quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:
Okay, watched the video. It doesn't even mention wind - the reason any good shooter misses.

quote:

Originally posted by Kanga69:
Instructor

It does adjust for wind. You have to dial in the value of the wind (8mph) and it is displayed in the up right corner of the scope.

AZ - It displays the range in the upper left view of the scope. Range finding scopes have been around, this just takes it to a new level. Previous manufactuers can range distance, but they have 0 ability to adjust your aim point. Scope range finders in my opinion are better because of the crosshairs and the stability when ranging at long distances.

If I could address your concerns. I hope I dont offend.

1. I am not sure of the patents owned but the company building this has their stuff together and I am sure have covered their bases.

2. The target market, for the civilian market is three pronged in my opinion.

a. The gun collector that wants one of everything. I know guys like that and I envy their collections and want to be them when I grow up.

b. Long range target shooters. There are a lot of people that would like to get into this game and do not have the time with their schedules to spend months if not years at the range perfecting loads, data, and research to be effective at long range shooting. I can take someone who has never shot long distance and have them hitting targets out to 1000 yds in minutes.

c. Long range hunters. The ethics debat will run on this for years. But, with this system, you will have a very unique oportunity to put your bullet where you intend it to be on game that is moving up to 15mph, with unmatched speed and accuracy. I cant see the risk of it being rendered illegal. If anything, it will provide cleaner kills at distances most shooters would not attempt to shoot. California might see that differently. It is still a rifle with a scope on it. You have to find the game get the crosshairs on it and pull the trigger. That is what we have all been doing since gun powder was invented. You will just have the highest rate of succes known to man, to date. I think the number of wounded animals would decrease exponetially because of this system. Thank you for all the questions and feedback!

quote:

Originally posted by gwahir:
Using the berger ballistics program I compared two 1000 yard shots with a .500 bc. bullet and a 10 mph, 90 degree, left side crosswind. The first had the wind between 0 and 200 yards, and no cross wind beyond 200. The cross wind component was 2.8" at 200. With no further crosswind influence the bullet hole would be 2.8" x 5 = 14" to the right of the point of aim at 1000 yds.

Suppose the shot were made with no cross wind for the first 800 yards and a 10 mph cross wind between 800 and 1000. The velocity of the bullet at 800 yds is 1492 fps which will give a wind drift of 6.09" by the time the bullet reaches 1000.

14" compared to 6.9"! The wind at the rifle has the greatest influnce, by far!

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

Look, this is beyond ethics. If a person shooting a rifle truly needed no skill, ie, you will never miss no matter what, then I see it being made illegal.

I think you are grossly underestimating what the vast majority of hunters think is fair. If the animal has no chance once you spot it, such a device is going to be made illegal, if not by Fish and Game then by voter proposition.

quote:

Originally posted by Instructor:
Kanga69,
I should have been clearer regarding wind adjustment. I meant that I thought the scope itself independently determined wind speed, direction, etc. without manual dialing in the adjustment for windage and curious just how that was managed. If I understand now(I am a bit on the slow side) the operator dials in what has been determined the wind speed/direction and the scope does the math to correct plus determines the range as well, is that the case??
There could be a problem for use of this set up in NRA regulation matches(Long Range) for unless the rules have changed, there are to be no electronic devices on the firing line and that includes wind meters. Having said that I have seen competitors using electronic wind meters on the line, but not challenged by CRO?? I am assuming the device is caliber specific and can different calibers be specified?
Appreciate your paitence.

quote:

Originally posted by 338zmag:

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

Look, this is beyond ethics. If a person shooting a rifle truly needed no skill, ie, you will never miss no matter what, then I see it being made illegal.

I think you are grossly underestimating what the vast majority of hunters think is fair. If the animal has no chance once you spot it, such a device is going to be made illegal, if not by Fish and Game then by voter proposition.

I have heard people complaining about all the the latest equipment for years, yet they end up buying and using it. I am talking about high end scopes, range finders, wind meters, ballistics software, custom rifles, hand loaded ammo, compound bows, crossbows and so on. The same thing applies to fishing.


No rifle can guarantee no misses and none ever will, even with smart bullets. Unfortunately, even the military doesn't always hit with guided smart bombs.

quote:

Originally posted by Instructor:
Kanga69,
I should have been clearer regarding wind adjustment. I meant that I thought the scope itself independently determined wind speed, direction, etc. without manual dialing in the adjustment for windage and curious just how that was managed. If I understand now(I am a bit on the slow side) the operator dials in what has been determined the wind speed/direction and the scope does the math to correct plus determines the range as well, is that the case??
There could be a problem for use of this set up in NRA regulation matches(Long Range) for unless the rules have changed, there are to be no electronic devices on the firing line and that includes wind meters. Having said that I have seen competitors using electronic wind meters on the line, but not challenged by CRO?? I am assuming the device is caliber specific and can different calibers be specified?
Appreciate your paitence.

quote:

Originally posted by Instructor:
Kanga69,
It varies from club to club, but usually there will be matches for "any/any" meaning competitor can use optics or micrometer peep sights, your choice of use in the match. Most will give you minimum of two sighter shots or perhaps as many as five and then following shots are for record. Some run the match w/ unlimited sighters, 20rnds for record, 30 minute time frame. If two sighters permitted, 20 for record, time allotment is 22minutes. A typical match setting for Long Range. Have shot in matches where there are no sighters and one had best have his zero and able to read the wind suffeciently to be able to get on the target.
A miss is minus 10 points out of a possible 200 for a clean as it is called. Would mention that Long Range is from 600-1000yds. It's not discussed much but w/ right hand twist barrel, bullet rotating to the right, and a right to left wind will cause the bullet to fly upward a bit in addition to the wind pushing the bullet to the left. Opposite for left hand wind. Such behavior of the bullet is not noticeable at shorter ranges of say, 400yds or less or it does not seem to be anyway. If shooting at 600-1000yds and putting anymore than 3 minutes of correction on sight will also slightly adjust elevation according to what is stated above. If the hits start creeping out of the X and 10 ring, upper right or upper left, I will adjust more to keep them closer to X ring. Curious if the system discussed here will compensate for such things. Would imagine folks developing the system would have knowledge of this issue??