I just got in from Wyoming from a cow elk hunt I shot about a 4 year old cow at 273 yards(lasered) with one shot from my 300win mag and a 180 gr match king. I felt really sorry for the elk as she only ran about 75 feet. I know that she should not have died so fast being shot with a match king. But after having her lungs and heart taken out I don't think she had much choice. Did't recover the bullet

Congratulation p dog shooter,
Sounds like you have your freezer full for this winter

I suggest you contact Sierra and ask them why they specially recommend against using their MatchKings on game. I did. E

No need to contact Sierra, bullet wasn�t recovered because it was partly fragmentised into one billion parts... Been there, done that and now i�m spitting copper fragmens from every steak. :-)
Regards

Wow, finally.

Now I can rest knowing this argument has been settled with such conclusive data!

Ermicus no need to contact serria ,match kings work just fine on game one shot one kill. Tippex I don't shoot my game in the steaks so no need to worry about fragments texas heart shots are out. Buffalobwana glad some one has seen the light For the rest of you that don't know about match kings you all should research the match king thread and read all 140 plus pages.

Pdogshooter,

Sorry about you having to walk the extra 74 feet. Consider Partitions next time.

Had to do it.

[ 11-01-2002, 19:30: Message edited by: steve y ]

Are you sure it was 273 yards and not 274?
smallfry

I believe if Sierra, Nosler or whoever would manufacture a styrofoam bullet with strict warnings against doing anything except punching paper with it, someone would start shooting game with them just to prove a point.

I'll stick with game kings, thanks.

pdogshooter, you were lucky with that stunt shot! Personally I think people like you should be jailed. Honestly, stunts like yours cause the senseless wounding of countless animals.

It sickens me.

RAB

Too bad she ran 75 yards. Maybe try a Nosler Partition or Swift A-Frame next time

P Dog Shooter.Was there ANY doubt.. ...Congrat's on the Elk.Elk must not be as tough as the Texas "dillo's" ....Must grow them pretty tough in old KenTuk too.RAB......Never mind........

[ 11-02-2002, 05:50: Message edited by: Boyd Heaton ]

I love it when people say they know more about a gun, bullet, ect than the manufacturer.

I am not about to flame, even if I disagree with the practice. I've seen and heard from a fair share of people who claim the MatchKings are good hunting bullets--Sierra claims otherwise. I doubt if anyone knows more about Sierra bullets than Sierra.

Could be luck or maybe something else. Whatever it is, I don't think it is too intelligent considering another life is at stake. Seems like these people are the same who will do anything just to prove they can.

Just because you can doesn't me you should. Someday your luck will run out and then you'll be sorry--the first time the animal runs of wounded and you have to track it down and watch it suffer...

I'll stop before I get too hot and bothered.

Just like FarRight, I don't want to start a flame. But why would one go against a manufacturer's recommendation when there are so many better choices out there?

My take on the matter:

1 elk + 1 MatchKing = 1 bad decision

Oh No!!! Here we go again!!!

Congratulations... you shot a premier game animal with a target bullet... too lazy or just plain don't give a sh-- enough to work up a load with a proper hunting bullet? Aren't you proud.... cripes!

My brother once dropped a fair sized whitetail doe with one shot from a .22 LR.

The key word there is once...

Dan

For all of you that doubtt I guess that you don't remember that are Very own Saeed shot a bunch of afican game with them and they killed just fine.
,,,,,RAB you really need to get a life no stunt just plain good shooting. I have shot many other game animals with so called hunting bullets and can't see any differants in the way they react.
,,,, Over 40 it was 75 feet most of the time you lung heart shot something they go farther then that.
,,,Boyd no doubt just need to stir the old match king debate.
,,,,Swede 7 you and Rab need to go hunting togather. I am really surprize it to this long to get this going.

Shot selectivity and accurate placement are what put animals down consistently.

I am a big fan of Nosler Partitions if I am going to shoot at normal ranges. If I can afford to pass up the less than ideal prey angle, and want to extend my range, I'll use a MatchKing every time. The increased level of consistent accuracy is desirable for precise placement at the longer distances. Bullet performance has been most satisfactory so far in my experience with the Sierra pill.

This year's antelope was 383, (LRF 800), yards with a 7-8 mph cross. Bullet was a .25 calibre 100 grain MatchKing at 3200 fps. This load consistently groups better than my premium bullet loads at 300 yards.

My desire was to get a 400 yard antelope and I hunted with that goal in mind. The MatchKing load performed very well, one shot to the lungs, in and out. Shot was fired from the prone with a short Harris bipod. Terminal velocity should have been around 2450 fps.

I have not taken a long shot at an elk as my skill level is not high enough yet for a heavy bodied animal at extended range. Additionally, I do not own a long range rifle in a proper elk calibre....

yet!

~Holmes

[ 11-03-2002, 09:10: Message edited by: Holmes ]

I just witnessed my 11 year old Grandson in Texas,at the old home place, shoot a standing broadside Mule Deer at 200 plus yards with a 222 Rem shooting a 60 gr. Hornady..It tore hell out of the lungs and heart and was recovered under the hide on the off side. A perfect mushroom, or rather a perfect tiny mushroom.It ran 20 yards and piled up....I used my 25-35 Win. for my deer later on...

So by P dogs standards of basing all on one animal killed, then the 222 is the perfect long range mule deer rifle...I think not....but, in both instances it does show the importance of shot placement, but thats about all it proves..I also know how to use my 25-35 and thats up close and personal...

I might add that I was well rested on a rock with my 300 H&H and the boys deer was on an open bald hill..It fell just as I was about to squeeze off an insurance shot...

My personal criteria is a bullet and caliber that will shoot lenthwise through any animal I am hunting and one that will normally break both shoulders on a broadside shot. Unless I am willing to close the gaps and hunt much like one would with a bow or muzzleloader... I believe this makes a lot more since.

Is the matchking a good elk bullet, it is if all your shots are close and broadside and you don't hit the shoulder bones...I don't like the odds of getting that posed shot every time I hunt elk...If I take them as they come and I need a tougher bullet...I chose this year a 300 gr. Woodleigh RNSP or a 250 gr. Nosler Partition in a 338. and you can bet next year I will use something very simular.

Bottom line anything will work if used properly and one can use lesser guns and inferior bullets if he adjusts his hunting methods to meet the need. During WW2, when ammo was not available, I killed deer with military ball ammo..It had to be right or a long tracking job would result.

Well said Ray, as always.

Sorry P Dog, guess I still have to wonder why at the yardage you were shooting you couldn't find a bullet designed for hunting that you couldn't feel confident of shooting to the point of aim. Glad it worked for you, really glad for the elk. I suppose I'm hopeless, doesn't seem like the right, or smart choice to me. Hope you have a good gun season here in WI.

Jon A.I too will be using the 240's in both of my 300 Ultra's....My "Light gun" 30" Hart barrel will chuck them to 3000fps with a Stiff load of RL25.My Heavy gun,36" Krieger.Will run them to a touch over 3200fps.Will try for a 2000 yard kill this year.I will be video taping the kill's and taking picture's of entry and exit wound's.Should be fun..

Ray, did you file the tips off the ball ammo to make "softpoints" or shoot them as is? Does fileing the tips amount to anything near expansion if you do?

Ray no one elk doesn't tell it all, I have shot more than one big game animal with the 180 gr match king haven't seen a differants in them from other so call hunting bullets. As you said shot placement is what kills. Gut shoot or blow a front leg off and they all run a long ways no matter what you shoot them with. So all of you that get down on match kings have you ever shot a big game animal with one. Having watch this along with the famous match king thread I see two types of shooters those who have and those who say you shouldn't. Most of those who say you shouldn't have not done so. Most of those who have do not see any differants between match kings and standard hunting bullets.
,,,,,,, So all of you who say it shouldn't be done lets see some real life storys no making them like Todd where they have failed with good shooting if is easy to say a bullet doesn't work if you have bad shot placement.

Jon A I just had some elk steak for dinner Oh wait I think I feel the critter starting to run around in there. Dam.

Seems simple enough to me, if you want to use Mks to hunt with, by all means use them, and if you don't, don't and, for Pete's sake, shut up about someone else using them. How many dead animals do you guys need to see that they WILL KILL big game. Geeesh.

The people that are anti Matchking because Sierra does not recommend them for hunting should consider two things.

Firstly, Sierra needs and wants the freedom to make those bullets to achieve peak accuracy. Many many years ago the Matchkings were Full Metal Jacketed. Perhaps in 5 years time the Matchkings by "accident" will be ideal bullets for Rhino. On the other hand they might not even be suitable for a 20 pound animal. Likewise, Sierra is probaly not going to recommed their game bullets for target use because future development of their spitzer game bullets might mean improved killing power but a loss of accuracy.

Secondly, how many people that adhere to the view that the "manufacturer's recommendation" is the key point also criticise the manufacrure when it comes to another topic.

Mike

TSj,
Yes I filed the points down on the ball ammo..two things were likly to happen, instant kill or a long tracking job, basically the same experience that I have had without filing them down...

P Dog,
I have use the matchkings on big game and in a couple of culling operations and I personally didn't care for them as they will fail on ocassion.

I also recall back when Sierras were all the handloader had to play with, not matchkings but just Sierra spitzers.they blew up on blesbok and springbok from time to time...They worked fine most of the time.

That is the problem with those types of bullets, most of the time they do work, then when you really get to trusting them they fail....

Sooner or later that light will dawn on you..From time to time you will finds exploded bullets with the matchkings. That should be your first clue to pending failure. It was with me and I ignored it until it happened a few times...fortunatly I got them killed.

My question is WHY? when you and I both know that there are better bullets available at the same price!, what are you trying to prove? I don't deny you the right, but I question your reasoning ability, and ethics, but I must admit to committing the same crimes over the years...I have always been a hopeless bullet experimentor...I finally proved we(you and I) were just waisting our time trying to make bad bullets work....

The problem Ray is that all bullets well fail once in awhile. Nothing is perfect even the best well do something stange now and then. Drive the wrong bullet to fast place in the wrong spot ect they well not be perfect. Having watch all these treads it seems to me almost every body has had a bullet do what its wasn't surpose to just a couple of weeks ago a guy said his nosler partations failed on deer we can go on and on. Like you ray I have emptied boxs and boxs of bullets trying to find the perfect one. There is no such critter. Just when you think you have found it something well happen to make you wonder.

What I do not understand is why use those matchkings when there are hunting bullets around. Always amazed by this.

POP if I remember right you are the one who started the famous match king thread. To answer you Question is becase they work!!!!!!!!!!

Amen George!

PD: Can't you find a bullet that is designed for this type of use?

We can help you .... just ask. We're here for you man!

BOYD:

Let me get this straight, you're going for a 2000 yard kill this year? Is this correct?

[ 11-04-2002, 23:08: Message edited by: POP ]