quote:

Originally posted by Iron Buck:
When looking at a stock blank, are you looking at both 1/4 sawn and flat sawn blanks the same way?

They're not looked at the same way, but both examinations are looking for the same results.....strength and stability.

quote:

Or are there different parameters that are desired for each?

Different parameters because of the way the grain runs in each. In either case, for strength, it's desirable to not have grain runout or exit in the middle of the grip or wrist of the stock. The "strength" parameter.

There are arguments that all wood will move......at least a little. If it does, it will move toward the bark. In this fashion, a true slab sawn blank will move "side to side" and a true quarter sawn blank will move up and down. Fairly important for wood in the forearm portion under the barrel of a rifle. The "stability" factor.

Take a book and consider the pages as the grain of the wood. A slab sawn blank will have the side of the stock on the page face. The quarter sawn blank will have the side of the stock on the binding end. Slab ....pages run through stock top to bottom, quarter.....pages run through stock side to side. Pick a front or back cover as your bark, and imagine the pages moving in that direction. You'll get the idea of how movement is affected in either cut.

This was SDH's quote about the two:

5. Quarter sawn wood will warp up and down, not side to side like slab sawn. This most often occurs in the forend and has the most affect on consistency.

A quick note about the vertical laminates:

Every other section of laminate is "flipped" to counteract the movement, and they are then bonded under pressure. You can see this in the example posted earlier.

I have no pictures of a good slab blank, but the laminate picture include earlier will serve.

Perfect slab sawn grain runs vertically from top of the blank through the bottom, and straight from tip to butt.

Perfect quarter sawn grain runs straight through the blank side to side, but must travel parallel to the barrel, down through the grip, and parallel the toe line.

Each of the above are fairly rare. Lots of "compromise" blanks are taken from a large piece of wood for each "perfect" blank.

In that context, lets put this SDH quote in better context:

"The point is not to have grain run-out especially in the wrist.
My attitude comes from someone who makes stocks and doesn't want to see them break.
The other attitude comes from someone who has a lot of poorly laid out stock blanks to sell.
Take one opinion of the other, your choice."

The above sounds unnecessarily harsh, but it comes from a person who doesn't use "compromise" blanks. I do. I would guess I'm a part of a large group of buyers that do so. However, I know what my compromise is. And I would agree that a "strength" compromise is probably the worst compromise to make. I have different risk evaluations building a stock for myself in my basement than I would if I were laying out 4 or 5 digit sums for a professional to build me one.

This is the best blank I personally have ever worked on. It was mannlicher length, and had great grain from forearm to butt. It runs almost perfectly side-to-side through the stock.

My brother bought it from Don Cantwell for a song. It had a a portion of light sap wood through the lower portion that was almost all eliminated when machined. I had to stain a minor portion at the bottom of the grip knob.

This is one of my more spectacular failures. Not great pictures, but I think the grain structure can be seen.

Grain runs fairly nice through the wrist, but not through the forearm. But viewed from the end of the butt, it was at a fairly steep angle side to side. This forearm continued to move. It finally had to be inletted with a metal rod in the barrel channel to keep it from moving.

From just appearances, I've had other similar stocks that didn't suffer this way. Lots about wood that I still don't understand, but starting with better structure and layout will certainly lessen the chances of this happening.

I've become a real bigot about straight grain in the forearm, and proper grain running through the wrist. I'll sacrifice color and figure for both of those factors.

quote:

This is one of my more spectacular failures

And it is still light years above and beyond some folks most prized successes! On a side note the dirty nasty things I would do to be the proud owner of the full stocked mauser with no stock furniture. Man I loved handling that rifle!

quote:

Originally posted by alvinmack:


And it is still light years above and beyond some folks most prized successes! On a side note the dirty nasty things I would do to be the proud owner of the full stocked mauser with no stock furniture. Man I loved handling that rifle!

Well.....thanks, Mike. But we both know you're being way too kind. We both know what top quality work is. Mine isn't junk, but it's light years away from top shelf stuff.

BTW........I traded with my brother to get the mannlicher back. It's coming back to Wisconsin this fall...

Grandview

That Mannlicher is just gorgeous.

What did you have to give up to get it back?

quote:

Originally posted by 22WRF:

What did you have to give up to get it back?

A pretty nice 1903 Springfield in .280.....wood and metal by Jim Lewis a few years ago when he lived in Idaho.

quote:

Grandview

That Mannlicher is just gorgeous.

What did you have to give up to get it back?

22WRF

Sibling horse trades are often one-sided in actual value between Grandview and me. There have been deals in the past which were done just to let the other person get something that they thought they wanted at the time and probably made little sense in dollars of value. The rifle I am getting back was the first rifle I ever had any gunsmith do completely for me. It is not in the league with much of what we see on this site but it still has sentimental value to me.

We both agree this upcoming trade is actually pretty even in value and I appreciate Grandview giving me the opportunity to get it back rather than selling it to someone else. I think he also likes the fact he is getting that little 7X57 back rather than me selling it to someone else. Hence, we both win.

Idared

I kind of know what you mean, having 5 brothers myself. I also know what you mean about stuff having sentimental value. We have a guest bedroom full of my stuff, and the wife claims that someday when I am not home she is going to throw all of that "junk" out the door!