I like 26" barrel velocity, but on a DGR I think that anything over 22" is far too impractical.

22" barrel without a muzzle brake maximum load in .460Wea. gets 500gr. Hornady up to 2540-2560 fps.

It is a velocity loss that I'm willing to sacrifice for every day practical use and fast handling.

Pyzda

Question:
What is your favorit barrel length on DGR bolt action?

Choices:
16-18"
19-21"
22-24"
25-27"
28" and longer

 

25 or 26 with iron sights.You need that to help aiming.The shorter the more difficult or the bigger the margin of error.

I had a 25" barrel while hunting buffalo last year. It got tangled in all sorts of shrubs while sneaking through brush. Came home and chopped it down to 23". Much handier and could have probably gone as far as 22".

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
25 or 26 with iron sights.You need that to help aiming.The shorter the more difficult or the bigger the margin of error.

I agree with George. The longer barrel will also balance better, feel better to shoot and looks better. The notion that a short barrel is necessary on a DGR is a myth. Look at all the doubles that were built by the British with 26" barrels.

24" feels about right for me. Everyone's different.

I prefer the 22 to 24" barrels on a DGR. Same for my doubles.

Mike - 24" barrels on a double like my .375 makes for as short a rifle as my M70 in .458 Lott that I cut down to 21".

My 9,3 has the original 23" barrel and I have often been tempted to cut it down to the European standard of 20".

And yes, if you shorten the barrel you need to lighten the stock...I don't like a bolt gun to weigh over 8lb so that isn't a problem.

A short barreled rifle with a lightened stock can be made to feel lighter in your hands than a long rifle can. Balance and handyness are easier to achive with a short barrel!

21-23 .. depends on the case eff. and intended purpose ..

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
25 or 26 with iron sights.You need that to help aiming.The shorter the more difficult or the bigger the margin of error.

I agree with George. The longer barrel will also balance better, feel better to shoot and looks better. The notion that a short barrel is necessary on a DGR is a myth. Look at all the doubles that were built by the British with 26" barrels.

This is true, but doesn't the shorter action of the DR make the OAL much shorter then a bolt rifle?

I like the 25" barrels. I've never noticed catching it in the brush.

Mine are 20 and 16-

in Zim and RSA this year not only did they work well but I had many inquiries- the local PHs loved them in fact at least two are ordering short barrels

Hunting DG is a close range affair, often in thick brush, and there are some very real advantages for
short bbls. But for fast, accurate handling overall balance is just as important.
When you can combine both you have the ideal.

The bbl on my 458 is 21"

Long barrel helps in aiming.Click the image.
[URL= ]2008 impala-458 lott[/URL]

Good shot!

The bridge mounted aperture sight on my 25 in 404 barrel gives me a 29 in sighting radius. That is a real advantage for accuracy. Not had to be in tight bush as yet so that is not a consideration I took into account when deciding on the barrel length.

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
Good shot!

Thanks!A closer look at the trophy Impala.
[URL= ]Impala[/URL]

Gentleman to me a hunting (especially DGR) rifle is a tool. Nothing different to the hammer.

I don't need a pretty hammer to work and I don't need a pretty rifle to work either.

I don't care how ugly they both are as long as they are practical and work 100% each and everytime I need them to.

Contrary to most people here I prefer stock heavy rifles to the extreme.

I don't drill stock butts to add weight, I use 1/4"-1/2" thick 316 grade stainless steel plate perfectly shaped at the end of the butt and then screw the recoil pad on to the plate.

I drill through my stocks all the way to the stainless steel plate and I use 1/2" high tensile threaded rod to reinforce the stock.

Every part of the rifles has open (larger than 90 degree) angles so the rifle CAN NOT CATCH on anything, but the bolt.

I don't use ordinary checkering, I use my own design finish that hand will never slip regardless of what.

I use only peep sights, and fuck me if they are too close together on a 22" barrel bolt action to spoil my aim.

Maybe 5-6" three shot groups from .460Wea. 500gr. full trottle at 100 yards offhand in less than 5-6 seconds isn't enough, but it is the best what I can do.

Pyzda

I prefer my bigger bore rifles between 21" and 23". Seems like a good compromise, although I don't think a couple inches either way really makes much difference as far as handling goes....not to me anyway.

I also have a 338 RCM with a 20" barrel that is really growing on me.

I picked 23" as a trade-off for handiness, limiting muzzle blast, balance and for correct velocity with acceptable pressure it produces from the 458Win.

Oz, that's a classy looking rile. Can you fill in the details on it? Nice!

I had a 458B&M built for me with a 20" bbl - 18" also works - and killed my last Ele with it this past August. To say the PH and staff were intrigued by the "short" rifle would be an understatement. And it handles like a dream, while being very user friendly in the bush. One shot, one Ele DRT.

These B&M rifles and cartridges were designed to be short, maneuverable compact big bores for DG. They are proving themselves repeatedly to be up to the task.

I encourage all DG hunters to investigate the B&M DG cartridges and rifles for yourself.

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:
Oz, that's a classy looking rile. Can you fill in the details on it? Nice!

It's a 458W built with German Recknagel fittings, German Walther barrel, Duane Weibe Bottom metal, Australian Walnut, M98 Action and put together here in Australia by a gifted friend of mine, Vettore.
Here it is with a 24" barrelled 9.3x62 by V;

Oz, those are proper rifles...all the way around.

quote:

Originally posted by LionHunter:
I had a 458B&M built for me with a 20" bbl - 18" also works - and killed my last Ele with it this past August. To say the PH and staff were intrigued by the "short" rifle would be an understatement. And it handles like a dream, while being very user friendly in the bush. One shot, one Ele DRT.

These B&M rifles and cartridges were designed to be short, maneuverable compact big bores for DG. They are proving themselves repeatedly to be up to the task.

I encourage all DG hunters to investigate the B&M DG cartridges and rifles for yourself.

I have to admit that Michaels458, 16-18" barrel DG rifles are to me the most appealling rifles of all.

(To me they would be even more appealling if they were on the CZ/602ZKK actions) sorry fellows, I just couldn't resist.

However I would prefer to keep the .460Wea. chambering and one day it may come to it.

18" barrel/8.5 pounds .460Wea. sounds very attractive to me.

The only thing that is stopping me from doing it is to cut the .460Wea. performance down to the .458 Lott level by using 18" barrel.

Maybe one day someone will have 18" barrel .585HE before me and share the info on the forum.

Pyzda

quote:

(To me they would be even more appealling if they were on the CZ/602ZKK actions)

There will be no days that a B&M will be put on a CZ anything. B&Ms have to work.

I could sit all day and attempt to explain how a 18 inch B&M handles, or the Super Shorts at 16 inches, but it would be a waste of time. One simply has to have hands on to understand. I can promise this, if you value you big long muskets with 22-24 inch barrels, DO NOT put hands on a B&M, if you do, then the rest of your rifles will be of no use to you, and you will not carry them again. Either have to have a safe big enough to put them in, or they hit the auction block.

I can say this for a fact, I will never carry another 9-10 lb 22-24 inch musket to the bush.

M

It would be interesting to know why don`t trap and skeet shooters use 18 inch barrels? Is it because it is more difficult to point or aim? Is it because the shot won't keep a tight pattern out to the target? If the shot won't keep a tight pattern,then why is this so? Does a long rifle barrel help stableize a bullet the way a long shotgun barrel keeps a tight pattern? Is a stable bullet more likely to penetrate deeper or remain more accurate?

They arn't facing dangerous clays in the thick brush.

quote:

Originally posted by srose:
They arn't facing dangerous clays in the thick brush.

They will be if they do not do it right the first time.

I prefer 21 ro 23" on bolt rifles and 24 to 26" on doubles.

465H&H

I am a big fan of short barreled bolt rifles.

My favorite Blaser R 93 barrels are the Trackers in 308 and 375 H&H, they are 50cm/19 3/4".

However my Beloved British 450 No2 has 28" barrels. The longer barrels enable me to see the front sight on this rifle better than any other I have.

I have hunted in Zimbabwe with this gun or 3 different Safaris totalliung 86 days of hunting. I have hunted in some really thiclk stuff and I have killed several cape buff and elephants, cape buff as close as 12 yards, and elephants at 6 yards and less, [the first shots], actually I have not found the 28" barrels to be any sort of handicap.

In fact on a big bore double I much prefer 28" barrels to 24" barrels.

My 450/400 has 26" barrels and my 9,3x74R has 24" barrels. I find both of them to be pwrfect for their frame size and calibre.

24" to 26" are best for me on bolt rifles. Longer on doubles.

And heavy contour, please. These features give great "hang" - which tends toward steadiness and ends with straight shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
24" to 26" are best for me on bolt rifles. Longer on doubles.

And heavy contour, please. These features give great "hang" - which tends toward steadiness and ends with straight shooting.

I had a 425WR with a heavy 24" barrel. Was the best pointing Rifle I have owned.

Pointing is one thing, maneuverability in the bush or any terrain for that matter is another thing.

They are both totally different to one other.

I like the 26" barrel for nothing, but velocity.

I wouldn't even consider to have a DGR or any other bolt action hunting rifle (in my case it is the same rifles) with barrel longer than 22".

If I could get the performance that I like from an 18" barrel. I would have all rifle barrels chopped to 18" without any hesitations.

That means single shot rifles as well.

Pyzda

quote:

Originally posted by Pyzda:
Pointing is one thing, maneuverability in the bush or any terrain for that matter is another thing.

They are both totally different to one other.

I like the 26" barrel for nothing, but velocity.

I wouldn't even consider to have a DGR or any other bolt action hunting rifle (in my case it is the same rifles) with barrel longer than 22".

If I could get the performance that I like from an 18" barrel. I would have all rifle barrels chopped to 18" without any hesitations.

That means single shot rifles as well.

Pyzda

I can`t think of any incident where a hunter could not discharge his rifle in Africa because there was a tree or a big rock inches in front of him.I have never read anywhere of an experienced hunter or PH mentioning that an 18 inch barreled rifle would be advantageous to them in any way.I have hunted Africa 3 times and never had any displeasure or inconvenience in carrying my rifle,even in the thick stuff and yet you believe an 18 inch barrel is a must.Why don`t we see a PH using an 18 inch barreled rifle?

Shootaway

If the performance was exactly the same and I had to choose.

I would take and use 18" barrel at 20 pound rifle, than 26" barrel at 10 pound rifle without slightest hesitation.

Keep in mind that I'm not talking about recoil management, I'm strictly talking about the MANEOUVERABILITY.

Pyzda

I know you are talking about that but maneuvering a rifle or shotgun with a 26 inch barrel has never been an issue with anyone hunting anywhere.If you were talking military combat in a room such is in a house them I might agree,but hunting DG is in no way like that even when it gets nasty,IMO.I have hunted small game in the thick Quebec bush with a 30 inch shotgun many times and going to a 26 inch is better and perfect but you can still do with a 30.Why someone would want a 18 inch in Africa is nonsense.

Shootaway

I never had an 18" barrel because I never wanted a .460Wea. to have .458Win. performance.

However I had .460Wea. 22" barrel in a Ruger NO.1. All in all the total length of that rifle was about the same as a bolt action with 18" barrel would be.

The barrel was a duplica of 45/70 and at 7.5 pounds with peep sights and no muzzle brake it was a pleasure to handle.

500gr./2540fps. Hornady bullets never let me down. It was great in every possible situation.

The only thing that was against, was that it had no magazine. So that was the final end of its faith.

If it was a same length bolt action with the same performance and MANEUVERABILITY it still would be here as my number one hunting rifle.

Pyzda

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:

quote:

Originally posted by Pyzda:
Pointing is one thing, maneuverability in the bush or any terrain for that matter is another thing.

They are both totally different to one other.

I like the 26" barrel for nothing, but velocity.

I wouldn't even consider to have a DGR or any other bolt action hunting rifle (in my case it is the same rifles) with barrel longer than 22".

If I could get the performance that I like from an 18" barrel. I would have all rifle barrels chopped to 18" without any hesitations.

That means single shot rifles as well.

Pyzda

I can`t think of any incident where a hunter could not discharge his rifle in Africa because there was a tree or a big rock inches in front of him.I have never read anywhere of an experienced hunter or PH mentioning that an 18 inch barreled rifle would be advantageous to them in any way.I have hunted Africa 3 times and never had any displeasure or inconvenience in carrying my rifle,even in the thick stuff and yet you believe an 18 inch barrel is a must.Why don`t we see a PH using an 18 inch barreled rifle?

You might want to ask Michael 458 that question---

quote:

Originally posted by Cross L:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:

quote:

Originally posted by Pyzda:
Pointing is one thing, maneuverability in the bush or any terrain for that matter is another thing.

They are both totally different to one other.

I like the 26" barrel for nothing, but velocity.

I wouldn't even consider to have a DGR or any other bolt action hunting rifle (in my case it is the same rifles) with barrel longer than 22".

If I could get the performance that I like from an 18" barrel. I would have all rifle barrels chopped to 18" without any hesitations.

That means single shot rifles as well.

Pyzda

I can`t think of any incident where a hunter could not discharge his rifle in Africa because there was a tree or a big rock inches in front of him.I have never read anywhere of an experienced hunter or PH mentioning that an 18 inch barreled rifle would be advantageous to them in any way.I have hunted Africa 3 times and never had any displeasure or inconvenience in carrying my rifle,even in the thick stuff and yet you believe an 18 inch barrel is a must.Why don`t we see a PH using an 18 inch barreled rifle?

You might want to ask Michael 458 that question---

Is that a joke?

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
I know you are talking about that but maneuvering a rifle or shotgun with a 26 inch barrel has never been an issue with anyone hunting anywhere.If you were talking military combat in a room such is in a house them I might agree,but hunting DG is in no way like that even when it gets nasty,IMO.I have hunted small game in the thick Quebec bush with a 30 inch shotgun many times and going to a 26 inch is better and perfect but you can still do with a 30.Why someone would want a 18 inch in Africa is nonsense.

You obviously have never been in the thick jess along the Zambezi river or had to literally craw through the pucker brush in coastal Alaska after one of these



Short barrels are every bit as appreciated in those situations as are HK's and chopped M-4's for CQB.