I woke up to find this thread has degenerated from a heated but reasonably polite debate on how successful/unsuccessful independent rule in Africa has been into a mud slinging argument about skin colour that would be more at home in Political Forum.

I don't believe in hurling personal insults across the internet from the safety of a keyboard & screen & would like to point out that my comment "weak willed, pig ignorant, politically correct moron" wasn't directed at Kim (even though he thought it was).

Anyway, for now at least, the current argument has nothing to do with me and I'll tip my hat to those I've debated with here and leave the thread at least until it returns to a degree of sanity & politeness.

In closing, I don't believe independent rule in Africa has been a success & I do believe that it's entirely the fault of the black African politicians who had the opportunity to create a brilliantly successful continent (let alone country) & have instead enriched themselves in return for destroying every aspect of their respective countries and abusing their fellow citizens to the nth degree...... and no, I don't have the answers. If I did, I'd be head of the UN or in some other role of responsibility.

Ad Probus qui nihil sciunt,

scientiam tuam de Africa et eius rei politicae sunt nisl

a probus planto a magnus sonitus tamen tantum propono suus ignarus

Moderator, time to close this.

I have a safari booked in the Save for July & check this thread several times a day to check for any news on the Save whether it be good or bad.
Now it has deteriorated to a hostile argument with petty name calling.
What started out as information has now gone to opinions.
Moderators, please clean this mess up!

quote:

Originally posted by KPete:

I've been called a lot things in the past few days, descriptions of me that I wouldn't allow my 10-year old son to read. My eyes have been opened a bit regarding some of the people who frequent this board. I would never have imagined the hostility and intrenched bigotry that percolates beneath the surface of many with whom we interact with on AR over what? The simple notion that you can't judge a person - or a people - by the color of their skin.

What with Mr. Wilde's contribution, there's not much more for me to say.

Kim,
I know my words won't mean much but I have to say it before this thread gets locked and lost in archives. You presented your arguments very well and fought a multi pronged attack with brilliance.

I have been a member of this board since 2000 and have seen this issue come up time and again. A few people tried to explain the side you represent but were over powered and shut out by the other side. I have been one of them on more than one occasion and decided to just stay away from this one sided howling of a wolf pack. You have shown immense patience throughout and for that I tip my hat to you.

You are a credit to the Harvard name (Now I am judging you by the sweatshirt you were wearing in some pictures and not by the content of your character)

War veterans storm Mzembi’s office
http://www.thestandard.co.zw

September 10, 2012 in Local
WAR veterans on Friday stormed Minister of Tourism and Hospitality Industry,
Walter Mzembi’s offices demanding an explanation as to why the recent
allocation of conservancies to a few politicians was being resisted.

REPORT BY PATRICE MAKOVA
The former freedom fighters, led by Joseph Chinotimba, who is himself not a
veteran of Zimbabwe’s war of liberation, later had a change of heart after
the meeting and pledged to support plans by the government to broadly
empower communities living along the Save Valley Conservancy, rather than
individuals.

Chinotimba is one of the 25 Zanu PF politicians who were recently issued
with hunting permits and 25-year leases to run the conservancies in a move
which has been roundly condemned.
Mzembi confirmed that Chinotimba and other war veterans visited his offices
but he persuaded him to adopt a broad-based approach to the issue.

“Chinotimba now sees sense in a broad-based approach and has agreed to go to
Save Conservancy on Saturday (yesterday) together with Zimbabwe Tourism
Association Chief executive, Karikoga Kaseke to assess the situation there,”
Mzembi said.

Kaseke said it did not take long for Chinotimba to agree to the idea of
empowering communities.

He said Chinotimba was only worried that the hunting permits of the white
owners had expired, hence there were fears that they could go into poaching.
Kaseke said the visit to Save Valley was meant to assess the extent of
damage to tourism in the area.

Chinotimba also confirmed that he now fully supported efforts to come up
with new policies to deal with empowerment in conservancies.

“As war veterans, we will listen and follow whatever policies Mzembi and
Francis Nhema (Environment and Natural Resources minister) will put in place
as long as they benefit the people,” he said.

Chinotimba said while war veterans now agreed that whites should not be
kicked out of the conservancies, there was a need for them to co-exist with
blacks to avoid suspicions and counter suspicions over who was responsible
for rampant poaching in the area.

As the self-styled commander in chief of farm invasions, Chinotimba led a
violent campaign to forcibly remove whites from their farms from 2001.

Despite owning another farm in Mashonaland, he now wants to diversify into
conservancies, claiming that whites evicted his family from the Save Valley
back in the 1960s.

seems a bit strange that the leader of the "freedom fighters/war vets" is neither. also strange that this same "war vet" has already stolen a farm in Mashonaland and wants to expand his horizons.Steve GL, you think perhaps he is motivated by greed or am i just being a racist pig who refuses to recognize his legitimate "claim" to anything and everything he can get his hands on???? looking forward to your erudite defense of outright theft....

http://www.herald.co.zw/index....ocal-news&Itemid=131


Villagers face starvation in Save Valley

Tuesday, 11 September 2012 00:00

Sydney Kawadza Assistant News Editor

Villagers resettled in and around the Save Valley Conservancy are in urgent need of food aid after going for five years without proper harvests.
The villagers can, however, be saved by proceeds from the wildlife business in the conservancy although they profess ignorance that they could have such benefits.
The rainfall is too low for agricultural production and villagers resort to barter trade to get maize, sorghum, millet and vegetables. A villager can trade firewood for tomatoes that are re-sold to the communities.
Some of the villagers travel for up to 25 kilometres in search of water. In separate interviews recently, villagers in Chigwete and Ward 26 of Bikita District urged Government to intervene.
“The soils are very poor and the rains are not that favourable for agriculture. We are virtually starving,” Mrs Juliet Sibanda from Chigwete Resettlement Scheme said.
She said while they received assistance from Government through programmes such as Food for Work, more aid was needed in the area.
“We have no boreholes in the area. People walk for three hours to get water from a tap on one of the farms. It’s even more difficult for villagers that do not have cattle or donkeys or even scotchcarts,” she said.
Mrs Patience Meki from the same village said children were forced out of school early because of the high levels of poverty.
“The harvests have not been good for a long time. There is no agricultural production because of the poor rainfall. We sell firewood to areas such as Chibuwe and buy vegetables that we will re-sell to fellow villagers,” she said.
Mr Gift Masasa said lions had also wreaked havoc in the area.
“The lions attack our cattle and donkeys but we want to work with the farmers in the conservancy so that we benefit from the animals,” he said.
Ward chairman in Village 26 Mr Tangson Charuma said some farmers in the conservancy were not repairing their fences and the animals were escaping into villages. He said they expected some compensation if the animals destroyed their crops.
“We have written to the farmers in the conservancy to compensate us but nothing has been forthcoming. Some of the new farmers have neglected the fence around the conservancy,” he said.
Mr Charuma said the area urgently needed a dam so that they go into irrigation.
“We have a small weir but it has dried up and we have abandoned some of the projects we started. Our problems have also been compounded by poor cotton prices, which are not sustainable,” he said.

How about starting up a "Save Valley Trust Fund" to assist the population in need with what the Government can't provide.

The Minister for the Environment Francis Nhema would aptly be nominated as the Chairman of the Trust who will appropriately allocate funds to the more distressed zones of the SAVE.

It would be nice to see the likes of Harris, Nakihunter, KPete and SteveGL being the "founder members" of the fund.

quote:

Originally posted by fujotupu:
How about starting up a "Save Valley Trust Fund" to assist the population in need with what the Government can't provide.

The Minister for the Environment Francis Nhema would aptly be nominated as the Chairman of the Trust who will appropriately allocate funds to the more distressed zones of the SAVE.

It would be nice to see the likes of Harris, Nakihunter, KPete and SteveGL being the "founder members" of the fund.

I don't know if fujotupu is just being sarcastic or not, but giving Western Aid for a situation like this is a very bad idea. It keeps the locals pacified when they should be getting angry, makes it easier for the bad guys to continue and gives them another opportunity to siphon off some or most or all of the aid money.

The unspoken question in the midst of all this conversation is, what can one person do ?

My son and I leave Thursday for Zimbabwe. We were originally scheduled to hunt out of the Savuli camp. Now, our hunt has been moved to Sentinal, in the Limpopo area. This will be our last trip to that troubled land until some sort of sanity returns.

I will not see one more penny of my hunting budget go to the criminal enterprise which rules that nation. Yes, if we all stopped going, the operators and workers will be harmed. But, If the government is allowed to continue the extortion we see going on, the same end will result. Turning off the money spigot is the only way to make a difference.

It is said the geratest threat to the whitesis not the war vets but the Zimbabwe navy all of whom were semen at the time of the bush war.
dande Jack

The problem with aid going into Zimbabwe is that Mugabe and his thugs take the cream and then only pass on dribs and drabs to lower hierachy of the party faithful. Non card carrying folk can eat stones, starve and sh*t bricks while liberal twats stand around sipping martinis, name calling and congratulating themselves on their brainless open mindedness.

Kathi, thank you very much for the updates on this situation. I have my first safari booked in the save for 14, and am thankful there is plenty of time to come up with another plan.

everything should be fine by 2014. by then the new black owners will have invested large amounts in community development, anti-poaching patrols, fence repair and the other expensive things needed to run the conservancy properly. if they haven't, i am sure Steve GL and Kpete will make up any shortfall in the name of brotherly love and to keep the new owners happy.

jdollar

Let me correct you. That should be brothaly love.

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
everything should be fine by 2014. by then the new black owners will have invested large amounts in community development, anti-poaching patrols, fence repair and the other expensive things needed to run the conservancy properly. if they haven't, i am sure Steve GL and Kpete will make up any shortfall in the name of brotherly love and to keep the new owners happy.

That made me laugh. Thanks!!!

Harris, you an your like minded buddies are just useful idiots and you don't even know it. You throw that racism word around a lot at people but you sir are in fact the real bigot and racist. Just keep voting for Obama and convince yourself of how wonderful you are.

376,
You are not worth wasting words on. Have a good day.

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
376,
You are not worth wasting words on. Have a good day.

376 Steyr summed you up perfectly. Surely you voted for Dear Leader last time around to prove you weren't a racist so how about voting for someone else this time to prove you're not an idiot?


Also, awaiting your promised refutation of the IQ graphs which I posted previously and for your education that was not a "tiki" article but rather a piece authored by John Derbyshire, a well respected journalist, which was published in TakiMag the online journal of Taki Theodoracopulos another well-respected journalist with a long history. You're not as clever as you fancy yourself.

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
Since you added the question of I.Q later in your post, I would address it separately. First of all there is a huge divergence in the views of psychologists about the accuracy of group studies regarding I.Q.

If you are ready to educate yourself about the subject, you should look into separate studies done by professor Sternberg and Brody. You will find out the limitations of I.Q tests.

If you would rather use tiki magazine articles for your education then don't bother.

P.S I live in Los Angeles

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

quote:

Originally posted by Harris:
376,
You are not worth wasting words on. Have a good day.

376 Steyr summed you up perfectly. Surely you voted for Dear Leader last time around to prove you weren't a racist so how about voting for someone else this time to prove you're not an idiot?


Also, awaiting your promised refutation of the IQ graphs which I posted previously and for your education that was not a "tiki" article but rather a piece authored by John Derbyshire, a well respected journalist, which was published in TakiMag the online journal of Taki Theodoracopulos another well-respected journalist with a long history. You're not as clever as you fancy yourself.

It must be quite depressing to believe you are better than someone else simply due to your skin color, something you did not acheive but inherited.

I won't be voting for Obama, and can't comprehend most of his policies, but I certainly can appreciate some of his accomplishments (becoming the leader of the free world is impressive by any standard).

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman:

It must be quite depressing to believe you are better than someone else simply due to your skin color, something you did not acheive but inherited.

I won't be voting for Obama, and can't comprehend most of his policies, but I certainly can appreciate some of his accomplishments (becoming the leader of the free world is impressive by any standard).

Who said I believe I am better than someone else because of my skin color and how the hell did you come up with that assertion based upon what I posted in my response to Harris? I could be green, orange, or even lavender for all you know. I do know, however, that Obama did not become the leader of the free world because of his accomplishments but rather because of the color of his skin thanks to dipshits like you. To paraphrase you, in a backhanded manner, he occupies an office he did not achieve through his accomplishments but rather inherited because of his skin color. If you believe I am wrong please enlighten me as to what he accomplished prior to being elected President.

Let's see..

He never held a real job. He never started a business. He's never managed a business. He's never had to hire or fire people. He has no foreign policy experience. He has no economic expertise. Has no relevant experience of any kind, etc, etc. Just what the hell is he qualified to do?

BUT!!!! He was a community organizer, whatever the hell that is, I guess a person who goes about the ghetto registering welfare blacks to vote, was a one-term Illinois state senator, had two ghost-written books published about himself, and spent 172 days in the US Senate voting present and then ran for President.

Now there, as you say, are some accomplishments to appreciate.

Tell me you're not that stupid.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

Who said I believe I am better than someone else because of my skin color? I could be green, orange, or even lavender for all you know.

Don't know where I could have gotten that idea? Try rereading some of your prior posts regarding "IQ studies" and these real eye openers:

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

Bud, are you really that fucking stupid?"

I roll through the bad areas of Atlanta EVERYDAY with a 9mm CZ next to my leg and a backup Walther .380 in the console, a necessity. I spend my time in Decatur, College Park, East Point, Forest Park and the rest of the nigger infested Atlanta shitholes where my customers are located. Don't lecture me about Atlanta, I've lived here for many years.

quote:

Originally posted by Robert Wilde:

The million dollar word. Yeah, NIGGER. You fucking pussy, you're afraid of a word, Fuck you.
I'm sick of niggers and their bullshit and even more so whiny PC pieces of shit like you. You're afraid of a word.

Did I misquote you? These are your words .... get the picture?

Also, I think your talking points are from last election. Obama is now the President of the United States, which means he has a pretty tough job, manages the world's greatest economy (however poorly), executes people on foreign soil via drones, has to live with sending our children to fight and die for our country on foreign soil (not something I envy), and has 4 years of the highest level of foreign policy experience (regardless of how little I might like his decisions).

Oh, and this has nothing to do with Zimbabwe or the SAVE, so let's just move on.

Eye openers? Because I used the word "nigger? So that gives you carte blanche to discount everything I say and gives you a pass on refuting facts I have posted? Why don't you refute the IQ studies that I posted regarding racial differences in intelligence that you are attempting to use to smear as being a racist? You can't, and I dare to you to do so. Please, prove me wrong, I await your response.

As far as my points about Obama being from the last election, they are still relevant. You incognito Democrats infesting hunting and gun-related websites don't fool us. You always give yourselves away, go away. We know why you are here and what you are trying to do. Your hero, Obongo is still an unqualified, inexperienced, amateurish fraud and you and I both know it. Your words follow and they speak well to your being an idiot who hasn't a clue...

quote:

Originally posted by tygersman: Obama is now the President of the United States, which means he has a pretty tough job, manages the world's greatest economy (however poorly), executes people on foreign soil via drones, has to live with sending our children to fight and die for our country on foreign soil (not something I envy), and has 4 years of the highest level of foreign policy experience (regardless of how little I might like his decisions).

Robert Wilde - As someone who knows "tygersman" personally, I'll assure you - he's not a democrat, did not vote for Obama, and will not be voting for him in November either. He's a good guy, who simply doesn't share some of the hard-core values that you do. He's well educated, intelligent, and simply has a softer side than some - but he's still on our side!

I on the other hand, think Obama is this country's greatest enemy since its inception! He was in fact voted in by the masses of morons that were dazzled by BS, rather than any factual/practical experience that would qualify one to lead the world's most powerful nation/economy. Painfully evident, by our continued financial struggle almost 4 yrs later. He HIMSELF is, and was, mentored by a known "socialist"! He's made blatant socialist statements many times, and the only difference between socialism and communism, is how you spell the word. His intent, as are all socialists/communists, like his buddy Hugo Chavez - is to be a dictator. And how do you do that? Drive the country to economic collapse, created a society of dependency, and then you have control!!! Never has a U.S. president created such divide between his own people, in this case, mainly the divide between the middle/upper class (class warfare). He's no community organizer, he's a community divider!! He's created tens of thousands of NEW "govt" jobs, all while the country continues to suffer from huge debt/financial struggle, a true sign of socialism. I could go on and on, but you get the point! Keep one thing in mind, Obama wasn't elected by the minority communites alone, they still are the minority, and would not have had the votes to get it done! He was instead, voted in by the middle/upper class "White Man", perhaps the dumbest of them ALL.

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
He HIMSELF is, and was, mentored by a known "socialist"! He's made blatant socialist statements many times, and the only difference between socialism and communism, is how you spell the word. His intent, as are all socialists/communists, like his buddy Hugo Chavez - is to be a dictator. And how do you do that? Drive the country to economic collapse, created a society of dependency, and then you have control!!! Never has a U.S. president created such divide between his own people, in this case, mainly the divide between the middle/upper class (class warfare). He's no community organizer, he's a community divider!! He's created tens of thousands of NEW "govt" jobs, all while the country continues to suffer from huge debt/financial struggle, a true sign of socialism. I could go on and on, but you get the point! Keep one thing in mind, Obama wasn't elected by the minority communites alone, they still are the minority, and would not have had the votes to get it done! He was instead, voted in by the middle/upper class "White Man", perhaps the dumbest of them ALL.

Geez Aaron, this rings a bell. Of course, I am living it, only on this side of the pond.

http://allafrica.com/stories/201209141275.html


Zimbabwe: Zanu-PF Technical Committee to Look Into Save Valley Conservancy Issues


By Lloyd Gumbo, 14 September 2012


The Zanu-PF Politburo has set up a technical committee to explore ways to deal with issues affecting operations at the Save Valley Conservancy.

Party spokesman Cde Rugare Gumbo yesterday said the committee would be made up of Local Government, Rural and Urban Development Minister Ignatius Chombo and Lands, Land Reforms and Resettlement Minister Herbert Murerwa.

Ministers Walter Mzembi (Tourism and Hospitality Industry) and Francis Nhema (Environment and Natural Resources Management) are also part of the committee.

Cde Gumbo, however, indicated that the party's supreme decision-making body outside congress would want the conservancy to be turned into a national park.

"The Politburo resolved that those ministers will meet soon to discuss issues around the Save Conservancy. They will provide us with the way forward but the thinking is to convert the conservancy into a national park," said Cde Gumbo. "If that succeeds, then it means those leases issued recently would fall away."

Cde Gumbo said the way forward would be guided by the committee's recommendations.

A group of indigenous recipients was recently issued with hunting permits and quotas by Government to engage interested hunters in the conservancy.

The storm has led to sharp divisions among Cabinet ministers. Minister Nhema has said the farmers should "play ball" and work with the partners. Minister Mzembi, however, called for a re-visit of the issuance of licences.

He said the conflict could jeopardise Zimbabwe's chances of successfully hosting the United Nations World Tourism Organisation general assembly set for August next year.

The new partners had been issued with 25-year leases in 2007 as beneficiaries of the Wildlife-based land reform programme.

The Zimbabwe Tourism Authority board also objected to this saying it was a ploy to empower a few individuals who benefited in other spheres of indigenisation programmes.

It urged Government to revoke the hunting permits issued to new partners and remove illegal settlers encroaching onto the conservancies.

http://allafrica.com/stories/201209140104.html


Zimbabwe: Zanu-PF Hawks Swoop on Mzembi


By Clemence Manyukwe, 12 September 2012


ZANU-PF hawks have zeroed in on their latest target, Tourism and Hospitality Minister Walter Mzembi who has proved to be a thorn in their backside following his opposition to the smash-and-grab-type of black economic empowerment in the volatile Masvingo province.

Viewed by many as among the moderates in President Robert Mugabe's government, the Masvingo South lawmaker has went off on a tangent with a number of hardliners in the revolutionary party who are now plotting to unseat him ahead of the next polls.

Mzembi stirred a hornet's nest within the fractious Masvingo Province, his home area, by opposing the parcelling out of hunting licenses at Save Conservancy to heavyweights within his party as opposed to empowering the surrounding communities.

His opposition has been taken as a personal attack by the beneficiaries of the hunting licenses who include Stan Mudenge, the Minister of Higher Education; Titus Maluleke, the Governor and Resident Minister for Masvingo Province; Lovemore Matuke, the Masvingo provincial chairperson for ZANU-PF; Josiah Hungwe, a ZANU-PF Politburo member; Shuvai Mahofa, a former Member of Parliament for Gutu South and others who were handed hunting leases at Save Conservancy.

The Tourism and Hospitality Minister has also treaded where angels fear by speaking out against ZANU-PF bigwigs closing in on opportunities accruing from the construction of Tokwe Murkosi Dam, on the edges of his constituency.

Hardliners in ZANU-PF now view Mzembi as an irritant. As a result, there are attempts to nationalise the provincial dispute to make it appear as if Mzembi is against ZANU-PF's empowerment drive.

Such attempts have failed to find takers in other provinces which are in support of broad-based economic empowerment that favours women, youths and the communities as well as those who fear mudding international sentiment ahead of the United Nations World Tourism Organisation general assembly to be co-hosted by Zimbabwe and Zambia next year.

Hardliners within the party are however, exploiting every opprtunity to get Mzembi out of their way.

ZANU-PF insiders said the hardliners have unleashed the party's agent provocateurs, the war veterans, to whip Mzembi into line but the former liberation war fighters were now said to have sold out after they bought into the Tourism Minister's arguments.

War veterans' leader, Joseph Chinotimba last week stormed Mzembi's offices in Harare demanding answers from the Masvingo South lawmaker but emerged out of the meeting a somewhat changed man, much to the chagrin of those baying for Mzembi's blood.

Although he vowed to stay put at Save Conservancy, Chinotimba told The Financial Gazette this week that he does not have any problems with Mzembi as he was appointed by President Mugabe, the patron of the war veterans.

The war veterans' leader previously clashed with Mzembi in 2009 and questioned his loyalty to the party after the latter criticised continued farm invasions that he said tarnished the country's image.

This week, Chinotimba pointed an accusing finger at the media for manufacturing differences between him and the Tourism Minister, threatening to lodge a complaint with the Joint Monit-oring and Implementation Com-mittee.

He however, said he does not see any sense in being disqualified from venturing into the safari industry on account of having already been empowered thro-ugh the land reform.

"Are you telling me that people who are benefitting from diamonds don't have farms? Animals are my diamonds, we are talking business," he said.

"Kumhuka ndokungoda kwangu (the safari business is my diamond). Those at Marange gave US$10 million to trusts and after shooting the rhinos I can also give US$10 million to chiefs. Those animals are my diamonds, there is no difference."

Seen as one of the few voices of reason in the inclusive government, Mzembi has spared no one in condemning lawlessness.

He has fortified his rear-end by winning the backing of traditional chiefs who are also fiercely opposed to the concentration of riches among an elite few.

To his advantage, some of his perceived nemesis such as Mahofa were rejected by the people at the last harmonised elections, and are currently languishing in the political wilderness.

Despite his political problems, he remains a popular figure within his constituency which he inherited from the late national hero and legal supremo, Eddison Zvobgo.

Mzembi this week confirmed the existence of a political plot against him.

"Resettlement is fraught with political mischief, a delimitation by default designed to politically eliminate Mzembi. I am alert to all this and my constituency will respond appropriately to imposition of new settlers in chiefs jurisdictional areas, in this particular case chief Nyajena (who) has new subjects while his people watch helplessly and landlessly," said Mzembi, without elaborating.

The turf wars between Mzembi and some of his colleagues in Masvingo dates back to several years ago.

In 2004, Mzembi was suspended from ZANU-PF on allegations of bringing the party's name into disrepute, but was later exonerated in a move that cleared him to contest the Masvingo South by election held in October of the same year.

Upon entering Parliament, he was appointed chairperson of the Parliamentary Committee on Agriculture, during which time he ruffled some features in the party through oversight roles on the executive at a time when the agriculture sector was collapsing.

In 2009, he lambasted war veterans for invading farms, drawing fire from the ex-combatants, with Chinotimba accusing him of being sympathetic to the Movement for Democratic Change (MDC-T) party headed by Prime Minister Morgan Tsvangirai.

Suspicions that he was aligned to the MDC-T swirled when he was selected to accompany the premier to the United States, when most of his fellow party members were and are still on American travel embargoes.

Last year, the minister stopped ZANU-PF youths from invading a local bird sanctuary, Kuimba Shiri, drawing him foes and friends in the process.

Born in Masvingo province in 1964, Mzembi has held various positions, both in the private sector and government.

Last year, he was exposed by WikiLeaks as some kind of a go between American diplomats and President Mugabe as the ZANU-PF leader allegedly sounded him on what the Americans were thinking.

Surprising that the local settlers, instead of moving to areas with higher rainfall, see the solution as settling on the game farms (where there is wood to cut and game to poach). This area should never have been resettled at all. When they are done it will be a dust bowl and everyone will be worse off.

Hats off to Mzembi for having some common sense and some giant macendes (cohones for those of you this side of the pond).

Wildlife is suffering in the safari areas as well. Poaching of elephant is almost out of control thanks to chinese buyers who could not care less about wildlife. While I was in Sengwa this last week, we found two poached ele and another hunter in the same area, hunting with Jannie Meyer, actually encountered poachers carrying wet tusks.

Unless there is a major change with this election, Zim is finished as a place for humans and animals alike to live. Where is the US gov't on that subject? Or do we only concern ourselves with Muslim countries now?

quote:

I on the other hand, think Obama is this country's greatest enemy since its inception! He was in fact voted in by the masses of morons that were dazzled by BS, rather than any factual/practical experience that would qualify one to lead the world's most powerful nation/economy. Painfully evident, by our continued financial struggle almost 4 yrs later. He HIMSELF is, and was, mentored by a known "socialist"! He's made blatant socialist statements many times, and the only difference between socialism and communism, is how you spell the word. His intent, as are all socialists/communists, like his buddy Hugo Chavez - is to be a dictator. And how do you do that? Drive the country to economic collapse, created a society of dependency, and then you have control!!! Never has a U.S. president created such divide between his own people, in this case, mainly the divide between the middle/upper class (class warfare). He's no community organizer, he's a community divider!! He's created tens of thousands of NEW "govt" jobs, all while the country continues to suffer from huge debt/financial struggle, a true sign of socialism. I could go on and on, but you get the point! Keep one thing in mind, Obama wasn't elected by the minority communites alone, they still are the minority, and would not have had the votes to get it done! He was instead, voted in by the middle/upper class "White Man", perhaps the dumbest of them ALL.

Aaron Neilson
Global Hunting Resources

and he's black

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
Robert Wilde - As someone who knows "tygersman" personally, I'll assure you - he's not a democrat, did not vote for Obama, and will not be voting for him in November either. He's a good guy, who simply doesn't share some of the hard-core values that you do. He's well educated, intelligent, and simply has a softer side than some - but he's still on our side!

I on the other hand, think Obama is this country's greatest enemy since its inception! He was in fact voted in by the masses of morons that were dazzled by BS, rather than any factual/practical experience that would qualify one to lead the world's most powerful nation/economy. Painfully evident, by our continued financial struggle almost 4 yrs later. He HIMSELF is, and was, mentored by a known "socialist"! He's made blatant socialist statements many times, and the only difference between socialism and communism, is how you spell the word. His intent, as are all socialists/communists, like his buddy Hugo Chavez - is to be a dictator. And how do you do that? Drive the country to economic collapse, created a society of dependency, and then you have control!!! Never has a U.S. president created such divide between his own people, in this case, mainly the divide between the middle/upper class (class warfare). He's no community organizer, he's a community divider!! He's created tens of thousands of NEW "govt" jobs, all while the country continues to suffer from huge debt/financial struggle, a true sign of socialism. I could go on and on, but you get the point! Keep one thing in mind, Obama wasn't elected by the minority communites alone, they still are the minority, and would not have had the votes to get it done! He was instead, voted in by the middle/upper class "White Man", perhaps the dumbest of them ALL.

Thanks for the kind words, Aaron. I enjoyed our "debates" very much. Hopefully, things will go well in November.

As Aaron is pointing out, there are more than enough policy issues with which to disagree with President Obama. There is no reason to to turn to the issue of race - it's simply morally repugnant and wrong. Even if some of the folks here can't understand that, hopefully, they'll understand that racism will only drive away any potential swing voters and ensure the States another four years of the guy you most despise.

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Originally posted by Scriptus:

quote:

Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
He HIMSELF is, and was, mentored by a known "socialist"! He's made blatant socialist statements many times, and the only difference between socialism and communism, is how you spell the word. His intent, as are all socialists/communists, like his buddy Hugo Chavez - is to be a dictator. And how do you do that? Drive the country to economic collapse, created a society of dependency, and then you have control!!! Never has a U.S. president created such divide between his own people, in this case, mainly the divide between the middle/upper class (class warfare). He's no community organizer, he's a community divider!! He's created tens of thousands of NEW "govt" jobs, all while the country continues to suffer from huge debt/financial struggle, a true sign of socialism. I could go on and on, but you get the point! Keep one thing in mind, Obama wasn't elected by the minority communites alone, they still are the minority, and would not have had the votes to get it done! He was instead, voted in by the middle/upper class "White Man", perhaps the dumbest of them ALL.

Geez Aaron, this rings a bell. Of course, I am living it, only on this side of the pond.

Yes, I believe you are - and I for one hate that for you and your family!

Aaron Neilson quote: Yes, I believe you are - and I for one hate that for you and your family![/QUOTE]

Thanks for the sympathy. With the Rand at 8.2 plus to the Greenback and the murder, mayhem and militancy on the mines and a government too bloody useless to do anything about it, I might well have to move to Shakari's barn and live there as a poor white.

You'll be very welcome mate..... and you'll have plenty of room!

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Originally posted by shakari:
You'll be very welcome mate..... and you'll have plenty of room!

Thanks mate, but be warned, I come with guns, a shit load of books and a cat!

Guns, books & furniture etc aren't a problem & I'm sure your cat & our two will learn to get along.

Do you come with good malt whisky though?

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Originally posted by shakari:
Guns, books & furniture etc aren't a problem & I'm sure your cat & our two will learn to get along.

Do you come with good malt whisky though?

Ooopps, that is per bottle and not case lots?

As long as we get to drink it, it'll be fine!