quote:

Originally posted by 2th doc:
On my very first trip Africa I hunted Sebra with Jan Du Plessis in northwest Namibia for plains game owner/operator of Sebra he had just a few camp staff and his wife. That trip spoiled me and I did not even know it at the time. Jan a first class hunter and gentleman seemed embarrassed when I gave him his tip...as if it was too much but when I handed him a tip to be split among his staff he handed half back to me. As I recall he said he did not wish to spoil them. I have forgotten those amounts but I believe I recall they were equal to 1 days rate fee for the 10 day hunt.
My first trip an I met a truly humble owner/PH whom I still believe to be the best hunter I've shared time with anywhere in Africa.

quote:

Originally posted by Capt. Purvis:
It has gotten out of hand in all of Africa. Moving forward, I think that the industry standard for all Outfitters should be no tipping but to simply raise the rates to where the compensation from the tips is already figured into the cost of the package. Similar to a restaurant where you have five of more people sitting at a table. This way people know what to expect ahead of time. I had a trip last week and one of my guides was complaining about not getting a tip. I gave him the extra money. Believe it or not it is a pain for the Outfitter as well.

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

Tell me, would a compromise be to list the number of camp staff with a suggestion of tips in the contract? This way the hunter would know what he is getting in to and if he can afford the total package or not.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

Tell me, would a compromise be to list the number of camp staff with a suggestion of tips in the contract? This way the hunter would know what he is getting in to and if he can afford the total package or not.

That is very similar to what CMS did with their website listing . . . and they were soundly lambasted for doing so.

So to summarize, what we know so far is:

* Suggesting tip amounts is gauche
* Not suggesting tip amounts leaves clients in an uncomfortable lurch
* Noting that gratuities are not included is distasteful
* Not noting that gratuities are not included is misleading
* Tipping should be discretionary as to the act and the amount
* We should roll tips in the daily rates and effectively force everyone to pay them

I am sure there are other pearls of wisdom and rays of enlightenment I have missed . . .

1. Be informed - As in don't get taken to the cleaners.


2. Don't feel pressured to leave a tip - the staff and PH will not die of hunger if you don't leave a tip. (They will most likely talk about you behind your back regardless)

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:
(They will most likely talk about you behind your back regardless)

[/LIST]

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

Very interesting statement. I'm sure many here have listened to PHs talk crap about former clients. I know I have. So, if they talk of others when you're there, the odds are they will talk crap aobut you when you're gone. I've listened to everything of how the clients were fat and could not walk, could not shoot, had a hot wife, drank too much, had a hot daughter, had an ugly wife, had a homely daughter, had a stupid son, shitty rifle, SCI mentality for trophys to be in the book, did not tip, tipped well (as if to say we expect you to do so), sweat like a pig, drank too much, ate too much, snored too loud, etc., and the list goes on.
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

Very interesting statement. I'm sure many here have listened to PHs talk crap about former clients. I know I have. So, if they talk of others when you're there, the odds are they will talk crap aobut you when you're gone. I've listened to everything of how the clients were fat and could not walk, could not shoot, had a hot wife, drank too much, had a hot daughter, had an ugly wife, had a homely daughter, had a stupid son, shitty rifle, SCI mentality for trophys to be in the book, did not tip, tipped well (as if to say we expect you to do so), sweat like a pig, drank too much, ate too much, snored too loud, etc., and the list goes on.
Cal

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

Very interesting statement. I'm sure many here have listened to PHs talk crap about former clients. I know I have. So, if they talk of others when you're there, the odds are they will talk crap aobut you when you're gone. I've listened to everything of how the clients were fat and could not walk, could not shoot, had a hot wife, drank too much, had a hot daughter, had an ugly wife, had a homely daughter, had a stupid son, shitty rifle, SCI mentality for trophys to be in the book, did not tip, tipped well (as if to say we expect you to do so), sweat like a pig, drank too much, ate too much, snored too loud, etc., and the list goes on.
Cal

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Once again Mike, we agree. I think these guys have figured out how to pedal the "Romance and Traditions" of the old golden age of safari. We buy it, mainline it like heroin.

I've been there and done that, we become enamored with these compelling personalities.

Great topic.

Steve

quote:

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
I am sure it varies from person to person, however, I would venture a guess that it has more to do with the clients than the PHs. I think many clients see PHs in some fanciful or idealistic way. They have both a respect for and at some level an envy of PHs. Therefore to be viewed as a "friend" of the PH in some way means they are part of the inner circle too. Not a lot different from the "groupie phenomenon" one might see with sports celebrities, politicians, musicians, etc. Again, I am not saying any of the foregoing is bad or unusual, just offering a perspective on what might cause folks to shy away from viewing the client-PH relationship as a commercial relationship and thinking of it more as a friendship . . . I am also not saying that there are situations where clients and PHs truly do become friends in the real sense of the term.

quote:

Originally posted by Opus1:
(They will most likely talk about you behind your back regardless)

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Mike,

Once again spot on. I've had that talk with many clients but the intimate nature of safari fosters these relationships real or not. Personally I've hunted with 19 different PH's. Only one did I not get along with fine and only one did anything egregious on safari. Three I consider as personal friends. The rest I got along with fine and I would be happy to share a camp with again but I don't send them a personal Christmas card nor receive one from them. I don't expect them to have any non business time for me at the show and I certainly don't care what they say about me as client once I've left camp. Bottom line safari is a business deal plain and simple.

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

quote:

Originally posted by Frostbit:
Personally agreeing with Mike, Steve, Cal, and Mark on this. May be a first in AR history.

That said I still have one specific item in all this that I have wondered about. The whole idea of safari being solely business vs. can you be friends with your PH.

What has confused me in this is Joyce's cancer battle. We had multiple PH's, one's we hunted with before, a couple we were already booked with to hunt after her successful recovery and a couple we only met and chatted with at SCI and had never hunted with or likely will.

All of them appeared to take a very personal interest in the battle. This included PM's on AR, Facebook communications, emails, and Skype calls. I'm not a PH groupie but I believe all these communications were sincerely caring in nature and doubt any were fueled by the hope of a financial reward in the way of future bookings.

There's a human side to these guys just like anyone else.

Cheers
Jim

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

Could be worse, you could be George trying to find an outfitter that doesn't think your douchebag. The good news for George is that his money is green and there will always be outfitters that ascribe to the "show me the money" school of accepting clients.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

Could be worse, you could be George trying to find an outfitter that doesn't think your douchebag. The good news for George is that his money is green and there will always be outfitters that ascribe to the "show me the money" school of accepting clients.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Mike,

Once again spot on. I've had that talk with many clients but the intimate nature of safari fosters these relationships real or not. Personally I've hunted with 19 different PH's. Only one did I not get along with fine and only one did anything egregious on safari. Three I consider as personal friends. The rest I got along with fine and I would be happy to share a camp with again but I don't send them a personal Christmas card nor receive one from them. I don't expect them to have any non business time for me at the show and I certainly don't care what they say about me as client once I've left camp. Bottom line safari is a business deal plain and simple.

Mark

Hi Mark,

I hunted last year in Tanzania. The first few evenings of the Safari, the "PH" was telling me stories about past clients and screw ups.

I excused myself and went to my shitty, old, torn up tent to retrieve my Ipad. On it, is my article "The Client" I just handed it to him and walked over to the fire pit to watch scorpions run out of the burning logs.

He read it and came over to the fire. He said, "Damn," I'm guilty of most of those things.

While we all need to have skin thick enough to be big boys. I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

quote:

Originally posted by Texas Blue Devil:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Mike,

Once again spot on. I've had that talk with many clients but the intimate nature of safari fosters these relationships real or not. Personally I've hunted with 19 different PH's. Only one did I not get along with fine and only one did anything egregious on safari. Three I consider as personal friends. The rest I got along with fine and I would be happy to share a camp with again but I don't send them a personal Christmas card nor receive one from them. I don't expect them to have any non business time for me at the show and I certainly don't care what they say about me as client once I've left camp. Bottom line safari is a business deal plain and simple.

Mark

Hi Mark,

I hunted last year in Tanzania. The first few evenings of the Safari, the "PH" was telling me stories about past clients and screw ups.

I excused myself and went to my shitty, old, torn up tent to retrieve my Ipad. On it, is my article "The Client" I just handed it to him and walked over to the fire pit to watch scorpions run out of the burning logs.

He read it and came over to the fire. He said, "Damn," I'm guilty of most of those things.

While we all need to have skin thick enough to be big boys. I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

I couldn't care less about a PH or guide thinking I'm a douchebag. As long as they are professional, polite, safe and generally do their job well, I'm fine with that. I'm there to hunt buffalo and elephant, not looking for a new best friend. We recently spent about $50K on a kitchen remodel job. Would you give a hoot if the contractor thought you were a douchebag, provided he did outstanding work?? I wouldn't.

All of my PH's in Africa have spoken very little about previous clients. When they spoke about previous clients, their comments were nearly all positive. I don't think for a second that these PHs really liked their past clients. They are just smart enough to know that speaking negatively of past clients is a really stupid, stupid thing to do.

What I have heard PH's talk about are other PH's. Lots and lots of that talk, with some positive comments and some negative comments. I have been amazed at the amount of gossip in the hunting industry.

quote:

Originally posted by Texas Blue Devil:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Mike,

Once again spot on. I've had that talk with many clients but the intimate nature of safari fosters these relationships real or not. Personally I've hunted with 19 different PH's. Only one did I not get along with fine and only one did anything egregious on safari. Three I consider as personal friends. The rest I got along with fine and I would be happy to share a camp with again but I don't send them a personal Christmas card nor receive one from them. I don't expect them to have any non business time for me at the show and I certainly don't care what they say about me as client once I've left camp. Bottom line safari is a business deal plain and simple.

Mark

Hi Mark,

I hunted last year in Tanzania. The first few evenings of the Safari, the "PH" was telling me stories about past clients and screw ups.

I excused myself and went to my shitty, old, torn up tent to retrieve my Ipad. On it, is my article "The Client" I just handed it to him and walked over to the fire pit to watch scorpions run out of the burning logs.

He read it and came over to the fire. He said, "Damn," I'm guilty of most of those things.

While we all need to have skin thick enough to be big boys. I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

I couldn't care less about a PH or guide thinking I'm a douchebag. As long as they are professional, polite, safe and generally do their job well, I'm fine with that. I'm there to hunt buffalo and elephant, not looking for a new best friend. We recently spent about $50K on a kitchen remodel job. Would you give a hoot if the contractor thought you were a douchebag, provided he did outstanding work?? I wouldn't.

All of my PH's in Africa have spoken very little about previous clients. When they spoke about previous clients, their comments were nearly all positive. I don't think for a second that these PHs really liked their past clients. They are just smart enough to know that speaking negatively of past clients is a really stupid, stupid thing to do.

What I have heard PH's talk about are other PH's. Lots and lots of that talk, with some positive comments and some negative comments. I have been amazed at the amount of gossip in the hunting industry.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:
This is the article "The Client" that I penned.

It appeared in The African Hunter magazine about two years ago and caused quite a lot of letters to the editor and emails.


The Client

I may be young, I may be old. Perhaps I am athletic and in shape or maybe a bit long in tooth and round in profile. I may come for lion and leopard or I simply come for an impala or a kudu.

Who I am is the international hunting client and what I am talking about should have been written long ago. It may be uncomfortable and frankly unpopular; nonetheless the topic needs to be broached.

We, the international hunting clients of the world fuel this industry, make no mistake. Without us the professional hunters of the world, whether good or bad, wouldn't be able to live the lives of their dreams. Only due to the client's collectively pursued passions are they able to walk daily amongst the magnificent antelopes and grim beasts of Mother Africa.

I am sure the professionals of which I speak will have some disagreement with this. I understand, and only bring these things to bear for stimulating thought......on both ends.

Somewhere along the way things, in my opinion, have gone horribly askew. On my last few trips overseas, I have begun to take notice of certain repeated behavior patterns displayed by some very well known professional hunters.

Some were in destinations I was only able to dream about in my younger years. Places of danger, places of intrigue. Fantastic places were hunted and some extraordinary creatures were pursued, successful pursuits in most cases.

I have come to the conclusion that "they" (some PHs) now somehow think it (international sport hunting) is all about them. We the sport hunting community are guilty, guilty of creating some of these ego driven, self-promoting personalities. Some of us are willing to even pay a premium to go afield with the "stars" of the industry. Why?

After you are safely aboard the charter on your way out of camp, you are the brunt of stories, jokes and anecdotal fowl ups for the next wave of "stumbling halfwits." We willingly plop down a year’s salary or more for the hunts of our lifetimes. It matters zero to them if you show up prepared physically and mentally, if you’re able to shoot, and you can see the animals. You will be treated the same as a first timer that stumbles around homesick for 21 days with your muzzle pointed at the back of their head and complains, of blisters, the heat or no ice for their cocktails.

I have formed these opinions from my own and unique position of experience. Having 33 Safaris in 21 separate trips overseas I’ve hunted nearly all sub-Saharan African countries and have collected the majority of her bounty. I am comfortable in my own skin and make no apologies. I claim no special hunting skills, only an ability to read people with an acute aptitude of situational awareness.

I write this in Heathrow, on a layover coming back from a Botswana elephant hunt. I sat one day on this last safari, at lunch listening to a PH of record and another PH that was between safaris. They openly made sport of guys, guys just like me. Guys with business', guys with jobs or perhaps retired. We return home to our families. The professionals return to the bush and make sport of me and others to the next "client". Funny thing, in all the stories, the fools they speak of don't have names, just "client".

We never take a moment to think that they feel the same about us. I maintain it's time to quit the game when the names and the faces all become one long blur of pictures, hunting stories and blown shots.

These safaris mean far more to us than it does them. This may be the one and only chance many of us get to experience these places and pursue these beasts.

I have even discussed these thoughts with one of the PHs one evening around the fire. His take was this: we finish with the hunt, get on a charter and go back to our safe lives and leave them to clean up the messes we create with our poor shooting. There is probably a lot of truth to his statement.

The romance and traditions of Africa are a powerful aphrodisiac. It draws us back time after time. I know it has me. Personally, I take my responsibility as a sport hunter extremely serious. I show up fit, both physically and mentally. A 21-day safari is a long one, at times you must focus to take things one day at a time and keep your head in the game. I also bring only rifles I can shoot and take shots I am virtually certain I can make. The last thing I want is to wound something the next client or PH must deal with.

How many stories have we all heard about client’s wives, or even daughters? Think yours are any different? They are flesh and blood just as we are.

For some untold reason, the international hunting community has assigned a “Rock Star” status or hero worship to many of these PHs. Perhaps it’s because I can think of no other “sport” where we can participate, side by side with a Professional at anything.

It's November, the phone calls start and the emails arrive. They are asking about coming over for a visit between the hunting conventions. We feel honored to have a "Professional Hunter" actually want to stay at our homes. We buy them dinner, take them places, they drink our finest single malt. We may even try to help them and book more "bumbling clients". We take days off work or away from our businesses to entertain them. Maybe it makes us feel like we are in their inner circle or within their appreciated sphere of influence.

You actually believe that you are somehow different or special. We even see it as some kind of a badge of honor that a real professional hunter from Africa has chosen me as a friend. These are superficial friendships at the very best.

Come as a client, leave as a friend?

It may be hard for some to accept these concepts and learned them the hard way. I have many friends and acquaintances that go back to Africa every year and hunt with the same guys, the same guys that behind closed doors refer to one honorable, successful and admirable man as “a Gomer”.

Personally, I have decided to change my approach. Moving forward, I will no longer go alone and look for any sort of companionship from these guys. I will now go with a pal or my wife and treat them as they should be treated, as an employee of sorts. No real difference than your relationship with your taxidermist, your dentist or the guy you just bought your new F250 Super Duty from.

A trophy celebration in a foreign language.

Now, they can celebrate "their" successful kills and I can have my own celebration with someone who is genuinely happy for me. The attending PH can take as many high quality trophy photos of himself for self-promotion as he has taken of me, and I could not care less. I once hunted with a guy that never once took a photo on his camera with me in the shot. Seems kind of nuts, but that act alone gave me the awareness to start becoming a student of these behaviors. He showed me his iPod one evening in camp. All of his pictures were of he alone, no "client" to be seen. This particular “Professional” must see the client as no more than a tool to do "his killing" for him.

Honestly ask yourselves, could any one of these guys be successful enough in business to afford to pay for one of the safaris that they ridicule "us" on?

How about personal relationships, failed marriages, questionable vehicles and finances. I wouldn't trade my life for theirs for any amount of money. I also am sure they would say the same about my life. But we don't make fun of, nor ridicule them, do we?

Have you ever gone home early?

Have you ever finished a safari early? Have there been "suggestions" of perhaps side trips? Do these side trips usually require a trip home for some reason? I think many clients prefer to just "go with the flow" and not make mention of things that probably don't sit right with us. After all, you really do want this guy to like you, right? I use to feel that way, and would say nothing. "Hey Steve, do you mind if my wife, girlfriend, brother in law, whatever comes into
camp". Well, yes I do. I now just spit it out and keep communication as open and as honest as is possible.

I have never left a safari early, not at my own request anyway. It was suggested once that, I could go home early if I wanted. I didn't, but took the suggestion as he prefer I be elsewhere so rearranged my families trip home to the order of 2,800. for changing the prearranged itinerary.

I really feel that poor communication is the biggest component of a safari gone bad. You as the paying client cannot keep your mouth closed if something bothers you. You need to stop things right then, and tell the PH what it is you want, or don't want, or what he does is bothering you in some way. It is your adventure, you're paying the bill. As long as it's not something weird or increases their cost, it should be granted. If you being popular with this guy is more important than your satisfaction on this safari, by all means, be the nice guy.

Because of the aforementioned changes, I also no longer go to the same place with the same professional time after time. I now see more of what Africa has to offer and see. I have also noticed that the same animals behave differently from country to country and game management areas. I also get to experience many different hunting styles. I will have a much richer bank of experience to call upon for stories to my children and grandchildren.

Who's at fault here?

There is plenty of blame to go around here. I think we, the clients can possibly be overbearing at times in our invitations to the PH's to come and visit. This goes back to the hero worship or rock star thing stated prior. Conversely, the professionals could just as easily tell us, they are on a tight schedule, prior commitments, whatever. My personal belief is; it has devolved into a PH being able to pick and choose who he would rather spend a few days with while in America. Can't say as I blame them for that. I'm sure many clients are a bear to be around. Think about this; nearly 24 hours a day 7 days a week for up to 28 days, with a guy you really don't care for. That may very well include me, after all, you can pay anyone to be your friend.

I truly hope my words are read as they are meant. I only wish to help someone else not repeat the same mistakes in safari hunting I have made. Keep things friendly yet, impersonal. It can be difficult, basically living with a guy, you tend to look up to a bit and not personalize the relationship.

All these things being said, I have enjoyed every minute of every day while hunting in Africa, I have made, what I thought to be close friends. As long as I feel that way thats what's
important.

Could you just bring along a brick of .22s?

Does this one sound familiar? I have been asked by more than one PH if I could "just throw a brick of .22s, 12ga, .375 etc. ammo in my bag." I chose to not spend my vacation in some African jail or trying to explain away why I have not declared it. I also probably don't have a firearm that matches the stuff in my gun box. So, the answer is, "No", and it should be yours as well.

Why do you think it is that we get requests for things? Sometimes I think we just bring gifts along unrequested. iPods, Oakley sunglasses seem to be a popular request. I've been guilty as well.

Perhaps it's just me. Maybe I'm burnt out on these musings. Hunting in Africa should be pure: it's raw beauty and savagery, her primal killing fields. Not some popularity contest. I believe it has been corrupted, corrupted possibly by us, the clients.

A friend of mine coined this timeless and appropriate phrase.

"Africa is about the men and the dust and the diesel, it sticks to your skin and cannot be washed away, nor does it wain." Andrew Baldry

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by Texas Blue Devil:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Mike,

Once again spot on. I've had that talk with many clients but the intimate nature of safari fosters these relationships real or not. Personally I've hunted with 19 different PH's. Only one did I not get along with fine and only one did anything egregious on safari. Three I consider as personal friends. The rest I got along with fine and I would be happy to share a camp with again but I don't send them a personal Christmas card nor receive one from them. I don't expect them to have any non business time for me at the show and I certainly don't care what they say about me as client once I've left camp. Bottom line safari is a business deal plain and simple.

Mark

Hi Mark,

I hunted last year in Tanzania. The first few evenings of the Safari, the "PH" was telling me stories about past clients and screw ups.

I excused myself and went to my shitty, old, torn up tent to retrieve my Ipad. On it, is my article "The Client" I just handed it to him and walked over to the fire pit to watch scorpions run out of the burning logs.

He read it and came over to the fire. He said, "Damn," I'm guilty of most of those things.

While we all need to have skin thick enough to be big boys. I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

I couldn't care less about a PH or guide thinking I'm a douchebag. As long as they are professional, polite, safe and generally do their job well, I'm fine with that. I'm there to hunt buffalo and elephant, not looking for a new best friend. We recently spent about $50K on a kitchen remodel job. Would you give a hoot if the contractor thought you were a douchebag, provided he did outstanding work?? I wouldn't.

All of my PH's in Africa have spoken very little about previous clients. When they spoke about previous clients, their comments were nearly all positive. I don't think for a second that these PHs really liked their past clients. They are just smart enough to know that speaking negatively of past clients is a really stupid, stupid thing to do.

What I have heard PH's talk about are other PH's. Lots and lots of that talk, with some positive comments and some negative comments. I have been amazed at the amount of gossip in the hunting industry.

I really don't care either, BUT…If the Ford dealer on my side of town treats me like a valued client and the Ford dealer on that side of town treats me otherwise, Fuck him, they're both Fords.

Safaris are no different than Fords and PH's are not different than a car salesman, they both will do whatever and say whatever to get your sale.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:
This is the article "The Client" that I penned.

It appeared in The African Hunter magazine about two years ago and caused quite a lot of letters to the editor and emails.


The Client

I may be young, I may be old. Perhaps I am athletic and in shape or maybe a bit long in tooth and round in profile. I may come for lion and leopard or I simply come for an impala or a kudu.

Who I am is the international hunting client and what I am talking about should have been written long ago. It may be uncomfortable and frankly unpopular; nonetheless the topic needs to be broached.

We, the international hunting clients of the world fuel this industry, make no mistake. Without us the professional hunters of the world, whether good or bad, wouldn't be able to live the lives of their dreams. Only due to the client's collectively pursued passions are they able to walk daily amongst the magnificent antelopes and grim beasts of Mother Africa.

I am sure the professionals of which I speak will have some disagreement with this. I understand, and only bring these things to bear for stimulating thought......on both ends.

Somewhere along the way things, in my opinion, have gone horribly askew. On my last few trips overseas, I have begun to take notice of certain repeated behavior patterns displayed by some very well known professional hunters.

Some were in destinations I was only able to dream about in my younger years. Places of danger, places of intrigue. Fantastic places were hunted and some extraordinary creatures were pursued, successful pursuits in most cases.

I have come to the conclusion that "they" (some PHs) now somehow think it (international sport hunting) is all about them. We the sport hunting community are guilty, guilty of creating some of these ego driven, self-promoting personalities. Some of us are willing to even pay a premium to go afield with the "stars" of the industry. Why?

After you are safely aboard the charter on your way out of camp, you are the brunt of stories, jokes and anecdotal fowl ups for the next wave of "stumbling halfwits." We willingly plop down a year’s salary or more for the hunts of our lifetimes. It matters zero to them if you show up prepared physically and mentally, if you’re able to shoot, and you can see the animals. You will be treated the same as a first timer that stumbles around homesick for 21 days with your muzzle pointed at the back of their head and complains, of blisters, the heat or no ice for their cocktails.

I have formed these opinions from my own and unique position of experience. Having 33 Safaris in 21 separate trips overseas I’ve hunted nearly all sub-Saharan African countries and have collected the majority of her bounty. I am comfortable in my own skin and make no apologies. I claim no special hunting skills, only an ability to read people with an acute aptitude of situational awareness.

I write this in Heathrow, on a layover coming back from a Botswana elephant hunt. I sat one day on this last safari, at lunch listening to a PH of record and another PH that was between safaris. They openly made sport of guys, guys just like me. Guys with business', guys with jobs or perhaps retired. We return home to our families. The professionals return to the bush and make sport of me and others to the next "client". Funny thing, in all the stories, the fools they speak of don't have names, just "client".

We never take a moment to think that they feel the same about us. I maintain it's time to quit the game when the names and the faces all become one long blur of pictures, hunting stories and blown shots.

These safaris mean far more to us than it does them. This may be the one and only chance many of us get to experience these places and pursue these beasts.

I have even discussed these thoughts with one of the PHs one evening around the fire. His take was this: we finish with the hunt, get on a charter and go back to our safe lives and leave them to clean up the messes we create with our poor shooting. There is probably a lot of truth to his statement.

The romance and traditions of Africa are a powerful aphrodisiac. It draws us back time after time. I know it has me. Personally, I take my responsibility as a sport hunter extremely serious. I show up fit, both physically and mentally. A 21-day safari is a long one, at times you must focus to take things one day at a time and keep your head in the game. I also bring only rifles I can shoot and take shots I am virtually certain I can make. The last thing I want is to wound something the next client or PH must deal with.

How many stories have we all heard about client’s wives, or even daughters? Think yours are any different? They are flesh and blood just as we are.

For some untold reason, the international hunting community has assigned a “Rock Star” status or hero worship to many of these PHs. Perhaps it’s because I can think of no other “sport” where we can participate, side by side with a Professional at anything.

It's November, the phone calls start and the emails arrive. They are asking about coming over for a visit between the hunting conventions. We feel honored to have a "Professional Hunter" actually want to stay at our homes. We buy them dinner, take them places, they drink our finest single malt. We may even try to help them and book more "bumbling clients". We take days off work or away from our businesses to entertain them. Maybe it makes us feel like we are in their inner circle or within their appreciated sphere of influence.

You actually believe that you are somehow different or special. We even see it as some kind of a badge of honor that a real professional hunter from Africa has chosen me as a friend. These are superficial friendships at the very best.

Come as a client, leave as a friend?

It may be hard for some to accept these concepts and learned them the hard way. I have many friends and acquaintances that go back to Africa every year and hunt with the same guys, the same guys that behind closed doors refer to one honorable, successful and admirable man as “a Gomer”.

Personally, I have decided to change my approach. Moving forward, I will no longer go alone and look for any sort of companionship from these guys. I will now go with a pal or my wife and treat them as they should be treated, as an employee of sorts. No real difference than your relationship with your taxidermist, your dentist or the guy you just bought your new F250 Super Duty from.

A trophy celebration in a foreign language.

Now, they can celebrate "their" successful kills and I can have my own celebration with someone who is genuinely happy for me. The attending PH can take as many high quality trophy photos of himself for self-promotion as he has taken of me, and I could not care less. I once hunted with a guy that never once took a photo on his camera with me in the shot. Seems kind of nuts, but that act alone gave me the awareness to start becoming a student of these behaviors. He showed me his iPod one evening in camp. All of his pictures were of he alone, no "client" to be seen. This particular “Professional” must see the client as no more than a tool to do "his killing" for him.

Honestly ask yourselves, could any one of these guys be successful enough in business to afford to pay for one of the safaris that they ridicule "us" on?

How about personal relationships, failed marriages, questionable vehicles and finances. I wouldn't trade my life for theirs for any amount of money. I also am sure they would say the same about my life. But we don't make fun of, nor ridicule them, do we?

Have you ever gone home early?

Have you ever finished a safari early? Have there been "suggestions" of perhaps side trips? Do these side trips usually require a trip home for some reason? I think many clients prefer to just "go with the flow" and not make mention of things that probably don't sit right with us. After all, you really do want this guy to like you, right? I use to feel that way, and would say nothing. "Hey Steve, do you mind if my wife, girlfriend, brother in law, whatever comes into
camp". Well, yes I do. I now just spit it out and keep communication as open and as honest as is possible.

I have never left a safari early, not at my own request anyway. It was suggested once that, I could go home early if I wanted. I didn't, but took the suggestion as he prefer I be elsewhere so rearranged my families trip home to the order of 2,800. for changing the prearranged itinerary.

I really feel that poor communication is the biggest component of a safari gone bad. You as the paying client cannot keep your mouth closed if something bothers you. You need to stop things right then, and tell the PH what it is you want, or don't want, or what he does is bothering you in some way. It is your adventure, you're paying the bill. As long as it's not something weird or increases their cost, it should be granted. If you being popular with this guy is more important than your satisfaction on this safari, by all means, be the nice guy.

Because of the aforementioned changes, I also no longer go to the same place with the same professional time after time. I now see more of what Africa has to offer and see. I have also noticed that the same animals behave differently from country to country and game management areas. I also get to experience many different hunting styles. I will have a much richer bank of experience to call upon for stories to my children and grandchildren.

Who's at fault here?

There is plenty of blame to go around here. I think we, the clients can possibly be overbearing at times in our invitations to the PH's to come and visit. This goes back to the hero worship or rock star thing stated prior. Conversely, the professionals could just as easily tell us, they are on a tight schedule, prior commitments, whatever. My personal belief is; it has devolved into a PH being able to pick and choose who he would rather spend a few days with while in America. Can't say as I blame them for that. I'm sure many clients are a bear to be around. Think about this; nearly 24 hours a day 7 days a week for up to 28 days, with a guy you really don't care for. That may very well include me, after all, you can pay anyone to be your friend.

I truly hope my words are read as they are meant. I only wish to help someone else not repeat the same mistakes in safari hunting I have made. Keep things friendly yet, impersonal. It can be difficult, basically living with a guy, you tend to look up to a bit and not personalize the relationship.

All these things being said, I have enjoyed every minute of every day while hunting in Africa, I have made, what I thought to be close friends. As long as I feel that way thats what's
important.

Could you just bring along a brick of .22s?

Does this one sound familiar? I have been asked by more than one PH if I could "just throw a brick of .22s, 12ga, .375 etc. ammo in my bag." I chose to not spend my vacation in some African jail or trying to explain away why I have not declared it. I also probably don't have a firearm that matches the stuff in my gun box. So, the answer is, "No", and it should be yours as well.

Why do you think it is that we get requests for things? Sometimes I think we just bring gifts along unrequested. iPods, Oakley sunglasses seem to be a popular request. I've been guilty as well.

Perhaps it's just me. Maybe I'm burnt out on these musings. Hunting in Africa should be pure: it's raw beauty and savagery, her primal killing fields. Not some popularity contest. I believe it has been corrupted, corrupted possibly by us, the clients.

A friend of mine coined this timeless and appropriate phrase.

"Africa is about the men and the dust and the diesel, it sticks to your skin and cannot be washed away, nor does it wain." Andrew Baldry

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Originally posted by Texas Blue Devil:

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Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

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Originally posted by Texas Blue Devil:

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Originally posted by Steve Ahrenberg:

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Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

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I think too many clients have the mistaken view that their relationship with a PH transcends being commercial. They believe they have bonded with the PH in some unique and enduring way. These notions are undoubtedly fueled by folks like Ruark and their writings. It is certainly a sentimentally appealing notion but my bet is that in the vast majority of the cases, boil away the idealism and romanticism, and what you would find is that the relationship comes down to dollars and cents. Which is fine and probably the way it should be.

Mike,

Once again spot on. I've had that talk with many clients but the intimate nature of safari fosters these relationships real or not. Personally I've hunted with 19 different PH's. Only one did I not get along with fine and only one did anything egregious on safari. Three I consider as personal friends. The rest I got along with fine and I would be happy to share a camp with again but I don't send them a personal Christmas card nor receive one from them. I don't expect them to have any non business time for me at the show and I certainly don't care what they say about me as client once I've left camp. Bottom line safari is a business deal plain and simple.

Mark

Hi Mark,

I hunted last year in Tanzania. The first few evenings of the Safari, the "PH" was telling me stories about past clients and screw ups.

I excused myself and went to my shitty, old, torn up tent to retrieve my Ipad. On it, is my article "The Client" I just handed it to him and walked over to the fire pit to watch scorpions run out of the burning logs.

He read it and came over to the fire. He said, "Damn," I'm guilty of most of those things.

While we all need to have skin thick enough to be big boys. I'll be damned if I want to return and plop down 20,30 or even 50K to a guy that thinks I'm a douchebag. Screw that.

I couldn't care less about a PH or guide thinking I'm a douchebag. As long as they are professional, polite, safe and generally do their job well, I'm fine with that. I'm there to hunt buffalo and elephant, not looking for a new best friend. We recently spent about $50K on a kitchen remodel job. Would you give a hoot if the contractor thought you were a douchebag, provided he did outstanding work?? I wouldn't.

All of my PH's in Africa have spoken very little about previous clients. When they spoke about previous clients, their comments were nearly all positive. I don't think for a second that these PHs really liked their past clients. They are just smart enough to know that speaking negatively of past clients is a really stupid, stupid thing to do.

What I have heard PH's talk about are other PH's. Lots and lots of that talk, with some positive comments and some negative comments. I have been amazed at the amount of gossip in the hunting industry.

I really don't care either, BUT…If the Ford dealer on my side of town treats me like a valued client and the Ford dealer on that side of town treats me otherwise, Fuck him, they're both Fords.

Safaris are no different than Fords and PH's are not different than a car salesman, they both will do whatever and say whatever to get your sale.

Hey Steve,

Yes of course, if a PH or Truck salesman doesn't treat you well.....definitely take your business somewhere else. That wasn't where I was going with my "I don't care" comment. I was referring to the false bonding or insincerity of the relationship between hunter and PH. You know,.... where a PH treats you like a valued customer, but thinks you are a douchebag.

I'm fairly easy-going guy with a simple approach to a hunt (or fishing trip). I'm there to have fun. It is a vacation. I have a very stressful job, and in Africa I really disconnect from work. It feels amazing. As long as my group is having fun, and the PH treats us well and performs his professional duties well,.....I don't give a stuff if he thinks we are all douchebags. And if he talks negatively about us after we leave,.....who cares. I have real shit to worry about.

Like I said in my earlier post, the PHs that I've hunted with, haven't really had anything negative to say about past clients. Now I have been on some North American hunts and fishing trips where guides bitched constantly about past idiot clients. It is not fun to be around,..and these trips should be all about fun!!!!

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Originally posted by Frostbit: Personally I am not offended if a past PH regales his clients with stories of Joyce and me. I've got nothing to hide nor am I embarrassed by anything I've done on safari including getting totally shit faced with Andrew after the Lion went down.

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Originally posted by Frostbit:There's a human side to these guys just like anyone else.

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Originally posted by Bill C:

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Originally posted by Frostbit: Personally I am not offended if a past PH regales his clients with stories of Joyce and me. I've got nothing to hide nor am I embarrassed by anything I've done on safari including getting totally shit faced with Andrew after the Lion went down.

Hey Jim, so how are those hemorrhoids doing anyway?