quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
People with disposable money pay these tack on fees and move on like it's no big deal

It is a big deal!!!



I looked at 3 bills of sale from a SA taxidermist that did D&P for some friends in late 2014

He charged these guys $500 US each for the wood crates !!!

$1500 for 3 wooden crates!!! Just nuts IMO

I have awakened fron the African hunting dream I once had so many years to the reality of what it really is

It's not just the antis and greenies that are killing the African hunting industry.
Cal

Curious Cal, do you think it is the vendors and outfitters or us as hunters? I lay the blame at our feet. If we are prepared to let the outfitters and vendors engage in some of these practices, shame on us not shame on them. Sort of like a sports fan complaining about the salaries of professional athletes and then dropping $200 for a ticket to a game. It starts with us. If we want this to stop, we have to stop facilitating it.

+1

Best way is refraining from such service providers. However, the issues is much more nefarious than just outrageous prices. Its the fact that these prices are presented after the fact - its as if one is a hostage.

Why are outfitters and booking agents tolerating such practices? Its their clients on their service provided hunts getting hosed on the last legs.

These after hunt service providers know that already that often 5 figures have been spent - it is very unlikely that someone who wants the trophies will say go pound sand. So we have $500 wood crates charges.

I will say Andy Hunter in Zim has been a delight to deal with. The first time he shipped my stuff before I had even wired him the money.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
Mike: It is many faceted and blame lies with all involved:
Greedy PHs
Greedy booking agents
Greedy camp staff
Taxidermists in Africa who know they won't see the client again
Freight agents who charge what they can
Dip and pack personnel
Hunters who pay and complain
Hunters who pay and don't complain
Government official (here and there) who don't understand, are just plain stupid, or who take bribes to do what they are supposed to do anyway.
Greenies and antis who tell one side of the story
The African mentality both white and black, who live for today and take all they can today and screw tomorrows as future planning is unknown to that mentality.

In 20 years, when I'm 80, there will be no international hunting in Africa. It will come from many directions. Pressure from the antis to the African governments to stop hunting, anti firearms laws in the US, airlines who won't carry trophies or firearms. We have "drug free and gun free school zones--what will happen after the next shooting when a politician drafts a bill to make air ports "gun free zones?"
Cal

Interesting you don't see airline fares, hotels, duty free ect mentioned. Anywhere where they are consumers other than hunters you don't see this massive price inflation. If there is this massive inflationary pressures in africa how come they don't show up in other tourist and recreational activities - photo safaris, shark diving, ect.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by GunsCore:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by GOB:
I guess for some we have reached a point in life where if someone is not happy with the fact we hunt and kill animals it is their problem not ours. We can choose our friends. We are not ashamed of who we are.

Tough to reach that point if you have to professionally answer to an alternative audience - the general public. If you are a ceo of a public company - even if you engage in hunting the big 5 you will have a low profile. Last thing you want is your hobby to impact your professional career.

How many politicians we see with dead elephants - the king of spain decided to retire early after pictures of him and a dead elephant showed up. How may hollywood movie stars you see with dead big five? Kirk Douglas safaris days are done - even he is out there saying he regretted killing animals in Africa.

We can live in our social space on AR saying congratulations on hunting reports with dead big five. That is a socially acceptable activity on AR but most likely not in everyday social and economic activity. A lot of people have to earn a living out in a world where they cannot openly disclose or display their hunting activity to customers, clients ect. They need to earn that living to hunt in Africa.

I have zero public profile - AR is as public as I get or will ever get in my life. I have my hunting pictures on AR and a few vendors display it on their website. But I don't have my picture with a lion anywhere. Simple reason last thing I want in my picture to be used by someone who is anti-hunting in their media stuff. Lions are different than buffalo or plains game in that context.

I think it is a lot easier for hunting opponents to target specific aspects of african hunting - airline shipping trophies, traveling with guns, banning trophies from entering the us than it is impacting US hunting - limiting ones ability to use ones property for hunting ect.

Same time if hunting is for meat consumption public and media is pretty receptive. You have Anthony Bourdain shooting an eland from a truck in South Africa for a TV food and travel show. On AR he would have been taken to the woodshed for shooting from a truck.

Mike

I have my own CPA practice in Southern California and in my office I have Cape Buffalo shoulder mount, a Sable shoulder mount, Kudu and Croc skull mounts, a hippo tusk shield and an elephant ear painting. Most clients want to hear about my latest trip and look forward to seeing new stuff up on the wall. My prominently displayed trophies may have cost me a few clients, but I keep getting more and more each year. If you think about it...who do you want on your side when battling the IRS? Some sensitive new age PC type or someone who puts heads up on the wall?

+1 on your office displays but more on fighting the IRS.

But you have to admit if your business was one where 90 percent of the clients got offended or did not need your service to fight the irs but something more mundane you might not display your trophies in you place of business.

Mike

In the 20 some years we have had our Big and Enlarged Trophy room and 6 of Dangerous 7 Displayed and Darted rhinos in Photos...my wife an RN and Executive in a large Hospital organization and me as a Controller, ie in a Fortune 100 Corp, we have had numerous "Office Parties" here and NEVER have had an Anti-comment or anyone not overwhelmed with interest and questions....and desire to come back year after year.
I always carry trophy room pictures and recent field photos on my wife's Ipad when we go on major upacale cruises.....NEVER a negative comment...those that don't like it don't join our our cocktail and dinner groups....many have followed up and visited as well....I am proud of my trophies and always share the Zim Campfire Program story....and you would be surpirsed how many doubters have become supporters....including little old ladies who had donated to HSUS and WWF...NO More after they meet me!!
We must be our own Media and and Cheerleaders....otherwise, blame yourself for a deteriorating press on hunting....WE HAVE A POSITIVE IMPACT ON WILDLIFE.....TELL THE STORY!!

JUST LIKE THE AGE OLD DRUG CAMPAIGN- JUST SAY NO!!
I get in everyone's face on Hangers On fees and I do say "Keep the DAMN Trophies"....they don't and I don't pay the fees....and I give SERIOUS NEGATIVE FEEDBACK to the OUTFITTERS!! I don't care what they think of me!! I also tell Outfitters when I think their prices are Outrageous....again, I don't care....but they do if I don't book.
We are a VERY SMALL group of people who support this industry....we can be our own worst enemy by rolling over and paying and NOT giving NEGATIVE Feedback....stand up and be counted...It will SUPPORT ALL OF US...in keeping prices in control. It only takes a few paying the excessive fees to VALIDATE them in the eyes of the industry....

The Subject of this Thread is BANG ON and focusing on the Problem....and the problem is us!!

CHEERS,

quote:

Originally posted by 470EDDY:
In the 20 some years we have had our Big and Enlarged Trophy room and 6 of Dangerous 7 Displayed and Darted rhinos in Photos...my wife an RN and Executive in a large Hospital organization and me as a Controller, ie in a Fortune 100 Corp, we have had numerous "Office Parties" here and NEVER have had an Anti-comment or anyone not overwhelmed with interest and questions....and desire to come back year after year.
I always carry trophy room pictures and recent field photos on my wife's Ipad when we go on major upacale cruises.....NEVER a negative comment...those that don't like it don't join our our cocktail and dinner groups....many have followed up and visited as well....I am proud of my trophies and always share the Zim Campfire Program story....and you would be surpirsed how many doubters have become supporters....including little old ladies who had donated to HSUS and WWF...NO More after they meet me!!
We must be our own Media and and Cheerleaders....otherwise, blame yourself for a deteriorating press on hunting....WE HAVE A POSITIVE IMPACT ON WILDLIFE.....TELL THE STORY!!

JUST LIKE THE AGE OLD DRUG CAMPAIGN- JUST SAY NO!!
I get in everyone's face on Hangers On fees and I do say "Keep the DAMN Trophies"....they don't and I don't pay the fees....and I give SERIOUS NEGATIVE FEEDBACK to the OUTFITTERS!! I don't care what they think of me!! I also tell Outfitters when I think their prices are Outrageous....again, I don't care....but they do if I don't book.
We are a VERY SMALL group of people who support this industry....we can be our own worst enemy by rolling over and paying and NOT giving NEGATIVE Feedback....stand up and be counted...It will SUPPORT ALL OF US...in keeping prices in control. It only takes a few paying the excessive fees to VALIDATE them in the eyes of the industry....

The Subject of this Thread is BANG ON and focusing on the Problem....and the problem is us!!

CHEERS,

Yep... around the world dedicated hunters outnumber the dedicated 'antis' by a good margin.

Prices have skyrocketed without a doubt. Personally I made the decision to not go back to TZ due to the 2006 and 2007 debacles. I believe I am not the only one. It is interesting that there are now incredible offers coming out of TZ. I might change my mind.

It isn't just TZ. Zim has gone way over board . I saw one offer that when you worked it all out was about $28k for a buff. At some point whether one can afford it or not, it just becomes ridiculous. I am old . I still remember paying $700 a day and an $800 trophy fees for my first buff in 1991.

Elephants are also out of control. One may pay trophy fees of $15,000 for a bull less than 40 pounds that cannot be imported into the U.S.

The mentality of the governments certainly cause a lot of the issues. I doubt that will ever change . There will be a total meltdown and these idiots will wonder what happened.

Some of the grief and ancillary costs have gotten out of control. While this is not Africa, I would like to relay a recent example . We went to Argentina in July. I have gone at least once every year since 2004, often more than once. I wanted to take my same gun that I have taken for 10 years. The level of grief that I had to go through was nothing short of shocking . To start with, I had to drive to Miami and back. That is about 550 miles round trip . The documentation they wanted was just insane. We spent MANY hours on it. It finally got to the point that it was clear the guy in the consulate was clueless. I gave up. Why put someone through this who has spent the kind of money I have spent down there.

The sad part is that I don't think anyone is getting rich doing this. When all these little things get put together, it adds up to a lot of money. A hell of a lot of money . It wouldn't be so bad if the governments were actually using the money as intended.

I love it but.........

Gave up a few years ago taking our guns to Argentina. It cost us $100.00 a day to rent a Beretta or Bernardelli and a half day as a bonus in the morning of our flight out.

The shoot is fantastic and cheap, the rental is a lot less of a problem than driving hundreds of miles and all the grief.

It does effect us on the big game. We will not go unless our rifle goes with us. So we cancelled the big game this year but made up for it in Africa.

The elections coming in Argentina appear to show the Socialist getting dumped so the new government may change things again back to some sanity.

Sorry Larry but do you mind telling us what documentation they wanted? Was there any reason for the change provided?

We stopped taking our shotguns when it was still really no problem to do so.

With the Berettas and Bernardelli going we just take a few shims they provide and it takes 10 minutes to set the gun up to your specs. Including a longer or shorter pad if required.

Thanks

Ok, for those of you who are whining "I am sho' sorry for me" over safari prices - what my life blood - OIL!

Today, I am getting $43 per barrel for my West Texas Intermediate - the same as in 1981 and again in 2008. Prices go up, prices go down.

YOu have no control other than to spend or not spend.

The euro is $1.10 to the dollar. Recently it was $1.35. The rand is upside down as well.

You can't take the money with you, so go if you can afford and quit looking backwards to the not so good old days.

DOGCAT- Doing what you are suggesting is PART OF THE PROBLEM....you are VALIDATING the PRACTICES and making it harder for the rest of us who PUSH BACK for the BENEFIT OF ALL OF US...whether you can afford it or not!!

Yes, I understand, you can't take it with you, but wouldn't you rather leave more to a good Educational or Medical Foundation to do GOOD for the WORLD than waste it on GREEDY in Africa?? I would and am doing just that!!

Yes, it is the GREED of many of Africa's "Leaders" that believe all hunters are a bottomless pit of WEALTH and they MUST EXTRACT their SHARE .....that is what has happened in Tanzania, but in Zim, it is the owners of the Conservancies who are the Gold Diggers!!

This whole thread needs to be printed up and mailed to each and every PH Association by Country in Africa....they need to get busy. BTW they have a good friend and very knowledgeable leader in the Publisher of African Hunting Gazette....he has spoken to me in trying to form an exporting company to control trophy shipments from PH's to Taxidermists doors....I have told him this needs to be funded by PH's and their Associations to be effective and well run...hard to do with investors this side....a losing proposition!!

BTW- I also failed to mention that Golf Country Clubs and Yacht Clubs are also failing and finding it VERY HARD to find new generation members....they just don't seek this kind of entertainment as many have enjoyed for the last 100 years....it is NOT focused on Africa and hunting....it is a NEW ERA!!

Cheers,

quote:

Originally posted by 470EDDY:
DOGCAT- Doing what you are suggesting is PART OF THE PROBLEM....you are VALIDATING the PRACTICES and making it harder for the rest of us who PUSH BACK for the BENEFIT OF ALL OF US...whether you can afford it or not!!

Yes, I understand, you can't take it with you, but wouldn't you rather leave more to a good Educational or Medical Foundation to do GOOD for the WORLD than waste it on GREEDY in Africa?? I would and am doing just that!!

Yes, it is the GREED of many of Africa's "Leaders" that believe all hunters are a bottomless pit of WEALTH and they MUST EXTRACT their SHARE .....that is what has happened in Tanzania, but in Zim, it is the owners of the Conservancies who are the Gold Diggers!!

This whole thread needs to be printed up and mailed to each and every PH Association by Country in Africa....they need to get busy. BTW they have a good friend and very knowledgeable leader in the Publisher of African Hunting Gazette....he has spoken to me in trying to form an exporting company to control trophy shipments from PH's to Taxidermists doors....I have told him this needs to be funded by PH's and their Associations to be effective and well run...hard to do with investors this side....a losing proposition!!

BTW- I also failed to mention that Golf Country Clubs and Yacht Clubs are also failing and finding it VERY HARD to find new generation members....they just don't seek this kind of entertainment as many have enjoyed for the last 100 years....it is NOT focused on Africa and hunting....it is a NEW ERA!!

Cheers,

Golf you can always try and bring chinese or europeans to come and use the golf courses as part of a vacation package. But I agree long term trends for golf don't look good - we have just built to many damn gold courses.

Yacht - don't know the market but everyone I know who owned big fancy fishing boats after a few years the cost of maintenance gets them. If you want to catch fish better of flying to costa rica/panama or chartering. If you like running a boat - get a boat.


I don't expect anyone in the hunting industry to come and justify their price increases - its either the market bears it or we see a lot of cancelled late season hunts offered. I think DSC in 2016 will be interesting. The full impact of oil decline will be realized and the fact that that everything in energy has not bounced back like in 2009 will be apparent.

As a side note the largest growth in $100K jobs with no college education was at halliburton in last few years. That is gone for a long while.

Somehow I don't think there are a lot of hunters at google or amazon or facebook.

Very few hunters on wall street (finance in new york) and if they hunted it was mainly release shoots for birds. Nearly 50% or more of the finance people I know in TX and LA and OK hunt.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by 470EDDY:
DOGCAT- Doing what you are suggesting is PART OF THE PROBLEM....you are VALIDATING the PRACTICES and making it harder for the rest of us who PUSH BACK for the BENEFIT OF ALL OF US...whether you can afford it or not!!

Yes, I understand, you can't take it with you, but wouldn't you rather leave more to a good Educational or Medical Foundation to do GOOD for the WORLD than waste it on GREEDY in Africa?? I would and am doing just that!!

Yes, it is the GREED of many of Africa's "Leaders" that believe all hunters are a bottomless pit of WEALTH and they MUST EXTRACT their SHARE .....that is what has happened in Tanzania, but in Zim, it is the owners of the Conservancies who are the Gold Diggers!!

This whole thread needs to be printed up and mailed to each and every PH Association by Country in Africa....they need to get busy. BTW they have a good friend and very knowledgeable leader in the Publisher of African Hunting Gazette....he has spoken to me in trying to form an exporting company to control trophy shipments from PH's to Taxidermists doors....I have told him this needs to be funded by PH's and their Associations to be effective and well run...hard to do with investors this side....a losing proposition!!

BTW- I also failed to mention that Golf Country Clubs and Yacht Clubs are also failing and finding it VERY HARD to find new generation members....they just don't seek this kind of entertainment as many have enjoyed for the last 100 years....it is NOT focused on Africa and hunting....it is a NEW ERA!!

Cheers,

I partially and partially disagree. I have see the financials on certain conservancies . They are not pretty. The owners are not getting rich based upon what in have seen.

quote:

Originally posted by 470EDDY:

Yes, I understand, you can't take it with you, but wouldn't you rather leave more to a good Educational or Medical Foundation to do GOOD for the WORLD than waste it on GREEDY in Africa?? I would and am doing just that!!


Cheers,

Amen brother. I certainly do, and applaud you for doing so. It's hard to have sympathy for someone who cannot afford to go on safari anymore, when there are good people struggling to feed their families. IMO and as a general rule, Americans are a spoiled bunch, with poor priorites.

I downgraded to plains game this year, and if I go back in the future it will be for plains game unless prices change. Prices have become insane on dangerous game hunts. Would I prefer to hunt dangerous game? Sure would, but not with the escalating costs and greed. I'm sure that there are many here on AR who are in the same boat or feel the same way. Greed will become the ruin of the industry.

African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:
African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

+1

It's just a high priced vacation - nothing more nothing less.


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/24...d-led-by-google.html


Maybe google or costco gets in the hunting business zero chance of that but nothing wrong with customers and clients shopping around for the best value proposition.

Mike

Many of us who own businesses, adjust our pricing, improve productivity, make decisions based on increasing our customer bases and marketing our products. The market and our own business objectives drive our decision making. It seems that the perception in the safari industry is that, well, we can just raise the prices as the Americans will just pay it. The dip and pack thing has just become annoying and quite frankly pisses us all off. We know we are being jilted with export, paperwork, shipping, traveling etc, fees and we know we are being screwed and taken advantage of, but quite frankly, feel like our trophies are being held hostage unless we pay up. Many of the outfitters are doing their own dip and pack and involved with all the rest of the fleecers trying to improve their wallet share. Our wallets.

Plain and simple...it's the attitude that the Americans can be had and let's get every dime out of them that we can. One of the outfitters on his thread went on and on about all the things that they have to do to care for the land, the game and their customers. While I appreciate all the effort...so what? Do you think any of us have a cake walk running our business? You wanted to be one!!!
He then asked, what is so hard about doing a wire transfer...ok..then you freaking do it. I go on 5-6 international trips per year at least...it's like 3-4m wire transfers per trip between deposit, dip and pack, shipping, and settling up. That about 1200 a year and more than that, a pain in the ass having to go to the bank, etc...in my business, the customer is king...we do what they want and do everything to make their lives easier.....they are the ones feeding our families and providing for our children. Start looking at us like that and not just a free for all meal ticket and we will start noticing you all.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Collector:
Many of us who own businesses, adjust our pricing, improve productivity, make decisions based on increasing our customer bases and marketing our products. The market and our own business objectives drive our decision making. It seems that the perception in the safari industry is that, well, we can just raise the prices as the Americans will just pay it. The dip and pack thing has just become annoying and quite frankly pisses us all off. We know we are being jilted with export, paperwork, shipping, traveling etc, fees and we know we are being screwed and taken advantage of, but quite frankly, feel like our trophies are being held hostage unless we pay up. Many of the outfitters are doing their own dip and pack and involved with all the rest of the fleecers trying to improve their wallet share. Our wallets.

Plain and simple...it's the attitude that the Americans can be had and let's get every dime out of them that we can. One of the outfitters on his thread went on and on about all the things that they have to do to care for the land, the game and their customers. While I appreciate all the effort...so what? Do you think any of us have a cake walk running our business? You wanted to be one!!!
He then asked, what is so hard about doing a wire transfer...ok..then you freaking do it. I go on 5-6 international trips per year at least...it's like 3-4m wire transfers per trip between deposit, dip and pack, shipping, and settling up. That about 1200 a year and more than that, a pain in the ass having to go to the bank, etc...in my business, the customer is king...we do what they want and do everything to make their lives easier.....they are the ones feeding our families and providing for our children. Start looking at us like that and not just a free for all meal ticket and we will start noticing you all.

Largemouth Bass fishing in Cuba will be popular very soon

A very good friend of mine that has bass fishes Cuba said it is even better than Mexico

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:
African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

+1

It's just a high priced vacation - nothing more nothing less.


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/24...d-led-by-google.html


Maybe google or costco gets in the hunting business zero chance of that but nothing wrong with customers and clients shopping around for the best value proposition.

Mike

I think some of you guys are overlooking the fact that your 'holiday' dollars spent are usually contributing to serious wildlife conservation. My holiday to the beach does not.

This is a good discussion but I'm not so sure that the all inclusive price is a perfect solution. Yes it can tell you up front what your cost is but...

In most countries there are multiple businesses involved in the process:

The outfitter who conducts the hunt and initial skinning/salting, etc.

A taxidermist or agent who handles tanning, fumigating, packing, paperwork, etc.

A shipper/exporter who actually exports the trophies. May be combined with above.

The outfitter has zero influence over how much these businesses charge or how well they conduct their business. Of course through experience and reputation they can recommend the good ones to work with.

So how does an outfitter guarantee that all this trophy prep/shipment will go off like clockwork? He can't since it isn't his business!!

What an outfitter could do is assume the risk, offer this as all inclusive but then he's likely to put some premium on it for the extra work he has to do chasing people around and to cover his ass if something goes wrong. Would that be acceptable to everyone to pay a higher price for peace of mind when there are already complaints that the prices are too high? I don't think that will fly for many hunters who want a breakdown of who is charging exactly what. Plus there will be endless complaints about the outfitter padding the fees and making extra profits. Damned if you do, damned if you don't!

I think the best solution would be to communicate with the outfitter, the taxidermist and everyone else involved who would bill you, AHEAD of time so there are as few surprises as possible. Quite often, what happens after the shooting is over is an afterthought and maybe the outfitters/agents should push harder on their clients to research these costs and pick those providers ahead of time(with their assistance) so there isn't any bad blood later on.

Even then the cost will likely be different as people invariably shoot more/less that what they originally intended to. How can someone quote a guaranteed fixed price ahead of time?

I feel a deja vu like I've written this before.

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:
African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

+1

It's just a high priced vacation - nothing more nothing less.


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/24...d-led-by-google.html


Maybe google or costco gets in the hunting business zero chance of that but nothing wrong with customers and clients shopping around for the best value proposition.

Mike

I think some of you guys are overlooking the fact that your 'holiday' dollars spent are usually contributing to serious wildlife conservation. My holiday to the beach does not.

Don't think anyone in the real world in the US - the IRS - buys the hunting as conservation argument. We would all be deducting our african hunts otherwise in the US.

Not sure if those 100K mule deer tags in utah are tax deductible, they may be.

Mike

VVREDDY- Apparently you haven't been around long enough to know that all of this EXTRA STUFF is a VERY RECENT happening....it used to be from Outfitter to Airline and to you or your taxidermist at arrival!! 10 years, Maybe??!!

Beretta-Mike, I can assure you that Costco will NOT be marketing hunts...I went to college, through same graduate school, with one of the Co-founders....both of the founders are SEATTLE LEFT WING OBAMA SUPPORTERS....and I am Right Conservative....go figure...and NO I DO NOT SHOP AT COSTCO unless I have no other choice, like in Kona!!

Cheers,

You should blame government regulations for that and not the outfitter. It doesn't matter what happened ten years ago. Good luck trying to put a bunch of trophies in air cargo and picking them up directly from the airline without Customs & USFWS poking their nose into it.

Besides that are you suggesting the outfitter would tan your zebra skin by himself and mail it to you directly? Nonsense

VVREDDY- NOPE, just properly salted and dried and packed in a FREE Box!!...march it off to the Cargo office....now I will say the terrorist activities now require folks to be a "known shipper" to ship unaccompanied freight these days....still free!! USF&W has always been involved in clearing....and that now costs $30 personal and $90 for a commercial clearance....yes that the client pays when he doesn't clear or Taxidermist.....
Cheers,

quote:

Originally posted by 470EDDY:
VVREDDY- NOPE, just properly salted and dried and packed in a FREE Box!!...march it off to the Cargo office....now I will say the terrorist activities now require folks to be a "known shipper" to ship unaccompanied freight these days....still free!! USF&W has always been involved in clearing....and that now costs $30 personal and $90 for a commercial clearance....yes that the client pays when he doesn't clear or Taxidermist.....
Cheers,

Where is this Costco Expediting Service located?

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:
African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

+1

It's just a high priced vacation - nothing more nothing less.


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/24...d-led-by-google.html


Maybe google or costco gets in the hunting business zero chance of that but nothing wrong with customers and clients shopping around for the best value proposition.

Mike

I think some of you guys are overlooking the fact that your 'holiday' dollars spent are usually contributing to serious wildlife conservation. My holiday to the beach does not.

Don't think anyone in the real world in the US - the IRS - buys the hunting as conservation argument. We would all be deducting our african hunts otherwise in the US.

Not sure if those 100K mule deer tags in utah are tax deductible, they may be.

Mike

Are donations to charities in other countries tax deductible in the US anyhow?

Sadly you are correct, there is no way F & W is not going to try to fornicate you. They hate you and hunting.

Sadly there are some real dreamers out there. There may be some very very poor practices on the part of the outfitters but do your research. If you cannot afford the game then stay out of it Or like we do, get your ducks in a row and do what you can afford.

I personally find the clowns that line up for tips a pain. But that is the game. Stay home and live in a plywood shack for 80k to dump with old Jim and the little Princess if that rocks your boat. I just returned from Zim shot a record leopard and other great animals for less than 20K, the people were great, quarters were lovely and the food was not out of a can in a shack.

We shall stay home and plan for the next adventure leaving the 80k moose burgers withe the King and Princess for those who fear Africa and think it should be free.

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:
African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

+1

It's just a high priced vacation - nothing more nothing less.


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/24...d-led-by-google.html


Maybe google or costco gets in the hunting business zero chance of that but nothing wrong with customers and clients shopping around for the best value proposition.

Mike

I think some of you guys are overlooking the fact that your 'holiday' dollars spent are usually contributing to serious wildlife conservation. My holiday to the beach does not.

Don't think anyone in the real world in the US - the IRS - buys the hunting as conservation argument. We would all be deducting our african hunts otherwise in the US.

Not sure if those 100K mule deer tags in utah are tax deductible, they may be.

Mike

I know of some that are at least partially tax deductible.

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Matt Graham:

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by Cazador humilde:
African hunting is a business, just like any other. It is not "sacrilege" to occasionally examine it with a critical eye.

+1

It's just a high priced vacation - nothing more nothing less.


http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/24...d-led-by-google.html


Maybe google or costco gets in the hunting business zero chance of that but nothing wrong with customers and clients shopping around for the best value proposition.

Mike

I think some of you guys are overlooking the fact that your 'holiday' dollars spent are usually contributing to serious wildlife conservation. My holiday to the beach does not.

Don't think anyone in the real world in the US - the IRS - buys the hunting as conservation argument. We would all be deducting our african hunts otherwise in the US.

Not sure if those 100K mule deer tags in utah are tax deductible, they may be.

Mike

Are donations to charities in other countries tax deductible in the US anyhow?

Potentially yes under the right set of circumstances.

Thanks Larry. I wonder if some programs in Africa could make part of hunts tax deductible?

Hey here's an idea folks ... why don't y'all come to Australia for your buffalo kicks?... $11,000 all-in in 2016. $225 for paperwork. $1,100 to ship your skull and skin back to the US all the way from camp.. plus US clearance charges of course. bargain!!

Matt:

To be able to take a legitimate tax deduction, the organization must be approved. Once approved, they will be listed in what is known as the Cumulative List of Exempt Organizations. Generally, if an entity is not listed in this book, one is not entitled to a tax deduction for contributions.

While not impossible, it would take some work to both (a) have an approved organization and (b) structure something that would pass scrutiny.

The tags referred to in another post are unique. For the Antelope Island permits for example, the money paid goes directly to the running of the park. To the extent the contribution exceeds the fair market value of the hunt, it could be deducted provided all other requirements are met.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Matt:

To be able to take a legitimate tax deduction, the organization must be approved. Once approved, they will be listed in what is known as the Cumulative List of Exempt Organizations. Generally, if an entity is not listed in this book, one is not entitled to a tax deduction for contributions.

While not impossible, it would take some work to both (a) have an approved organization and (b) structure something that would pass scrutiny.

The tags referred to in another post are unique. For the Antelope Island permits for example, the money paid goes directly to the running of the park. To the extent the contribution exceeds the fair market value of the hunt, it could be deducted provided all other requirements are met.

Thanks Larry, so could all of that money going to Antelope Island be tax deductible for a US citizen?

Most of it.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Most of it.

Very interesting. What about governors tags?

Have to be reviewed individually.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Have to be reviewed individually.

Thanks Larry.... and now for that Aussie croc permit!!! .... who knows, one day maybe.

All these high dollar tags that are tax deductible are issued by a state agencies with proceeds specifically designated for conservation and most likely is in a specific geographic area.

Very unlikely an African or Australian hunt is tax deductible. Maybe if you are in the hunting business but then you have the hobby loss rules.

Mike

I

Mike- Usually if the hunts out of country are sold by a "qualified" 501c3 in US, the amount above the normal retail price would be deductible in US.
In the Governor's tags, one must be very careful t whom one is writing teh checks, again a "qualified" 501c3.....and NOT all auctions are run by Qualified Charitable organizations even though you might THINK they are or appear to be!!
HA, US is generally the only country in the World that has such a thing as deductions....all the rest are gross income taxes and they pay the piper!!

Cheers,

quote:

Originally posted by 470EDDY:
HA, US is generally the only country in the World that has such a thing as deductions....all the rest are gross income taxes and they pay the piper!!

Cheers,

Australia does.