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USF&W upholds ban on Zim Elephant
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Service Confirms Suspension of the Import of Elephant Trophies from Zimbabwe


Following evaluation of all available information, the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has confirmed the suspension of the import of elephant trophies harvested in Zimbabwe on or after April 4, 2014, the date an interim suspension was announced. In response to that April announcement, the Government of Zimbabwe, non-government organizations, safari outfitters, professional hunter associations, and individuals provided the Service with additional information regarding the management and status of Zimbabwe’s elephant population. The Service has completed its review of this information and is unable to find that the killing of an elephant whose trophy is intended for import into the United States would enhance the survival of the species in the wild.



African elephants are protected under the U.S. Endangered Species Act, which contains a provision that requires the Service to make annual determinations as to whether the import of elephant trophies from each range country would enhance the survival of the species. Only if the Service is able to make such an enhancement finding for a country is the import of an African elephant trophy allowed. While documents provided to the Service identified broad policy goals and objectives for the management of Zimbabwe’s elephants, the information did not identify specific management activities or measurable outcomes.



To make an enhancement finding, the Service evaluates a number of factors including: 1) whether a country has a national or regional management plan; 2) whether that plan is being implemented fully; 3) the status of the elephant population and trends over time; 4) how the sport-hunting program has been incorporated into national/regional management strategies, particularly in light of data on population numbers and trends, levels of utilization (both legal and illegal), and ability to effectively implement hunting programs.



The decision to suspend import of elephant trophies from Zimbabwe will be re-evaluated in December 2014, or before if additional information is provided to address data gaps identified in this decision. For the complete text of the enhancement finding, please visit: http://www.fws.gov/internation...lephant-Zimbabwe.PDF.



For a list of frequently asked questions, please visit: http://www.fws.gov/internation...-hunted-trophies.pdf.


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Posts: 7624 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 05 February 2008Reply With Quote
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Idiots!
 
Posts: 1128 | Location: Zimbabwe | Registered: 22 June 2009Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Buzz Charlton:
Idiots!


Indeed!!


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Posts: 7624 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 05 February 2008Reply With Quote
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Very disappointing. While folks may want to be dismissive of litigation and other hard line approaches, seems to me efforts to take a more cooperative approach are certainly destined to failure. I find particularly galling the almost gratuitous, and certainly intended to be an in your face, statement that the agency is "unable to find that the killing of an elephant whose trophy is intended for import into the United States would enhance the survival of the species in the wild".


Mike
 
Posts: 21698 | Registered: 03 January 2006Reply With Quote
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Sadly, not surprised in any way by the news. Their initial decision wasn't based on fact so more facts aren't about to sway them.

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Posts: 22442 | Location: Occupying Little Minds Rent Free | Registered: 04 October 2012Reply With Quote
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I am surprised, very surprised.

I think there is more to this than meets the eye.
 
Posts: 12095 | Location: Orlando, FL | Registered: 26 January 2006Reply With Quote
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Anyone notice the true irony in the link I provided? At the top of the page it states...



Conserving the Nature of America


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Posts: 7624 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 05 February 2008Reply With Quote
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I'm disappointed but not in the least surprised and what's more, I'll bet a pound to a pinch of the brown stuff they'll also introduce a ban on lion within the next 12 months or so.






 
Posts: 12415 | Registered: 01 July 2002Reply With Quote
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Shame. thumbdown Wouldn't doubt it, Steve. Mad
 
Posts: 18561 | Registered: 04 April 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
I am surprised, very surprised.

I think there is more to this than meets the eye.


Of course there is Larry, you know that. Its called the Obama admin, and the head of the DOI.


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Posts: 4888 | Location: Boise, Idaho | Registered: 05 March 2009Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shakari:
I'm disappointed but not in the least surprised and what's more, I'll bet a pound to a pinch of the brown stuff they'll also introduce a ban on lion within the next 12 months or so.


Steve, don't talk like that bro!!! Frowner


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Posts: 4888 | Location: Boise, Idaho | Registered: 05 March 2009Reply With Quote
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3 things come to mind:

1. No surprise although I commend the forlorn hope effort to lobby congress.
2. Litigation is an option but it may be futile as well depending on the Judge we get. An analysis of potential Judges is no doubt being done now.
3. It may be that the best chance is to get Zimbabwe to change, which is proof of how hopeless a problem this is. It would be nice if we could present evidence of on the ground changes in Zimbabwe to a Judge who is not a born again animal rights proponent.

If I had money to bet, I would bet on Zim turning its back on us and reaching out to China. If I was running Zimbabwe that's what I would do. The US is too scatterbrained and emotional to deal with.
 
Posts: 1981 | Registered: 16 January 2007Reply With Quote
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Continued blatant disregard for Charter, Mission, Scientific facts, and common sense.
The bureaucrats will be our downfall...
 
Posts: 1490 | Location: New York | Registered: 01 January 2010Reply With Quote
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Has the Zim govt turned in proper documentation? I doubt it. Not to take up for mike carpenter and the US fish and wildlife. But this happens to other countries when their documentation does not meet the agencies restrictive rules. I lost a sheep hunt for marco polo in Kirghizia a few years back. Got postponed for a year. The host country got it's act together and all was well. My guess is the piece of crap zim govt is to stupid and arrogant to think the bull shit requirements matter. Now the ph's and local communities will suffer due to zim stupidity, again!! if they get off their collective stupid asses this will be fixed in dec
 
Posts: 718 | Location: va | Registered: 30 January 2012Reply With Quote
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Lions and leopards will be next for sure. The face or fate of African hunting is changing rapidly. Everywhere in the world and even in Africa more and more people are gravitating to the bigger cities and towns, these folk have less to do with wild life and don't understand how hunting can save wildlife. Which is truly a bit of an alien concept unless you take the time to understand how killing something can save it! To a general city person anywhere in the world, how often does the well being or picture of any wild animal come in to their mental picture.

Pretty depressing all in all.

Don't put off your hunting plans, the opportunities are going fast.

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Posts: 2570 | Location: New York, USA | Registered: 13 March 2005Reply With Quote
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So very sad! Another depressing day for African and all hunting!
 
Posts: 2271 | Registered: 17 July 2003Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by brent ebeling:
Has the Zim govt turned in proper documentation? I doubt it. Not to take up for mike carpenter and the US fish and wildlife. But this happens to other countries when their documentation does not meet the agencies restrictive rules. I lost a sheep hunt for marco polo in Kirghizia a few years back. Got postponed for a year. The host country got it's act together and all was well. My guess is the piece of crap zim govt is to stupid and arrogant to think the bull shit requirements matter. Now the ph's and local communities will suffer due to zim stupidity, again!! if they get off their collective stupid asses this will be fixed in dec


The problem I have with what you are saying is that it ignores the fact that the Conference of the Parties under the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species has made a determination that the elephant population in Zimbabwe is sustainable with a quota of 500 animals (1000 tusks). The United States was first country that joined CITES in 1974. Our current President feels that we should be a member of the world community and take action collectively (a debatable proposition for sure, but the administration's position nonetheless), so why in this instance is the United States prepared to ignore the international community and take action inconsistent with the position of CITES? Or stated another way, why are we so presumptuous to believe that we know better than CITES what the export quotas from Zimbabwe should be?


Mike
 
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quote:
Originally posted by MJines:
quote:
Originally posted by brent ebeling:
Has the Zim govt turned in proper documentation? I doubt it. Not to take up for mike carpenter and the US fish and wildlife. But this happens to other countries when their documentation does not meet the agencies restrictive rules. I lost a sheep hunt for marco polo in Kirghizia a few years back. Got postponed for a year. The host country got it's act together and all was well. My guess is the piece of crap zim govt is to stupid and arrogant to think the bull shit requirements matter. Now the ph's and local communities will suffer due to zim stupidity, again!! if they get off their collective stupid asses this will be fixed in dec


The problem I have with what you are saying is that it ignores the fact that the Conference of the Parties under the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species has made a determination that the elephant population in Zimbabwe is sustainable with a quota of 500 animals (1000 tusks). The United States was first country that joined CITES in 1974. Our current President feels that we should be a member of the world community and take action collectively (a debatable proposition for sure, but the administration's position nonetheless), so why in this instance is the United States prepared to ignore the international community and take action inconsistent with the position of CITES? Or stated another way, why are we so presumptuous to believe that we know better than CITES what the export quotas from Zimbabwe should be?


Mike,

You also left out the fact that USF&W is an American agency with a mission statement to protect American animals.


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Posts: 7624 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 05 February 2008Reply With Quote
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This is very disappointing and truly shows that USFW is an absolute joke. We are all collectively preaching to the choir, sadly...


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Posts: 2981 | Location: Lexington, KY | Registered: 13 January 2005Reply With Quote
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Is this the final word then??
 
Posts: 6080 | Location: New York City "The Concrete Jungle" | Registered: 04 May 2003Reply With Quote
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Mike:

I the language used is very troubling:

"unable to find that the killing of an elephant whose trophy is intended for import into the United States would enhance the survival of the species in the wild"

You could apply the logic in reverse and be just as correct:

"We are unable to prove killing elephants by trophy hunters will impact the survival of the species in the wild."

It is all about poaching!

Talk about ecological colonialism...


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Posts: 7577 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Leopardtrack:
Is this the final word then??


From the cut and paste at the top....


"The decision to suspend import of elephant trophies from Zimbabwe will be re-evaluated in December 2014, or before if additional information is provided to address data gaps identified in this decision."


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Posts: 7624 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 05 February 2008Reply With Quote
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I don't think it's about conservation of the species or about poaching at all..... I think it's about popular and uninformed opinion. politics and political correctness.

USF&WS are a law unto themselves and they know it and as has been proved by the long running Mozambican ban, they know they can even ignore the US courts so even in the unlikely event of an appeal winning and the ban being overturned, they would still refuse to follow orders and allow imports again.

The only real options are not to hunt the species, buy a holiday home outside the US or rent long term storage space outside the US in the (perhaps forlorn?) hope that things will change in the future.






 
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The USFWS is one of the worst agencies in all of the Federal Govt. The handful of rational, educated wildlife scientists remaining are slaves to the political agenda of the liberal parasites that have consumed a once beneficial wildlife management agency!


I hunt to live and live to hunt!
 
Posts: 299 | Location: Big Sky Country! | Registered: 19 March 2011Reply With Quote
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Well said!
 
Posts: 18561 | Registered: 04 April 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
quote:
Originally posted by larryshores:
I am surprised, very surprised.

I think there is more to this than meets the eye.


Of course there is Larry, you know that. Its called the Obama admin, and the head of the DOI.


Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How many times have I said that the lion and the ele are purely political.

There is going to be zero cooperation and zero change in any of the policy until we change the president and the Secretary of Interior.

From all of the hours you and I and others spent fighting the potential lion uplist which still looms...I became thoroughly convinced that nothing was going to change until we change presidents.

I am not against any hardline litigation per se...I just see this administration, the USFW, and other executive branch agencies continue to disregard court rulings time and time again until it is ruled on by the Supreme Court...and with the last SCOTUS ruling against the administration...they are trying this time to denouce it.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House

No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991.
 
Posts: 37821 | Location: Gainesville, TX | Registered: 24 December 2006Reply With Quote
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P.S. there was a chance with the lion in the beginning had we gotten cooperation with SCI to potentially change that one due to the fact that we had the scientists with the influence on our side. When we failed to bring SCI on board with the Definition of a Huntable Male Lion...we lost them and consequently lost our chance to stop the up-list politicallly.

Therefore...much to my chagrin...I suspect Shakari is correct. Frowner


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
J. Lane Easter, DVM

A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House

No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991.
 
Posts: 37821 | Location: Gainesville, TX | Registered: 24 December 2006Reply With Quote
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I sent my Senator and Representative letters questioning the validity of their reasoning, rather than a blatant attack on hunters.

I suggested that they consider a bill to remove their jurisdiction over trophy animals hunted overseas. I told it was a similar ploy to that of the CPSD's attempts to regulate ammunition as a hazardous substance some years back.

Both responded. Our Rep says he will have a staffer contact FWS and find out who gave them that authorization, and if was Congress, to determine why. The Senator says his staff will parallel the Rep's investigation.

I suggested a 20% reduction in their 2015 FY budget would be a good place to start...

Rich
 
Posts: 23062 | Location: SW Idaho | Registered: 19 December 2005Reply With Quote
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Horrible, and I agree with all of you that pointed out that the wording is more than troubling and was something that immediately stood out to me when reading the press release. What worries me is not just the elephant and lion, but the fact that I'm beginning to think this trend is aimed at shutting down importation of ALL sport hunted trophies abroad. I don't intend to sound like a doomsday prophet, I just see it as a systematic way of taking away our hunting opportunities and the antis have focused where they know they can hurt us most. If they can't get foreign governments to stop allowing hunting, why not try and stop our own government from allowing the trophies in?

Just today, National Geographic posted photo of a lion in the Okavango Delta on their Instagram page (which has over 6,000,000 followers), with a caption below that read "Botswana has 1500 lions remaining, making it the ONLY country with over 1000 lions within its borders". Apparently failing to recognize Tanzania and its 16,000+ lions, (or the 5 additional countries that have more than 1,000 cats) it then went on to list hunting, not poaching, as one of the two main culprits. No one is there to check them on this bullshit, and they freely post lies to get their agenda pushed through. Lies that get seen by millions of people who are uneducated on the subject.

I don't mean to sound hopeless, but what can be done about this? Their reach is much farther than ours, and to date they've been a hell of a lot more outspoken about it. It certainly seems to be an uphill battle that we're facing.

Greg


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When Momma Obama went to South Africa for Mandelas funeral she made some decisions and now we have to live with them. This is an end run around democracy and they are famous for that.
 
Posts: 914 | Registered: 06 January 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Greg Brownlee:
Horrible, and I agree with all of you that pointed out that the wording is more than troubling and was something that immediately stood out to me when reading the press release. What worries me is not just the elephant and lion, but the fact that I'm beginning to think this trend is aimed at shutting down importation of ALL sport hunted trophies abroad. I don't intend to sound like a doomsday prophet, I just see it as a systematic way of taking away our hunting opportunities and the antis have focused where they know they can hurt us most. If they can't get foreign governments to stop allowing hunting, why not try and stop our own government from allowing the trophies in?

Just today, National Geographic posted photo of a lion in the Okavango Delta on their Instagram page (which has over 6,000,000 followers), with a caption below that read "Botswana has 1500 lions remaining, making it the ONLY country with over 1000 lions within its borders". Apparently failing to recognize Tanzania and its 16,000+ lions, (or the 5 additional countries that have more than 1,000 cats) it then went on to list hunting, not poaching, as one of the two main culprits. No one is there to check them on this bullshit, and they freely post lies to get their agenda pushed through. Lies that get seen by millions of people who are uneducated on the subject.

I don't mean to sound hopeless, but what can be done about this? Their reach is much farther than ours, and to date they've been a hell of a lot more outspoken about it. It certainly seems to be an uphill battle that we're facing.

Greg


Greg,
The turning point for all of this is when the SCI failed to sign onto the Definition of a Huntable Male lion and then TZ failed to renew Craig Packer's research clearance.

I tried to warn everyone involved that there would be repercussions from these two actions.

Believe it or not...Craig Packer stood between USF&W and hunters...in regards to lions.

Craig, from spending years on the ground in TZ, knew hunting was needed...albeit in a more controlled fashion. He was on our side.

Luke Hunter; president of Panthera, a major contributor to National Geographic; realized that hunting was a significant help to wild lion but wanted to see the Definition of a Huntable Male lion adopted by SCI, and all the PH associations. That didn't happen and we lost Panthera...thus Nat Geo.

Those guys defended us against the Obama USF&W...but not anymore. Now Obama and Sally Jewel can run a muck...and they are.

There are consequences on the above failings and there are consequences for electing Obama to begin with...now...we are reaping what we sowed...in both instances.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
J. Lane Easter, DVM

A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House

No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991.
 
Posts: 37821 | Location: Gainesville, TX | Registered: 24 December 2006Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shakari:
I'm disappointed but not in the least surprised and what's more, I'll bet a pound to a pinch of the brown stuff they'll also introduce a ban on lion within the next 12 months or so.


I hear you Steve!!!
Sad indeed Frowner
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Posts: 3430 | Registered: 24 February 2007Reply With Quote
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I actually took the time to read over the USF&W multi page report.

It is clear that reports / studies from 1996 and 1997 were heavily relied on by Zim and submitted to USF&W in suport of their position that all was well with the elephant and that sport hunting was viable in 2014, some 18 years later in time than the proffered scientific studies.

While the USA might not have any business sticking their nose into African nation states' management practices and protocols, Zim, Tanzania, Moz, and others must put on a better showing when there's so much at stake for the industry and the elephant.

To me, the USF&W report reads as if better data from Zim would have reversed the import ban. In fact, USF&W said it would review the decision again in December 2014 OR EARLIER IF MORE INFORMATION WAS PROVIDED.

So, there's your invitation Zim and Tanz. Get your data up and get it in. Time's wasting. Elephants too.

My $.02.


Will J. Parks, III
 
Posts: 2989 | Location: Alabama USA | Registered: 09 July 2009Reply With Quote
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In fairness Will, sort of hard to blame Zim when until the ban was announced on April 4, no one was aware that the USFWS had a specific concern, needed better data in their opinion, was not prepared to rely on the CITES quotas, etc. Recall that the ban was announced with no notice, no opportunity for comment, no request for input, no consultation with the affected countries and no factual support for the decision. So the fact that Zim had to rely on historic data given that the ban was announced a little over three months ago is not surprising. Most folks would figure that an agency acting in a responsible and reasonable manner would communicate their concerns and need for information before taking action . . . giving folks an opportunity to fill the perceived data gap. But we are where we are at this point and clearly Zim is going to have to do a better job of documenting the issue . . . if for no other reason than to help make the case to the courts and Congress. In that regard, while we were in Dande in June there were two researchers, a pilot and someone from Parks, in camp that were doing aerial elephant counts with a Super Cub to update those studies from the 1990's.


Mike
 
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True, Mike. True.

I know it was short notice, but the submission of data 17 to 18 years old was a losing effort from the start.

In a vacuum, this is fixed with a crisis manager, scientists, some time and lots of PRIVATE money.

In Zim, however, it is hard to imagine that the government will be able to function well enough to work through this. It certainly cannot finance the effort.

I hate it, but this is a huge industry and the future of the elephant in Zim is clearly at stake. More and better information should be available, even by African standards.

Maybe the folks that ran the show in Bots are looking for work now? Perhaps poach some scientists and research guys from Kruger?

The only fix here is updated data, aerial surveys, transparency with respect to government / communal / private enterprise and how they work together for the good of the elephant via sport hunting.


Will J. Parks, III
 
Posts: 2989 | Location: Alabama USA | Registered: 09 July 2009Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by safari-lawyer:
I actually took the time to read over the USF&W multi page report.

It is clear that reports / studies from 1996 and 1997 were heavily relied on by Zim and submitted to USF&W in suport of their position that all was well with the elephant and that sport hunting was viable in 2014, some 18 years later in time than the proffered scientific studies.

While the USA might not have any business sticking their nose into African nation states' management practices and protocols, Zim, Tanzania, Moz, and others must put on a better showing when there's so much at stake for the industry and the elephant.

To me, the USF&W report reads as if better data from Zim would have reversed the import ban. In fact, USF&W said it would review the decision again in December 2014 OR EARLIER IF MORE INFORMATION WAS PROVIDED.

So, there's your invitation Zim and Tanz. Get your data up and get it in. Time's wasting. Elephants too.

My $.02.


+1

We as hunters have transferred significant dollars to Uncle Bob and his criminal cronies. Zim hunting prices are up 40-50 percent in the last 4-5 and all this money has flowed into criminal hands.

Maybe this will forced some of the criminal zim politicians to transfer some funds to parks and do good data collection and game management.

But given what these f@ckers have been doing in the save I have little faith.

Mike
 
Posts: 13145 | Location: Cocoa Beach, Florida | Registered: 22 July 2010Reply With Quote
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I should also add that my comments are not an indictment of Zim Operators, PHs, or Guides, but are a statement of the sad state of affairs in Zimbabwe. This is a mess made by their government and ours.

Righting the ship, however, will likely fall on the shoulders of the Zim Operators, PHs, and Guides as well as like minded individuals in the US and other countries that are willing to spend the time and the money to make this right.


Will J. Parks, III
 
Posts: 2989 | Location: Alabama USA | Registered: 09 July 2009Reply With Quote
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Any word on Tanzania? I'm hanging out there for 2015. Not that I expect a different result but Tanzania is hitting poaching hard.

Greg, interesting comment. In my limited experience, lions are pretty hard to count. I wonder how many lions there are in Tanzania, and more particularly in such places as Congo, CAR, South Sudan -- places the greenies aren't likely to go count.
 
Posts: 10328 | Location: Houston, Texas | Registered: 26 December 2005Reply With Quote
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Good post Will - I agree.


"There are worse memorials to a life well-lived than a pair of elephant tusks." Robert Ruark
 
Posts: 4780 | Location: Story, WY / San Carlos, Sonora, MX | Registered: 29 May 2002Reply With Quote
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Dangerous to extrapolate based on a data set of two, but the two fellows in camp seemed to know what they were doing and were clearly just part of a much broader effort. The methodology and grids they were flying were identical to the ones used in one of the studies from the 1990's. They made the point that the reason they were tracking the methodology used and the grid samples flown in the earlier study was to ensure that the study was not subject to attack based on different methodologies or sampling techniques being used. As noted, they indicated they were simply part of a broader nationwide study. It involved flying and counting random sections identical to the earlier study's sections at the same time of year. Later in the year, before the rains, there would be another aerial survey done using another grid search methodology, again, the same methodology used in the earlier study later in the year. Bottom line, it seemed to be sound from a methodology standpoint and these folks were taking the job seriously. They were flying every morning (not in the afternoons because apparently the thermals made it difficult flying in some of the valleys and gorges). All that said, when we pressed them, sounded like getting the survey done, the results compiled and the results documented by the end of the year was going to be tough.


Mike
 
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