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| one of us |
oh they will pay IF the doctor has the right lawyer....... might have been CHEAPER to buy a learjet to haul their crews from place to place........ you would think a business that flies people from to place would be better equiped for that task wouldn't ya?? | |||
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One of Us |
Their stock is back up today after the BIG dip yesterday. I guess everyone already forgot about it? | |||
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| One of Us |
I have discussed this with to two commercial pilot friends of mine-both Check airmen- that flew for different airlines, American and southwest if it matters, and the both same this was completely caused by United - what ever the fine print says. There were much better ways to handle the situation, and the same goes for Chicago PD--should have been handle much better. "The rule is perfect: in all matters of opinion our adversaries are insane." Mark Twain TANSTAAFL www.savannagems.com A unique way to own a piece of Africa. DSC Life NRA Life | |||
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| one of us |
CEOs never have a clue what the fallout of their stupid actions will be . For those of you good in math --Add up the cost of hiring a 4 passenger plane for the employees , vs the bad PR [" I'll never fly UAL again" ] stock prices , law suits etc , etc . I hope the CEO is pushed out ! | |||
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| One of Us |
"You can drag me, I'm not going. I'm staying right here. You'll have to drag me." http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new...argument-police.html Well OK. Arguing with and ignoring the lawful instructions by the police seldom ends peacefully. Wonder if Scooter actually thought he was going to win the argument? I'm a doctor!  ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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| One of Us |
Do you think the CEO knew anything about this until well after the episode was over? There is not a chance in hell he did. | |||
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| One of Us |
"This can never, will never happen again," he said. Quote today from Munoz. He also said United would "never use the police again" and "In the ABC interview, Munoz apologized profusely to Dao, his family, passengers and United customers." It would be nice to know how many small jets they could have rented to fly the 4 crew members for what this is costing them now and will cost them in the future. Don Trust only those who stand to lose as much as you do when things go wrong. | |||
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| One of Us |
Yup. An arrogant prick with an attitude. Screaming the way he screamed told me all I needed to know. | |||
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| one of us |
Larry, in this country we went through a period of teaching CEOs and other management [not all that long ago ] because of dumb reactions and poor planning to various emergencies . It doesn't seem that any of them remember , if they learned at all. In this case everyone seemed to make things worse .There were many mistakes ,so many idiots ,starting with the suspended doc. | |||
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| One of Us |
I'm a little amazed that some of you are taking the position that regardless of what you had paid for a ticket or what it might have impacted if you had been the "chosen one" that you should have meekly given up your seat. I'm not buying that for a second. If you had a major hunt or a daughters wedding resting in the connection I doubt most of you would have taken the high road and walked off the plane like you had won the lottery. If you think United was right in this one then good for you. And I hope the next time it is you and not me that gets bumped after paying for a service. Trust only those who stand to lose as much as you do when things go wrong. | |||
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| One of Us |
I agree it was handled poorly on many levels by many people some of which were not United employees. The doctors behavior really makes me wonder about his stability. I do not care what the situation was, there is not a chance in hell you would find me acting like he acted. | |||
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| Administrator |
No matter how you look at this disaster, it IS a management problem. Instructions should have been in place that when things look like are going out of hand, someone in authority should be contacted, rather than take an utterly stupid action like they did. Their CEO seems to be beyond any help, how the hell someone like him has ever gotten to that position is incredible. This is the norm in modern society, never admit your mistake, or the lawyers would be lining up to sue you. Well, they got their ways, it IS going to court. | |||
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| One of Us |
Perhaps you are right Saeed. Remember, it was not United employees who took the gentlemen off the plane. | |||
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| Administrator |
Larry, No matter how and by whom he was taken off the plane, the original problem was created by United. Denying a passenger boarding before he gets on the plane might have an explanation. Giving him a boarding pass and putting him on the plane, then trying to take him off because of you have to have your employees in his place, is never acceptable. And the final outcome of this is, United IS going to suffer. | |||
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| One of Us |
Given the quality of airline travel nowadays, I am surprised this hasn't become an issue before getting to the government getting involved. Yes, they put all kinds of lawyerese in their contract, but where else do you buy a service that may be delivered at the whim of the corporation? Frankly, overbooking should be banned. If that means changing flights is more expensive, so be it. I kind of look at this as possibly being a watershed. I doubt Rosa Parks was the first black person to refuse to give up her seat on a bus, but given when she did it, it sparked a dramatic change. Yes, this guy is a doofus, but enough people feel the airlines have been behaving badly enough for years that maybe uncle is going to get involved now. Of course that will likely have unintended consequences if it does happen, but from the sound of it, enough folks have been treated poorly by the airlines that it may well happen. | |||
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| One of Us |
I agreed | |||
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| One of Us |
Don, I believe that most of us who fly a lot know what our rights are and what are rights aren't. If you get bumped, you have rights to compensation but you do not have the right to throw a fit, disturb other passengers, delay the flight, and then ignore lawful orders and become combative. That is only going to result in an assbeating. The situation could have (should have) been handled in a dozen other ways to avoid conflict. However, IF it had happened to me, I would have walked off the plane without being dragged and immediately spoken with an airline rep. I would have attempted to plead my case as to why I must be on this flight and failing that, I would have demanded maximum compensation and then some. I would then have found another flight and would send the bill and letter explaining the whole mess to Oscar Munoz. The LAST thing I would have done is what our little snowflake did. And finally, if you had the most important meeting (or hunt) of your life planned the next day and were flying, I would leave a day early - especially on international flights. Nothing is a guarantee when dealing with public transportation. ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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| one of us |
Hmmm. "Scooter". "Snowflake". Says it all. The only thing corporations understand is money. They WILL understand this! Peter Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong; | |||
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| One of Us |
As soon as the police were called, it was out of the airline's hands so their culpability will be limited. ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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| one of us |
I'll bet serious money "their culpability" won't be limited. I'll also bet they settle. True, the airlines can eject or reject a passenger BUT once they have seated him, AND the ejection is for non-emergent, non-passenger caused reasons, I think they will be found seriously liable. I also think the doctor, acting in the way he did, seriously escalated his eventual payoff. I suspect he will receive at least 6 figures (100K) plus which is a helluva lot more than he would have gotten if he had "walked off the plane without being dragged." We'll see, but I suspect the settlement will be sealed. In addition, until further details arise, I am not sure the Chicago PD have any real blame. They are told they have a passenger who refuses to leave the plane and to remove him. I am not at all sure they knew many details. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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| one of us |
First off these was not the Chicago Police Department. This is the Aviation Security Department which is a stand alone department attached to ORD. They are police not security guards and have full arrest powers. Just FYI. I'm willing to bet that the Dr.in question gets more than 6 figures. I'll also bet that this settles quickly with no court. | |||
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| one of us |
At the risk of acting like Crazyhorse, this guy is not a "snowflake" - the term was originally applied to millennials being too easily offended as a result of their helicopter parents. It morphed into an insult for liberals. This guy is anything but a snowflake - not saying I admire him, but a true "snowflake" would have burst into tears. Beyond that, the word is so overused it is getting to be a bit tiresome. Reminds me when people said "Been there, done that" and thought they were cool. | |||
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| One of Us |
I think you are right. Not because they have any real liability, they simply want to avoid any more adverse publicity. | |||
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| one of us |
from financial blurb today.....
....and the beat goes on..... xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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| one of us |
.....and on......
xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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| one of us |
I thought this was private transportation? Let's see maybe I should leave a week early, because "nothing is guaranteed"?. What does a seat reservation mean? They have taken my money. This is complete BS. If airlines did not deliberately overbook they MIGHT have a leg to stand on. Does the moral standing of the passenger have an affect on the way he is treated? Dragging a doctor has had his license suspended is OK, maybe even Nancy Pelosi, but anyone else, hell no! You can go and write your letter to the CEO but once you are off the plane you have NO LEVERAGE, and THAT is what they understand. Another AZ, thanks for the explanation! I did not know the meaning of the term but inferred that it was meant to be derogatory, something that obviously mattered to the poster of those comments. Peter. Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong; | |||
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| One of Us |
Scream at your next flight attendant and put up a fuss that you have rights and please tell us all how that works out for you...  ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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One of Us |
[(Concussion + Broken Nose)(Public Relations Faux Pas + CEO Fault Admission)] * 2 = Big Pay Day Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
Mike, no one is denying that our little At the end of the day, this will be forgotten and United will continue to make billions. But maybe next time someone decides to make an ass of themselves on a flight they will think about the potential assbeating that awaits... I still wish flight attendants could carry tasers. Would make flying so much more entertaining. ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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| One of Us |
. . . and he damn well should be. Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
That's a matter of opinion Mike. And probably why our little ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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one of us |
News here is reporting someone broke his nose & knocked two of his teeth out & that he's appointed a lawyer & is going to sue..... As I see it, quite rightly. It's certainly no way to treat a paying customer or allow a paying customer to be treated no matter what the small print says. | |||
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| one of us |
Opus: Not sure why you don't think he would find a sympathetic jury. The entire country and most of AR is pretty outraged. Even Trump weighed in, saying for the right amount of money, he will step off the plane. The fair and equitable solution to this problem is to keep increasing the amount until you have takers. Delta asks you to bid on the amount you will take. As for the crew, I read today the only reason they were on the last flight of the day is their previous flight had been delayed for mechanical reasons. Not a good day for Republic on Sunday, at least at ORD. | |||
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| One of Us |
A lot of this reaction shocks me. Was this handled badly? Sure it was. The doctor is a whiny ass cry baby prick. The law enforcement people probably over reacted. What really blew it up was the cell phone videos. There is a lot of talk about his seat that he had paid for and all of that. Yes, I get it. If I was him, I would be madder than hell. Gentlemen, I travel a hell of a lot in my work. Before the end of this year, I may well pass 4 million miles on Delta alone. If not this year, certainly next year. I have seen it all in my travels. Was this guy inconvenienced? I am sure he was. United was trying to get employees to another airport. Guess what was going to happen if these employees did not get to that airport? Every single person on at least one flight, perhaps more flights was going to be stuck in the Louisville airport, waiting until a flight crew arrived. This often starts a domino effect. One flight is late. This means a whole bunch of people start to miss connecting flights. Off we go with a chain reaction of delays that can spread like wildfire. It happened to me last week. I have no sympathy for this doctor based on his behavior. I think a lot of people miss the big picture here. Making one person late is minor compared to making an entire plane maybe more late. I have seen people taken off planes by law enforcement before. Actually, I have seen it several times. Every single time, seriously bad behavior on the part of the passenger was involved. I am willing to bet the same thing happened here. | |||
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| One of Us |
From a lawsuit perspective, no "reasonable person" expects to: * Buy a airline ticket, board a plane, get in your seat . . . only to be told you have to leave to accommodate another airline crew for another flight. * When you refuse, to be physically removed from the plane. * To end up in the hospital with a broken nose and a concussion. Not only are his lawyers not afraid of a jury, if they cannot get the settlement they want, they will demand a jury. Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
Mike during your next speeding ticket please argue with the cop, refuse all commands, become combative and whine a lot that you're a lawyer and you have rights. Let us know how that turns out for you. Let me know if you need a reference for a good dentist and plastic surgeon. ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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| One of Us |
. . . pretty poor analogy . . . this fellow was not "speeding" or doing anything else "wrong" . . . he was singled out by the airline to accommodate other airline employees when the airline refused to step up the plate economically. Tell you what, let's just let it ride and see what sort of pay day the fellow gets then we can revisit the issue . . .  Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
Once again, no one is denying he will get paid something. The discussion is - can any reasonable person believe it's kosher to argue with and be non-compliant to a police officer and expect nothing will come of it? Like you're going to win that argument because you're a doctor? And my analogy is exactly what happened with our little ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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One of Us |
Getting a judgment from a jury, does not mean you will collect. Appeals court will apply the law and not emotion. | |||
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| one of us |
Ridiculous argument. You are saying that attacking a paying passenger was the only solution. Ummmm, they can offer enough MONEY that someone will take them up on it. There is no way that someone on that flight would not have stood up and voluntarily left for a couple of thousand and free hotel and food. Ummmm, there are private jets available for rental that would get the crew to Louisville on time. Ummm, there are other airlines that possibly could have accomodated the flight crew. ANY of the above will prove to be hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars cheaper than the actual result AND no one down stream would have had a flight cancelled. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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