I hate to jump in, here, but I will.
This business of black vs. white governance is misplaced. Going back to colonial days is ludicrous. With one exception.
What allows any government to work for its people is rule of law. That goes back to the Magna Carta, the notion that the king (government) has to obey the law. We got it from the Brits.
That vestige of colonialism should not have been lost, and I don't know how it can be recovered. Perhaps it is a cultural problem?
It has been a constant struggle to keep rule of law in our own republic over the last couple hundred years, and it actually is part of our culture.

Marty

I'm not suggesting & have never suggested going back to the colonial days of white rule.

My argument is simply that every African country that has been given independent rule has stuffed it up & that ALL standards in ALL African countries that has been given independent rule has seen a steady decline since that time.

Oh and also that African problems will never be solved by western solutions or political correctness.

My point is that rule of law, politically speaking, is the only thing separating man from beast. That is what is missing from colonial days. I think that is what you pine for, as we all do.
Lack of this fundamental principle is what allowed Stalin and Mugabe to happen. It is what prevents good men from acting effectively. It is what creates "Might makes Right."
If that counts as a western solution, or political correctness, then things there are truly hopeless. If so ,you are right as rain.

I certainly take your point completely but I'm not sure I pine for the old days anymore........... but I do get mucking fad when I see how the fidiot African politicians have so comprehensively & unnecessarily destroyed what could & should be the finest continent on the planet.

What makes it even worse is the fact the weak willed, pig ignorant, politically correct morons in the western world have not only stood by & let it happen, they've also taken active steps to help it happen!

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
I do agree with one thing. The " call a spade a spade" comment was out of line. The modified picture of Mugabe is also out of line.


Hey Larry, perhaps you and others have WAY mis-understood my "spade a spade" comment. I'm referring to call the "truth the truth", call an "apple and apple", etc, etc. Frankly, I'm not sure how else that would be interpreted? I did not realize "spade" was a bad word????? If you're un-sure of someone's meaning/insinuation, simply ask for clarification, before condemning their words!!!

Aaron Neilson
Global Hunting Resources
www.globalhuntingresources.com
globalhunts@aol.com
303-619-2872

Well, I know this has moved on a bit - but I still wanted to go back an offer up an apology.

One of the other AR members informed me that the word "spade" can also be a deragatory word for blacks, something I was NOT aware of. In my call a "spade a spade" comment, I was referring to calling the "truth the truth", and nothing more.

So I have removed the comment, and I apologize if it was offensive. It was not meant as such, and I had never heard of the word "spade" used in that context before, so my apologies to all.

Aaron Neilson
Global Hunting Resources
www.globalhuntingresources.com

You gotta be kidding me, some of you guys are a bunch of vaginas.
Aaron, you used the euphemism because your elders used it, their elders used it and their elders used it, for nearly 500 years. See below link, please note last paragraph.
no need to be a vadge
And no need to feel special, I know why you said it (I was the one who intentionaly shined a nasty light on it), and the vadges that are accusing and squeezing an apology out of you know it to. Which means they see nothing more than an opportunity to satisfy some sick craving they have of exerting force over another man in front of others. Personally, the behaviour I would expect to see in a room full of women, I believe the term is "cattiness", or "bitchy" if you prefer the other species. Or, maybe they don't really know what it means, which would indicate a fairly high level of ignorance.
Oh, and Larry, you got my intent on my avatar correct.

Further to my previous post (see below) I'll add that the Botswana Government that Kim is so keen to hold up as a shining example of how successful African Govts can be, has sooooo little foresight, it's (as mentioned previously) not only banning hunting at a time it's awash with elephants, it's also diverting the Delta floodwaters to the mining industries so it can get more money, faster but doesn't care that once the Delta & the game therein has gone, it's gone for good. Finish & klaar......... Great example of farsighted governance of natural resources huh!

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
The reason Botswana went from low to high GDP so quickly is that when it was a Protectorate most of it couldn't produce much. Water was short in most of the country, soil was more sand than anything else & there was relatively little interest in tourism or anything else.

Then came independence and as many whites as possible were kicked out and soon after, umpteen treasures from copper to diamonds was found in a variety of places.

And that's why GDP went from virtually bugger all to quite reasonable in such a short time. It had nothing whatsoever to do with the new Government managing the country better but it has allowed them to use the additional income to act as a buffer to their own inefficiency & collapse of even the most basic infrastructures.

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
I certainly take your point completely but I'm not sure I pine for the old days anymore........... but I do get mucking fad when I see how the fidiot African politicians have so comprehensively & unnecessarily destroyed what could & should be the finest continent on the planet.

What makes it even worse is the fact the weak willed, pig ignorant, politically correct morons in the western world have not only stood by & let it happen, they've also taken active steps to help it happen!

quote:

Originally posted by shakari:
The reason Botswana went from low to high GDP so quickly is that when it was a Protectorate most of it couldn't produce much. Water was short in most of the country, soil was more sand than anything else & there was relatively little interest in tourism or anything else.

Then came independence and as many whites as possible were kicked out and soon after, umpteen treasures from copper to diamonds was found in a variety of places.

And that's why GDP went from virtually bugger all to quite reasonable in such a short time. It had nothing whatsoever to do with the new Government managing the country better but it has allowed them to use the additional income to act as a buffer to their own inefficiency & collapse of even the most basic infrastructures.

Steve:

Well, maybe I am a "weak willed, pig ignorant, politically correct moron", but I'm not willing to ignore facts just so I can cling to a decaying memory of the good ol' days. But are you so intrenched in your hatred of black-led governments that you feel compelled to invent 'facts' to support your position? What you are saying is simply not accurate.

For example, upon its independence, your statement, "as many whites as possible were kicked out" of Botswana is an out-an-out lie. No such expulsion occurred. Neither history books nor my discussions with whites who lived through the independence period and remain there to this day agree with what you are saying. Even independent organizations highly critical of revolutionary leaders like Mugabe have attested to the fact that Botswana strove for racial harmony following independence - because they saw it as vital to their survival as a new country.

According to Scott Beaulier, an economist at Beloit College, Botswana's first President “adopted pro-market policies on a wide front. His new government promised low and stable taxes to mining companies, liberalized trade, increased personal freedoms, and kept marginal income tax rates low to deter tax evasion and corruption.” And the American Enterprise Institute, a free-market think tank that has assailed Mugabe and his regime, wrote, "Botswana benefited greatly from the human and financial capital of her large white community, which totals 7 percent of the overall population." It is surely a sign of Botswana’s relative comfort with racial diversity that in April, 2008, Ian Khama, the first-born son of the country’s founder, took over the reigns of power in Botswana, thus becoming the first half-white leader of an African democracy. (His mother was white.)

To your point as to whether the governing elite are better off than their citizens? Like most countries, including the United States, yes. However, as Robert Guest of The Economist (a periodical hardly thought to be a sop for the political left) noted in his 2004 book, The Shackled Continent, “In the last 35 years, Botswana’s economy has grown faster than any other in the world. Yet, cabinet ministers have not awarded themselves mansions and helicopters — and even the president has been seen doing his own shopping.”

President Khama chose to embrace the free market and limited government at a time when Marxism seemed to be on an unstoppable march in other African countries, probably another fact that you will sneer at as unimportant or untrue from your experience. The fact that property rights and anti-nationalization language is incorporated into Botswana's constitution is one of the reasons the economy is so healthy. Do natural resources play a role in that country's prosperity? Of course, just as it does in countries like Norway, Canada, US, and UAE, to mention only a few. But mineral exploitation only accounts for 33% of GDP - less than many prosperous western countries.

There is much that could be improved in Botswana, and I don't hold it as a paragon of political virtue. However, your constant refrain that every African country has been run into the ground following independence is quite simply untrue. A fidelity to human rights, free press, universal suffrage, open elections, free-market economics, low corruption, protection of property rights, and a preparedness to partner with white citizens who often hold the key to a healthy business climate, are the keys to success in Africa. Botswana has done most of that relatively well, and should be a model for basket cases like Zimbabwe.

quote:

Originally posted by 505 gibbs:

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
I do agree with one thing. The " call a spade a spade" comment was out of line. The modified picture of Mugabe is also out of line.

You gotta be kidding me, some of you guys are a bunch of vaginas.
Aaron, you used the euphemism because your elders used it, their elders used it and their elders used it, for nearly 500 years. See below link, please note last paragraph.
no need to be a vadge
And no need to feel special, I know why you said it (I was the one who intentionaly shined a nasty light on it), and the vadges that are accusing and squeezing an apology out of you know it to. Which means they see nothing more than an opportunity to satisfy some sick craving they have of exerting force over another man in front of others. Personally, the behaviour I would expect to see in a room full of women, I believe the term is "cattiness", or "bitchy" if you prefer the other species. Or, maybe they don't really know what it means, which would indicate a fairly high level of ignorance.

Oh, and Larry, you got my intent on my avatar correct.

505 gibbs:

Regardless of what I said about you and your loathsome avatar in my earlier post, I do have to acknowledge my respect for someone who so openly and honestly embraces their personal bigotry. On the internet, no less! Most people shy away from so explicitly exposing such an ugly side to their character, but you wear it on your sleeve - much like your avatar - for everyone to gawk at!

Now I know it's not much of a compliment, coming as it does from what you see as a 'sick, catty, bitchy, ignorant vagina' (and who others have called "and enemy from within" and a "weak willed, pig ignorant, politically correct moron"). So take it for what it's worth.

Kim - One thing that I find interesting as it pertains to Khama is, despite being raised hand in hand with the Blackbeard family, he's a staunch anti-hunter, believing photographic safaris all throughout Bots and other countries are the way forward for the wildlife. Thus the almost nationwide closure of hunting by the month's end. Interestingly enough, he's also a large share-holder in Wilderness Safaris, one of the continent's largest photographic safari companies! I think it would be a stretch to assume he too does not make any major decisions without some consideration to his financial benefit, or lack there of.

I have hunted Botswana on numerous occasions, and yes, its alot better off than places like Zim. But, considering the country's huge wealth in resources such as diamonds, and its relatively small population - its clear when visiting the many rural areas throughout the country that most of that wealth is NOT reaching the locals!!

You certainly are very articulate, that's clear in your posts - and obviously you have obtained info/facts that you find valuable/helpful. I on the other hand, similar to Shakari who lived in Africa for many years, will rely on my 31 trips - over 17 yrs to the dark continent, as my guide to how I feel about the subject. I simply believe that most native Africans have little to NO compassion/care/concern for their fellow man, despite his color, and Zim is the best example of that, there is at the moment. I especially believe that, when some of them tell me the very same thing. Considering the examples like Zim over the past 10 years in particular, and the many other African regimes that have behaved the exact same way towards their countrymen in the past 30 yrs - I seriously don't understand how some fail to recognize that as truth?

Kim

The comment "weak willed, pig ignorant, politically correct moron" wasn't directed at you particularly but hey, if you think the cap fits, be my guest & wear it.

I haven't invented any facts at all...... despite the PC claims, Bots was very quick to get rid of the whites when it could. As an example, a friend of mine was station commander at Baine's Drift Police Station (Tuli Block) until independence & they cancelled his visa very quickly indeed & he & his family had to move to RSA PDQ where he became an ivory dealer...... That's just one example that I personally know of but there were plenty more.

The rest of your post is pure drivel that yet again, you've trawled from the internet....... If things are so good in Botswana please tell me why a significant percentage of the people are so very poor, sick, uneducated, lacking in even the most basic of facilities & so many of the roads are so shite?

When the country claims a "preparedness to partner with white citizens who often hold the key to a healthy business climate" it means they want a share of the action for mahala. As an example, I have a good friend here in PT who recently sold his thriving business in Botswana & moved here because he was told he had to take in a local partner (nominated by the Govt (surprise, surprise)) & give him half the business he'd worked so hard to build. He sensibly decided to sell out while he had !00% of his business to sell rather than 50% after giving half away & voetsak instead.

If the country has such a "fidelity to low corruption" please tell me why I've had to pay a bribe or leave a haunch of kudu etc at the customs post every time I've gone in or out for the last 25 years or so?

As for Khama & helicopters..... he doesn't need one of his own because his Govt have several & when he wants one, he usually whistles up 3. One for him & the others to escort him...... I've seen it several times...... & I can also tell you he doesn't expect to be given the bill when he & his escorts drop in somewhere for a bit of 'hospitality' either.

If you want to talk about what should be a model for "basket cases like Zimbabwe", you could even nominate Somalia, the Titanic or a 3 ring circus as good examples to aim for.

Life is easy when things are so black and white, eh petey? Who is the bigot?

Zanu PF officials in wildlife bribes scam
http://www.dailynews.co.zw

Sunday, 09 September 2012 13:18
HARARE - Willy Pabst, the Germany industrialist and hunting enthusiast who
has been leading a campaign to save wildlife sanctuary, the Save Valley
Conservancy, from occupation by Zanu PF officials has made sensational
claims that party stalwarts have been asking for bribes from owners of the
targeted conservancies.

Pabst has been leading a public campaign through a series of newspaper
adverts to save the conservancies that he himself invested in way back in
1993.

He told the Daily News on Sunday that a clique of “greedy” Zanu PF officials
have openly approached owners of wildlife ranches demanding bribes ranging
from $10 000 to $100 000 in exchange for permits issued to them by the
National Parks and Wildlife.

“There were 25 people who were given hunting permits each for about $5 500.
They have been coming to us asking for money in exchange for the permits,”
said Pabst in a telephone interview from his Cape Town base.

“They have been asking for money from my colleagues and business partners.”

The country’s wildlife authority says the move to parcel out wildlife
ranches to Zanu PF officials is necessary to empower blacks in this
multi-million dollar sector.

The takeover of the conservancies has set Zanu PF cabinet ministers against
each other.

Tourism minister Walter Mzembi is fighting in the conservationists’ corner
while minister of Environment Francis Nhema is pushing for the accommodation
of black people in the sector.

Mzembi argues the takeovers are tarnishing Zimbabwe’s image ahead of the
United Nations World Tourism Organisation general assembly to be co-hosted
with Zambia next year.

Nhema, on the other hand, says the indigenisation of the white dominated
wildlife sector takes precedence over the tourism indaba.

According to Pabst, indigenisation is being used as a front for looting by
President Robert Mugabe’s cronies.

“This is not indigenisation. This is a group of 25 people who are determined
to enrich themselves by destroying wildlife at the expense of the
communities that are benefitting from Save Valley projects,” said Pabst.

He claimed the Zanu PF officials who were recently issued with leases and
hunting quotas openly declared that they are not interested in the wildlife
business and are willing to step aside if a bribe with the right figures
comes their way.

Asked how the businessmen responded to the alleged requests for bribes,
Pabst said, “We could not entertain such mafia style operations. It is
blackmail and we cannot run businesses based on blackmail. This has nothing
to do with indigenisation.”

Pabst claims in his newspaper adverts that thousands of livelihoods are
threatened in the 2 600 square kilometre nature reserve and surrounding
districts.

“When humans behave like animals, we destroy not only each other but
generations to come,” the adverts read, adding that politicians “want to
destroy agreements and policies that have made Save the world leader in
conservation management.”

One of the alleged bribe seekers, former deputy minister and Zanu PF top
notch Shuvai Mahofa, described the accusations as “rubbish”. “That is
rubbish. It is stupid and ndezvavo izvozvo izvo (they can go to hell),” she
said when approached for comment by the Daily News on Sunday.

“I entered into a contract with Terry and we agreed that we are going to
work together and we have been working together very well for a year now but
this Pabst then came and influenced Terry not to work with me and that is
when the problem started,” said Mahofa.

“We agreed to put money into the business and that is why I have taken these
whites to court. I am suing them for breach of contract. Hunting costs me
$84 000 and that is the money that I want Terry to contribute. “I do not
care what they say because I am now in business and making money. We have
freed Zimbabwe from these Germans and Italians,” said Mahofa.

Save Valley Conservancy is a habitat for elephant, zebra, giraffe, as well
as the nation’s second largest surviving population of endangered black
rhinoceros.

The area also supports an array of African antelope and most species of
birds and small animals.

Several nearby communities also benefit in the form of employment and
conservation efforts.

The German government recently gave $30 million to the Kavango-Zambezi
Transfrontier Conservation Area to help regional countries boost wildlife
conservation efforts and curb poaching but Zimbabwe was excluded from the
fund because of its failure to protect wildlife.

Being PC and a vage will not solve anything LOL

Shakari,

You have said it so many time on this thread that you don't support going back to the white rule, yet you can not let an opportunity go by to slam the majority rule while reminding us how much better it was back in the days.

At least three times you have mentioned with certainty that political correctness and western thinking are not the solution, but when I asked you what in your opinion the solution was, you said you didn't know.

I find it hard to believe that you have not given any thoughts to the solution.

I think your British dimplomacy is not working in this thread.

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Shakari,

You have said it so many time on this thread that you don't support going back to the white rule, yet you can not let an opportunity go by to slam the majority rule while reminding us how much better it was back in the days.

At least three times you have mentioned with certainty that political correctness and western thinking are not the solution, but when I asked you what in your opinion the solution was, you said you didn't know.

I find it hard to believe that you have not given any thoughts to the solution.

I think your British dimplomacy is not working in this thread.

Harris,

you ve got the answer but you didnt see ???!!! where Shakari is located now? ans many of white south africans that had the choice they didnt stay because there is no solution especially coming from the western world.

i lived in CAR but was not born there but i can feel why people dont stay, coming on a safari will not give you all the answers, living on a longer basis wont give you the answers but at least you got some clues.

Phil

Damned facts getting in the way of liberal logic.


(11) The mean intelligence of blacks is much lower than for whites. The least intelligent ten percent of whites have IQs below 81; forty percent of blacks have IQs that low. Only one black in six is more intelligent than the average white; five whites out of six are more intelligent than the average black. These differences show in every test of general cognitive ability that anyone, of any race or nationality, has yet been able to devise. They are reflected in countless everyday situations. “Life is an IQ test.”

http://takimag.com/article/the.../print#ixzz261thHhG6

Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

double post... deleted

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

Harris,

You are absolutely correct, Asians do score higher. I'm okay with Asians running Africa, they surely couldn't do any worse than the blacks have done.

BTW, name one country, city, school board, company, lemonade stand, or anything else anywhere in the world that blacks have successfully managed. I won't hold my breath awaiting an answer because we all know it has NEVER happened, though almost everyone is afraid to state that fact and most, like KPete, are apologists for black underachievement who choose instead to blame the problems of blacks on whites. I nurse no such guilt complex and am happy to call "a spade a spade" with no apologies.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

Harris,

You are absolutely correct, Asians do score higher. I'm okay with Asians running Africa, they surely couldn't do any worse than the blacks have done.

BTW, name one country, city, school board, company, lemonade stand, or anything else anywhere in the world that blacks have successfully managed. I won't hold my breath awaiting an answer because we all know it has NEVER happened, though almost everyone is afraid to state that fact and most, like KPete, are apologists for black underachievement who choose instead to blame the problems of blacks on whites. I nurse no such guilt complex and am happy to call "a spade a spade" with no apologies.

Gentlemen:

My disappointment has changed to disgust.

This thread is becoming a clarion call for the most unsavory among us. Several of you have been skirting perilously close to the vile and abhorrent conclusions your brother Robert has now committed to writing. I'm sure many AR members who have been silent on this issue will now wait for either your repudiations of such ugly and uncivilized rhetoric or your silent acquiescence and presumed concurrence.

As hunters and as members of AR, we should all be embarrassed by this ...

KPete,

Which of the facts I posted do you care to dispute and how do you propose to do so or are ad hominen attacks all that remain in your arsenal?

You have been compared on this thread to a vagina. I think that is a very unfair comparison. I have been intimately familiar with a few vaginas over the years and can say I enjoyed my acquaintance with each of them immensely and to compare a whiny, hand-wringing, politically-correct wimp like you to a vagina is grossly unfair to vaginas everywhere.

Your disappointment has changed to disgust? I am disappointed that you are such a politically correct fool.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

Harris,

You are absolutely correct, Asians do score higher. I'm okay with Asians running Africa, they surely couldn't do any worse than the blacks have done.

BTW, name one country, city, school board, company, lemonade stand, or anything else anywhere in the world that blacks have successfully managed. I won't hold my breath awaiting an answer because we all know it has NEVER happened, though almost everyone is afraid to state that fact and most, like KPete, are apologists for black underachievement who choose instead to blame the problems of blacks on whites. I nurse no such guilt complex and am happy to call "a spade a spade" with no apologies.

This is getting ridiculous. A successful company or a lemonade stand you say? I am sure Chris Garder, Oprah, Quincy jones, Magic Johnson, Sean Combs and George Foreman can answer your question. I really hope it's George.

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

Harris,

You are absolutely correct, Asians do score higher. I'm okay with Asians running Africa, they surely couldn't do any worse than the blacks have done.

BTW, name one country, city, school board, company, lemonade stand, or anything else anywhere in the world that blacks have successfully managed. I won't hold my breath awaiting an answer because we all know it has NEVER happened, though almost everyone is afraid to state that fact and most, like KPete, are apologists for black underachievement who choose instead to blame the problems of blacks on whites. I nurse no such guilt complex and am happy to call "a spade a spade" with no apologies.

This is getting ridiculous. A successful company or a lemonade stand you say? I am sure Chris Garder, Oprah, Quincy jones, Magic Johnson, Sean Combs and George Foreman can answer your question. I really hope it's George.

Zimbabwe, Congo, Uganda, Rwanda, Kenya, RSA, Haiti, Detroit, New Orleans, Washington DC, Dekalb County GA, Clayton County GA, Fulton County GA, etc, etc and on and on...

Would you move to a black ruled area and if so where?

I 100% percent guarantee you do not live in a black governed municipality nor do you live amongst them. Please prove me wrong, I live with them in the South, where do you live? We have 3 million blacks in my state and I know what it is like to live with them. I just laugh when liberal dipshits like you, living in white America, lecture us Southerners on race relations. You have not a fucking clue.

Also, please provide proof that the graphs I posted are incorrect. You posted that Asians score higher on IQ tests than Europeans, which I agree with, yet when I posted that whites score higher than blacks that is apparently racist and offensive according to you although what I posted is essentially the same logically as what you posted, substitute Asian for black and we made essentially the same assertion.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

Harris,

You are absolutely correct, Asians do score higher. I'm okay with Asians running Africa, they surely couldn't do any worse than the blacks have done.

BTW, name one country, city, school board, company, lemonade stand, or anything else anywhere in the world that blacks have successfully managed. I won't hold my breath awaiting an answer because we all know it has NEVER happened, though almost everyone is afraid to state that fact and most, like KPete, are apologists for black underachievement who choose instead to blame the problems of blacks on whites. I nurse no such guilt complex and am happy to call "a spade a spade" with no apologies.

This is getting ridiculous. A successful company or a lemonade stand you say? I am sure Chris Garder, Oprah, Quincy jones, Magic Johnson, Sean Combs and George Foreman can answer your question. I really hope it's George.

Zimbabwe, Congo, Uganda, Rwanda, Kenya, RSA, Haiti, Detroit, New Orleans, Washington DC, Dekalb County GA, Clayton County GA, Fulton County GA, etc, etc and on and on...

Would you move to a black ruled area and if so where?

I 100% percent guarantee you do not live in a black governed municipality nor do you live amongst them.

First I thought I'd ignore it, Then I thought about writing a list of many Eastern European countries, failed businesses, almost bankrupt U.S counties and several failed school districts but honestly I don't know how many of them are run by whites and how many by blacks, latinos or the purple martians.

Your problem is that you see incompetence and associate it with race. When I see it I associate it with incompetent people. I guess we can't change ourselves.

It did remind me of a wonderful Paul Robeson spiritual that goes something like, some come crippled and some come lame, bear the burden in the heat of the day.

I guess you and I will have to live with our burdens.

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Alright Robert, You have pretty much closed the debate. How can anyone argue with IQ studies?

Well I have a better idea, since East Asians have scored higher than Europeans in several I.Q studies, may be we should ask them to run Africa or the world for that matter?

Harris,

You are absolutely correct, Asians do score higher. I'm okay with Asians running Africa, they surely couldn't do any worse than the blacks have done.

BTW, name one country, city, school board, company, lemonade stand, or anything else anywhere in the world that blacks have successfully managed. I won't hold my breath awaiting an answer because we all know it has NEVER happened, though almost everyone is afraid to state that fact and most, like KPete, are apologists for black underachievement who choose instead to blame the problems of blacks on whites. I nurse no such guilt complex and am happy to call "a spade a spade" with no apologies.

This is getting ridiculous. A successful company or a lemonade stand you say? I am sure Chris Garder, Oprah, Quincy jones, Magic Johnson, Sean Combs and George Foreman can answer your question. I really hope it's George.

Zimbabwe, Congo, Uganda, Rwanda, Kenya, RSA, Haiti, Detroit, New Orleans, Washington DC, Dekalb County GA, Clayton County GA, Fulton County GA, etc, etc and on and on...

Would you move to a black ruled area and if so where?

I 100% percent guarantee you do not live in a black governed municipality nor do you live amongst them.

First I thought I'd ignore it, Then I thought about writing a list of many Eastern European countries, failed businesses, almost bankrupt U.S counties and several failed school districts but honestly I don't know how many of them are run by whites and how many by blacks, latinos or the purple martians.

Your problem is that you see incompetence and associate it with race. When I see it I associate it with incompetent people. I guess we can't change ourselves.

It did remind me of a wonderful Paul Robeson spiritual that goes something like, some come crippled and some come lame, bear the burden in the heat of the day.

I guess you and I will have to live with our burdens.

A wonderful spiritual...are you fucking kidding me? Do you have any clue what it is like to live with blacks in great numbers? Are you really that stupid??

You have no burden, you love the blacks from a distance. I see you chose not to answer my questions about living amongst blacks and you also chose not to address most of the remainder of my reply to you.

It is easy to love blacks when one doesn't live amongst them. I am happy for you in that regard as they are tiresome but please spare us Southerners your self-righteous lecturing, we've been listening to your shit for 200 years and are sick of it. If you love the blacks so much please send me your address and I will be happy to box up and send you a couple million of them, we have plenty of them and it sounds like you have a shortage.

Since you added the question of I.Q later in your post, I would address it separately. First of all there is a huge divergence in the views of psychologists about the accuracy of group studies regarding I.Q.

If you are ready to educate yourself about the subject, you should look into separate studies done by professor Sternberg and Brody. You will find out the limitations of I.Q tests.

If you would rather use tiki magazine articles for your education then don't bother.

P.S I live in Los Angeles

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

You have no burden, you love the blacks from a distance. I see you chose not to answer my questions about living amongst blacks and you also chose not to address most of the remainder of my reply to you.

It is easy to love blacks when one doesn't live amongst them. I am happy for you in that regard as they are tiresome but please spare us Southerners your self-righteous lecturing, we've been listening to your shit for 200 years and are sick of it. If you love the blacks so much please send me your address and I will be happy to box up and send you a couple million of them.

I'm a Southerner. I'm a Republican. I live around all sorts of people. I'd also like to think of myself as a decent human being. All that said, I'd like to box you up and send you back to the Andromeda Galaxy.

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

You have no burden, you love the blacks from a distance. I see you chose not to answer my questions about living amongst blacks and you also chose not to address most of the remainder of my reply to you.

It is easy to love blacks when one doesn't live amongst them. I am happy for you in that regard as they are tiresome but please spare us Southerners your self-righteous lecturing, we've been listening to your shit for 200 years and are sick of it. If you love the blacks so much please send me your address and I will be happy to box up and send you a couple million of them.

I'm a Southerner. I'm a Republican. I live around all sorts of people. I'd also like to think of myself as a decent human being. All that said, I'd like to box you up and send you back to the Andromeda Galaxy.

I'm not a decent human being because I referenced uncomfortable studies which have been proven as fact? I'd like to box you up and send you to South Atlanta, you'd last about 5 minutes without a sidearm.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

You have no burden, you love the blacks from a distance. I see you chose not to answer my questions about living amongst blacks and you also chose not to address most of the remainder of my reply to you.

It is easy to love blacks when one doesn't live amongst them. I am happy for you in that regard as they are tiresome but please spare us Southerners your self-righteous lecturing, we've been listening to your shit for 200 years and are sick of it. If you love the blacks so much please send me your address and I will be happy to box up and send you a couple million of them.

I'm a Southerner. I'm a Republican. I live around all sorts of people. I'd also like to think of myself as a decent human being. All that said, I'd like to box you up and send you back to the Andromeda Galaxy.

I'm not a decent human being because I referenced uncomfortable studies which have been proven as fact? I'd like to box you up and send you to South Atlanta, you'd last about 5 minutes without a sidearm.

I don't know you past your racist rants, so I can't make that call. But I certainly won't be buying you any Budweisers.

I guess you're referring to violence in ATL? Dude, I live/work in New Orleans. When's the last time you rolled through South ATL in your dually with the Confederate plates and were fired upon?

Maybe it's time the moderators close this thread!

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

You have no burden, you love the blacks from a distance. I see you chose not to answer my questions about living amongst blacks and you also chose not to address most of the remainder of my reply to you.

It is easy to love blacks when one doesn't live amongst them. I am happy for you in that regard as they are tiresome but please spare us Southerners your self-righteous lecturing, we've been listening to your shit for 200 years and are sick of it. If you love the blacks so much please send me your address and I will be happy to box up and send you a couple million of them.

I'm a Southerner. I'm a Republican. I live around all sorts of people. I'd also like to think of myself as a decent human being. All that said, I'd like to box you up and send you back to the Andromeda Galaxy.

I'm not a decent human being because I referenced uncomfortable studies which have been proven as fact? I'd like to box you up and send you to South Atlanta, you'd last about 5 minutes without a sidearm.

I don't know you past your racist rants, so I can't make that call. But I certainly won't be buying you any Budweisers.

I guess you're referring to violence in ATL? Dude, I live/work in New Orleans.

quote:

"When's the last time you rolled through South ATL in your dually with the Confederate plates and were fired upon?"

Bud, are you really that fucking stupid?"

I roll through the bad areas of Atlanta EVERYDAY with a 9mm CZ next to my leg and a backup Walther .380 in the console, a necessity. I spend my time in Decatur, College Park, East Point, Forest Park and the rest of the nigger infested Atlanta shitholes where my customers are located. Don't lecture me about Atlanta, I've lived here for many years.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

Bud, are you really that fucking stupid?"

I roll through the bad areas of Atlanta EVERYDAY with a 9mm CZ next to my leg and a backup Walther .380 in the console, a necessity. I spend my time in Decatur, College Park, East Point, Forest Park and the rest of the nigger infested Atlanta shitholes where my customers are located. Don't lecture me about Atlanta, I've lived here for many years.

And then came the million dollar word. Must have been painful keeping it in for this long.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Maybe it's time the moderators close this thread!

What dog do you have in this fight?

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

Bud, are you really that fucking stupid?"

I roll through the bad areas of Atlanta EVERYDAY with a 9mm CZ next to my leg and a backup Walther .380 in the console, a necessity. I spend my time in Decatur, College Park, East Point, Forest Park and the rest of the nigger infested Atlanta shitholes where my customers are located. Don't lecture me about Atlanta, I've lived here for many years.

And then came the million dollar word. Must have been painful keeping it in for this long.

The million dollar word. Yeah, NIGGER. You fucking pussy, you're afraid of a word, Fuck you.
I'm sick of niggers and their bullshit and even more so whiny PC pieces of shit like you. You're afraid of a word.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Maybe it's time the moderators close this thread!

Agreed. Long overdue.

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Maybe it's time the moderators close this thread!

Agreed. Long overdue.

You should go join the NAACP.

Do I see a "free Robert Wilde" icon on the forum in near future?

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
Maybe it's time the moderators close this thread!

Agreed. Long overdue.

You should go join the NAACP.

So angry and full of hate .... Good night, Robert. I hope tomorrow is better for you.

Also, please try not to burn down half of the ATL suburbs when your lab explodes because you paid too much attention to AR tonight.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:
Bud, are you really that fucking stupid?"

I roll through the bad areas of Atlanta EVERYDAY with a 9mm CZ next to my leg and a backup Walther .380 in the console, a necessity. I spend my time in Decatur, College Park, East Point, Forest Park and the rest of the nigger infested Atlanta shitholes where my customers are located. Don't lecture me about Atlanta, I've lived here for many years.
---
The million dollar word. Yeah, NIGGER. You fucking pussy, you're afraid of a word, Fuck you.
I'm sick of niggers and their bullshit and even more so whiny PC pieces of shit like you. You're afraid of a word.

This is directed to those of my friends on AR who I have been debating with over the last couple of days, and not to Robert Wilde.

When you find yourself believing against your better judgment that it's okay to characterize people because of their race or their heritage, bear in mind that remarks like Wilde's are where that slippery slope inevitably ends.

When some of you generalize by saying, "the black African is ..." you are ultimately directing that statement at every man, women, and child on the continent - and every black friend you've made on safari. Talk like that inevitably distills itself to where it becomes easy to savage and demean an entire race of people.

Germany, Cambodia, Rwanda are just a few places where good people first allowed themselves to become lazy and comfortable with cruel generalizations. But those seemingly innocent generalizations had consequences, and the pathway from a thoughtless slur to a lynching - and later a concentration camp oven - requires only time and circumstance ... and people who think like Robert Wilde.

I've been called a lot things in the past few days, descriptions of me that I wouldn't allow my 10-year old son to read. My eyes have been opened a bit regarding some of the people who frequent this board. I would never have imagined the hostility and intrenched bigotry that percolates beneath the surface of many with whom we interact with on AR. And over what? The simple notion that you can't judge a person - or a people - by the color of their skin.

What with Mr. Wilde's contribution, there's not much more for me to say.