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| One of Us |
I think if you are Colorado one should pay an attorney to brief for you how Colorado applies Terry Stop to person and vehicles. Most states allow Terry Stop search of vehicles. Also, LE includeing Warden can enter private property without a warrant so long as that property is not part of the curtelage. This is property you have an expectation of privacy. The back 500 you may not. That is why Game Wardens, wee police, moonshine hunters can show up unannounced without a warrant. The more remote or isolated the property is from your home the more likely it is not part of the curtlidge. Thus, no expectation of privacy. | |||
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I'm also familiar with Terry - v Ohio, but civil rights do still apply, especially in CO. | |||
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This reminds me of a time I exercised my "rights." Remember how a few after years after 911 TSA would always inspect the last and first person boarding a flight? It got to be so ridiculous that no one in first class would want to board. One time I was running late for a connection and was last in line for a commuter flight to the small town in which I owned a house. Sure enough, I was flagged for an inspection. I also knew it was my "right" to ask for a private screening, which TSA did in a nearby bathroom. We finished well before the cutoff time to board the flight, but when I got out the gate agent told me the pilot decided to leave anyway, since he didn't like my "attitude" or something similar. I was incensed and asked for a supervisor. They put me up in a hotel for the night and gave me a free ticket, but at the end of the day the pilot cost his airline money, I was in a hotel when I really wanted to be home, and in the end airline security was never really in question anyway. | |||
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Scary world out there I’ll thought I left that behind in Europe where LE has a lot more power and they abuse it a lot more too Kinda like cop here in Stevenville has DUI last year and still driving around and giving DUI tickets to county jail Or county judge, who got two DUI’s and still presiding over DUI proceedings Something wrong with this world " Until the day breaks and the nights shadows flee away " Big ivory for my pillow and 2.5% of Neanderthal DNA flowing thru my veins. When I'm ready to go, pack a bag of gunpowder up my ass and strike a fire to my pecker, until I squeal like a boar. Yours truly , Milan The Boarkiller - World according to Milan PS I have big boar on my floor...but it ain't dead, just scared to move... Man should be happy and in good humor until the day he dies... Only fools hope to live forever “ Hávamál” | |||
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Why does it matter that he had the antlers/horns in his vehicle???? They were LEGALLY killed and had documentation of such. Only a really naive person woiuld drive around with illegally taken trophies in plain sight, and only a naive person would believe that someone would do something like that. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Bro, we've talked and done some biz together too - remind me to tell you sometime about when I came home from my Polar Bear hunt - with gun in tow. You'll get a kick out of the story. Local PD in Chicago were so awesome I wanted to buy em a beer, but TSA / United totally failed to the point that I thought Chicago PD was gong to arrest the U/A folks!  | |||
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Sir, you and I have been friends and done biz together for years now. I never want to suggest anyone disregards the respect we should give LE in this country, but like you - I have seen it abused numerous times, and I would like to think LE here is above that! BTW - you shot one of the best elephant bulls I have ever seen come from ZIM!!! | |||
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Fact is CHC, in Colorado there's no law saying / showing I - we need proof of legal take of / ownership on the antlers anyway. Yes, I did in fact have a tag on the antlers - because that's how they do it on the Navajo Rez in AZ - from my understanding, and the tag is still on the rack now. Please know - I am agreeing with you - not the opposite. Fact is, I could go down the street to a garage sale and buy 10 elk racks - there's no law in CO that requires me or the seller to have them tagged or a license to "prove" they were taken / owned legally....period! That's my whole point to the story! I was in possession of a "legal" item to possess, no different than your vehicle / cell phone, thus LE has no reason to "assume" I have said item illegally - nor am I required to show "proof" of ownership / take. | |||
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Thanks Aaron I’ll always maintain respect for LE as long as I get respect, which for most part they do give me respect When I do something wrong ( driving ticket) I always offer to take the fine right from the get go In the end , we are lucky here we have unalienable rights and we can exercise them, which in most of rest of the world we people cannot It is good we can push back some against LE otherwise, just imagine what it would be like if we could not... " Until the day breaks and the nights shadows flee away " Big ivory for my pillow and 2.5% of Neanderthal DNA flowing thru my veins. When I'm ready to go, pack a bag of gunpowder up my ass and strike a fire to my pecker, until I squeal like a boar. Yours truly , Milan The Boarkiller - World according to Milan PS I have big boar on my floor...but it ain't dead, just scared to move... Man should be happy and in good humor until the day he dies... Only fools hope to live forever “ Hávamál” | |||
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Several high profile/celebrity/media star hunters have been convicted of game law violations over the past few years. Some of those violations were serious and drew heavy fines for the state coffers. Maybe the Colorado DOW is watching high profile hunters more closely. That's no excuse for the the way Aaron was treated initially but it could explain what brought on the unwarranted attention. No longer Bigasanelk | |||
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Aaron, The California Supreme Court has ruled differently and the US Supreme Court refused to hear the defendant's appeal of the case. Note, in general CA Courts are more pro defendant than other states. In this instance CA Supreme court ruled that even though the game wardens lacked reasonable suspicion that any violation had occurred that the warrant-less vehicle search was permissible. This was after the lower courts had ruled the search was inadmissible. The case is CA v. BOUHN MAIKHIO This from the CA Supreme Court Opinion (bolding added by me): For the reasons discussed below, we conclude that the Court of Appeal erred in determining that, under the applicable California statutes and the Fourth Amendment of the United States Constitution, a game warden may make such a vehicle stop only if the warden is aware of facts that give rise to a reasonable suspicion that the angler or hunter has violated a fish and game statute or regulation. As we shall explain, California authority has interpreted the relevant statute as authorizing a stop of a vehicle occupied by an angler or hunter for such purposes, and the United States Supreme Court has held in a number of decisions that an administrative search or seizure may be conducted, consistent with the Fourth Amendment, in the absence of reasonable suspicion that a violation of a statute or administrative regulation has occurred. Such administrative searches and seizures are permissible when (1) the governmental action serves a special and important state need and interest distinct from the state's ordinary interest in enforcing the criminal law, (2) the administrative rules or regulations that are required to achieve the state's interest are of such a nature that limiting inspection only to those persons reasonably suspected of committing a violation would seriously undermine the state's ability to meet its special need, and (3) the impingement upon the reasonable expectation of privacy of those subjected to the procedure is sufficiently limited such that the state's need to utilize the procedure outweighs the invasion which the search entails, thus rendering the procedure reasonable for purposes of the Fourth Amendment. This is not an attempt to compare your scenario to this case. Just a general FYI about the 4th Amendment regarding searches and fish and game activities. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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'I lived in Colorado for 14 years back in the '70's and '80's. During that time I probably had about six encounters with G&F personnel in both Colorado and Wyoming. In Colorado the attitude seemed to be "we know you are a violator, we just have to discover how". In Wyoming it was the exact opposite. The Wyoming G&F people aged animals, checked license and thanked hunters, almost apologizing for any inconvenience. Based on Aaron's experience not much has changed. | |||
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Mr. Neilson, unfortunatly, I have been in a similar situation. What I decided to do is 1) be very courteous 2) have a witness 3) let them check/examine what they want 4) politely ask if they are finished/done 5) when they respond ‘yes’, thank them and then get their name(s) AND their badge # and bosses name. 6) start making phone calls up the chain of command. Having put up w/ this horseshit b/4, I decided I will not endure it quitely again. | |||
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I went on my first elk hunt in Colorado in 1992. Making the trip up, I went thru Gunnison, and there was a store in down town Gunnison that sold Hunting License, but they also had elk and mule deer racks and even Big Horn Sheep horns for sale. During that first hunt, the outfitter/guide I hunted with out of Collbran, actually hit it off pretty good, along with his family. We ended up putting in for Antelope tags in Unit 99 in southwestern Wyoming for 1993. I got drawn and we met up with some other folks that he had guided from Tennessee that had drawn goat tags. After getting drawn I found out I could get a doe tag for $25.00, so I ended up with two goat tags. I got my buck and doe and the 3 folks from Tennessee each got their bucks, thru a goof up the guy I went up with did not get drawn but new the area and went along to help the rest of us out. The folks from Tennessee only wanted the heads for mounts and I said that if the area GW would clear it, I would take all the meat. We finally hooked up at the motel where we were staying and even though we had skinned and cut up everything, we still had the hides and he said it would have been better if we had waited, he signed off on it. Course, that just sort of confirms some folks idea of my intelligence, but that goat sure tasted good to everyone we shared it with. Pardon me for taking the topic off track. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Chapter W-0, Article X, #18 states that only legally harvested or obtained antlers may be sold. Not saying it is right or wrong, but the State can ask for proof of legality according to the the above Rule. | |||
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I learned a great lesson 30+ years ago Hunting in Utah. Was riding out in my truck after a morning hunt with a older local (Utah resident) contractor who built my house. I was a non resident and my truck had out of state plates. The warden (Norm) and the my contractor had “History”. No violations, just history. The warden approached my side of the truck and the conversation went as follows: Warden: I WANT TO SEE ALL YOUR LICENSES AND FIREARMS! Contractor: Norm, is it true to be a game warden, you have to have 10 people swear your a prick before they give you that badge? Needless to say, the next couple hours were wasted as they went through EVERYTHING. Fortunatly no violations were found and we were sent on our way. | |||
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I've only hunted in CO once and it was way back in 1980 on my first trip out west, so I can't speak to the GWs there. However, I have hunted in Wyoming since 1992 and haven't missed a year out there since 1998 while spending all of September and October there most years. In all those years I've never met a GW or Biologist that wasn't exactly as you have mentioned in your post! The GW where I hunt has been there for the last 20 years and almost always looks us up just to shoot the shit and after he got to know us hasn't even asked to see a license or our required Conservation Stamp over the last 15 years at least. | |||
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x2 My wife and I was making our annual trip to WY and our son, who was in the Navy joined us. ONe evening we were headed back to Buffalo, where we were staying, and got stopped at a check point. Everything went well until they asked my son for his "Hunter Safety Card". My son told them that he had left it at home when he went into the Navy. The gw told him that he was supposed to carry it with him anytime he was hunting. My son replied "yes sir". GW: So you're in the Navy? Son: Yes sir. GW what do you do? Son: I'm a corpman. About this time, my wife spoke up and said, We took the course at the same time and here's my card. The GW looked at her card and then gave Terry a grin and a wink and told him that if his momma vouched for him, he'd have to let him go. Also, I was in the Navy too and I know sailors never lie. FWIW I worked for an airline for 40 years and there is no bigger pain in the ass than someone who is really impressed with who they are. That goes for the cops AND especially the people they have to deal with. Aim for the exit hole | |||
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Grew up in the last unspoiled corner of Colorado. Watched as our friendly Federal and State servants turned into centers of people with personality and power issues. There is a trend here and the "Regulations" explosion supported by Overarching Statutes and agendas counter to the citizenry have given rise to this. Fish and game are only one example. There are worse. We just see F&G more because of hunting season concentrates the groups of us and them. "The liberty enjoyed by the people of these states of worshiping Almighty God agreeably to their conscience, is not only among the choicest of their blessings, but also of their rights." ~George Washington - 1789 | |||
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I see the same thing here in this area once the GW gets over that first 24 months of "Fresh Out Of The Academy/All Hunters Are Thieves/Poachers and Assholes! After that "Break-In" period, the vmajority of tutrn out to be pretty damn good folks. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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Imo, you started the "confrontation" by acting like you had something to hide rather than answer what seemed to be normal questions in the situation. I could answer your list of questions, but the above would pretty well cover it. How would they know the antlers are legal without seeing your license to take? Tags can and probably have been counterfeited in the past. I'm not going to argue about this you asked for opinions and this is mine. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Seems they are often looking for the low hanging fruit.The real problem guys don't post on FB, drive around with evidence in their pickups, brag in bars or report their mistakes, and they take work to catch. | |||
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Eny, Not necessarily a fair characterization, there have been a number of instances of illegal taken game and the hunter cited because they posted on the internet or bragged about it in a bar etc. and only after detailed investigation was the violator caught. A good percentage of all violators of any type of law are caught because they can't keep their mouth shut or they do various things to bring attention to themselves. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I've had an annoying experience with wardens in North Carolina, but wardens in Wyoming and Montana have been uniformly pleasant. TomP Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be kept right, when wrong to be put right. Carl Schurz (1829 - 1906) | |||
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When I read this I thought: 1. Why in the wide blue f*^k would you leave sheep horns in sight anywhere? Let alone your Indian antlers? 2. Seemed to me you wanted to brag or maybe pick a fight with any potential fish cops so you could post it and offset some of the past poaching threads. That was my impression only from reading this. That is even though I have been stopped and "harassed" by fish cops in 6 states, MI, MN, MT, ID, AK and WA. Same theme every time. "This guy is a hunter, so he is breaking the law, now we have to get the truth out of him." Even with their universal motto of "We write them you fight them". I have never been ticketed in any of the many unpleasant run ins with numerous asshat fish cops. In the interest of complete disclosure. Last fall I met the exception to the rule. I was glassing for elk in WY. A truck pulled up off an old two track and drove up to my spot. Two fish cops. So I am thinking here we go again right? Wrong. They asked if I had seen any that morning and I told them I had not seen any elk yet and was thinking of moving on. They told me where they had just driven from and were surprised they had not see a single elk on that loop. They wished me luck and drove away. They never even got out of their truck let alone asked for my license and tag? Positively friendly. Kind of creepy when compared to my past. I have told many hunters since, and almost nobody believes me. | |||
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Plenty of dumb asses around here have been caught because of what they posted on FB and elsewhere. Bears, gators, etc. | |||
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The original story simply sounds like a story of who is the biggest dick. They were dicks for coming into the restaurant, you had to prove you were a bigger dick by being as belligerent as possible and they had to one-up you for a third time. I think the only person you proved a point to was you. I have had dealings with GW in three different states Kansas, Nebraska and Texas. All were quite pleasant to deal with. The Nebraska guys are always very nice at the check stations and even try to bend what they can for you. For example, I shot a deer one time that I thought was a doe, but it ended up that the buck was broken off completely on one side and only 3-4 inches remained on the other. I put my buck tag on it and went to the check station. The GW saw what I had done and asked me if I only had one bullet in the gun. Not understanding, he explained to me that next time since he could clearly tell the one side had broken off a long time ago, just shoot the other one off and put the doe tag on it. Not legal, but he said they do not penalize for honest mistakes. The last one was a year ago in Texas. I went to Randall (CHC) and shot a couple does. As I was leaving the next day, I stopped for gas and snacks. There was a GW there. Now mind you that Randall and I cut the deer so they would fit nicely in my cooler so there was nothing in the back of my truck except a closed cooler and the Mesquite logs that Randall filled my truck with for bringing him some apple wood. He asked if there was anything in the cooler, and I was not a dick about it, I just said, "sure, the two does I shot in Young County". He asked to see them and I was fine with that. Everything was good and he even politely let me know that he was glad I had not boned out the meat since it was illegal to bone out the meat before it was processed. I thanked him and we were on our respective ways. I'm sure it would have gone differently had I said, "you have no right to ask me what is in the cooler and I know my rights." Just saying. Larry "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history, when everybody stands around reloading" -- Thomas Jefferson | |||
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Like I said before, a lot has to do with tone. Personally, I can't imagine not giving my name under any circumstance. Failure to provide ones name could make this go downhill quickly. They may be total jerks. It sounds like it. Failure to give them the name gave them the opportunity to prove it. | |||
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Does PAST history make any sense to anyone. Not taking anyone's side, because I have witnessed it from both angles. Previous encounters, whether with the same individual(s) on seperate occasions with a extended time period in between, or with a different individual, but in a fairly intense/confrontational interaction 30 minutes to an hour earlier whether you are the GW or the Citizen can be and often are stressful on someone. I doubt that any of us ever forget confrontational situation we have we others, especially if that individual is an LEO of some type. Hell it shows up on AR plainly, multiple time daily! So damn many have of us have and hold grudges against people we will never meet, simply over differences of opinions/beliefs on any subject at hand. If the entire active membership of AR was as combative and confrontational in "Real Life" as we come across on the site, we would all be in jail or prison! Hell maybe some of us are. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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That is true, Damn True! Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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I will really be surprised if anyone comes on this thread with anything negative to say about the Wyoming GWs. Maybe Colorado needs to send all their GWs up to work a shift or two with their northern neighbors to let them see how the job can be done effectively with absolutely no harassment on their part! | |||
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Aaron, I don't know you from adam. Maybe there tone justified your response. But from just reading your post. All you did was cause yourself and everyone else a lot of unneeded stress. I picture it this way. Its my elk. It still has the rez tag on it. The sheep is plugged from when I took it in NV. Feel free to look them over if you want. If you have any more questions ill be outside when I finish my lunch. Most likely end of story. I have walked in the foot prints of the elephant, listened to lion roar and met the buffalo on his turf. I shall never be the same. | |||
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If LEOs of all sorts had a dollar for everytime someone said "I know my rights" they could all retire early. Aim for the exit hole | |||
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You are dealing with a couple of dicks.The best thing you can do is walk away and forget about them.They are not worth your time.Some Game Wardens think they have special police powers.I think you pointed out to them that they do not.Time to move on.Be happy,life is too short to hold grudges and it is bad for your health,OB | |||
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+1 on that! While antelope hunting in WY, I was dropped off by a water hole early one the morning, to be picked up at noon. About 9:30 a herd of goats show up and I shot the buck. Then I realize I was in such a hurry I forgot my knife as well as a pen to validate the tag. About a half hour later the warden shows up and I thought "here we go, I'm going to get nailed for failure to tag and maybe waste of game for not gutting the 'lope right away." I explained the situation and the warden said "you didn't move the antelope so there's no violation here." He hands me his knife and a pen and I punch out and sign the tag. I was surprised and impressed by the warden's attitude , it was the most cordial interaction I have ever had with a leo. "I don't have to tell you nothin' flatfoot" is not a good way to start an interaction with an officer even if you have the Constitutional right to do so. The fish cops could have confiscated the horns and antlers just to make you jump through the legal hoops to get them back. No longer Bigasanelk | |||
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Since you asked for an opinion: A couple of GWs who don't know how to talk to people, who need training and perhaps some discipline, and a legend in his own mind, taking the opportunity to show his pals and the rest of the world just what a big shot he is. Not defending the GWs in any way, they need spanking. But as another poster said, why is it that the same guys have the same problems under the same circumstances...all the time? Video guy doing his thing sees Barney and his partner Bubba doing their thing. "Watch this pards", says the video guy to his friends. And wait until I get home. I'll post something on AR, which will be impossible to refute, and I'll show the world just how badly I was wronged...again. 114-R10David | |||
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Over time thru personal observations ion life and the various tales that I have seen on here and other sites, there is a segment of the population, both hunters and Game Wardens that just really do not like making contact with each other. If a person has done everything legally, they should not feel threatened when approached by by a GW. Conversely a GW should not have the attitude that EVERYONE is doing something wrong. All that is going to be accomplished by a citizen taking an attitude with an LEO of any kind over something that isn't a problem, and turning it into a PROBLEM! No one wins in that little game, it merely affirms that each party views the other with contempt and always will. Even the rocks don't last forever. | |||
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I can only remember one investigation that I made in my 30+ years with the state of MI that turned a little ugly because of the way the person I was dealing with was. We had been having some of our food inspection staff within the Department do some undercover work involving making buys at various meat markets and meat departments that had "over-the counter" weighing activities, rather than prepackaged products with weight labels that are easily reweighed by the area inspector. One store that was visited by an undercover inspector found that the store wasn't taking any tare for the cardboard trays and other inedible materials being used that can add up to quite a bit at the price per pound of most items. After looking over the paperwork, as well as going over the files and finding that there had never been any outstanding problems I decided it was appropriate to issue a written warning to the owner. I had the warning paperwork in hand and went in and asked for a few minutes of his time to discuss the weighing violations the inspector had found. In short order when he found out why I was there he openly stated that he knew he and his people were not weighing things properly and if they did it right out in front of the customer he didn't see why they shouldn't if the customer didn't catch it and ask that the items be reweighed properly! Rather than get into a heated discussion when he said that and I guarantee I was very close to doing that, I merely showed him what would have been the written warning I was going to ask him to sign. I then tore it up and told him I would be back with a warrant and he could explain to the Judge the following week why he was knowinging cheating all of his customers. The reason I remember that situation is because not too long after that the guy went to a big meeting where our top Department Director was giving a speech. After the meeting ended he approached our Director and complimented me on how I had handled that situation and that he had it coming to him and respected how I had handled the case even though he now had a record and money out of his pocket when the court case was completed. | |||
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I would never in my life trust any LEO to search my vehicle without me being there to witness the event, sorry I don't trust anyone that much. I had a discussion with an LEO once who told me flat out that if "they" had to they would plant something to get the arrest they want, "if they knew you were guilty".... I am always very respectful to LEO's until they prove I should be otherwise. I am a habitual speeder and I get to visit with cops more than most people and by being respectful I only get cited for speeding 1 time in 10 contacts on the average. I have had many conversations with officers correcting them when they spout inaccuracies about law, what they can and will do etc.. I am a firm believer in knowing your rights and standing up for them when wronged. Many LEO's operate on taking control of the situation by badgering and intimidation, works on 90%+ of the population but I've never been a Sheep so I don't follow suit. If I am guilty as charged then so be it I won't lie to get out of it but I will never let anyone badger or buffalo me into compromising my rights, ever, I am very stubborn that way. I've been on a couple ride alongs with a Deputy Sherrif and I don't envy their job in the least and have great respect for good cops and I must say there are a lot of good cops. Stopped at a game check station during Antelope season one year here in Colorado, it was being conducted by the Colorado Division of Wildlife, also present were some County Deputy Sherrifs and State Patrol wandering around I assume for backup. The DOW guys were checking our Antelope in the back of the truck and going over our carcass tags and being very friendly about it when 2 other LEO's walked up and opened my cooler in the back of the truck. I promptly slammed it on their fingers which got an interesting look from the two of them. I looked them straight in the face and said "you didn't ask to search my cooler". They spun on their heels and went to the next truck. DOW guys just laughed. I was pretty upset that they thought that they could just start looking through my stuff and wondered if I let them where would it stop? | |||
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