Sources tell me that the first shoe has been dropped and that many more are on the way.
See Executive Order #13959 dated today and now in effect.

This should be an interesting week and more fun for some than others! Keep your powder dry.

quote:

Originally posted by Fury01:
.461 Diameter bands yes?

Yes. You can choose your diameter

Those on this forum who want to stifle speech that is neither dangerous nor harmful (Dr. Ron Berry, aka RIP) do not have long to wait before their whole worldview will be weighed in the balance and found wanting. It is a sad day when Ron, who is largely responsible for perpetuating possibly the best thread ever on any firearm-related forum, is removed for a non-politically-correct point of view. I fully understand the rights of private ownership, but shame on those responsible.

Yes. Shame indeed. Shame, for those who remember the meaning of the word, will know that shame carries its own millstone.

quote:

Originally posted by Fury01:
Yes. Shame indeed. Shame, for those who remember the meaning of the word, will know that shame carries its own millstone.

Hear! Hear!

But those on that particular side....know no shame.....

Unfucking believable that RIP would be banned. For a different political point of view? Where does it end?

Shocking.
What did RIP post?

You can click on RIP name and see all his posts. I did that and see that when one contributes to the Political Forum that all bets have been off for a long, long time.
I can't imagine anything can be worse than what has been there by many for Years.
So; I don't Think Rip could have posted anything beyond that measuring stick. I think RIP being so visible is just on the "Wrong" side of the discussion and there is the shame of it.

I hope the owners that be let him back.
Free RIP!

I will continue to post his results of testing for the great .458 WM, as long as the environment is safe. If it isn't, I'll be out of here as well!

Whatever the case, I'll post some of it in my blogs.

Let me add, however, that Ron has NEVER requested that I do any of this, either here or elsewhere... It was my suggestion.

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
The third Gold Star Load on the wall is the second from Sir Jerry:

I think the RIP Modified 500 TSX to both 400 and 450 grains should be tested for Gold Star Loads. Several of those bullets held great promise to my mind. Forward to sound of the mighty 458 WM bullets hitting the target boys. Truth always prevails. It's only the time line that is tough to live with.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Unfucking believable that RIP would be banned. For a different political point of view? Where does it end?

It is un fucking believable, where in the hell is this world going to. Can’t speak you mind for fear of persecution. Welcome to the new ideological socialist/ fascist agenda.

Do unto others...
Don’t do to others...
I ask for intellectual honesty.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Shocking.
What did RIP post?

Nothing worse than anyone else. If you have the unfortunate experience of visiting the Political Forum you’ll see far worse. The vulgar foul mouths of a few that post there is 10x worse from what I can see. However, their political leanings align with Donnies so therefore, I’d wager that they are safe.

Intellectual honesty requires two things; intelligence and honesty, both seem to be in short supply today.
Hate and bias you can find everywhere.

quote:

Originally posted by Fury01:
Intellectual honesty requires two things; intelligence and honesty, both seem to be in short supply today.
Hate and bias you can find everywhere.

Beside hate and bias, I'd add cowardice in this case. These cancel culturalists are nothing if not cowards. And since I'm not a coward, I'd be glad to say that to their faces if I knew who they were. By that, I mean specifically the ones who cancelled RIP from this forum.

Axing RIP was a huntamerica level blunder, for those who remember how that went. The wreckage of over moderated forums stretches all the way to the beginning of the internet. And usually follows the same path each time.

RIP was probably the premier bigbore expert on the site. His knowledge was derived reading and taking part in tens of thousands of posts on big game rifles going back 20 years. We all evolved and grew with him on this site.

The most bizarre thing is that this site was once he premier example out there for free speech on gun forums. I have held it aloft several times on other forums( some of the so called 'free world' forums can be the heaviest moderated in existence)and nothing gave me greater pleasure than pointing to the diplomacy and dignity of an Arab gentleman showing the world how it was done.

Thanks Karl. Yes the World always stands ready for great Leadership.
The road to the top is never crowded.

Wow ;
Just Wow!

Well . Everyone knows it is a privately owned, public forum.
I probably have come close to getting the boot and probably will.
Oh well. It will save me time.
However !
I do hope we can keep this thread rolling along. If not on AR then on another forum.
Surely there is more than one.

quote:

Originally posted by Karl:
Axing RIP was a huntamerica level blunder, for those who remember how that went. The wreckage of over moderated forums stretches all the way to the beginning of the internet. And usually follows the same path each time.

RIP was probably the premier bigbore expert on the site. His knowledge was derived reading and taking part in tens of thousands of posts on big game rifles going back 20 years. We all evolved and grew with him on this site.

The most bizarre thing is that this site was once he premier example out there for free speech on gun forums. I have held it aloft several times on other forums( some of the so called 'free world' forums can be the heaviest moderated in existence)and nothing gave me greater pleasure than pointing to the diplomacy and dignity of an Arab gentleman showing the world how it was done.

Well said Karl!

Yet the "free world" is not so free anymore. Just visit a University campus where the rhetoric is anti-Israel, or if you don't agree with the "far left" you'll be ostracised as a bare minimum! And it could get far worse than that! Millennials are leaning strongly in that direction, and if you are a politician you'll need their support if you want power, or to stay there! Hence, the American "new revolution" is happening! It's happening here too, but slower.

However, the first recorded murder was caused by jealousy! Scratch democracy and out comes all sorts of evil! (see what Jesus said in regard to men's hearts: The Gospel of MARK, ch.7: verses 20 -23).

After I went to bed late last night, I thought about the latest "lockdown" imposed on ALL in Ontario. We must stay indoors! No walking the streets! If I do, Icould be arrested... put in jail... or have to pay a hefty fine! Yet, I must walk as mandated by my doctors... so I do - OUTDOORS, down hill, up hill, down hill and up hill to my home. That's because I have diabetes and five stents already. So there's a conflict between what's necessary to maintain my health at 85 and what the "powers that be" say! So, I'll break the current "law" to do what's necessary!

"Democracy" isn't always fair nor right, and it may be the undoing of itself if "freedom" means a choice to do unrestrained wickedness, as in the murder of unborn babies, and/or "sexual" freedoms that ultimately destroy families!

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

Our country’s first President clearly stated that our governance plan was only suited to a moral, guided people Bob. Of course you know he was referring to the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob. So many today and Likely here don’t know or understand the history of God dealing with his people but it should be sobering if they do or trust that we do and are saying so. I have enjoyed my nearly 20 years here on the AR and wish to offend not, but the carrying away of the people in the tribes of Israel by the Babylonian and Assyrian empires was done partially due to the people sacrificing their children to the pagan god Molec. I don’t expect different judgment than the 12 tribes had but I would like to postpone it by begging for forgiveness.
To tie this all back to this thread and the great and mighty 458WM-T, all can go back to page one of the thread and my first post. The truth was and is always the goal. I think RIP has done a masterful job of testing and reporting the truth of the 458WM-T and I am sad to see him silenced in this way. All are diminished by this but none more than the one who choose to do it.
Best regards to all.

quote:

All are diminished by this but none more than the one who choose to do it.

There it is. Well posted.

Anyone know if Hornady is currently producing 458 Win brass ?
One of the Awesome things about the 458 is , as Finn Aagard (spelling ?) reported that Phil did. When asked by a client what cartridge his rifle shot? Phil answered (something like) oh, anything . Where apon he proceeded to drop a 7 RM, 300 ? Mag, 338 Win, 375 H+H, and iirc a 416 Rem and finally a 458 Win round in the chamber of Old Ugly.
I wasn't successful at necking up 264 Win brass up to 458 but I have been with 300 Win and Whby . And of course 338. 375 H+H I would just shoot. Fireforms out just fine.
Anneal and reload. The 300s I had to Anneal @338 and again @ 416 . but then they were fine. It may not make for bench rest level accuracy. But they put meat on the ground just fine.
However, if I don't have to revert to such measures that would be preferable !
The factory ammo loaded with Wonder bullets is great. But I miss the old WW 510gr8 softs with the big blue nose . And the Remington and Federal ammo loaded with what I think was 500 gr Hornady sorts and solids.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

All are diminished by this but none more than the one who choose to do it.

There it is. Well posted.

+1

Also where are all the mods on this issue? Some have known RIP for near 2 decades. Jeffeosso, Bakes, George S, Canuck? No independant opinions from anyone? Did we all sign some sort of subordination clause?

CTF, Hornaday is not making 458 win or lott at this time a few months ago while talking to them I was told they would run a batch this Feb but I was told the same thing last year and they never did so who knows when they will not speak with a forked tongue and make some

quote:

Originally posted by Karl:
Also where are all the mods on this issue? Some have known RIP for near 2 decades. Jeffeosso, Bakes, George S, Canuck? No independant opinions from anyone? Did we all sign some sort of subordination clause?

Exactly.

Saeed and RIP have been friends for a long time. So much so that Saeed took him on Safari to Tanzania. I would say that's a pretty strong friendship.

Now, in the interest of suppressing any independent speech that doesn't align with a leftist agenda, Saeed allows his friend to be sacrificed in the name of ideology.

THAT is where the leftist agenda leads, every single time. Sacrifice everything for ideology. Ideology is supreme. Every narrative must be bent to fit it. Those who refuse to conform to the ideology must be cancelled.

It has to be fought at every turn, lest we allow history to repeat itself.

BTW, wasn't this forum about hunting and shooting back in the day? I know that's what drew me here.

I'm maintaining contact with Ron (RIP). He's sent me lots from his recent testing, as he promised to do here. So he still has a ways to go.

I'll be publishing a lot of it in my blogs and some here in his name. He's not asked me to do that but I want to keep this thread going, and have decided to continue with it without the politics -- unless and until those who banned him thinks otherwise.

I left AR for 8 years due to prejudice against my testing results in a CZ 550 for the .458 WM. I came back on invitation (though I'd never been banned) and met RIP sometime over two years ago, and we've become friends. So, I have some strong emotional feelings over what has happened, but have no intention of maintaining this space for correcting wrongs! I'll do that privately if I think there's any point in it.

Let's let RIP's legacy survive despite what's going on in the politics of this nation.

We can learn something from the old saying: "If you love me you must also love my dog". That applies to politics as well as in most other areas of living in a democracy. So-called "religion" being another!

In RIP's case, I love his dog too!

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

A thought on saving this forum, simple really.
1.Delete any political forum
2. When politics show up in a thread, block the user for a month with a warning. If it happens again, remove user from forum.

I must say,I am shocked

Saeed,
I have read you say this many times,that AR is for all views,freedom of speech is allowed on here,with all due respect & appreciation for this site,I will admit to being deeply shocked & saddened ,have the rules changed recently?

I have always found RIP to be a somewhat knowledgeable ass, not to say a complete buffoon, and an insulting and nasty one at that. So much so, that, for some time now, I have had him on ignore.

But I believe in free speech, short of threats and incitement to violence.

Short of that, I would not wish that he be banned, but I no longer even open the Political Forum or view any of RIP’s posts anywhere. So, I have no idea what his alleged sins may have been.

The few times I have visited the Political Forum in the past, I have found it to be a cesspool of intemperate and often outright obscene bickering. Not argument, but mere bickering and ad hominem attacks and counterattacks.

Nothing enlightening or even entertaining.

Nothing.

I can only imagine that, given his temperament, RIP leapt into that cesspool, began to drown, and couldn't drag himself out.

quote:

Originally posted by hydehunter:
CTF, Hornaday is not making 458 win or lott at this time a few months ago while talking to them I was told they would run a batch this Feb but I was told the same thing last year and they never did so who knows when they will not speak with a forked tongue and make some

Thank you !

I guess I'll start scrounging 300 brass.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill73:
I must say,I am shocked

Saeed,
I have read you say this many times,that AR is for all views,freedom of speech is allowed on here,with all due respect & appreciation for this site,I will admit to being deeply shocked & saddened ,have the rules changed recently?

Since none of the mods are inclined to reply,I 'braved the PF' to get a reply from someone. Mike Mcguire was also banned. In his case by Walther, with no warning and the only explations being "Your account is suspended due to posting false crap" or words to that effect.

My post below

quote:

So all this aside DRG and Saeed,

Do Mike and RIP get to come back?

I posted here a couple months ago as Mike couldnt get in apparently, which wasnt a ban DRG said, and Don also said Mike was an old friend, get him to mail him directly.

Now it appears he runs afoul of a mod with limited explanation of how/why before or after the event. So does this mean you are still 'old friends' Don?

I cant speak for RIP circumstances I didnt see them, but Id find it hard to beleive he has cursed more in 20 years, then Ed hubel does in a single post..

quote:

Saeed
Administrator

posted 15 January 2021 12:25 Hide Post
Karl

Why do we need to explain our actions to you or anyone else?

Two of us have also had our posts modified to include anti-trump rants, edited by mods we assume or other unknown parties. Most bizarre in my case as I dont care about American politicians one way or the other. This was put down to an accident, but no mods came forward. Not good, posting on public forums is risky enough without people using your handle to make rants.

But thats how it runs now fellas.

Forums of this nature should be kept objective, and keep personalities out of it. But, unfortunately, with a Political forum as a significant part, and strong feelings, the character of individuals is revealed.

I went to the political forum once recently and it was so rancid with vitriol that I felt like I must leave AR permanently.

I prefer an intellectual atmosphere where honest experience and opinion can be exchanged in a gentlemanly manner. Should there be those with a different slant, view or experience, let them freely express it. I can handle that. But, as in my early experience on AR, there were put downs, slander, intimidation and slaps to the chops.

I've, personally, found none more generous than RIP, but he's no coward. If you slap him in the chops you may want to be prepared for a fist full.

Having said that, I'm leaving here for a while until matters settle. RIP won't be back, regardless of what is said or done. And I'll not be a spokesman for him. He is more than capable of defending himself, if he so chooses.

As a pastor of over 60 years I've dealt with every kind of personality and just about every kind of problems and issues in individual lives. And, my wife as a professional counsellor along with myself "have seen and heard it all". We've dealt with thousands between us, and there really is "nothing new under the sun" - to quote Solomon. We only need to hear a few sentences while watching facial expressions and body language to quickly understand what's going on. And what's going on here at AR is anything but healthy... it's not a wholesome environment. It's not a "safe place". If it's "The American way", America is dammed for sure!

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

quote:

Why do we need to explain our actions to you or anyone else?

They don't need to explain anything. Isn't Freedom great for those who still have it?

quote:

Originally posted by crshelton:
A thought on saving this forum, simple really.
1.Delete any political forum
2. When politics show up in a thread, block the user for a month with a warning. If it happens again, remove user from forum.

maybe too late crshelton. This forum used to have pages of a new posts a day, down to what 3-4 now? With Mike Mcguire and RIP gone, thats a another big dent. In fact looking at the current posters its you, Fury01, .458, Todd williams and a few others carrying the flame.

I would love help keep Rip’s thread going but my 458 work is all the same. I have a proven load and I carry it all over the prairie with a happy step. That story is told. Rip as a contributor is irreplaceable. Even him weaving a bit of his view of the world into naming loads and the 458WM with a T was done in a format that made great reading and prompted others to expand their thinking. His multiple rifles, mounds of bullets, willingness to use JB WELD and humor to show what he and we could do if we so choose, was brilliant work. Best I can is to say this and hold the door open for his return by ignoring the hypocrisy in even the Humor forum; the offensive nature of many posts. I gave up giving anyone the power to offend me years ago. As a person of Jewish heritage and Christian faith, that was a wise choice. I can recommend it to everyone. If others had chosen likewise, we would not be in this situation.
Best regards,

Wow;
Ya, it's strange how some people act sometimes.
Then to find out that the strange isn't an act .
Them seeming like a good hand was an act.
I found that out with a member of AR that I thot I knew fairly well. Even had him to my place for dinner on occasion.
It really shocked me.
But being naive isn't morally reprehensible.
Being down right nasty is.
Those in the know have conceded several long term departures from what is true of correct for a long time. Case in point being that the 375s were included into the Big Bore category. Entirely due to the Boss/Owners like of said caliber of choice for hunting big game.

So by being here , we accept the fallacy of the 375s being of equal ability to the 458 Win .
Then its just a matter of what else or how much will we swallow.

I always clicked on this site because I enjoy large bore rifles. However, I learned most of what I know about large bore rifles before I ever signed up the first time to AR.
I have been disgusted that the Ak Hunting forum side of AR is just advertisements for those in the commercial services/entertainment industry.

The world is changing/ getting worse. And this forum has followed along.
This thread has provided many hours of great entertainment. And has saved me a bunch of money buying gun magazines.
I do need to go thru and download some of the data. As my 458 will be singing its song for a long time to come.

As an aside, it's slap ya in the face obvious NOW. All that would have been necessary back in the day when all the trouble was being had with the 458 Win. Would have been to take the mag block out of the Model 70s mag boxes, roll a new cannalure into the pulled bullets . And reload those to 3.6 ish" with a slight increase in powder . Problem solved.
Bob learned that a long time ago. RIP learned that and not only started beating that drum ! But started a whole new Crash and Roll band.
If I can scare up another long action in the future, CZ 550, Interarms Mk X, Model 70 or 17 Enfield . I will have it built into a 458 Winchester Magnum Trump. And will have that stamped on the barrel.

quote:

Originally posted by Karl:
maybe too late crshelton. This forum used to have pages of a new posts a day, down to what 3-4 now? With Mike Mcguire and RIP gone, thats a another big dent. In fact looking at the current posters its you, Fury01, .458, Todd williams and a few others carrying the flame.

Agree.

It's a shame. And the Facebook groups have taken a lot of members from web forums long ago. THR and 24HCampfire have a bunch of ruthless members that post like our political subforum in every post...thats what I like about AR.

I think the political forum should be removed from the hunting forum, if for no other reason than it stirs everyone up.

I hate that we lost 2 members because of it. It isn't really fun when you log onto here and the same 5 people have posted things from the day before. We may as well just start a fb messenger group or group text.


Just noticed a few posts where ALF disappeared..he may have been deleted as well..