

SSR

Michael458,
A 17 and 31 year old... sorta explains your mental state...

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
Michael458,
A 17 and 31 year old... sorta explains your mental state...

Yeah, (21yr old) typo I am sure--Regardless you are correct! Now add to this, a 7 yr old that thinks she is 16! None of the 3 have ears--I keep threatening "Ear Amputation" as they don't use or need them anyway!


M

I was wondering if you had forgotten one!

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:
Michael458,
A 17 and 31 year old... sorta explains your mental state...

Yeah, (21yr old) typo I am sure--Regardless you are correct! Now add to this, a 7 yr old that thinks she is 16! None of the 3 have ears--I keep threatening "Ear Amputation" as they don't use or need them anyway!


M

And I bet the 7 yr old rules the roost! Though perhaps 2nd inline with the wife.

SSR

Ya'll smarter than you look! Yep, Momma is big boss, little 7 yr old is the "little Boss", then when they let me, I can be boss #3. I got the boys under my thumb, sometimes!

I have to show you what I got today. Gun Porn!

This one is going to Australia--This is Paul's new 500 MDM and new backup rifle for buffalo.








This is the brand new Gun #1 475 B&M Super Short! Another Hillbilly Gun, all camo and such! YEHAHHHH......







M

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:

quote:

how long does a lb of 2520 last with the 70-75 loads?

since a pound is 7000 grains, loads of 70-75 grains will get you about 93-100 rounds. If you think that you need 5000 primers instead of 1000, then you need 8-lb powder cans. I only do 200 rounds a year, so a 1000 primer purchase last year has me resting comfortably.

Tanz

200 rds a year! Oh lord, I did that the other day!

M

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:

quote:

how long does a lb of 2520 last with the 70-75 loads?

since a pound is 7000 grains, loads of 70-75 grains will get you about 93-100 rounds. If you think that you need 5000 primers instead of 1000, then you need 8-lb powder cans. I only do 200 rounds a year, so a 1000 primer purchase last year has me resting comfortably.

Tanz

200 rds a year! Oh lord, I did that the other day!

M

More like 1000 per day if there are pop-guns involved ...

Michael,

If I were you I would send those two rifles back to the maker. They forgot to put the second barrels on them.

465H&H

Those are prettier than Ellie May.



SSR

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:
Michael,

If I were you I would send those two rifles back to the maker. They forgot to put the second barrels on them.

465H&H

Can you leave the poor guy alone!

He can barely handle one barrel and can't even manage the complexity of having more than one brand of single-barrel.


now you want to add the complexity of multiple barrels ... and multiple triggers ... and a lever on top instead of the side ...

Please ...baby steps before walking ...

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
Ya'll smarter than you look! Yep, Momma is big boss, little 7 yr old is the "little Boss", then when they let me, I can be boss #3.
M

I'd say YOU are the smart one. The smart man knows when they are outnumbered and that, (wife + 7 year old) in my book, is about 1,000:1 odds against winning in any arena.

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:
Michael,

If I were you I would send those two rifles back to the maker. They forgot to put the second barrels on them.

465H&H

Can you leave the poor guy alone!

He can barely handle one barrel and can't even manage the complexity of having more than one brand of single-barrel.


now you want to add the complexity of multiple barrels ... and multiple triggers ... and a lever on top instead of the side ...

Please ...baby steps before walking ...

465HH

Doc is right, man things with two barrels confuses me! Two triggers, barrels, which one shoots what, no I can't keep up with that at all. Did ya'll take a gander at that two barrel bolt thing??? Did you see that thing slinging brass out both sides? At the same time!!!!!!! Snatches one bolt back, two rounds eject out opposite sides, bolts up, two new cartridges feed in! Don't ya know that had to be a nightmare to build such a thing and get it to actually work!

No, I keep things simple, 1 barrel is a plenty!

M

quote:

Originally posted by Macifej:

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:

quote:

how long does a lb of 2520 last with the 70-75 loads?

since a pound is 7000 grains, loads of 70-75 grains will get you about 93-100 rounds. If you think that you need 5000 primers instead of 1000, then you need 8-lb powder cans. I only do 200 rounds a year, so a 1000 primer purchase last year has me resting comfortably.

Tanz

200 rds a year! Oh lord, I did that the other day!

M

More like 1000 per day if there are pop-guns involved ...

MacJ



I do admit most of the other day was 50 B&M Super Short and 50 B&M AK. Which I have some super data on both of those now with some of the new bullets! I am pretty sure that our 375 North Fork CPS at 2225 fps will make for buffalo medicine, combined with it's twin 375 North Fork Solid! Not bad for a little gun!

M

Michael

If shootaway is right you sure must wear out alot of barrels A day.



SSR

quote:

Originally posted by michael458:
drew

The HP in the .620 measures .355 across the top, as best I can see. Wicked looking!

Ideal meplat per caliber?

No, I don't believe that it works that way. Yes, I can see where you might be leading to, but let me explain my "Theory" on this. A 67% meplat on a .620 is roughly .416 caliber! Holy Cow! A .416 67% meplat is only around .278 or so. Then with .416 caliber meplat then the meplat is TOO LARGE--could get by with less and be stable, right?

Wrong! How can that be wrong? Well, you still have a .620 caliber bullet pushing "BEHIND" that .416 meplat don't you? So for a .620 to be stable during terminals, it still needs a 65% to 70% meplat regardless of caliber.

Slice the bullet up in your mind--slice just the top off, the meplat. It's .416 caliiber. Now slice a part of the caliber off, .620 behind it. You have .620 pushing .416 ahead of it--it still needs to be 67% meplat, regardless of caliber, as you have "caliber pushing meplat".

So in my opinion, no matter how large or how small caliber is, it still needs to be 65%-70% to be terminally stable.

Michael

So the general rule is 67.5% in the meplate, 13 degrees from the meplate to the body, careful radius at the edge of the meplate, and four bands, one on the base and three up higher. How much up higher and what spacing for the bands? If we use RIP's .395 caliber as an example, it has a bore diameter of .388, therefore we need a .26 meplate and a .388 body diameter? But where do we place the bands? And how do we come up with the bullet weight in brass?

For the noncom, I seem to remember some general rule for the hole dia and depth.

All this being the starting point. Experiments to follow to confirm the results.

quote:

Originally posted by Cross L:
Michael

If shootaway is right you sure must wear out alot of barrels A day.



SSR

Cross

Yep, wore slap out, not a bit of rifling left at the end of the day!

Disposable barrels!

Oh, and by the way, you should receive your "smoothbore" 416 B&M today maybe I would think?

HEH HEH.......

M

quote:

Originally posted by I Bin Therbefor:

So the general rule is 67.5% in the meplate, 13 degrees from the meplate to the body, careful radius at the edge of the meplate, and four bands, one on the base and three up higher. How much up higher and what spacing for the bands? If we use RIP's .395 caliber as an example, it has a bore diameter of .388, therefore we need a .26 meplate and a .388 body diameter? But where do we place the bands? And how do we come up with the bullet weight in brass?

For the noncom, I seem to remember some general rule for the hole dia and depth.

All this being the starting point. Experiments to follow to confirm the results.

IBT

Bullet design is very very complicated--HEH.......It takes a very very wise and learned man to do such things There are many considerations to take into account , and much hard work "digging" into the unknown , many trials and tribulations and much frustration at times , sometimes it works , and then again sometimes it does not , most of the time it leaves us bewildered as to what to do next , and sometimes we just have to beat things into submission

But most of the time I find "inspiration" coming from the strangest places

I could not help myself


HEH.........Anyway, now, where to place the bands? First we need to know what we are dealing with. We need a nose to mouth that is going to fit in the magazine of most rifles, so this dictates where the top bands are going to be located. A fair rule of thumb anyway. Some have to be rather specialized such as some of the BBWs that are designed for my 50 B&M Alaskan, lever gun. These have to feed through the relatively short Marlin action, so overall length of the cartridge cannot be more than 2.56 inches to feed and function. Case is 2.1 inches, so that leaves us a nose to mouth max of .460 inches! Short! Need bands in place that will work with that! Most bolt guns can have a nose to mouth of .700 to .750 or so and work in most all bolt guns. So bands would need to be located so that if on a particular cartridge one needed to crimp, you can, if not,then neck tension is important as well. Pretty much I think the BBWs work in most things well, I have have not heard of any issues with various cartridges, so we must have mucked around and got the bands about in the right places.

Michael

Sure hope it shows up, I will be in town this PM haunting the gunshop.



SSR

quote:

This is Paul's new 500 MDM and new backup rifle for buffalo.

Amazing. That rifle looks good enough to eat!

quote:

Originally posted by someoldguy:

quote:

This is Paul's new 500 MDM and new backup rifle for buffalo.

Amazing. That rifle looks good enough to eat!

Looks great, but it handles like a dream! He wanted a 20 inch barrel, all mine have 21s. He wanted 8.5 lbs max, he gets 8.25 lbs! I want to keep this one, and send him one of mine! HEH HEH.......

M

Labcoat Man,
Care package arrived today - thank you so much!
Can't wait to try the .409's!
I have a favor to ask - please don't post any more pictures of B&M rifles.
I was hoping one B&M would be enough, but....!

IBT,
You are off by .001". The bore diameter of the modern .395-cal is .387", groove is .395.

UGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FedEx apparently tried to deliver those itty-bitty .409s yesterday but no one was home to sign except the dogs. Cosmo (223lbs) and Goliath (167lbs) would if only they had opposable thumbs and didn't take umbrage with any and all who approach the house without appropriate greeting from one of us.

Zoe, the boss and 23lbs would agree to anything and hold the pen with her teeth if given a treat in advance and following.

Guess I'll sign the paper to leave at the door without signature and hope they actually do.

Now I only have about 200 .620 and 100 .585 to play with.

Doc

Damn, hate you missed those! Nice little bullets! You will like. I should warn you, I also have some very vicious killer dogs here on the compound as well! Yorkshire Terriers! Huge specimens, Maximus is a full 4 lbs now, and his sister Abby is approaching 3 lbs! Deadly creatures!

Yep, sign the paper see what happens Monday! Find another address for me to send to if you want?

OK, what about the .620s and the .585s--What do you think?????

M

Like women, its the little ones that are most evil. Cosmo (English Mastiff) could hide them both in his mouth and you would never know it BUT if they are his friends, he wouldnt hurt a hair. They play with my dad's teacup poodle Sugar until Sugar has had enough and puts them in their places.

The .620 and .585 are simply works of art. I am VERY excited and can't wait to play with them. I now finally understand the "rolling around" thing.

The address you have is fine, hospitals don't like receiving that sort of stuff.

Thanks again!

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
IBT,
You are off by .001". The bore diameter of the modern .395-cal is .387", groove is .395.

Sorry about that, I was working with the bore diameter as shown on the barrel maker's site.
IBT

CCMDoc

quote:

The .620 and .585 are simply works of art. I am VERY excited and can't wait to play with them. I now finally understand the "rolling around" thing.

Yeah, now you know! Just be careful, those .620s are a little bigger than I want to have an accident with and have one get stuck in the wrong place!


Hey, want to show you guys what I have been doing for the last two days with my new toy!








This was yesterday, it's first day on the job! Been plowing fire lines.


Michael

quote:

I could not help myself

BTW, Michael

But you've actually gone through all that!

quote:

Hey, want to show you guys what I have been doing for the last two days with my new toy!

If your weather has been as nice as ours has, then it's the perfect time to go outside with your toy/toys of choice!

Glenn

You nailed it, its a great time of year to be outside playing



hope my new toys show up soon

Michael, I hope you dont drive that thing as fast as you do everything else

SSR

CrossL and Glenn, in the 70s the last two days! Excellent weather, spring has sprung, Maybe? Well that's great, but I need one more bit of cooler weather so I can light some fires! Always liked playing with fire, someday I will tell you about some houses I burned down! Legally! Big ones too! Lot's of fun!

Anyway, Cross, think we missed the Friday delivery. I am sure they will show on Monday!

Me, drive things fast? Well, we can't be dilly dallying around, gotta go, stand still moss will grow on your ass and slow you down! HEH........

Michael

Fires are FUN, I love "Controlled Burns"

Acres of pasture going up with flames everywhere



SSR

Hey Michael nice work toy!

By the way, I received a very heavy small box today…woohaa…talk about some very superb looking BIG bullets!

I sat the .620 caliber next to the .585 caliber next to the .500 caliber CEB BBW #13 FN Solids and it looked by Big Daddy, Slightly Smaller Mama standing next to a small child…and the .500 caliber was a 500grainer!!!! Dang…now I truly understand that moving above 50 caliber is a whole new leap up in BBBIIIGGG!!!!!

I have a whole new level of awe for those individuals who regularly shoot the +.600 caliber rifles!

quote:

Originally posted by I Bin Therbefor:

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
IBT,
You are off by .001". The bore diameter of the modern .395-cal is .387", groove is .395.

Sorry about that, I was working with the bore diameter as shown on the barrel maker's site.
IBT

Sadly, they have a typo there at McGowen Precision Rifle Barrels.
From the start with Harry McGowen and I deciding the specs, it was .395" groove and .387" bore, I repeat: .395/.387
A difference of .008" is routine in the medium bores such as .308"/.300" and .458"/.450" from thirty-cal to 45-cal.

I will have to call them up and discuss this.

I have purchased six .395-cal barrels. Max and friend have purchased three.
They are excellent quality barrels.
Even though the gunsmith that Doc M uses has a phobia of them, or some other hangup.
Highjack off.

Cross

Back in the old days we used to do a lot of hazard reduction and site prep burning in forestry. I would light fires to 10000-12000 acres a year in the 80s and early 90s. Due to liabilities we don't do any today. I have this little plantation that is going to be it's second burn here hopefully in a few days if I can get the weather to corporate with me. The Can-Am did put some nice lines in, very pleased with it so far.







Capo

Yes, I know, put our .500s up against the .620 and .585s is not a good idea. Get to thinking .500 is minor caliber when you do that! My salvation is that it is just not a simple thing to get anything above .500 on a Winchester M70--I did not say impossible, I said not simple! I like simple things, gets too complicated it causes me issues! I could seriously want a .585 on one of my Winchesters--but simple does not enter into it! Hubel sent some dummies of his .585 and it will be a chore to do on a WInchester. But still looking.


RIP

No worries about a hijack here, hell I hijacked us with a 4-wheeler and plowing! That's a stretch! HEH....Sorry all, I could not help it! Lot's of fun being out in good weather plowing lines and such! No telephones, and people to aggravate!


I don't know what the issue is with the barrels and Brian? Must be some sort of bad experience in his youth? I know when I was a kid I got rolling off the wall stupid on a bottle of Canadian Mist! I spent the night eating raw half cooked squirrels, and the next day hugging the toilet! To this day the very thought of brown stuff just kinda turns me the other way! That was 30 yrs ago! Some things just leave a lasting impression.

M

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
Hey Michael nice work toy!

By the way, I received a very heavy small box today…woohaa…talk about some very superb looking BIG bullets!

I sat the .620 caliber next to the .585 caliber next to the .500 caliber CEB BBW #13 FN Solids and it looked by Big Daddy, Slightly Smaller Mama standing next to a small child…and the .500 caliber was a 500grainer!!!! Dang…now I truly understand that moving above 50 caliber is a whole new leap up in BBBIIIGGG!!!!!

I have a whole new level of awe for those individuals who regularly shoot the +.600 caliber rifles!

Hey Jim,

You mean like this:
Size does matter ...

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

quote:

Originally posted by I Bin Therbefor:

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
IBT,
You are off by .001". The bore diameter of the modern .395-cal is .387", groove is .395.

Sorry about that, I was working with the bore diameter as shown on the barrel maker's site.
IBT

Sadly, they have a typo there at McGowen Precision Rifle Barrels.
From the start with Harry McGowen and I deciding the specs, it was .395" groove and .387" bore, I repeat: .395/.387
A difference of .008" is routine in the medium bores such as .308"/.300" and .458"/.450" from thirty-cal to 45-cal.

I will have to call them up and discuss this.

I have purchased six .395-cal barrels. Max and friend have purchased three.
They are excellent quality barrels.
Even though the gunsmith that Doc M uses has a phobia of them, or some other hangup.
Highjack off.

Thanks for the knowledge. I've corrected my records.

Is the phobia centered on the barrels or the .395 caliber?

Well,

Have both .409 CEB #13 Solids and Non-Cons loaded up for Michael to do a test of the bullets and of my Sabatti 450-400.

These bullets are truly works of art and loaded up look even more beautiful!

I'll try to take a photo and post it in a bit.