This might be old news around her but I thought it was quite interesting. Looks like a lot of fun to me. I also noted that some folks were having some ejection issues and not many were keeping their cheek weld anywhere close with the stock while cycling the action.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59jQs2FkqIE

WOW!! Too scary! I'm embarrased for those guys. Pathetic reloading, speed, safety? Comical except that most of them were dangerous to themselves and bystanders. Some of them could barely move!

Were these professionals or tourists?

I'd like to shoot that course with the 505 or 550 Gibbs. If it was supposed to be veldt conditions, why aren't they using a cartridge belt? You can tell DR guys set it up, that shoot two and reload is why my 550 Gibbs holds three in the magazine and one in the chamber. It's Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom reload, not Boom-Boom find some more rounds on the table, reload.

It really did look like a hoot to be a part of.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

That does look like alot of fun except I sure wouldn't want anyone video taping me under pressure like that. Every flaw you have would be exposed mechanical or physical and I believe that is the whole idea behind this course. Looks like a great setup. I would like to try it a few times first before the taping started.

Go to a combat shotgun or three gun match in your area and see how it's supposed to be done. The type of weapon doesn't matter - having a clue does.

I thought a couple of them moved pretty good.

That could be duplicated for bubba shoots...

rolling tires...

targets on pulleys...

What do you think would be the best DG safari course?

No, at bubba shoots the only position allowed is "lawn chair".

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
No, at bubba shoots the only position allowed is "lawn chair".

LMAO... when we are shooting at 200 yard water bottles (12ozers) or farther, we had a habit of using the "field" rests... which usually means using the chair as a rest...

LMAO.. and I am probably the most guilty of it!

oh my!!!
Looks like a cross between hooligan's alley, idpa, and a PH shoot...

WOW that looks like fun!

The course actully looks like it would be a lot of fun. Watching the video gets the gears turning thinking of something I could put together for my own practice shoots.
The video would have been much more entertaining if they showed someone really smoke that course.

I wish they had ranges like this around here,where you can shoot standing at various targets.

I would love to participate in a course such as this. Looks like the scoped rifles were at a decided disadvantage at those ranges......JMHO.

Looks like a bunch of guys out having a good time to me.

Doesn't anyone work the bolt from their shoulder anymore?

That course looks like it would be fun....

A learning experience anyway....

Some looked better than others...

The guy that fell (with a round in the chamber I assume) scarred me the most...

I think the optimal weapon would be a Marlin 1895CB 45-70. You would never have to reload (9+1), the cycle time is faster than any bolt action, and all the power you would ever need for dangerous game .

quote:

I think the optimal weapon would be a Marlin 1895CB 45-70. You would never have to reload (9+1), the cycle time is faster than any bolt action, and all the power you would ever need for dangerous game .

Perfect for punching paper that looks like DG.....LOL!

The rolling tires was pretty cool, they should have rolled them at the shooters to recreate a charge situation, a miss and the tire would roll into you.

If I had been the cameraman and the guy fell on his butt and pointed that loaded bigbore straight into the camera I would have quit. Right after I counted my blessings.

quote:

Originally posted by Oregon45:
Doesn't anyone work the bolt from their shoulder anymore?

That is what I noticed and it appeared that some had ejection problems, not extraction problems but it appeared some had to reach into the loading port and pull the spent case out. And this on a dangerous game rifle?

Sure looks like it would be a fun course to run, though!

One of the clubs here has "warhorse shoots". Basically any Military bolt action rifle is allowed. You shoot offhand from chairs at 100yrds-600 yrds. It's hard as hell! Timed fire and no spotters. I had a blast. With a DGR that would have been even more fun. BTW, If you know how you can shoot a 1903 springfield just slightly slower than a MG in aimed fire. It takes a fair amount of practice but it really does work.-Rob

quote:

WOW!! Too scary! I'm embarrased for those guys. Pathetic reloading, speed, safety? Comical except that most of them were dangerous to themselves and bystanders. Some of them could barely move!

Were these professionals or tourists?

We're still waiting for your video....

I wish we could do stuff like that at ranges over here! Those rolling targets are a great use for old tires. I bet that gets the adrenaline pumping when you're done; it probably also helps you realize just what kind of shot under pressure you really are.

Looks like some guys having good fun, many of us need to video ourselves to fine tune our reloading and shooting techniques.

quote:

Originally posted by kayaker:

quote:

WOW!! Too scary! I'm embarrased for those guys. Pathetic reloading, speed, safety? Comical except that most of them were dangerous to themselves and bystanders. Some of them could barely move!

Were these professionals or tourists?

We're still waiting for your video....

So you were the guy who slipped on his ass!?!?

That looks like way too much fun not to have us locals shooting also. I think that when your shooting for times like that Murphy gets involved big time. Your probably better off taking a bit more time and a bit more care.
Looks like great fun and a fun bunch
Dave

No...I just think that finding it 'pathetic' and 'comical' is turgid.....

Its obvious that its a bunch a guys who like to get together and shoot their BB's and have a social, not out to prove their cyber legitimacy by being perfect...

The only unsafe thing was the slip and muzzle pointed at the camera...an accident. We have all at one point or another accidently pointed a muzzle in the wrong direction, even with the utmost attention to safety, haven't you? We can unfortunately only reduce the occurence of accidents by being aware and engaged, not rule them out completely.

they didn't have any tannerite.... ... a dangerous waterjug shoot is not complete without it!!!!!!

That absolutely looked like a hoot!! Makes me 2nd guess a scope on my Ruger Alaskan, though.
I love action shoots like this. Not a lot of DG here in NH, tho!

We definately need something like that here!

That looks like a well.......BLAST.

Need some small cable and old tires. Looks like absolute fun!!

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
I'd like to shoot that course with the 505 or 550 Gibbs. If it was supposed to be veldt conditions, why aren't they using a cartridge belt? You can tell DR guys set it up, that shoot two and reload is why my 550 Gibbs holds three in the magazine and one in the chamber. It's Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom reload, not Boom-Boom find some more rounds on the table, reload.

It really did look like a hoot to be a part of.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

I like the Mandatory reload part it teaches good skills. Some were 1 and reload, 2 and reload. Not just how to empty a high capacity magazine. If it's Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom-Boom reload what happens do you put a extended mag on your 505. Just kidding Rich.
Yes it was a little scary with the guy falling down with a loaded rifle and not keeping it pointed in a safe direction. The way to make it safer would be to run it like the Cowboy action shooting stages where moving is required. You have a shooting box and you can’t load till you are in the box. Yes you might have to tweak some of the stages but it would be fun to try. Safety must be #1!!!
Pegleg I am not sure those were ejection problems. What I think you were seeing was bad habits of catching the fired brass so it didn’t fall on the ground. This is why you need to shoot practice like it was the real thing. Obviously this could get you hurt if you were facing dangerous game.
This match looks like it would be great practice. I have always felt match pressure is as close to the pressure to perform in the field. If you don’t think so let me stand behind you with a timer and give the command “SHOOTER READY?â€
Bill

It is interesting that this same video, which was produced by a fellow AR participant, when posted on the African Hunting forum, got rave reviews.

And, I think, nary a deprecating comment.

Les

This topic is quite a bummer like Lhowell, said I posted it on African hunting and the worst said was asking why the guys don't reload from the shoulder.

I was the cameraman and produced this video clip. Yes the guy who fell Katte did have the muzzle pointing at me but it was an accident and that is why the shoot is so important. Have you ever fell with your rifle and checked where the muzzle is pointing while falling ? Now Katte knows his mistake. His right hand was never close to the trigger on the fall.

I would honestly like everyone to try this themselves and record yourself you will be surprised what you will see.

As for the loading procedures it gives you practise, practise to reload while under pressure.

The shoot was a hoot and a lot of fun and they want to start a proper chapter in the US so rather get it going and try it yourself you will not be dissapointed. Rather than posting comments that could happen to anyone. Have fun

Looked like a lot of fun to me, and a good opportunity to learn how to better use your rifle under pressure.

Much more satisfying than those silly .38 Super race guns...

Rick,

Ouch!

(Could it be that this is much more your "game" than the pistol thing?)

Exercise under time pressure is always worthwhile. I think the IPSC thing helped when there was a real time issue in the field and a moving target that could bite back.

That looks like a lotta fun and some very good practice too.

Guys, how nice to see such warm debate about our association!
I am the (recently appointed) Marketing Co-ordinator for The Big Bore Assoc. of Southern Africa, and would like to shed some background info about what you see on this video.
This 6 minute film condenses a tiny fraction of what a typical BASA shoot day comprises and who we are.

I will not dwell on specifics here: for that go to http://www.bigbore.org/

What is important to know is that we are a home for ALL enthusiasts of big-bore shooting and try to create the nearest possible dangerous game situations at every shoot. We rely on a host of experience from active PHs, outfitters and hunting concession owners, to highly respected and experienced hunters, authors and especially the last remaining "living legends" of Africa's golden era of hunting & safari.
Every shoot is a massive learning curve for the participant as well as the course designers. We never exactly repeat a course, and there are no 2nd chances. You live or die by your first score just as in real DG hunting!

To answer 2 specific issues that this forum raises:

1) The issue of not recycling from the shoulder is a matter of debate in a real DG situation. One of our most respected members and retired PH with masses of experience, Ian MacFarlane wrote an article for our Dec 07 journal where his closing paragraph states "I realised that shoulder recycling is a good idea if shooting against the clock at a target that can't bite you, but I have doubts about it's effectiveness in the bush" To learn further from such respected legends you can join us and find out what are myths and what are facts.
Big Bore Association of SA
2) Mention is made on the forum of the "bad" habit of catching falling brass. At the same shoot where this footage was taken, I was privy to a conversation between 3 legendary "old timers", Ian MacFarlane, Richard Harland and Fred Everett (Pen name, Ra Da Phiri, author of "Heat, Thirst & Ivory" and "Tuskers in the Dust" who started professionally ivory hunting aged 12!)They stated that the worst thing about auto ejectors is that there is no sound like brass hitting stony ground to get an angry elephant to home in on you. Makes you think? Join us to learn from such old timers.

We have access to the most respected data on loading large, obscure cartridges. Pierre van der Walt, our journal editor is author of The International Big-Bore Cartridge Load Data Collection and we have regular contributions from many respected authors.

What we need is support and membership to spread the pleasure of being addicted to recoil

Anyone wanting further information can visit our website or contact me directly at stephen@thegrillmaster.co.za

Stephen Palos
Randfontein, South Africa

I am impressed by the overwhelmingly positive comments about BASA on this thread. BASA shoots indeed are great fun and a offer immense learning opportunities.
Some of the comments. Based on decades of experience the SA National Parks Board teaches all its elephant culling rangers not to keep their cheeks welded to the butt during cycling. Richard Harland formerly of the Zimbabwean Parks Board and one of the most experienced elephant hunters in the world is vehemently opposed to keeping cheeck on stock during bolt cycling.
Let me put it this way - the most experienced elephant hunters in the world do not keep cheecks welded to butt for reasons of visibility of attacks from all sides, visual confirmation of feeding and numerous other reasons. Nuff said.
Insofar as slipping and safety is concerned. Indeed that is something that always needs attention and something BASA addresses during every post-shoot analyses. Falling is a reality of African hunting. You will notice that a lot of movement of the shooter is required under circumstances forcing him to focus on target and not at footing. Not so long ago one of the most experienced Africa PH's, Johan Calitz nearly died when he stepped into a grown-over hole during a charge. He not only broke his leg, but was badly mauled. Part of the BASA exercise is to create awareness and safety. The object of the excercise is to undergo the stress and learn from it as was the case with the shooter that fell. The only people who do not make mistakes are those who do not do anything. More was learnt from being there, doing it and making the mistake, than never having been there. Again - experience comes not from criticism, but being subjected to it during experience gaining. It is really hard being there and doing it all right, but that is how we prepare for the real situation.
Ejection. BASA Shoots also are the events where we bring our new rifles and torture test them to see what works and what not. That is where problems are eliminated. Very few rifles shooting reliably from a bench stand up to the BASA Shoots from the word go. There is a purpose behind all this and you may think you have a reliable rifle until your brought it to a BASA Shoot. The bolt that gave a little hitch was a new .416 Rigby. If the double ejections were considered hick-ups it shows ignorance. They were extractor models and the guys are practicing clearing technques.
Reloading. The shoots are deliberately set up to force competitors to develop reloading and other skills. That is how you survive in a crisis - with automatic, muscle memory ingrained skills. It is one thing to have three shots if they worked. It is another matter altogether when you shot two elephant in four seconds and then find the angry herd coming at you in the jesse. That is not the time to realize that you need a lot of reloading experience. Get it on the range.

I personally enjoyed the video and wish we had something like it here. Stephen, many thanks for the info. It looks like great fun! To the critics: When we see your level of proficiency you can then criticize, otherwise please keep the negative comments to yourself.