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The folks here on AR seem to conform to a standard when hunting game. Buffalo is always a contentious subject and the ageing can be difficult but generally we do our best to pursue those animals that are big and mature. They are stocky gruff animals and sometimes we call a shot on an animal that is best described as a little 'soft'. So what? He is mature and hairless and is without doubt a good buffalo to take. The hunt was good. Well check this crap: http://www.africahunting.com/t...alo-in-3-days.22920/ ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | ||
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Looks like they are shooting chattle. Want another buff - sure let's bring him out. Mike | |||
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Was this a meat hunt?  You know Andrew, I have a lot of people show me pictures and ask me questions about the trophy quality . Far more often that not, these "trophies" are not even mature animals. I just had a friend show me a bunch of pics from a friends TZ safari. Lion, buff, warthog, sable, croc, leopard and a few more minor animals. To be sure, this guy shot a hell of a sable. Probably 46. The other critters were shocking. The buff was clearly soft. I would not have even looked at the warthog through my binos. If that lion was 6 years old, I will vote for Hillary. Look at the pics some of the outfitters post on Facebook. Often, they are very surprising. I wouldn't be shooting those young animals much less posting their pics if I did. To be sure, there was a time in my life where I would not have known better either. To each his own I suppose. | |||
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Larry do not drop your guard. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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I believe that most new African safari hunters count exclusively on their PH to rate the game they shoot. I know I did when I started. I had never seen most of the animals live, even in a zoo, so I certainly had no clue how to score them. But when I realized that I would be returning often to partake of the safari hunting experience, I began to educate myself, through books, videos, seminars, becoming an official scorer for both SCI and Rowland Ward. I also discussed the game animals with every PH I hunted with, as well as the trackers. When riding in the jump seat I would try to spot the game before the trackers, and many times did. After 20 safaris in 8 sub-Saharan african countries I consider myself to be pretty fair at judging mature animals. PHs mostly seem to appreciate the discussion when evaluating a potential trophy with a knowledgeable client. Not so much with someone who hasn't a clue. I was once handed a bunch of photos by a friend who had completed his first safari. As I was going through the pics I came to a photo of a clearly immature Common Waterbuck. I was shocked and there was a long pause as I considered a comment. I finally looked at him and said simply "You know this is an immature animal, right?" His response was "I do now". He had been told to shoot the Waterbuck by his PH's Appie. My friend had no clue until he arrived home and began showing his photos. He was not happy with that PH/Outfitter. Mike ______________ DSC DRSS (again) SCI Life NRA Life Sables Life Mzuri IPHA "To be a Marine is enough." | |||
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Hey that middle one looked like George's cow!  Put & take is not my cup of tea. I have shot one animal behind wire in NZ on pure meat rates. Never called it hunting & never will. In India I used to have a lot of fun shooting striped squirrels with a slug gun. They are very fast, very cunning and great at hiding and scooting behind a branch. Far more fun than shooting some animal behind wire. https://phototrap.files.wordpr...humb.jpg?w=801&h=774 "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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That Buffalo "hunt" was shameful. It was a, no doubt, very expensive meat hunt as Larry stated. They positioned the story like it was amazingly successful hunt. Well, we all know any idiot can cut a track (ANY track in this case) and blast the first animal you see. Unfortunately, this is what gives many operations in SA a bad name... This type of BS can only happen there... | |||
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Fairgame, I am glad you called them out on it on that thread. Can't wait to see what they have to say. I have only been to Africa once which was Zim, and I am aware I have no business posting about trophy quality to the people on this site as most of you have hunted over there more than I ever will. I have no interest in canned hunts but to each his own. Anyway, while in Zim I killed 1 tuskless, 1 bushbuck, a waterbuck, and a baboon in 7 days. I was the hunter right before Mr. shores in 2013 at Matombo so he will understand how the hunting is there. It is great, but not a big plains game area. When I got back all I heard was how many animals I could have killed on this or that ranch for one tenth of the price I paid. In my very humble opinion I think much of the hunting world wants it fast easy and cheap. This is not meant to offend the wrong people just siding with fairgame, and Larryshores. | |||
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I can't decide which is worse; shooting a buff like that as a "trophy" or coming on a forum and patting yourself on the back, bragging about a successful "hunt." | |||
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Not sure what kind of hunt this was but I guess we will find out.....hope it was not a trophy hunt as they could have shot buff cows for a lot less. I have to believe that the hunters were very inexperienced as they are beaming in the pictures like they are sitting behind world records. If it was a meat or cull hunt, then fine...but if a trophy hunt, the PH has some explaining to do. | |||
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Reminds me of some articles in SCI Safari Magazine. Where they praise a hunter for going to "Africa" and firing 10 shots, getting 10 animals Having said that, there a lot of people who really have no concept - or experience - of actual hunting. And this IS what hunting IS to them. It is the same people who have a feeder not far from their homes, feed the deer all year round, have a sort of car port built a few yards from that feeder. Come deer hunting season, they get their cool box full of beer, drive into that purpose built carport, enjoy their beer and wait for the deer to come to the feed, and shoot it. The same sort of hunter who shoot elk in a compound you can throw stones from one end to the other. | |||
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Ah, but you forget that negative comments on trophy quality are frowned upon by some. Its OK to shit all over someone if you open a separate thread but Lord forbid if you do it on the poster's thread. | |||
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May be we should introduce the same rules one hunting website has that no negative comments are allowed? In fact, that is one of the new rules we will put into effect on January 1st, 2200! | |||
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Some insight. These hunts are becoming all the more prevalent in the country due to the increase in the "buffalo breeding". These reject animals are not worthy of being bred with and as a result are often chucked onto a game farm to grow out, or not, and are then shot at reduced rates. I got lined up and screwed over by an operator once who had very cleverly used the name of a legitimate operation to sell me a hunt for a "trophy bull". In short it was a complete balls up and by 10am on the first day I offered the client the option to leave the farm as there were possibly 3 hard bossed bulls on the entire farm and many of the young bulls were still carrying ear tags from wherever they were bred. The client elected to continue withthe hunt in the hope that we were able to get onto the old bulls. But in the end it was a very disappointing hunt. While it hurt to have gotten to this point, the real damage was the relationship with the client that was forever soured. Beware as this has become very common. A few suggestions when you are booking a buffalo hunt in SA. Property size: anything less than 5000ha is most likely not going to support regular hunting of big game. i.e. the bulls that are there are most likley not very old as the owners cant sit on the investment for too long as it does not appreciate with the age of the animal. Many of these animals are going to be 4 years old as at that age they are just passable as a "soft" mature bull. Old Cows: ask if they have any available to hunt. If not ask when they will have. Any farm with stable populations will hunt a few old cows each year. If they don't have any, its not a self sustaining population Photos: ask to see the photos of the bulls that have been shot. If they are all from odd angles to avoid showing the boss or face then you know they are young. Good luck Specialist Outfitters and Big Game Hounds An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Ian, Thanks for that. Now and again you get a hunter to shoot something which you suspect you could have done better. With buff I have called a couple that were a tad soft but were mature animals. We strive to get the best out of an area and show off our achievements here on AR. It just goes against the grain when very young animals are hunted and posed as something else. Then to cap it all are then applauded by others? Just proves that AR is first for hunters. Where have I heard that before? ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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That is true however I would not refrain from comment if someone here posted such crap. These buff were babies. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Shit all over the hunt reports as you wish. You will have less and less places to take a crap. Now go to the link provided and will will see my comment quoting Andrew. That website has moderators so perhaps you may want to be quick before the comment disappears. Cheers Jim ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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On AR the moderators wouldn't bat an eyelid - its the members (a handful) who do the policing and voice their displeasure.  | |||
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Sign of the times Im afraid. Its just as normal to shoot these animals and proceed to have a back slapping session as it is to see the Whitehouse draped in rainbows and "men" being allowed to marry one another. On that note the second buff did bear a resemblance to a cow, how bout we just call "him" Caitlynn and applaud him as a national hero of the buffalo clan. Specialist Outfitters and Big Game Hounds An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Agreeing with yourself must be gratifying. ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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Ian, This sort of spectacle does very little for South Africa and will tarnish the good names of those like yourself who truly hunt for a living. 3 buff in 3 days? I could have done that shit in three minutes with a good catapult. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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You are right Andrew. Its why we need to focus our efforts on wilderness conservation and the protection of hunting blocks. What you are doing in Zambia needs to be replicated over and over again. Sad state of affairs. Specialist Outfitters and Big Game Hounds An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. - Winston Churchill | |||
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+1. It makes me wonder how they conduct their sport at home if they believe that what they had in Africa was hunting. Pathetic. | |||
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I got a better look at those pics this morning. OMG! I have shot bigger bait animals. My guess is: 1- This was the clients first trip to Africa and/or their first DG hunt. 2- They were so excited/scared they were completely blinded. I am reminded of a hunt about 10 years ago. The first night in camp, I heard lions. Fantastic I thought. The second night, I heard them again in what seemed to me about the same place. I thought hmmmmm........ The 3rd night I heard them in the same place. I knew something was up. I questioned the PH about it. He admitted they had some lions in a pen. He was very surprised. I was the first to every question this. | |||
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I got three buffalo in just a few minutes | |||
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"An entire day of relentless tracking on foot!" Imagine that! _________________________________ AR, where the hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history become the nattering nabobs of negativisim. | |||
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Could it have not been local SA hunters? I know sometimes for us, it is much much cheaper to shoot a cow buff as they can be had for around $2k. The number of SA guys who have the cash to pursue big dagga boys are not a whole lot. I have not seen the pics myself but just a thought on what it could be. | |||
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LMFAO! I might have to add that as my signature line. | |||
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I have no dog in this fight and I certainly don't know the circumstances of the hunt. My observations however are the following : The hunters seem to be South African hunters. It is very common for South African hunters to hunt Buffalo cows. Nothing wrong with that. They are much cheaper. Even the APNR has Buffalo cows on quota from time to time. No where does the hunt report state that it was a trophy Bull hunt. And if they were young bulls that needed to be culled -- so what ? I see every Buffalo has its own hunter and PH with it. This is not so strange to have 3 Buffalo hunted in 3 days. Any good Buffalo area -- fenced or free range , should have the possibility of that happening. Any suggestions from the PH's on the forum as to the gender of that 3rd Buffalo ? Seeing that so many members got the first 2 wrong....  | |||
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No dog in this fight either but this is the latest from the OP of that thread on page 2: Apologies for the late reply here guys, we have been out in the bush hunting. All three are buffalo cows hunted legally with RSA clients in a Big5 reserve of 5000 ha. When cows get old and they no longer able to produce calves, we get tags to hunt them as it brings some additional income into a reserve rather than just let them just die. The meat was donated to a nearby Wild Dog, Lion and Cheetah sanctuary that welcomed the meat with open arms. The clients enjoyed the thrill of a more affordable buffalo hunt and the sanctuary benefited from all the meat. Hope it clears it all up..? | |||
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All I can say is wow. Nothing better to do then pick apart other peoples hunts. They take 3 cow buff were not mislead but did a hunt they could afford. There was a reason for the hunt to control the numbers of buff on the land. We have airlines banning taking trophy's shipments,laws trying to stop us from taking are own guns to Africa and so much else going on. But this is what we will worry about because in a few peoples eyes it is not hunting how they see it. You elite people who think your only the hunters because you hunt buff,ele,lion and all the other big 5 in what you think is the only place to do so are just killing yourself. You all cry when they try and ban something you want to hunt and then look for your every day hunter to give a shit about it. Then you say us hunters need to stick together because then you need us guys who only hunt SA or Namibia. Some of you guys really need to start thinking instead of judging everyone else. Yes I have only hunted SA so far because that is what I can afford to do. I myself could give a rats ass what some of you think about hunts in SA. | |||
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Rubbish these are obviously young animals and it was reported as a big game hunt. If you feel that is acceptable to shoot young females for kicks and cash then so be it. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Ah and there lies the main point. I have hunted in South Africa twice, and loved every minute of it. In fact, Walter said it was the best hunt of his life! Now, Walter has some health issues, where sadly he is not able to walk very much. And shooting off the back of the truck was just the ticket for him. I had a bit of a problem early on our hunt, as I kept jumping off the truck to shoot - to the non stop laughter of everyone there. Eventually I followed that old axiom "when in Rome, do as the Roman's do", and I shot off the back of the truck. I think we might not be having this discussion if those involved in this had actually stated that they were shooting animals as culls, or for meat. I do that in my back yard, but it is not hunting. If I am not mistaken, Andrews point is don't make it out what it was not. | |||
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Really Andrew ? And if this was an impala hunt with females being hunted ? Does it really matter what age they were ? The area they hunted them in owns those animals and can have them hunted if they so wish. Is it only a hunt if its an old animal ? Well , then I'm afraid a lot of our members have been taken for a ride if I look at the hunting reports. Is it more difficult shooting a bull ? Maybe , only because you would have a greater selection to choose from when shooting a cow. Now , HOW they were hunted is anyone's guess and a different story. If they were hunted on foot , great. Saeed , animals are being shot off the back of trucks all over Africa , not just South Africa. In some "exclusive" African countries ,they might let the hunter step just off the truck and then shoot though... | |||
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A cow buff hunt is sold as a cow buff hunt.... I'm not sure why you keep attacking the blokes. Mate go and have a look at the hunt report section and see how many immature trophies are coming out of other countries besides SA. Give the guys a break. I'm sure they enjoyed their hunt immensely. As it is locals are having a hard time competing with the ever increasing prices of the hunting industry. I think you should just let this one go. | |||
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As some of you gentlemen might have already noticed...... The AR African..... (or any other country for that matter) .....hunt report areas have gone more than flat this year My wife and I have made just one trip to SA in our 46/47 year lives in June 2014. We saved for years and fell short about one year out so I took out a loan to be sure to have the funds. A lot of planning and endless emails and phone calls to this or that guy or whoever for whatever and worry and anticipation of the unkown this or that. The time came and off we go. Had a trip unlike any in our life and returned quite happy. In the weeks to follow I uploaded pictures a prepaired a lengthy report and posted it here to share I didn't post for a pat on my back or smoke blown up my but as I knew we hunted was a cushy spot that wasn't any great feat of accomplishment. It was after all our 25th wedding aniverserary trip and I wanted my wife to have a nice vacation. That being said I was proud to have done it and happy to post a report and pictures. In the weeks to follow I received more than one PM that was less than in good spirit. One such person has chimed in on this thread as I can tell by having his elitist ass on ignore. I was told of the poor quality of the animals in my pictures and that hunting from a lodge in a reserve was not hunting at all. "The next time you go please hunt away from the lodge" was one other AR members statement For whatever reason a person hunts and however a person hunts is up to them I say. Hunting is dying off as the younger generation has moved away from the sport but those who remain throw stones on a regular basis at the ones who still hunt Hunting....it isn't always about horns and score As a matter of fact....imo....the tape measure has no place in hunting Just my .02 cents ________________________________________________ Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper Proudly made in the USA Acepting all forms of payment | |||
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Spot on Ted. I was one of the many here on AR who enjoyed your report. Only sorry you got screwed with getting your animals sorted at the end of your adventure.jc | |||
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I'm in the process of getting all of that mess sorted out John. I have been told that the crate is on it's way home.......but I am from the "show me state" so I'm not getting all tuned up just yet ________________________________________________ Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper Proudly made in the USA Acepting all forms of payment | |||
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Gentlemen: I agree 100% that is in bad form to attack a hunt report posted by a hunter. It shows no respect and no class. In some respects, it is even worse to attack the hunter via e mail or PM. This case is a bit different. There is a outfitter posting this like it was some kind of ultra-successful trophy hunt. It was not. The outfitters explanatory post conveyed something not remotely close to what the opening post portrayed. This wasn't attacking some unsuspecting soul who had no idea what they had shot. This was calling out an outfitter. If the outfitter had posted the details he last posted, I would have thought nothing of it. I think we need to face the facts. While there are many quality outfitters doing quality hunts in the RSA, there are also some really bad guys operating there. Those need to be weeded out. I have had some great hunts there. I have also seen some things I refused to participate in. | |||
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Looks like a lot of us jumped to the wrong conclusions, including myself. The outfitter may have not explained the hunt to everyone' satisfaction but jumping on his shit without knowing all the details is just plain wrong and impolite. | |||
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