YOu know what, it is fine to be impressed with your 204 Ruger, but it is a silly argument to claim it is superior to the 220 swift. Silly as all get out, period. Go enjoy your 204 and get a life while you are at it, the swift is and has been for a long time a truely awesome varmint cartridge. Your argument would have been more impressive if you would have chosen the 223 Rem, but you know what, I give a flip about your 204, just from reading the thread, I doubt I ever will be interested in that skinny bullet.

quote:

Now I, am gonna go off on a tangent here a bit and declare that all things being equal in two Rifles (one being a 223 and the other a 22-250) that the 223 will be slightly (but noticeably and appreciably!) more accurate! I have proven this to myself on many occassions over the years!

So first you say that a flater trajectory makes a more accurate rifle but then say that the 223 is more accurate than a 22-250. HHMMM that doesn't make much sense now does it. Maybe ou should read through some of your previous posts so you can get all your unproven superficial nonsense in order. Also to anyone else reading this article let this person believe himself. we are only fueling the fire for this crap to continue. there is clearly no reasoning with this person. he twists words from other posters comments to fit his own agenda. To VarmintGuy good luck with your umpteen firearms and 40+ years of shooting experience. hopefully in the next 40 you will learn somthing other than big words.

varmint guy, I am really glad that you like your 204 ruger and you feel so strong about putting the word out about how great a round it is BUT the way you are pushing it reminds me of a preacher from a fire and brimstone church! while I might not agree with your feelings toward this round I am not going to tell you to go well I can't say that but I will offer a suggestion, while I don't have the 40+ years of shooting or do I own many guns I feel that everyone has their opinion and while most of us would rather not here it their are forums like this where we may voice our opionions on how we feel about something wrong or right, I don't feel that you are wrong for your situation the 204 is the cats meow and I'm glad it works for you but it's not my chioce of cartridge! I have sold off most of the rifles I don't use anymore and have kept the couple I feel are right for ME not the ones I feel are right for Fred or Bob and I don't push the fact that the rounds I choose are the best for them nor do I try to say that Freds 22-250 sucks compaired to my 17 Remington for pasture poodles! while I do enjoy seeing a bullet impact and the grace that said pasture poodle performs accrobatice feats that would make some of the folks with Ringling Brother Circus go wow the final point is that Freds 22-250 still kills the pasture maggots just as well as my 17 Rem and Fred laughs just as loud as I do so why tell Fred that his rifle is ballistically inferior to my rifle? Fred really does not care! varmint guy best of luck with your 204 and I hope that it never looses it's luster like my 17 Remington does for me. Best wishes to you and I hope that everyone here has a great and safe New Years Later,

Ksmirk

Varmintguy,
Man are you ever going to quit with that gay ass shit
long live the magical 204,
long live remington.
Get a life man and take that 204 ruger and shove it up your ass.
How about instead of arguing with everyone about it getting nowhere, why dont you take it out and go hunting with it.
oh yeah here I will do it for you

long live the magical 204, my sexy baby
long live the 204 the 8th wonder of the world
long live remington
hold into the wind

there do you feel better now?

Guys:

I am telling you, he calls me a chump, and says I can't disrespect him, what a bunch of crap! I give the dumb ass solid info, and he disrespected my input. He is that same A/H that we have had previously on another site, I am convinced of it!!

This is gunshop bullshit, and I can't believe I have been drawn into it.

Happy New Year to all, even Varmintguy

Jerry

Hey Jarrod:

I wish I had read your post to Varmintguy before I had completed the above post.

Man are you right on.

Jerry

Arguing this shit is like arguing over which is the better plane, a Super Cub or 747. For a flight to Milan, I'll always take the 747. For landing on a Forest Service strip in the Bob Marshall I'll always take the Cub. Guess what, they're both airplanes and are equally fantastic. They're just not designed for the same purposes, even though they both have flight in common!

A NA big game hunter can easliy get by with one rifle. On the other hand, Varmint shooting is more specialized than nearly any other type of "hunting." On a prarie dog shoot I'd always rather have the 204 as it has little muzzle jump and a guy can call his own shots. On a yote I'd rather have the swift... it pushes a heavy bullet faster. As an all-arounder I'd rather have a 22-250... serious varminters, however, should be like golfers, having more than one club.

Me, I'm not a serious varminter anymore and use a 30-06 or 22lr... a complete pagan I know...

Why do people compare cartridges that have no two things in common. Everything is different between the two.

Lets start with this...

THEIR BORE DIAMETERS ARE DIFFERENT.

THERE CASE SIZES ARE COMPLETLY DIFFERENT

In your Comparison you are using ammo with 18 Grains of bullet Difference. Why don't you compare it to the .458, yes its only 400 and some grains different but it would be a good comparison....GO BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD.

Arguing this is like Wipeing before you crap. "Whats the point???"

Why do People have to Compare things and why the hell does something always have to be better than something else. There are a hell of a lot of great calibers out there and a hell of a lot of cool wildcat cartridges. Why does someone have to say one is better than the other??? Can't people just be happy with all of the cool shit out there.

I see I'm not the only one tired of VarmintGuy's bullshit rants...............

I asked him once to come to Camp Perry and prove to the world how good that 204 Ruger is. Man, you should have seen the tirade he launched on.....

To me the concept of a all-purpose Varmit Rifle
is alot like the all-around Big Game Rifle, if
your hunting is diverse, one rifle will leave you lacking in some situations & not just because of the cartridge, but the optics needed
for different situations & other things become
factors. If not, we could just get a 30-06 for
Big Game & a 223 for Varmits & be done with it.
To me, rifle selection is application driven.
I like to have a specialized load with each rifle & know exactly what to expect with that
rifle, but some people like a variety of loads
with each gun. Different strokes for different folks. Right now for Varmits I use the following: 17hmr/little stuff up close
22Mag/little stuff up close while small game hunting.
.223 Super 14/ because I can
.223 RRA Varmiter/groundhogs, all volume varmit shooting & coyotes to 300 or so yd
22/250 Rem Var. Syn./ Varmits out to
500 yards or under good conditions somewhat
further.
25-06AI Sendero/ Varmits way out there or very windy conditions w/125gr. ULD
These work for me but maybe not for you.
My point is they all have their place & have the loads & optics to handle certain chores. I
have used many other Varmit guns in the past, especially 223's, 22/250's & 1 220 Swift Ruger
& have shot Varmits with Big Game rifles up to
300 Wea. I only have 30 years experience, not 40
years, but for sure not a beginner. The good side of that is I guess is that I may be younger.

I am looking at getting a 204 Barrel for my Encore, probably a custom barrel so that I can get a 1-10 twist for the 40GR, but when I do, it
will be another niche gun like my others, I SEE
NO NEED TO GET EMOTIONAL ABOUT A WONDER GUN, BUT
TO EACH HIS OWN.

I'll repeat...

quote:

Originally posted by Brad:
Arguing this shit is like arguing over which is the better plane, a Super Cub or 747. For a flight to Milan, I'll always take the 747. For landing on a Forest Service strip in the Bob Marshall I'll always take the Cub. Guess what, they're both airplanes and are equally fantastic. They're just not designed for the same purposes, even though they both have flight in common!

A NA big game hunter can easliy get by with one rifle. On the other hand, Varmint shooting is more specialized than nearly any other type of "hunting." On a prarie dog shoot I'd always rather have the 204 as it has little muzzle jump and a guy can call his own shots. On a yote I'd rather have the swift... it pushes a heavy bullet faster. As an all-arounder I'd rather have a 22-250... serious varminters, however, should be like golfers, having more than one club.

Me, I'm not a serious varminter anymore and use a 30-06 or 22lr... a complete pagan I know...

I love both of these rounds and they each have their place, which does overlap a bit. However, it is clearly easier and less expensive to MAKE a rifle with excellent accuracy in the 204. Once you start shooting on a regular basis, the 204 bbl will last longer...the expansion ratio of the 220 is 46% higher than the 204.

...and a 747 burns more fuel BUT climbs higher, goes further and carries more!

Ahhhh, the smell of napalm in the morning! LOL

Well my dad can beat up your dad...........NO my dad can beat up your dad!!!!! ect.ect......ect.........jeezz quite a pissin match you guys got going, anyway it doesn't really matter cuz my 30 carbine shoots way flatter and faster than your 204/220 does anyway

Hell, some of you anti 204 people are just as bad as Varmint Guy if not worse and very few of you have open minds, I think alot of you have tunnel vision and cannot see the overall picture.

The 220 swift and 22-250 are great rounds but would burn out barrels too fast for me, I can also do without the noise they make, give me the 204 ruger anyday and If I was hunting game that the 204 couldn't handle then i'de step up to the 243 without hesitation.

For anyone who hasn't seen it before , here is a sight with heaps of good info on the 204.

http://www.204ruger.com/index.htm

quote:

like arguing over which is the better plane, a Super Cub or 747.

Why the Cub of course!

I doubt that any of us started out as "anti 204" folks but rather were made into that ilk by the in-your-face aggression of the pro 204 people. Kinda like the Barnes bullet people. As I said earlier, some folks can't just tell you the good points of their rifle, they've got to bad mouth your rifle in the process. Just from reading this thread, I doubt that I will ever buy a .204.

iwzbeeman,
I know how you feel. The only mature thing to do with this post was to bury it 2 or 3 pages ago.
It's not the cartridge, it's some people and their over eagerness to beat the .204 drum.
I've never met a cartridge that I didn't like. There are a few rifles that I don't ever want to shoot again! But the cartridges are all good and whether or not we find them useful or not is a personal thing.
Among all the stuff that I own is a new .204 Ruger. I bought it to replace a .223 I sold some time ago. I also bought it because I beleive that everyone that likes to shoot should own a "fun" gun in the varmit catagory, regardless of headstamp.
I hope you get the opportunity to pull the trigger on a .204 some day. It isn't magic, but it is fun. Then you can make up your own mind.
Have a great New Year. BT53

quote:

Why the Cub of course!

Dan, ya always give me a smile!

Jwzbeeman & Aggiedog: I laughed so hard when I read your posts I had tears in my eyes!
I doubt that you meant them to be funny - what made me laugh was your idiotic statement that you won't ever buy a Rifle in the wonderful 204 Ruger cartridge because you think someone "bad mouthed" your Rifle on a computer thread!!!
You have demonstrated most perfectly and hilariously the old adage "cutting off your nose - to spite your face"!
If you could only "hear" how stupid you two sound!
I am laughing again.
Long live the wonderful 204 Ruger!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Blacktail53: Are you saying its somehow "over eager" to point out a superior trajectory and a ballistic fact or two!
Is "over eagerness a sin? Or a reason to automatically discount facts? Make your point with some facts and rational observations if you don't mind.
I do disagree with you also on this point - the 204 Ruger IS a magical cartridge and it does perform way out of proportion to its size. Both ballistically AND lethality wise!
Come on you characters come up with some valid criticisms or facts regarding Cummins Cowboys declaration or admit you have none.
Don't slip down to Jerry Edens level and show you asses! Come up with proof to contradict him or quit slinging your childish hash.
Long live the Magical 204 Ruger! He-he.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

quote:

The only mature thing to do with this post was to bury it 2 or 3 pages ago.

Im moving on, thanks

dartfreak8: Here is another thing I have learned in the last 40 years, a few people - maybe including you, have closed minds and minds filled with ideas based not on reality but on what "seems" real.
Want some reality - then go back and read the initial posting on this thread and OPEN YOUR mind to that!
You would be better off doing so.
Also try to absorb this into your mushy mellon. The flatter a Rifle shoots ADDS to a Riflemans ability to make hits on targets and on game. If you can't comprehend this then you have problems that perhaps will take many years in the field and on ranges that can't be rectified here.
Sorry about that.
You are the one not making sense dartfreak8, get some more years of experience and observation under your hat band and things will seem clearer to you, at least I hope they will.
I will repeat here once again, for your soggy noodles - all things being equal the 223 Remington is more ACCURATE than equally equipped 22-250's and 220 Swift's!
Simple enough for you so far - I hope!
Now once you (or a more experienced shooter probaly would be better!) takes "A" more accurate Rifle out in the field if that more accurate Rifle also has a flatter trajectory and better wind bucking ability then the experienced shooter will make more hits!
This is the point of my appraisal of and praise for the 204 Ruger - splendidly accurate AND splendidly flat and straight shooting.
If you find yourself getting a headache dartfreak8 trying to comprehend this simple set of facts then seek medical attention it may be a tumor.
State specifically what you feel is crap there dartfreak8 and I will either set you straight (correct you) or concur with you whichever is appropriate. But don't try to distort what I say - you won't have any luck at that either.
Long live the Magical 204 Ruger!
Don't sell your 22-250 dartfreak8 UNTIL you understand WHY you would want a better ballistically performing cartridge - like say.. the 204 Ruger! He-he.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Blacktail53: You are admitting then that Cummins Cowboys and mine contentions have won out over your tripe!
I thought so.
I'll ask you again - does "eagerness" some how, in your mind, discount facts and reality regarding ballistic and trajectory matters?
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

HP Shouter: Please state which of my facts figures and experiences you find untruthful.
In public - and now - like A MAN would.
Don't refer back to some previous posting where I publicly whipped your ass also and make AMBIGUOUS statements or spout off goofy challenges!
Bring up ANYTHING I have stated here or anywhere else and prove me wrong! See if you can recoup any of your dignity by doing that mature and manly thing.
I bet you can't AND won't. He-he.
Or keep your low powered ass quiet.
He-he.
You are almost "to easy".
Long live the Magical 204 Ruger!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

According to the laws of physics, if both bullets were traveling at the same velocity, and had the same bc, then they will shoot the same regardless of weight. So...one could conclude that if you could get something with a high bc, like a 6.5mm, to go 4000fps, then it would be considered a flatter shooter than a swift or 204 at the same speed.

So...again you could conclude, they are virtually the same, one happens to be a 20, and one happens to be a 22. The only difference is the 22 has more kinetic energy. What am I missing here?

aren't yall just shooting at big rats anyway?

first who cares, shoot what you want to shoot and go get laid instead of typing on a computer crabbing at everybody with your hand in your pants! this is why sows eat thier young
long live savage

Dan, come to think of it, I too prefer the cub... it's a better varminting rig and truly one of the great planes for yote control in which case a Benneli is better than the 204 or Swift...

Long live the 12 ga!

I just want to know one thing....

How old are all of you????

I have been reading these forums off and on since the 23rd of November 2002. I only have around 230+ posts....

You guys want to know why????

Because I was in college learning but also getting laid, thats what I was doing with my time (instead of being on the computer).....

The reason I was wondering about your age is that I had a few other questions.

When you get older does arguing on the internet get you off??

Is arguing on the internet better than sex???

From the amount you guys are arguing, I think it does....

Now if you do have a problem (For you older gentlemen such as Getting the big E) There are products to help you out. I have also heard (from friends) that there is some good porn out there on the internet .....You guys might to check that out. People argue less and are more relaxed after sex. Some of you might want to try it...

I just hope that in 30 years I will not be turning on my computer instead of turning on my wife.

Not trying to get a rise out of anyone .

Just wanted to have some fun in the new year!!!!

I actually heard that the guys who visit the "Big Bore Forum" are just there to compensate.

I actually had some good one liners.

varmintguy, I may be a lot of things but stupid isn't one of them. My definition of stupid is a vomitous twit like you that doesn't know when to shut up. And thus, from my lips to your ears, "fuck you".

quote:

Originally posted by VarmintGuy:
HP Shouter: Please state which of my facts figures and experiences you find untruthful.
In public - and now - like A MAN would.
Don't refer back to some previous posting where I publicly whipped your ass also and make AMBIGUOUS statements or spout off goofy challenges!
Bring up ANYTHING I have stated here or anywhere else and prove me wrong! See if you can recoup any of your dignity by doing that mature and manly thing.
I bet you can't AND won't. He-he.
Or keep your low powered ass quiet.
He-he.
You are almost "to easy".
Long live the Magical 204 Ruger!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

You are about as pathetic as someone can get, basing your self-worth on some internet argument.....

Arguing on the internet is like the special olympics. You're still a retard, even if you win.

Congrats, VarmintRetard, you win:

quote:

Arguing on the internet is like the special olympics. You're still a retard, even if you win.

Congrats, VarmintRetard, you win:

Now that's funny,right there. I don't care who you are....that's funny.

OK. Now for my kick at an already dead and rotted horse.

As per the original post: Who's still running around backward puking 50 grainers out of a Swift at 3950 fps. I'm shooting a book-spec charge of 3031 and getting 4080 at 15 feet. They will consistently run in the high .4's and .5's (5 shots at 100) from my Mark I 77V. I don't know how this load compares, ballistically, to the revered .204. Honestly I couldn't give shit. What else do you want from a vermin exploder?? The last new, snot-nosed thing I bought was a 7-STW. But it could show me something I couldn't see with what I already had. No pox on your 204 Wooger. But there's a Swift in my house that's been here for years and will be here (alone) for a lot more years.

Dogcatcher22: What are you missing, slowly re-read the info posted above. I know theres a lot but pay special attention to the parts where the 204 uses about 20 grains less powder than a 220 Swift, has NO recoil, allows one to spot their own hits, heats barrels much slower, is (in my experience) more accurate than the big cased 22's, has a flatter trajectory, has less wind drift and IS very lethal once a person strikes small game and Varmints (apparently even large Kangaroos according to one poster!).
This is the short version of what you were missing.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Does anyone have a good 40 grain load that they like.

Thanks,

Snapper

jwbzweenyman: You must be without any meritorious argument to the facts and figures posted here as you have joined your immature to the point of being premature, brother in arms, low power shouter!
Neither of you two characters has the intelligence OR the tamarity to mount an argument based on facts or experiences.
I relish showing you two chumps up for what you are! He-he!
I did not say you were stupid I said it was idiotic (therefore implying you are an idiot!) for stating you will never buy a Rifle in the wonderful 204 Ruger Ruger caliber BECAUSE someone said something you disagree on a computer thread - but can't prove it wrong!
I will repeat - that is idiotic to the point of being hilarious! Therefore you and others may infer that YOU are hilarious as well as idiotic and immature.
To bad that!

low power shouter: Your use of a picture showing an obvious Downs Syndrome afflicted person to try to berate someone with is a very profound self admission of how sick and immature you are!
I could not have berated you more than what you have done to yourself - if I tried!
Now, I will try.
You are sick and immature and bereft of any ability to defend yourself and your contentions!
Your only way to try and best your position over another persons position is to make fun of Downs Sundrome folks! Where is your head at low power?
You are pathetic as well as immature and unmanly!
If you had any pride or decency you would apologize to any and all folks with Downs Syndrome who visit this board or who have Downs Syndrome afflicted relatives and loved ones!
You have shown your TRUE colors with this latest imbecilic posting low power shouter!
You really have!
By the way low powered one, WHO ARE YOU to assess the "worth" of anyone let alone me? Do you have some magical power to ascertain over the internet the "personal worth" of people?
With your latest infantile and ill mannered posting you have made quite a defining comment PUBLICLY on your worth!
And you appear to be "worthless" low power shouter.
You should be ashamed of yourself.
Long live the Magical new 204 Ruger!
It performs way out of proportion to its size!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Strut 10: Okay if you insist on hot-rodded figures then also go with some of the folks who have turned in 4,400 FPS+ loads with their 204's.
Again the Swift gets bested along with all the other factory 22's.
My advice, load only to factory maximums! For to many reason to list here!
There are other factors also Strut 10 that you have apparently chosen to disregard if you got this far in this entertaining thread!
How about 20 grains less powder per shot with the 204?
How about not only less recoil but virtually no recoil from the 204?
How about better accuracy with the 204?
How about less barrel heat with the 204?
Any thoughts on 20 grains or so less powder extending barrel life of the 204 compared to the Swift - does that interest you?
I know it interests a whole bunch of Varmint and small game shooters I know!
Remember a trip to the Riflesmith for a new barrel (on your Swift!) is about a four hundred dollar bill anymore! So barrel life on Rifles is a big concern to me!
I am not saying the 204 will have the longest barrel life of any small caliber Rifle but I am SURE it will be longer than your Swift! Or any of the many Swift Rifles I own and shoot for that matter!
I do not fully understand your reference to the 7mm STW? Is it a "small caliber" cartridge? No I don't think so.
Is it often used in applications where a 220 Swift and/or a 204 Ruger IS commonly used? Again no.
Are you saying that you got suckered once into buying a 7mm STW when someone professed it was the cats meow and you will never try another NEW cartridge for the rest of your life?
I had nothing to do with 7mm STW's when they were new or now that they have been around a while! At ALL!
But I am professing the Magical new 204 Ruger as being a SPLENDID small caliber cartridge and it performs way out of proportion to its size!
Thanks for not putting a "pox" on the 204 Ruger - but to tell the truth I am pretty sure the 204 Ruger IS doing and WILL do just fine whether you tried to pox it or not!
I know, I have shot my 204's quite a bit now.
I hope you consider the attributes of the 204 Ruger that I have relisted for you to consider. And especially for those (YOU) who "want MORE from a Vermin exploder"!
I think these attributes of the 204 are very worthy of yours and everyones unbiased consideration.
Also this Strut10 - aahhh.. how can I put it?
Your parents should have raised you a little better in this regard - it is poor form and bad manners to laugh at or try to make fun of "retarded folks" and folks who participate in Special Olympics.
Simply immature this crude thing you have done.
Perhaps you should modify your post?
Long live the Magical 204 Ruger!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

strut10, and hpshooter,
This is one time where I actually have to agree with VarmintGuy on something.
You 2 really should edit your above posts that make fun of mentally disabled people. It is in very bad taste, shows bad manners, and very immature.

HP Shooter and Strut10,

By all indications, the individual in the picture has Down’s Syndrome. It is a trisomy of the 21st, and sometimes the 22nd chromosome. It is a genetic defect that affects approximately 1 in 1000 births. Individuals with this genetic defect have cognitive and developmental disabilities, although they still develop (like normal individuals) according to their ability and environment. THEY ARE NOT RETARDED.

Individuals with disabilities do not ask for, or require your pity. They deserve your respect as any other person does.

Jim