i have thought of making up a big cartridge
based on the .416 Rigby brass shorten down to let say 2.5" and then give it a .510 cal to the length of 3.4", and make out a mannlicher style
M98..
The ballistic performance that i am looking for
is a 500-600 grain bullet going 1700-1800 Ft/sec

has anyone ever done that?

jens...

next year jeffeosso is making the 510 a.r. on the rigby or lapua brass to work in a std mag length action that should do at least 2150 if not 2300...

be patient and have jeffeosso make one for you.

the 510 a.r. is the top end of the a.r. line and should be a dandy rifle made on a ruger m77 markII.

see post...

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/.../830108924#830108924

Hey!! What boom said!! A Dane at a Bubba shoot to kick off your new rifle! Save up for a trip to Texas and have a moment to always remember! Seriously!! Think about it.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
jens...

next year jeffeosso is making the 510 a.r. on the rigby or lapua brass to work in a std mag length action that should do at least 2150 if not 2300...
be patient and have jeffeosso make one for you.

the 510 a.r. is the top end of the a.r. line and should be a dandy rifle made on a ruger m77 markII.

hey Boomstick!

Thanks for the link

It looks like I`LL have to go to the "lone star state" next year
I believe this cartridge has some kind of potential, and desguised in a slim-trim full stock Mannlicher M98, everybody is in for a surprise . I have the action, an original mauser + a magnum triggerguard from Blackburn
already.
For me, this kind of rifle would be a 100 yard proposition..
Maybe jefferso will pop-in a remark

give him a p.m. i am sure if the demand is there it will happen. he was talking about putting it on a ruger but i guess he could make it work on a 98.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
give him a p.m. i am sure if the demand is there it will happen. he was talking about putting it on a ruger but i guess he could make it work on a 98.

...has been "pimpent".

As ya'll probably know, we have the 416, 458, and 470 ARs, based off the RUM brass, which is 2.55" long, and improved. The rigby brass is several times more expensive, and far hard to get the feeding geometery down properly for a stagger feed, though a single stack would work.

the ARs are designed to fit in a standard length action, in fact, will DROP in, with a rebarrel, on a ruger mkII "mag" (7, 300 338)


Here's my concept of the 500 AR, based off rigby brass... this is a 2007 project, for me.



here's the AR round drawings


and here's a link to the AR page on my website
http://weaponsmith.com/AR-rounds1.html

jeffe...

for those who money is not such an object and for the sake of "i did it back in...

you might want to make drawings for not only the 500 a.r. but the 416, 458 and 470 on the rigby/lapua

call em 416, 458 and 470 a.r. express or nitro ect.

just a thought

question...if you did the smaller cals on the rigby/lapua would you have to move the shoulder back or could you keep it in the same place? (for the sake of cost or reamers, guages ect and uniformity)

Well, awhile back, I drew up a 3.1" COL 470 on Jeffery and Rigby cases. Everyone (including me) convinced me that the Jeffery wouldn't neck there easily, and the Rigby wouldn't feed (from M70/M1999, etc.) But seeing Jeffe's 470 AR and RIP's 500 Mbogo I'm back to thinking about it.
It would be a little longer than what you had in mind, but shorter than Jeffe's.
Most sensible would be off the WSM case, for that extra .010" at the base, but it isn't ideally long nor assuredly available in the future.
BTW, if looking at bolt thrust, it turned out I could expect about the same velocity from the Jeffery case as the Rigby. If one had a monster-sized action, yet short enough to make a short cat make sense (something goofy about a little cartridge in a mag action, no?) then you could gain alot from the Rigby, but I wouldn't be comfortable pushing it like that in a M70, for instance.
And for the record, I was counting on about 2150 for a 500g bullet, 24" bbl. Nice Nitro-like speeds.

Bwana-be:
Take a gander at the .500 Van Horn, 2.575" case made from 460 Weatherby with the belt turned off (pg. 414 of Ken Howell's Magnum Opus):

Your cartridge from .416 Rigby basic brass would be even better. An M70 or 1999 of standard length should handle the bolt thrust, it would just be a chore to get the right box and feeding worked out, IMHO. That is why I chose to use the full length 500 Mbogo in a BRNO/CZ Magnum action.

Seems there was a .500 Weatherby Magnum with more than a caliber length neck before the 500A2. How does this compare in date of origin to the .510 Wells, which is not in the Howell book??? Donnelly's specs for the .510 Wells show it to be different from the .500 Weatherby.
However, Howell's book is a lot more reliable than Donnelly's regarding the specs shown.

oh, another good thing about the 500 a.r. is the pistol bullets for "plinking"

Yup, feeding is the main obstacle I see. The headspace would work, performance would be around what I'd expect, I'm sure. Just think trying to get it to feed would be way over my head.
Make it from Jeffery brass chambered in a M70 WSM rifle, and it should be ready to rock.
Oh, and I talked with Howell about that round, and he actually knew nothing about it more than that drawing there.

quote:

Oh, and I talked with Howell about that round, and he actually knew nothing about it more than that drawing there.

are you reffering to the 500 a.r.? if you are from what i know jeffe only talked to him about the 470, 458 and 416.

the 500 a.r. came about separately originaly called the 500 boom stick but jeffe objected to the name

but the a.r. name is great and the 500 a.r. will be great once jeffe has the time to do it. single stack it will have to be.

500 van horn is "only" .025 longer than the 500 AR... no real reason to make yeat ANOTHER round, is there?

i'll take some woodleigh 535s and back into the max length for a 3.35 case...


wanna bet it's about 2.65 or more?

jeffe

jeffe,
Your design looks great. It has a better neck length than the 500 Van Horn.

IIRC, about the max bullet nose space needed would be 0.75" long, for something like the XLC or TSX, all the rest can be shorter.

2.5" + .75" = 3.25"

2.6" + .75" = 3.35"

Do you dare?

Split the difference and make it a 2.55" case length to match the other AR's.
If you ever start mass producing a vertical stack dropbox for the Ruger M77 Mk II, I want a couple.

BS, I was talking about the Van Horn, but I misspoke. Was thinking about the metric number at the bottom of p562, 12.7x64mm HK, from some guy named Heinz Krenn. Basically the same case with a few thousandths moved around here and there.

Oh, and RIP, not sure what back thrust you had in mind that you thought the M70 could handle, but I've been convinced that the RUM line is pretty well pushing it at 62kpsi or so, which equates to about 50k with the Rigby.
It would be interesting to look at QL's guestimates, but at least with a caliber that will fit the Jeffery, that case could meet Powelly's expectations of the Rigby at the lower pressure. Moot point when you're talking about .510" bullets.
But yeah, I'm sure 50k psi would do some damage on both ends! And neat to have in a M70.
I once drew up an "improved" 416 Rigby, that was only 2.8" COL, and it had virtually the same powder space as the real one.

Rip
I would jut buy a 416 rigby mag, for the express, and delete about what, .500 or so from the middle, tig it back up, and it SHOULD feed...

or, just open the regular 77 to take that box, and you could mag feed 642gr milsurps!!

the ruger is wide wide!!

but, a single stack for the 77, with a "weatherby" drop box (perchbelly) would probably hold 3

jeffe