quote:

Originally posted by Wink:
Since I've already got a rifle in .375 H&H, why would I buy a .375 Ruger?

Particularly since, for all practical purposes, .375 Ruger ammunition is unavailable in Africa...

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
let me know where in Africa the shops stock Ruger 375/416 ammunition...

Rich

You won't find 375/404 UAE Express ammo ANYWHERE in Africa, but Saeed's two rifles have managed to whack over 800 head of African critters in the last 15 years.

Yeah, right! When's the last time you saw Emirates Air Lines lose a prince's luggage? Gimmie a break!

quote:

Originally posted by jetdrvr:

Particularly since, for all practical purposes, .375 Ruger ammunition is unavailable in Africa...

yeah.. and at one time, the 458 lott wasn't there.. 460 weatherby... 416 rem .. .

in fact, there's NO certainty of ammo anywhere, is there?

and let's face it, 99% of all shots are taken on your home ground.

quote:

and let's face it, 99% of all shots are taken on your home ground.

Because of circumstances beyond my control, I recently arrived in Tanzania for a ten day buff/PG hunt with 20 rounds of H&H softs and four solids. That turned out to be enough, barely, but there was plenty of spare .375 H&H ammo in camp. As luck would have it, there wasn't a single round of .375 Ruger to be had anywhere, should someone have needed it. The .375 H&H will be the medium bore caliber of choice in Africa for quite some time to come. The Ruger is a good caliber. It's an American caliber and will remain so for many years.

Hornady loads the .375 Ruger the same way they load the .375 H&H Heavy magnum loads. That is, with proprietary propellants and loading methods. Tested out of 24" barrels you'll get the following:

.375 Ruger/300 grain - 2660 fps.
.375 H&H Heavy magnum/300 grain - 2705 fps
.375 Ruger/270 grain - 2840 fps
.375 H&H Heavy magnum/270 grain- 2870 fps.

I don't know what all the hype is about the better performance of the Ruger over the H&H. It's the way they load the ammunition.

Having said this, I think the Ruger rifle/cartridge setup is one of the best I have seen for years and I am seriously looking into the .416 Ruger in the Alaskan Hawkeye. This may be the best combination for dangerous game I have ever seen. Anyone here tried the .416 setup? If so, how do you like it?

Thanks

jfm

If those are advertised factory figures, you can subtract 100 fps across the board.

here's the proof gentlemen
http://www.realguns.com/archives/144.htm

in ALL CASES, the ruger is a larger capacity and higher velocity, with a 23" barrel vs a 25" 375 hh.

Jeffeoso, you state that in all cases the Ruger has higher velocity than the H&H. Did you really read the article?
This partial paragraph is right under the ballistics charts on part II of the article.

"As a points of reference, Hornady Heavy Magnum 270 grain 375 H&H ammo checked out at 2907 fps. Pretty stout stuff from a factory box. Hornady factory 270 grain 375 Ruger ammo ran 2850 fps, good news for non-handloaders".

I'm not trying to make a big deal out of this. What I was trying to say earlier is that these two are ballistic twins the way Hornady loads the Heavy magnum stuff in the H&H and the normal loading of the Ruger stuff.

Anyway, there would be no difference in either in the hunting fields.

Now, what about the .416 Ruger?
Anyone tried it?

Thanks,

jfm

quote:

Originally posted by jfm:
Hornady loads the .375 Ruger the same way they load the .375 H&H Heavy magnum loads. That is, with proprietary propellants and loading methods. Tested out of 24" barrels you'll get the following:

.375 Ruger/300 grain - 2660 fps.
.375 H&H Heavy magnum/300 grain - 2705 fps
.375 Ruger/270 grain - 2840 fps
.375 H&H Heavy magnum/270 grain- 2870 fps.

I don't know what all the hype is about the better performance of the Ruger over the H&H. It's the way they load the ammunition.

Having said this, I think the Ruger rifle/cartridge setup is one of the best I have seen for years and I am seriously looking into the .416 Ruger in the Alaskan Hawkeye. This may be the best combination for dangerous game I have ever seen. Anyone here tried the .416 setup? If so, how do you like it?

Thanks

jfm

Game doesn't notice any difference until it gets over 100 - 150 fps between 2 loads and even then it would be marginal until you get distance involved.

A little bit flatter trajectory but is it that important ?

jfm - The Ruger 375 can be loaded faster than the H&H, everything else equal, simple maths... But not very much...

jfm - by the way. another thing:
I am not sure taht the 375 Ruger is loaded with their "heavy magnum" technology / powder. First - it is not written anywhere, second - It is difficuly (very!!) to duplicate the performance of Hornadys Heavy Magnum ammo in 375 H&H when handloading that caliber - with acceptable pressures..
But the factoryammo in the 375 Ruger is easily duplicated by handloading. Actually I can exceed it by a small amount - and that is in my 20" Alaskan rifle.. For me no doubt - the 375 Ruger is a better construction/efficient design, and it is my preference in the furtue when selecting a 375. Still I will keep my H&H because it has more nostalgia...

With the .375 Ruger, I've got pretty near to "factory" velocities in my ALaskan, from what was quoted as African velocities.

There isn't any voodoo here...You can handload the .375 Ruger to it's factory ammo velocities, easy.

And they are just about the same velocities or a bit more than H&H velocities...

No voodoo, no special powders, nothing...As if 100fps is gonna make a huge difference ANYWAY???

I guess I am more of a traditionalist. When looking at all the options on a big bore, I couldn't afford a double so I put a 416 Rigby in the gun safe. I chose it mainly due to better availability of ammo in Africa. And maybe long time hunters like Harry Selby may have had some influence on me. I really do not have much here in Texas to hunt which requires a 416. I pick up my new 375 H&H today, once a again, a traditional rifle, and ammo easy to come by. The 375 ruger is a super gun,, just personal preference on everyones part as to what they want. The 375 in either gun is potent medicine for these feral pigs that are ruining our farms here in Texas.I don't think the 375 ruger will do anything but increase in popularity.

I was told by Steve Hornady that the 375 Ruger is not loaded with the same technique as the HM loads. Their point of creating a new cartridge was to duplicate the long, obsolete H&H case in a beltless round that would fit in a standard length action. The fact that it holds six grains more powder was just a bonus.

.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
methinks not and to date after scrounging around many a gunshop across, BC and Manitoba could not find any 375 Ruger rifles or ammo and as to the 416 Ruger..... most do not know it even exists.

by that silly logic, federal large rifle mag primers are also mythical

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:

quote:

obsolete

375 H&H, obsolete, methinks not

"2. of a discarded or outmoded type; out of date..." http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/obsolete

Thus the 375 H&H is certainly a dated design; a long, tapered case intended for use with a long discontinued propellant, possessing narrow, sloping shoulders and a belt to allow its use in the rifles of its era. Today it's as obsolete as all the cartridges it made unnecessary in its day. That fact does it's long history of success no disservice. Neither does it mean the cartridge will not continue to serve with distinction, likely for as long as the private ownership of firearms and sport hunting is permitted. Is the 375 Ruger a better design for today's rifles, powders, and shooters? Certainly. $0.02 P.S. Me, I'll see if I can't make do with my 376 Steyr...

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:

quote:

obsolete

obsolete |ˌäbsəˈlēt|
adjective

- no longer produced or used; out of date : the disposal of old and obsolete machinery | the phrase was obsolete

375 H&H, obsolete, methinks not and to date after scrounging around many a gunshop across, BC and Manitoba could not find any 375 Ruger rifles or ammo and as to the 416 Ruger..... most do not know it even exists.

Alf, if you are looking for a .375 Ruger in BC, Omineca Source for Sports in Vanderhoof should be able to help. I got a .375 Ruger, ammo and brass through them 2 years ago.

Well, I was told by a friend of mine that the loading process is the same for the Ruger as it was for the Heavy magnum H&H loads. If Steve Hornady says it's different then I will have to believe other than what I was told.
I'll tell you though, I have never loaded my .375 H&H 300 grain loads up any higher than 2600 fps, + or - 25 fps and I feel it's just about right for everything. That this person in the article loads the H&H 300 grainers to 2736 fps and the 350 grainers up to 2405 fps is a real eye opener. I don't believe I would care to try those loads in my gun.
This makes me think. What is the recoil like in those short Hawkeye rifles with the 300 grainers at (factory loaded 2660 fps)?
I would still like to know about the .416 Ruger.
Anybody tried one of them yet?

Thanks for the informative posts you guys.

jfm

the 416 ruger is more or less the same as a 416 rem, but shorter .. my 416 AR is actually a trivial amount larger, and performs amazingly well .. it can break 2500+hornady 400gr pill ..

why more than the rem? IMnsHO, its the shoulder causing a venturi

yeah, but you DID say "thru" them as opposed to "off the rack".
Cabela's in Boise still doesn't have any. They told me if I paid up front they would order one. Ditto with ammunition or dies. They had three different brands of the "obsolete" 375 on the rack and over 500 rounds of ammunition by four different companies.

Rich

I’ve tried with zero success to stay out of this open ended argument.

quote:

quote:

obsolete

obsolete |ˌäbsəˈlēt|
adjective

- no longer produced or used; out of date : the disposal of old and obsolete machinery | the phrase was obsolete

Perhaps better descriptors are needed:

Obsolete (adjective): out-of-date…superseded by something newer, though possibly still in use.

quote:

The roots of the .375 can probably be traced to the 9.5mm Mannlicher-Schoenauer. In 1910, the 9.5mm was known in Great Britain as the .375 Nitro-Express Rimless. The 9.5mm Mannlicher-Schoenauer caused concern with the British gunmakers because of the 9.5mm's popularity in the African market which the British gunmakers viewed as their own. About 1910, the prestigious British firm of Holland & Holland introduced what was probably the first belt-magnum - the .400/.375 which was also known as the .375 Velopex. The .375 Velopex was a short-case magnum which would fit into a standard Mauser Model 98 action, but its downfall was the fact that it fired a 270-grain bullet at 2,175 feet per second. In other words, it was simply not powerful enough. Holland & Holland followed up on the .375 Velopex and in 1912 introduced the .375 Belted Rimless Nitro-Express, or as it is known the world over, the .375 H&H Magnum.
http://webpages.charter.net/375magnum/history.htm

quote:

A truly classic cartridge, the .375 H&H was only the second cartridge ever to feature a belt… It initially used cordite propellant which was made in long strands - hence the tapered shape of this cartridge, which was also to ensure smooth chambering and extraction from a rifle's breech.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.375_H%26H_Magnum
Cordite is a family of smokeless propellants developed and produced in the United Kingdom from 1889 to replace gunpowder as a military propellant…
Cordite is now obsolete and it is no longer produced. However, cordite propellant may still be encountered in the form of legacy ammunition dating from World War II onwards.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cordite

Ok…a cartridge designed to compete with/outperform its competition. So, if I have this correct…In 1912 Holland and Holland had to redesign their first .375 caliber belted cartridge, the .375 Velopex (aka: .400/.375), because it failed to outperform the smaller and more popular 9.5x57mm Mannlicher-Schoenauer.

So in 1912 H&H's newly re-designed .375 cartridge case was driven by the need to fit a sufficient amount of long-strand temperature-sensitive cordite gunpowder so the re-designed cartridge would outperform the smaller and more popular 9.5x57 MS cartridge. …as well as its other British bolt action medium-bore competition:
* .318 Rimless Nitro Express
* .333 Jeffery Rimless Nitro Express
* .350 Rigby Nitro Express
and its continuing German nemesis, the 9.3x62mm Mauser…(I threw this into the mix just for discussions sake).
Hence the need for a long tapered cartridge case the taper of which in conjunction with its severely sloped shoulder required a belt for headspacing.

Had Holland & Holland utilized the small granule smokeless gunpowder of the latest design of the day for the .375 caliber rather than the British’ long-strand cordite gunpowder they’d have met their performance requirements of: a 235-grain bullet at 2,800-2,900fps for light game; a 270-grain bullet at 2,650-2,700fps for medium game; and a 300-grain bullet at 2,500-2,530fps for large and dangerous game…with a shorter cartridge case not requiring a belt for headspacing.

Yes H&H could have designed a rimless beltless case adaption of the semi-rimmed upstart small caliber .280 Rimless Nitro Express Ross (better known as the .280 Ross in Canada and the USA), utilizing a full caliber neck length and a neck to shoulder diameter difference from the very popular .318 Rimless Nitro Express, using loaded cartridge overall length of 3.4” and they’d have designed a very modern looking cartridge with a capacity about ½ grain larger than the current longer belted case that easily fit within the readily available standard length bolt actions of the day! OMG it’d have looked almost exactly like the .375 Ruger!!!

Very interesting how the cartridge market from 1915 through present would have looked had this been the path that H&H had traveled.

Outdated (adjective): superseded by something better, more fashionable, or more technologically advanced.

Yes, I think I got it correctly. So…I guess these two adjectives appropriately describe the .375 H&H.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
what do you have in Orygun to use a 375 on?

Rich

Californians

quote:

yeah, but you DID say "thru" them as opposed to "off the rack".
Cabela's in Boise still doesn't have any. They told me if I paid up front they would order one. Ditto with ammunition or dies. They had three different brands of the "obsolete" 375 on the rack and over 500 rounds of ammunition by four different companies.

Rich

Rich,

I’ve never had to pay upfront for store stocked items without having the merchandise in hand; non-stock items always require upfront payment so that they can keep a percentage of it should you change your mind after the product's been ordered.

Did you perchance ask Cabela’s in Boise if the .375 Ruger and .416 Ruger rifles are stock items for their store? And if they are stock items how long they stayed on the shelves before they sold out?

The 375 Ruger is a good ctg. The 416 Ruger is simply fantastic.

all that, for that?

Anything that is generally conceded to be obsolete no longer performs its function compared to a supposedly newer/better/ competitor. That by the majority of its intended market audience. The only vote here that counts are those who will buy one or the other in the next six months.
The rest of us are, in a manner of speaking, "peeing our pants wearing black levis...". It gives us (personally) a nice warm feeling, but doesn't do much for anyone else.

That said, the ruger has to present as a major improvement over the Holland. The several ways that can be accomplished are:

1. ruger dropping the Holland in its line up. It has only moved the Holland chambering upscale; to a more affluent buyer.
As of this date, the ruger version is in the cheap model.
2. Other companies adopting the ruger chambering in addition to; or dropping the Holland. I will be interested to see at the SHOT Show
in six weeks if Remington or Winchester or Savage or any major manufacturers have done so for 2010.
3. Other ammunition companies picking up the round. Again, the SHOT Show will tell me a lot. At this point, the ruger must be considered
in the same "boutique" category as the Dakota Arms or Lazzeroni cartridge lines.

At this point an objective observer would question if any of the ruger specials will still be in production in five years, let alone bury the Holland. I remember a lot of noise here about the .376 Steyr intended to do the same thing as the ruger. How's that round working out?

I remain skeptical...

Rich

The question is never about the merit of a new cartridge, Rich. Just like there is no such thing as a new melody, there is no cartridge that can be incorporated into existing rifle technology that does something so unique it becomes a "must have" or a hunt will fail.

It is about whether or not it will increase sales and the Ruger rounds are doing that well enough to justify their existence. And for me there is nothing wrong in that; it is still a free country (for now) and people should buy what the think they want regardless of whether their neighbor thinks they should buy it or not.

With CAD and ballistics programs available at the professional level, the cost of developing a new round in cyberspace is nothing compared to the old trial and error methods. CNC machining takes a lot of cost out of tooling up for new brass. So a gun/ammo company can recover cost quickly and show profit sooner than 30 years ago. So why not entertain us with new choices?

My third H&H is a keeper. I also bought a 375 Ruger. This gun was the same weight as my 24" H&H so the H&H with 4 down and powder coating gets to stay. I could not find ammo, brass or dies for the ruger and the H&H is plentiful. I think the Ruger would be very handy if it was lighter and the sights are to die for. I want a set on my 404. If I could get a fluted black Alaskan with a light stock then the 416 Ruger would be in my safe. But when I'm done with my 404 it will be duplication again. I guess I am a classic kind of guy... some days.

Isn't the 416 Ruger Alaskan like 7.75lbs? How light does a 40+ magnum have to be?

Rich,

I can see your points about the ammo and guns coming from other manufacturers....but I wonder, how long is Ruger holding out on the patent? That could really hinder them being available to other guns/ammo producers. IIRC, USRAC held the WSM patents out only for a few years, and then EVERYONE was making them, even Remington after a while. I know for sure you can get a Howa 1500 barreled action in 375 Ruger, but I am not sure if they're making complete rifles. I would assume so, with the Hogue stock most likely. As for the 376 Steyr..it had the performance but had some major manufacturing flaws. For one, its an odd length case. Too long for a short action, too short for a long action. It also has an odd rim size. The Ruger, has the standard .532, and isn't rebated to a bigger case head like the WSM/SAUM/RUM, and its the standard 2.5" case. This means it would be extremely simple for any other gun maker to produce it, or for someone to pick up a used magnum and convert it.

OH, almost forgot, didn't CZ add it to their safari classics line this year too?

quote:

by that silly logic, federal large rifle mag primers are also mythical

That logic isn't so silly, given the paucity of the primers in question...

jfm,
You are full of beans, eh?
Loads can be cooked anyway you want them, home cooking.
Hornady HM .375 H&H loads velocity quote is really flatulent!
As said, subtract 100 fps from claimed.
The .375 Ruger is bigger in case capacity than the .375 H&H. Period.
I have a .375 H&H that weighs 6.75 pounds dry.
It is a Pre-64 Winchester with one-pound stock and skinny 24" barrel (Douglas no.3 sporter).
A similar Brown Precision "Pounder" stock on the .416 Ruger 20"-short-and-fatter-barreled Hawkeye Alaskan rifle would produce a rifle of 6.5 pounds.

A .375 Ruger could be cooked up to weigh in at 6.75 pounds or less, easily. No fart.

DRG says: "Kiss my liberal grits!"

Ruger was able to corner a specific market when Winchester closed the doors and stopped production on the stainless classic.
Those stainless classic's were selling for about $750.00 prior to the shut down.
Ruger seized the opportunity for this niche market with a economical alternative with a new repackaged 375 offering.
If the new "winchester" brings back the stainless classic in 375 H&H at a $800.00 price tag it could give Ruger bean counters some head aches.
Both would be great options for the inclement weather applications but history and availability of ammo globally for the H&H would most likely prevail.
If this happens I suspect the new Ruger offerings will go the way of the 6.5 and 350 Rem mags (Remington 600 & 660). Has anyone thought of a short cartridge / cartridge packege before??? I think someone at Ruger has a Remington 660 and repackaged that concept from 40 years ago. Wide lapels may come back too! Nice cartridges but will not gain main stream status.
I just do not believe the market is large enough to support so many alternatives.
I love my 375 Weatherby but it will most likely be a handload proposition for the main part and will not take market share from the H&H.
If Winchester brings back the stainless classic in 375 H&H. I think you will see Ruger die a slow death in their 375 offering. If not; ?????

EZ

The 375 H&H will be here for a long time. I own
one have never taken it hunting. Always took something else. Not that it couldn't do the job.

RIP, I guess I don't understand your post. I only stated the velocity of what was advertised on the side of the Hornady .375 H&H Heavy magnum box as compared to what was advertised on the side of the .375 Ruger box. The article that Jeffeoso provided advised that the 270 grain .375 H&H Heavy magnum clocked out at 2907 fps whereas I had stated that they clock out at 2870 fps. I don't know if the person who wrote the article was lying or not but if he was then I guess we can assume that he may be adding some fluff to the velocities of the .375 Ruger also. Phil Shoemaker advised that Steve Hornady told him the loading process was different for the Ruger and the Heavy magnum loads. I advised I stood corrected. I also completely agree that if we are handloading, it is a fact that the cartridge case with the larger capacity will have the edge on velocity. Maybe you could explain why I'm full of beans. If it's a good reason then I'll be the first to admit I'm full of beans. Je ne comprend pas.

jfm

quote:

Originally posted by MileHighShooter:
IIRC, USRAC held the WSM patents out only for a few years, and then EVERYONE was making them, even Remington after a while.

I seem to recollect reading in the Short Magnum section of a now defunct forum that quite a few US gunsmiths stopped chambering for the WSM after Jamison won his patent suit against Winchester as they’d have been required to pay Jamison a patent royalty for each barrel they chambered in a WSM cartridge.

No idea why Ruger hasn’t released the .375 Ruger/.416 Ruger to the “trade” per se. Perhaps it relates to a sole manufacturing rights contract with Hornady for the cartridge development and manufacturing. Or perhaps they’re until they’ve first released all future derivatives in the M77 rifles and Hornady has production up and running for the derivatives before releasing to the trade.

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
Ruger was able to corner a specific market when Winchester closed the doors and stopped production on the stainless classic….
If Winchester brings back the stainless classic in 375 H&H. I think you will see Ruger die a slow death in their 375 offering. If not; ?????

EZ

EZ…you may be correct but I don’t believe Ruger is relying upon the African hunting market for the survival of the .375 Ruger/.416 Ruger rifles and cartridges. Seems like many guides and hunters in Alaska really like the carry and use handiness of Ruger M77 Alaskan rifle in either caliber vis-à-vis their previously used .375 H&H Magnum rifle. Might require Winchester to produce a 20” barrel .375 H&H all weather to compete…or maybe they’ll use the tactic of releasing a .375 WSM or .416 WSM in a stainless all weather to compete with the Ruger M77 Alaskan.

I don’t see the .375 H&H or the .375 Ruger/.416 Ruger cartridges dying out anytime soon.

Was that shortmags.org? I miss that site, too bad it went away. There was a lot of good info and some great guys over there. I wonder if that patent law suit went away or something...because every barrel maker and gunsmith webpage I have been on still lists the WSM's including a lot wildcat WSM's. A big bore shorty would be cool, but then you'll get the same arguments we are seeing now...why make a 375 WSM when there is a 375 Ruger? LOL I have seen some date for the 375 and 416, they seem to be RIGHT there with the standards. I see that as even more of an advantage as you're lopping off an inch from the action. And they would work splendidly in a short tube, look at Michael458's B&M series for proof of that.

I still wonder why Ruger decided Howa of all companies was the first one to be allowed to make the 375?? They make great rifles, but they're almost half the cost of a Ruger. Probably figured the big bore nuts would pick the CRF over the PF. Lets see what happens with the rumored new M70 big bores, I think there might be a good chance there will be Ruger chamberings....

quote:

Originally posted by MileHighShooter:
Was that shortmags.org? I miss that site, too bad it went away. There was a lot of good info and some great guys over there.

Yes that is the site; it was merged into their bigger website before going defunct. Definitely would have been nice if financing to fund the site had been forthcoming from somewhere.

quote:

Originally posted by MileHighShooter:
I wonder if that patent law suit went away or something...because every barrel maker and gunsmith webpage I have been on still lists the WSM's including a lot wildcat WSM's. A big bore shorty would be cool, but then you'll get the same arguments we are seeing now...why make a 375 WSM when there is a 375 Ruger? LOL I have seen some date for the 375 and 416, they seem to be RIGHT there with the standards. I see that as even more of an advantage as you're lopping off an inch from the action. And they would work splendidly in a short tube, look at Michael458's B&M series for proof of that.

I never understood why Jamison was able to win the patent lawsuit to begin with as his only distinction from everything that’d been wildcatted up through the 1980’s was a rebated rim size of .532 inches…

Yes FNH potentially could do very well with a big bore(s) short action all weather stainless steel M70 with 20” barrel targeted towards Alaskan and “big” bear hunting; it’d be slightly shorter than the M77 Alaskan and performance would be similar. Would also give a distinction between it and the long action H&H belted derivative cartridges; i.e., long overall rifle vis-à-vis short rifle. And properly done it’d be very usable for DG larger than Alaskan big bears.

Yep Michael’s B&M line is neat and I’m sure that he’d allow FNH to pick it up in their short action M70s without royalties but then I guess they could just pick up every wildcat with the WSM nomenclature without royalty fees as they already own the WSM name.

quote:

Originally posted by MileHighShooter:

I still wonder why Ruger decided Howa of all companies was the first one to be allowed to make the 375?? They make great rifles, but they're almost half the cost of a Ruger. Probably figured the big bore nuts would pick the CRF over the PF. Lets see what happens with the rumored new M70 big bores, I think there might be a good chance there will be Ruger chamberings....

I don’t know that Ruger made the decision; I think it more likely that Howa approached Ruger. Howa, like Ruger during Bill’s life, only chambers other manufacturer’s cartridges lines and there magnum action is a true standard cartridge length action so the .375 Ruger/.416 Ruger cartridges are a natural fit for the Howa action.

I personally believe RemChester will only offer the Ruger cartridges in rifles via their Custom Shops. The M700/M70 are both long action (3.6” magazine) based rifles that require factory blocking to properly function with standard length cartridges and they’re already set up (at least FNH is getting closer) to produce the .375 H&H and .416 Remington in unblocked rifles so doing the Rugers would be an extra cost for them. Now the Remington Model 7 would be a natural for the two RCMs especially as they’ve dropped their SAUM cartridges…but then they already have the manufacturing set up for the SAUM/WSM cartridges so that might mitigate against chambering the RCMs. Winchester…the RCMs compete with the WSMs so that’s not going to happen unless its extra cost via the Custom Shop.

However, the much beloved on AR CZ does offer the .375 Ruger/.416 Ruger in its 550 Express Rifle line. I don’t know if the action is a true standard length action (3.4” magazine) or if it’s a long length action (3.6” magazine) that is factory blocked for standard length cartridges…here’s a link to their website page for their express rifle:
http://cz-usa.com/products/view/express-rifle/
Utopia would be…now that the BRNO brand is fully under the CZ umbrella that we’d see the resurrection of a full line of CRF action lengths available to the consumer: magnum action for the long/jumbo cartridges; long action for the 3.6” cartridges; standard action for 3.4” cartridges; intermediate for the 3.2” cartridges; short for the 3” cartridges; and super short (Kurz) for the little guys. That would definitely open the world of great handling rifles appropriately sized for the chambered cartridge to once again be available to the hunters in modern manufactured rifles at a reasonable price.

So…currently in the year 2009 the .375 Ruger/.416 Ruger cartridges are available in two major brand manufacturer’s CRF feed rifles lines and one minor brand manufacturer’s PF rifle line.

I’d say that’s not too bad for an unnecessary redundant proprietary cartridge designed in 2007 and released to the consumer in 2008. Blossom wilted or dying??? I don’t believe so.

most of the CZ "custom shop" offerings are "build to order", whereas the 375H&H is a standard chambering, and you can find them all over.

Talk to me in five years, when "real people" (read not some writer who got a free trip to shill for ruger) start taking them to Africa and can buy ammunition there. So far, the only people who have taken the shorty are ruger executives and Craig Boddington.

Rich
I got no problem with it, just the lame marketing approach.

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:

Talk to me in five years, when "real people" (read not some writer who got a free trip to shill for ruger) start taking them to Africa and can buy ammunition there. So far, the only people who have taken the shorty are ruger executives and Craig Boddington.

Rich
I got no problem with it, just the lame marketing approach.

If the 375 H&H depended solely on people who took it to Africa it would soon die or become very uncommon.

It is interesting to visit the Hornady agent in Australia after a shipment arrives. All the 375 bullets are there but what is very obvious is the huge number of 220 grain flat points and 225 grain Spire points and you can bet the 220 grainers are not going in 375 Winchester lever guns and the 225 grain Spire points are not going in 376 Steyrs

jfm,
Glad you clarified. I understand. Just a brain fart on my part.
I get gas on the brain whenever anyone says anything superficially disparaging the .375 Ruger.
So, like I always say when I fart out loud: EXCUSE ME! (blush)

Rich,
You, conversely, get brain gas whenever the .375 H&H takes back seat to the .375 Ruger.
Members here have already done well with the .375 Ruger in Africa. Are all their trips sponsored by Ruger or Hornady?
Sign me up for one of those.
As to your comments I say: "I think it was a fart."

Looks like the CZ .375 Ruger, .416 Ruger, and .416 Taylor are on the CZ 550 Medium.
That is a standard length action, not .375 H&H length.

DRG says: "Kiss my liberal grits!"