RMK no it was horse back hunt. You see we have elk and moose in Wis. too never mistaken one for a deer or anything else. Our elk herd is just about in my back yard matter a fact a calf was hit by a trk less then a mile away. Having hunted and trapped, raised on farm and spent many a vacation in west and AK for the past forty years you and wstrnhuntr are barking up the wrong tree. I'll challenge any of you in woodsmanship skills and hunting ability.
''''''' Then again I just might be one of theose lazy out of shape out of state hunters. My I only put 2500 mile on my bicyle and another 400 or so running this last summer never did keep track of the miles walking with a pack getting ready. Only shot 500 rds in my 300 mag and another few thousand other center fire rounds plus a few thousand 22rf rounds. Yep just another fat lazy never shot my gun before city slicker. Both of you before you start attacking someone should really get to know them.

I would use my choice of Hunting bullets on DG in a heartbeat, would you?

Just one DG Matchking hunt per Matchking hunter, thats all I ask. The rest should take care of itself.

The hell you say! Take a couple pictures of the elk and moose,there in wisconsin. Then have them copied into flash cards,so that your fellow wisconsin residents will have a field referance while hunting elk in wyoming.

WH,Cape buff work for you???????You pay for the tag....I'll even let you sit in the truck..........

I have read this whole thred. ALL I gotta say is GOOD SHOT and I wish I could have been there to see it. As for usin SMK's, GO with what ya know! I just started shootin long distance, It's NOT as "e""z" as IT LOOKS. Time, practuce, and a willingness to learn have helped me appreciate what it takes to but the bullet where you want it.
PS. BOYED is my witness I took out a Ground hog at 525yds. I think it was MK bullet Was I bad?

Soory Boyd, I fat fingerer you name.

Jody,I've been called worse thing's....

Fact, I punch holes in manhole covers with every shot at 500 meters with my 300 grain MK's. Gee, I wonder if that would penetrate on soft tissue or bone?

Boyd
Thank you for understanding what i meant by "if i can shoot 3 to 5 inches at a 1000 yards and the kill zone .......... "At least you were reading more in depth to the text.

Gato
After reading your posts i have no more tolerance for narrow minded people. Even if i was to challenge you and when i shot those groups you would come up with every excuse to back out. My scope that is on my rifle probably cost more than your whole rig combined or damn near it. No matter what proof is said to you about what it takes to shoot like that you won't listen cause you already have your brain locked into not challenging yourself as a shooter and hunter.I build houses and heard people make HUGE houses out of Straw Bales. I thought there is no F***in way that is possible but until i read articles and seen first hand how they do ie: materials used to strengthen insulate and so on i was a non believer but now i know it can be done. It is a shame people have such narrow minds nowadays and aren't willing to explore the unknown.As far as still challenging anyone to shoot a 5 shot group at a 1000 yards 3- 5" sounds like you are on the losing end on that deal cause Boyd has just givin 2 examples of 10 shot groups at that distance.Don't ya think a 5 shot group would be less? Think about it. DO you want to change your challenge? If you are so confident and know of the groups shooters shoot at a thousand yards why not go to a match and challenge anybody on the firing line or did i just trip your trigger?


Yard Bird
That is a pretty good bench you use to shoot deer from but kinda sucks you can't move it. I have found the next thing since slice bread. It is called a Harris BI pod.The only time i use a bench is when i shoot the through the chrony and am developing loads. I practice shooting prone and all positions i will be utilizing in the field. And for me i shoot my best groups prone with the bi pod with a rear bag.

NeMd,I had a guy tell me once that a MK would not go through a pop can.WOW,THAT MUST HAVE BEEN ONE HELL OF A TOUGH POP CAN!!!!!!!!! ....I also told him he must hit it first

LOL, yeah Boyd didn't you know those pop cans are dangerous game?

Hey I want to thank you for holding our end up in this debate. In spite of the difficult opposition.

I've been going through this crap for a long time.I'm not very good at talking.Now when it's shootin time,that's a different story

Oh, God, no. This thread has become "Son of Match King." We're up to page four already, with no end in sight. I'm reminded of all those cheesy '50s horror movies, with the various monsters that couldn't be stopped, bullets would bounce off, radiation wouldn't work, et cetera.

My God. Page four.

<< Horror-announcer voice, on. >>

"The Thread That Wouldn't Die! Coming soon to a forum near YOU!"

<< Horror-announcer voice, off. >>

Russ

I guesss when you have no argument personal attacks is all that are left.
'''''''''''' wstrnhunter I would think that a 300 gr .338 mk at around 2400 or so well take care of about anything or to think it would just bounce off.

Boyd I shot some pop cans at 400 yards with my elk load match kings didn't have any trouble hitting them or putting two holes into them.

Tell us again!! tell us again!! Elk at 2890 yards!! with volley ball size exit wounds!! tell us again!

p dog shooter


HMMMMM sure hope we haven't driven them off!!! i was up for a debate again tonight

Did I tell you youngin's, about the time I fought a big ole wild boar with my bare hands?

Poor feller couldn't stand losing and killed hisself..... with a MatchKing to the testiculars...

J/K, I was the one that shot him in the testicles.

Recono....LMAO, that was good! It's like the guy from Arkansas that shot at clay pigeons with MKs until his wife made him quit because she didn't know how to cook the clay type pigeons.

BTW, nice shot with the MKs. Smoke 'em if you got 'em.

Some day I'll tell you about the incident involving a MK and a chipmunk. It was NOT a pretty sight.

R-WEST

Matt27:
You wrote:

quote:

---

Boyd
Thank you for understanding what i meant by "if i can shoot 3 to 5 inches at a 1000 yards and the kill zone .......... "At least you were reading more in depth to the text.

---

You lying again, you did not write "if i" you wrote "i can". Big difference.

Challenge is still open to any shooters that want to take me up on it, anytime, anywhere, as long as we are going to shoot enough groups for enough money to make the trip worthwhile. And in particular, asshole, it is open to you for any groups in the .1s at 100 yards and 1 1/8 inches at 600 yards as you claimed.

Take your trigger and your scope and put them where the sun never shines, you liar.

Matt, my rifle of choice is a .30-06 M70 Classic FTWT and it HATES bipods. I have a Harris that works very well when I am sitting and is used on my .243 on coyotes and p-dogs. I'm in the process of buying an Encore that will be free-floated and have a bipod stud on it that will be used for deer/varmint hunting.
Yardbird

"Some day I'll tell you about the incident involving a MK and a chipmunk. It was NOT a pretty sight."

Let me guess, the chipmunk used "The Force" to convince the MK that it is not in fact a "hunting" bullet and caused it to lose confidence and change trajectory to a more suitable destination - like a target?
Or did the chipmunk go splat.

My therapist has been working for months to help me forget the effects of the 'chipmunk incident', but, since you insist. I'm sure this will mandate another 6 months' therapy.

It all started during the 'MatchKing is NOT a hunting bullet thread' months ago. I got to thinking (mistake #1) "hmmm, maybe there's something to this MK stuff", so, I loaded up a batch of 308/168's to try in my Rem 700, 308 VSSF at the next range session. They shot quite well. During a break, I noticed some movement in the grass about halfway between the bench and the target butt; a quick check showed a chipmunk. Aha - an actual target. Through the 12X Leupold, I could see his beady little eyes as he coldly scanned 'his' domain. Confident in the capabilities of the MK, I held on his shoulder and squeezed off. The resultant explosion of snow, mud, grass, etc.., obscured the target, but, there was no doubt of the outcome, or so I thought.

A quick trip downrange to collect the trophy turned into a spectre that's haunted many nights' sleep since then. While inspecting the 'munk, just about the time I noticed there was no entry/exit wound (actually shot just OVER his shoulder and the concussion must have knocked him out), he woke up. Holding a recently awakened, highly agitated, bull chipmunk by the tail is quite an experience, let me tell you. Fangs, claws, screams, mud, sky/ground/sky/ground, staring down the Grim Reaper. It was nip and tuck for a while, but, his fate was predetermined.

quote:

---

This is R-WEST's therapist, Dr. Baron O'Graymatter. R-WEST is in serious denial. According to Mrs. R-WEST, who witnessed, and participated in, the chipmunk incident, the actual events are somewhat different than his recollection. Mrs. R-WEST said the screams were his, interspersed with shouts of "oh my God, we're all going to die". First he attempted to dig a hole, then, tried to run/crawl/roll away from the (tiny) creature, while said creature was also attempting to run in the opposite direction. Unfortunately, Mrs. R-WEST, who, by personal observation and examination of numerous targets, is a much better shot than R-WEST, was covering that escape route with her 22 Colt Woodsman. Dead chippie.
This is CRITICAL!! Do NOT, I repeat, NOT, tell R-WEST what actually happened that day. He needs MUCH more therapy (let's see, at $150.00/hr, how much more can I bleed out of this loser so I can get that custom pre-'64 Model 70 I saw over at GunsAmerica?)

---

It was terrible. Terrible I tell you!! Better schedule another therapy session right away. Need more of those happy pills.

R-WEST

R-WEST,

Read your next 4473 VERY carefully before signing. And kiss your CCW goodbye.

Please take this very seriously, just like all the other postings on this thread.

I knew this thread would degrade just as it did...

With years of manufacturing experience and excellent test facilities, I think that Sierra's word shold be given a little more thought. But then again, if you put a sheep into clover.....

I've seen a .30 caliber mK fail miserably on a 175 pound fallow deer -- and that, combined with my own expansion testing, is enough to convince me that Sierra is right on the money when it comes to the MKs.Sometimes they'll work well; other times, they nose may pinch shut, and expansion will be minimal. And other times, they come unglued quicker than the MK defenders when someone questions their choice

As to the fallow deer, a hunter in the Texas Hill country put a nice behind-the-shoulder shot on a fallow buck at a range of perhaps 140-150 yards. The MV of the bullet was, if memory serves, on the order of 2900 fps in the hunter's own handload. The impact was evident through the binoculars as it had been drizzling and the buck's coat was saturated. The guide was sure he'd be down just over the ridge.

Well, the buck made it over the ridge -- and quite a ways after that. I put my own hunt on hold to help with the search, and the sparse blood trail finally dried up. The next day, by sheer luck, the guide & hunter stumbled onto a bedded buck and noticed a dark patch that appeared to be dried blood on the ribcage. After watching the buck for a while and determining that all was not well with him, the hunter neck-shot the fallow to end its suffering. A quick examination of the buck indicated the bullet had passed through a rib upon entry and proceeded through the upper portion of the lungs before exiting. The nose may have pinched shut upon impact because there was very little damage to the lungs (and the shot may have caught the buck upon exhaling). The exit was the size of a dime, but that, more than likely, was due to secondary bone fragments of the ribcage and not any expansion of the bullet itself.

The guide had apparently questioned his load selection earlier -- prior to the hunt -- and was met with defiance and a holier-than-thou attitude. He maintained that same attitude when I asked why he used a bullet that the manufacturer said not to use on game. (Actually, he resorted to telling me what an accurate shot he was and what tiny groups he could put on paper. I insisted that paper and game are two different things, but instead of trying to use a logical expanation, I was met with profanity and basically told to mind my own business.)

Suffice to say, he is persona non grata at that camp -- and that was equally likely due to his attitude and unwillingness to change as it was to the actual use and failure of an MK on game.

Boyd,
Why would anyone shoot a doe in the butt at 6 yards? Surly you could have head or neck shot her at that range, doe are only for meat, I would have passed on that shot or waited for a better opertunity...

In my opinnion shooting deer beyond 400 yds is not a good practice, simply because a good shot will always hit them, but perhaps not just right whereas a bad shot will normally miss altogether..thus the best of shots will more likly wound one now and then.

Shooting animals at unknown ranges is a hell of a lot different than shooting at a bull at exact known ranges.

Bobby tomack I have shot way to many deer with any thing from a 22 rf to 338 mags to know that if you double lung any of them they die. Any bullet at 2900 through the lungs will kill them deader then dead. What about all the muzzle loaders and pistol shooters using hard cast bullets that do not expand kill deer. I have shot way to many deer with mks to know that they do work. I think your story is a hunting legend like some urban legends that refuse to die. With all the deer I have shot with match kings personal experience that includes more then one over 175lbs and lots smaller ones they go in and make big holes out the other side. Were you the hunter or the guide in your story or did you just hear it.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Ray go out and buy a laser range finder and you will not have to shoot them at unkown ranges. I think you most likey can afford one the leica 1200 is very nice.

Ray,I was being a smart ass,I don't shoot doe's .......Smallfry,go back and read all of the MATCHKING'S ARE NOT A HUNTING BULLET THREAD.It's talked about there....

[ 11-09-2002, 07:34: Message edited by: Boyd Heaton ]

Hey Boyd,,, I'll trade you one of my wifes sisters for that thar gun on the table,, but,, only if you throw in a hundred or so rounds of MK's to boot.

[ 11-09-2002, 08:24: Message edited by: Nutoy ]

This one shoot's REAL BAD...Don't think you want this one...

How about this one???

p dog shooter-
I was hunting on the ranch at the time -- and you'd have known that if you read the post thoroughly (meaning completely and comprehending it as well)

And I resent the implication of an "urban legend." By the way, you could at least have the courtesy to spell my name correctly.

So, since this incident does not "agree" with what you profess, it must be wrong, right? And, I guess your "experience" means all the techs at Sierra are wrong, too.....

Now, Sierra can save a ton of money on ink by leaving out the line: "MatchKings are not recommended for hunting"

Gee, maybe you should run for president and then set into motion a law that all should hunt with MKs.