McMillan+WCC for Sambar-makes perfect sense to me.

quote:

Originally posted by M 98:
mike
im afraid to say this on AR as i will probably get lynched,but the actions are going into mcmillam stocks, actions will be coated with Wcc , and they will be used to sort out a few sambar, do you get the picture
barrels 06 has a kreiger as does the 375 ruger and the 416 ruger is going to wearr a barrel from Dan peterson

In other words, good gear.

The 06 action has been done since Thurday night.

It feeds so slick and smooth. Put a barrel on it Put a stock on it, It's done.

LETS GIT SOME LEAD IN THE AIR.

YEE HAWWWW. HEH HEH HEH. WELL I'LL TELL YA, BAK IN '47.........4/4 BEAT HERE. WHURL WHURL TWIST AND TWURL BUZZ AROUND LIKE A FLYIN SQUIRRL.

Ladies and Gentlemen.............drum roll..Please.

( please insert Wink Martindales voice here)

He's opening the envelope and reading the number
and it says 33 actions produced and delivered since march of 06.

Yes folks thats it,..... only 33.

So how's everything? Is everything tasting ok? yes and I'd like a bit more coffee........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................Timan

mike/trax
but isnt it the unpardable sin to sink a
M 98 into glass...

Sin is an imposed guilt complex invented by distorted Xtians to extort money from folk.....
You know they did a blind test, where they had 6 or so different top end violins played behind a curtain, with 6 or so highly trained pairs of ears on the other side,
none really had a clue which was the Stradivari.
For all I know, they could be playing carbon fibre harps in heaven these days.

TRAX
and there all made in CHINA

quote:

Originally posted by M 98:
mike/trax
but isnt it the unpardable sin to sink a
M 98 into glass...

I like it

M70 not quite the same but D'Arcy Echols Legends are in stocks made for him by McMillan.

Some time ago on one of the American auction sites I saw a full Duane Wiebe rifle and in...wait for it....375 Wby.

There is a quite a bit of mix and match at the expensive end. I am a keen follower of Wby and their custom shop will put out some pretty special stuff and especially the French walnut. Some of those are in 375 H&H.

And there have been some pretty high end wood guns on Rem 700s. Do you remember Bill Hambly Clark. A mate of mine had a 5.6 X 50 fully done by Hambly Clark on a Rem 700 and you would swear on a stack of bibles that the recoil lug grew out of the action.

Ross Waghorn told me once he would like to stock a Wby custom shop barreled action with the Krieger cut barrel and action work and do it in Californian walnut.

So in short, you are walking down a well trodden pathway

If I had the money I would give Wby a blank cheque to do a 404 J and get H&H do a 30/378

Wood or synthetic, really makes no differance, as long as it shoots well.
When I'm pulling the trigger on game, what the stock is made of is the last thing I'm thinking about. By then I'm in the zone, both eyes open. Doing a nice controlled squeeze. Watching for the bullets impact.
ss

quote:

but isnt it the unpardable sin to sink a
M 98 into glass...

Daniel,
I believe the members have granted absolution! From my point of view (functionalist) the difference does not make a rodent's buttocks bit of difference. If you are happy with it, you will shoot better and have a more enjoyable experience. Drive On!

I recently went to the range and watched a friend shoot his new custom .375 H&H with a Granite Mt. action. He was shooting 3 shot groups. The largest was 1/2". The smallest was .060" Granted, you need a lot more than just a good action to get this kind of accuracy. My point is that GMA must be doing something right.
I saw Satterlee's display at SCI a couple of years back. It was nice but certainly nothing outstanding. After seeing the arrogance and childish disdain he has displayed towards his past customers and potential future customers, I would never waste my time let alone my money dealing him.

Hello all,

Here a few facts backed buy real records. My Firearm aquisition and desposition.

108 GMA actions Feed and function and barrels installed at Satterlee Arms by me since 4-02 to 5-09.

That's a lot of favors at $250.00 a pop.

Of course Mike and John Roden are gratefull and I consider them friends.

No matter what happens, I still know what I know. and can make a mauser anytime anyplace on anybodys equipment, practically from memory.

Do you have any idea what that is worth to some?

Who out in the world wants to make a mauser?
lets go lets do it.

your money.
my know how.

So far I've funded this whole thing on less that a 100k a year income.

come on who got any guts.
lets do it.
throw some real coin at this.
I can suit up, can you?

Stuart

I said this before, Stuart - I like the look of your product. However, the approach and attitude you portray online is such a turnoff from a business perspective I wouldn't do it.

Your last post is some chest thumping and then what? a dare to folks to come do business with you? have you noticed echols does not advertise? the reason is because his work speaks for itself while your posts here attempt to speak for your work. there is a fundamental difference between the two approaches; the former gives off and air of quiet confidence while the latter is nothing short of boorish.

Take a leaf from his playbook, Stuart and you may find more people willing to do business with you. Take my post for what its worth - I am speaking to you from the consumer's side of the table. I would not do business with someone who is rude and boastful about their trade and I am sure many others feel similarly no matter how good your actions may be.

quote:

Originally posted by Timan:
Hello all,

Here a few facts backed buy real records. My Firearm aquisition and desposition.

108 GMA actions Feed and function and barrels installed at Satterlee Arms by me since 4-02 to 5-09.

That's a lot of favors at $250.00 a pop.

Of course Mike and John Roden are gratefull and I consider them friends.

No matter what happens, I still know what I know. and can make a mauser anytime anyplace on anybodys equipment, practically from memory.

Do you have any idea what that is worth to some?

Who out in the world wants to make a mauser?
lets go lets do it.

your money.
my know how.

So far I've funded this whole thing on less that a 100k a year income.

come on who got any guts.
lets do it.
throw some real coin at this.
I can suit up, can you?

Stuart

Oh my! More infamy!

Thanks JSL, good advice for me and some things to consider inside myself.
Sincerely,
Stuart

Dear Mr. Satterlee:
I didn't read the thread so I am not on any "side."

I and very impressed by your work and I am curious about approximate deilivery times. How long would you you estimate a barreled action would take, probably in 404 jeff. Also, can you give me a guess on a fully finished rifle?

If these questions need answered privately that is fine.

My email address is:

amerine mech @ taylortel.net (remove the spaces.

thanks,
josh

quote:

Originally posted by Timan:
Hello all,

Here a few facts backed buy real records. My Firearm aquisition and desposition.

108 GMA actions Feed and function and barrels installed at Satterlee Arms by me since 4-02 to 5-09.

That's a lot of favors at $250.00 a pop.

Of course Mike and John Roden are gratefull and I consider them friends.

No matter what happens, I still know what I know. and can make a mauser anytime anyplace on anybodys equipment, practically from memory.

Do you have any idea what that is worth to some?

Who out in the world wants to make a mauser?
lets go lets do it.

your money.
my know how.

So far I've funded this whole thing on less that a 100k a year income.

come on who got any guts.
lets do it.
throw some real coin at this.
I can suit up, can you?

Stuart

Wow

From previous posts (pics etc) I know you can make some really nice actions. I also know that production of same can be, ah, unpredictable. I have followed most of these SS threads and your response to ForrestB in another older thread left me cold. In the following months I thought I saw a new, better Stu...producing product with a new attitude of "getting 'er done" and filling orders post haste. From your latest post it seems it is business as usual. I almost got took by Hein in a project and I'm a little gun shy for sure. Remember that I think your skill/work is great it is the customer service side/delivery that needs major work.

John

Hi there:
As a small business owner I'm just amazed at this threat. Frankly, shocked too. Mr. Saterlee, let me assure you, due to your lack of style and politness I will never do business of any kind with you. Your arrogance is diappointing, and the way you treat your customers on this forum is simply disgusting.
I don't think you are capable to learn a lesson from the comments made, but perhaps somebody else might gain something from this.
If this is the brightest and best the gun industrie has to offer, I fear for it. Fortuantely I know this is not the case, having met some truly fine and honest gunmakers in the past.

This is getting better every day. If enough of you folks "Asshole Up" here maybe the delivery times for those of us who do want a Satterlee action will shorten.

Roll on gentlemen...!

Rich

Here is a constructive criticism. You always have to remember that It takes quite awhile to build a Positive reputation and just a second to destroy it. Moreover, THOUSANDS of people will read this thread and develop an opinion of where they want to put their hard earned money ( in a failing economy). To be honest, after owning a few GMA actions, I would be hard pressed to buy another. Poor customer relations is a bad buisness practice particularly in an age where the whole internet hears about it instantly. The damage is also self inflicted.-Rob

quote:

Originally posted by Robgunbuilder:
To be honest, after owning a few GMA actions, I would be hard pressed to buy another. -Rob

Rob,

Why?

Just "bang for the buck" or structural problems?

Thanks,
Paul

P.S. Check your PM

Rob,how was the Vektor?

quote:

Posted 26 December 2009 20:57 Hide Post
Hi there:
As a small business owner I'm just amazed at this threat. Frankly, shocked too. Mr. Saterlee, let me assure you, due to your lack of style and politness I will never do business of any kind with you. Your arrogance is diappointing, and the way you treat your customers on this forum is simply disgusting.
I don't think you are capable to learn a lesson from the comments made, but perhaps somebody else might gain something from this.
If this is the brightest and best the gun industrie has to offer, I fear for it. Fortuantely I know this is not the case, having met some truly fine and honest gunmakers in the past.

quote:

Hi there:
As a small business owner I'm just amazed at this threat. Frankly, shocked too. Mr. Saterlee, let me assure you, due to your lack of style and politness I will never do business of any kind with you. Your arrogance is diappointing, and the way you treat your customers on this forum is simply disgusting.
I don't think you are capable to learn a lesson from the comments made, but perhaps somebody else might gain something from this.
If this is the brightest and best the gun industrie has to offer, I fear for it. Fortuantely I know this is not the case, having met some truly fine and honest gunmakers in the past.

Have a nice day sir. and thank your for your opinion.
Stuart

quote:

Originally posted by CCMDoc:

quote:

Originally posted by Robgunbuilder:
To be honest, after owning a few GMA actions, I would be hard pressed to buy another. -Rob

Rob,

Why?

Just "bang for the buck" or structural problems?

Thanks,
Paul

P.S. Check your PM

Without knowing Rob's answer, I can say there is a market for those who pay 10k to 15k for a rifle because it was built with a brand "whatever" action. What isn't often known is that 5k of that was spent finishing the action into a useable, reliable product. Original Brevex actions come to mind; they were rough as cobs from the factory.

That is something to think about when you compare value. What did it cost aand what willl it take to make it what I wanted? I learned that the expensive way on both actions and inletted stocks. Also one reason why certain Mauser actions command so much money. Even at the high sale price, they are usually cheaper than starting from scratch.

quote:

Originally posted by M 98:
MEHULKAMDAR
i was in europe two years ago. and went to a lot of the top gun makers like prechtal H&W JOHAANSON etc etc, there actions are good real good but still not in the class of what satterlee makes
Danel

Can you describe, what was the difference from a Golmatic-H&W and to a Satterlee action?.
..or perhaps I should ask: "where does the Satterlee action truly makes it self outstanding in comparison to the H&W for instance"? Technical info would be great!.

In all sincerety

I belive one of our resident gunsmiths of renown has said the GMA comes "as machined" and not necessarily caliber-specific while the Satterlee is hand finished, feeds for the requested cartridge and ready to barrel and blue. The issue isn't necessarily quality as much as degree of readiness for use. As for the Golmatic, you may be better able to say than us.

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
I belive one of our resident gunsmiths of renown has said the GMA comes "as machined" and not necessarily caliber-specific while the Satterlee is hand finished, feeds for the requested cartridge and ready to barrel and blue. The issue isn't necessarily quality as much as degree of readiness for use. As for the Golmatic, you may be better able to say than us.

When I was looking at the GMA I priced what I wanted and GMA recommended I talk to Rheto Buehler to finish the barreled action.
Buelher's work is beyond reproach,but the cost of finishing the action to get ready for blue was just more than I could afford.

Now Fanzoi has said Stuart's action is one of the best available,so I have been told.

I think Stuart did the right thing and has priced his work and action more in line with the custom Mausers available.

fast

What sort of costs are we looking in the bare "raw" actions (Saterlee $5K?), barreled actions, and complete rifles? I know things can vary greatly but, I'm curious about a good working rifle, say in 416 Rigby, without a lot of fancy fluff.

How do these actions and rifles compare to something like an AHR which is in the $5K range based on a CZ action?

Can you describe, what was the difference from a Golmatic-H&W and to a Satterlee action?.
..or perhaps I should ask: "where does the Satterlee action truly makes it self outstanding in comparison to the H&W for instance"? Technical info would be great!.

In all sincerety

The trigger is where my satterlee action really stands apart from the others.
The Trigger,
being of m-70 origin. It's concept was first used by pete grisel back in the 80's. on the Grisle M-98 actions. I've always liked the M-70 trigger design it is one of the best hunting triggers ever.
I cut my teeth on that trigger as an apprentice gunsmith/Machinist in the 80's and 90's at Dakota Arms. (10 years)ago
This triggers symplicity and reliability has not been improved upon since its arrival when winchester originally introduced it. (pre-war) m-70.

I also offer a RH or a LH safety or original mauser flag. As well as then wisner 2 position conversion.


I consider the Satterlee M-98 a marriage of the finest American trigger to the finest European bolt action design. M-98 of course.

materials vari between makes 4140, 8620 ,1018.

In the end it all works and wonderful rifles are built. I prefer the 4140 and thats the end of it.


A GMA is 2030 euro $3250 us. non-function

Satterlee 3125 euro $5000 us. fully function

A golmatic is 4300 euro $6880 us dollar. Non-function
A H&W is 4500 euro $7200 us dollar. fully function.

To all,
have a great new year.
Maybe see you in Reno.
SS

WOW! an enlightening thread, in many ways. I don't have a dog in the fight, so have no comments to add to the manure pile.

Imp, i have 4140 prehard under my workbench. It's yours if you want, you know where to find me. No danger of me using it up, as you know, my machines haven't run in 5 years. No need to order and buy some, unless you're particular about size...... Also have some titanium if you have any interest of playing with that.

dave

Thanks Dave,
I am about ready to get back in the saddle. We got Joe’s .338 Lapua Magnum most of the way done on Christmas day and there is not a lot left to do. I really enjoyed working with him on that project; we are waiting on one part before we finish it so it might be a few days. Hopefully we can get it done and shot before he leaves.

I will probably be around to get the 4140, If the titanium is the right shape, I might be interested when I get my single shot design finished; why don’t we get together and discuss it over lunch after the new year?

It was nice to see you the other day and our talk persuaded me to try harder to talk my friend out of borrowing money to go into business making actions; I just cannot see where it would be a workable proposition for him. As you said, the air is pretty thin when you look at the production records on the ATF website. It is one thing to be able to make the actions, but for a new contender to be able to market enough the first year to make a go of it is a different story altogether.

Take care,

Jim

UPDATE
06 action finished and barreled
375 ruger action finished and barrled
just waiting for the 416 action to be finished
Daniel

quote:

Originally posted by Sid Post:
What sort of costs are we looking in the bare "raw" actions (Saterlee $5K?), barreled actions, and complete rifles? I know things can vary greatly but, I'm curious about a good working rifle, say in 416 Rigby, without a lot of fancy fluff.

How do these actions and rifles compare to something like an AHR which is in the $5K range based on a CZ action?

Plain Jane qithout any sights, synthetic stock and fixed scope I can't see it done right for less than $7000 with a GMA. If you want classic sights, wood and a detachable scope make it $9000. If you want it pretty too, the price goes up from there.

$8,000 to $8,500 for a Rigby Synthetic Satterlee m-98.


News update:

With my new partner in machining. We will be producing many more actions per year.

The goal is 49 finished actions.

My new partner has two 4 axis machines we can dedicate fully receivers on one, bolts on the other.

Bottom metals and safetys on my cnc.

All small parts are going on my small cnc and my dads small cnc.


Also we will be getting all my designs,dimensions and tolerances into a 3-D pro-E, pro-Manufacture format.

For further Quality outsourcing, within the US.

While this is being done I will be cleaning out my backlog and getting ready to go to phase 2.

We have our own action. It is time to really make them quickly.

Time to step it up a notch.

Thank you,
Stuart

Stuart, it sounds good but as always the weakest link in your plans is YOU. Who is going to get you out of bed in the morning and force you to actually turn out the work you've committed to producing?

You can't even follow through on your recent commitment to leave AR and focus on your work.

quote:

Originally posted by Timan:
$8,000 to $8,500 for a Rigby Synthetic Satterlee m-98.


News update:

With my new partner in machining. We will be producing many more actions per year.

The goal is 49 finished actions.

My new partner has two 4 axis machines we can dedicate fully receivers on one, bolts on the other.

Bottom metals and safetys on my cnc.

All small parts are going on my small cnc and my dads small cnc.


Also we will be getting all my designs,dimensions and tolerances into a 3-D pro-E, pro-Manufacture format.

For further Quality outsourcing, within the US.

While this is being done I will be cleaning out my backlog and getting ready to go to phase 2.

We have our own action. It is time to really make them quickly.

Time to step it up a notch.

Thank you,
Stuart

Keep moving foward Stu, there are some here that appreciate your artistry.

"Why is everybody always picking on me?"

I don't know Jim, why is everybody picking on you. I think you said it yourself in a post you made elsewhere on this site when you admitted that you were an "ass".

Big man. Hot shit. Getting accepted in the Guild. And acts the way you do on this site?

quote:

no job is too difficult; I can do anything you want me to do as long as you have enough money

Kind of reminds me of my younger days when I raced automobiles. I walked into the speed shop and asked the owner "How fast I can I make my car go?". His reply was "How much money do you have?" needless to say, my car never reached its full potential

Forest,

How you doing boss.

Just opened my new alarm clock I got for christmas.

love it.

Thanks boss.

Talk soon,

Stu

quote:

Originally posted by Timan:
Forest,

How you doing boss.

Just opened my new alarm clock I got for christmas.

love it.

Thanks boss.

Talk soon,

Stu

Lets make a comparison per se. I don't see threads about Echols not delivering product. Yes he might have a backlog...as many good (great) smiths have. Yes his product is expensive and out of reach of a lot of us. BUT we KNOW he will produce the product, whether it is in six months or 16, 24 or whatever. He has reached the point that his WORK and WORD is worth the wait. You WILL receive an Echols rifle and it will work to your or above your expectations.

You may do great work but you must deliver product and NOT be a smart ass! IMO, from a retail perpective you should try to empathize with your customers concerns. They have a lot of money and dreams on the line and a believable timeframe is underatandable. Stuff happens but a whitty reply might not be approporiate! Be true to your customers, as they are your lifeblood.

A quality smith that delivers the goods is a Godsend. A 'smith that has all talent but no product is not a reputable smith at all. An honest smith that delivers the goods in a timely manner is one all of us crave. No Heins or Scheerzs etc please! Just deliver the goods!

John