How many people have a 375H&H with a 20" barrel? How much velocity do you lose?

I like the idea of the 375 Ruger. The shorter barrel would make it handy in the woods for bear or even deer with lighter bullets.

I am concerned about the pressure of the 375 Ruger. I like the idea of the lower pressure of the H&H better.

1: 1000 psi lower .. 55K cup is abour 62,500 psi -- the ruger is saami at ~63,000 psi.. aint "lower"

2: i'll actually be testing from 25 to 16.5" on both

don't buy the hype that the ruger is "high pressure" .. its not higher pressure than a 270

My favorite 375 H&H's have been a SAKO HANDY 20" barrel, and a Blaser R 93 Tracker with a 19 3/4" barrel.

ave a 20" on my 375H&H. as for velocities, to be honest, I do not give it much thought. At the distances I mostly shoot at, it still gonna (hopefully) knock bears silly.

I'm still load testing, etc but it will be ready for spring.

I had a 20 incher model 70 and it was almost exactly 100 FPS slower than My M70 with 24 inches with the same ammo.

I am more curious about the blast and flash from the shorter barrel. Especially those who have identical models with different length barrels!

quote:

Originally posted by 510wells:
I had a 20 incher model 70 and it was almost exactly 100 FPS slower than My M70 with 24 inches with the same ammo.

Ditto.

quote:

I had a 20 incher model 70 and it was almost exactly 100 FPS slower than My M70 with 24 inches with the same ammo

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ditto

I think that you can easily more than make up the 100fps loss using Hornady Superformance ammo for the 375H&H. I would not, but for the 'psi' minded that is one obvious solution. And as a backup you can use any 375H&H load while the Ruger375 is only available from Hornady and only in Superformance. Why limit yourself and shoot a classic.

If you decide to wait for Jeffe's data, keep in mind the 375Ruger Superformance should approximate the behavior of the 375H&H Superformance. The beauty of the H&H is you can shoot either type of load.

Well FB.... - the 375 Ruger acheives 2600+ fps from a 20" barrel without issues at all. Been there done that. Both with fac.ammo and reloads. And with several different powders, no problems at all to get this velocity, and no signs of high pressure.. The 375HH is hard pressed to do the same. The Superperformance 375HH ammo will not give 2600+ fps in a 20" barrel.

I have both and I must say that I regard the 375 Ruger as far ahead of the 375HH, much more similar to the 375 Wby...

quote:

The 375HH is hard pressed to do the same. The Superperformance 375HH ammo will not give 2600+ fps in a 20" barrel.

Oh, exactly what does 375H&H Superformance run in your 20" bbl?

And exactly what was the Hornady Superformance load in 375Ruger deliver in your 20" bbl?

It is interesting as the Superformance H&H actually starts out faster than the Ruger.

It runs 2630-2640 fps in a 24,5" barrel. You do realize that taking 4,5 inches of the barrel will reduce velocity???? Some above says around 100 fps, which is close to my observations as well.. So 2530-2540 fps is not unrealistic to expect for the 375HH Superperformance ammo in a 20" barrel rifle..

You are saying your estimate for the 375H&H Superformance is 60fps slower than the 375Ruger Superformance in your two guns, extrapolated to 20" barrels?

Not a precise data point, but seems very reasonable and pretty close to equal performance for the two, given gun to gun variations.

IMHO, to measure this small a difference would take some serious science, with a significant sample of guns. Could 60fps really make a difference?

Unless I missed it, which is possible, did anyone state what weight buyllet here? Are we talking 300 gn 375 H&H and 375 Ruger or what?

I have an extra magnum length pre 64 Magnum action and have been kicking around a short barreled 375 H&H.

I sure wish Jeffeso had done his test! I was interested in those velocity numbers. I wasn't going to pick between the two from it; I was going with the H&H from the start, but it would have been nice to see some numbers on the various lengths to pick from.

quote:

Originally posted by airgun1:

I sure wish Jeffeso had done his test!

Good things take time.

The Joust

quote:

I sure wish Jeffeso had done his test!

That will be an interesting data point and chance to contrast against prior data. That test will be two guns and one load each. I think. A 375H&H classic load and a 375Ruger Superformance load. Testing both with Superformance would be redundant as the 375Ruger and H&H are pretty much a ballistic twins and you would be more likely measuring bbl to bbl and chamber to chamber variations.

I was talking 300gr loads as posted on Hornady web site. That is the data that shows 10fps advantage to the H&H when both are superformanced. 10 fsp - Another, statistically insignificant number.

I guess I'm wrong about the pressure difference. I've just read some complaining about 375 Rugers in the field with a reference to pressure.

I really think a short 375 (Ruger or H&H) would be an extremely versatile rifle. The Ruger Alaskan and Sako Kodiak are neat looking guns.

I like the idea of fewer more versatile rifles that can share scopes. (I'm smitten by Blasers, but the expense and lack of CRF are big questions for me.)

Looking forward to hearing more thoughts.

I like the feel of the Ruger Alaskan - not so much for the looks though.

I recently discovered (here on the web) the 9.3x62 and I find it very impressive by reputation as potential big bear gun. Not a big gun, but a big bear gun. A couple of options are CZ 20" bbl Kevlar Carbine (7lbs) or the Ruger African 23" bbl 7.75 lbs (not on the web, but rumored to be coming)

http://forums.accuratereloadin...3221043/m/1701052841


I am obviously not from the more is always better camp, but since you asked for ideas, there is another. It is a small step down in power a small step down in gun weight, less recoil or a much lighter gun. And apparently a pretty good killer for the 338/350/375 class of game.

quote:

Originally posted by MileHighShooter:
I am more curious about the blast and flash from the shorter barrel. Especially those who have identical models with different length barrels!

I'm also interested in this. I'm looking at shortening the barrel of my CZ to 20 or 22 inches.

I believe the Ruger load would be faster than the H&H load if both had 20" barrels and used superformance ammunition. That's the only problem I see with the Ruger. Too much velocity. It turns the .375 Ruger into a longer range big game cartridge instead of a dangerous game round. Now if the Ruger round could be down-loaded to about 2450 fps it would become a dangerous game round again. I guess I'm lost on the higher the velocity the better the round argument. I know that both of the Alaskan guides I spoke with before I went for brown bear advised they preferred the H&H round to the Weatherby rounds as they felt uncomfortable regarding bullet performance with Weatherby loads. I think I've heard that Kevin Robertson guy talking about this before as well. I think I've heard a few people around this forum touting the 2450 - 2500 fps thing as better for DG also. I just don't ever recall any guides raving about high velocity being a good attribute for a dangerous game load.

Thanks,

jfm

quote:

I'm also interested in this. I'm looking at shortening the barrel of my CZ to 20 or 22 inches.

I look at the 375H&H as a kinda of scaled up 30-06 in terms pressure and velocity. FWIW, The standard bbl for the 06 was always 22" so that length does not sound very radical to me. The CZ is pretty heavy, are you think of a Kevlar stock too?

Here is the Ruger African in 9.3x62, 7.75 pounds, 1-10 twist, 23 " bbl

http://www.ruger.com/products/...pecSheets/37113.html



Maybe buffalo would comment of the noise question. he has both?

quote:

FWIW, The standard bbl for the 06 was always 22"

I don't think so, maybe in the last 15 to 20 years so, and with "newer" powders. But for most of it's life the 30-06 has sported a 24" barrel.

The 30-03 was a 24 inch barrel. The 30-06 is 1/12 of an inch shorter .. At least in the first couple thousand springfields.

22 inch barrels are a reinvention of recent times

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22 inch barrels are a reinvention of recent times

I stand corrected, 22 inch is the modern standard then. Yea, I guess if you go way back long bbls were more fashionable for rifles or shotguns. I think the analogy is fine, for modern time, that being 22 inch bbl is very reasonable middle way.

I think there is a tendency to go a little extreme, that is chasing the last 100 fps, or extra +/- 2 inch bbl on the long side or short side. Although, 20 or 22 inch bbl both seem to carry, balance and point nicely. I don't think there should be any hesitation to select 22in for any moderate performance ctg like 30'06 or 375H&H.

I have a 16.5 bbl Marlin and its a dream to carry but I dont care for the way it handles. I think the 18" bbl feels better for the little 44 carbine. I have an 18" bbl on a Model 7 that both carry and handle nice. I think today those M-7 are made with 20". The WinM70 in 458 had a 22" barrel for a while. Today it seems either 24, 25 or a custom 20 are the fad.

quote:

I'm also interested in this. I'm looking at shortening the barrel of my CZ to 20 or 22 inches.

I suggest 22" as fine for a 375H&H. IMHO. You can always cut more later. If you can stand the looks maybe think about Kevlar.

I'm on my way to the smith after lunch, 22 inches it may well be.

Now if I go with 20/22 inches. Is there a better powder choice than the IMR 4064 I've been using? I'm about to reorder some powder at the gun shop. Now, with a new barrel lenth would be the time to change. Not that 4064 would go to waste.

quote:

Originally posted by fourbore:
Here is the Ruger African in 9.3x62, 7.75 pounds, 1-10 twist, 23 " bbl

http://www.ruger.com/products/...pecSheets/37113.html

Good Job Ruger with adding the 9.3x62!! Piss Poor Job Ruger that you dumped the barrel band swivel mount

I've had a 20" 375 for a while now... no idea how much velocity was lost as it had been cut sometime between 1953 and when I bought it. What I can tell you is it'll send a 300 grainer at 2500 with no problem. With all the barrel volume you get in a larger caliber, combined with the medium speed powders the H&H likes, a couple inches doesn't make much difference. It still has less muzzle blast than my long-gone 300win with a 26" barrel.
I say cut that sucker down. A bunch of us up here run them at 20", it does make it easier when you're poking through the alders. Take care, Nick

P.S. If the 4064 was working before, it'll still work for you. 4064, Varget, RL15, all seem to get their job done within 20" pretty efficiently in my experience. -Nick

Thanks Nick, I'll likely stick with 4064, it's been the powder for me for years. I've left before and always come back to it for 308/30'06 and now 375 H&H. Powder choices are limited in my area and 4064 is always on the shelf.

Glad I could be of some help!

Another vote for the 20" barrel. My 9.3x64 Brenneke has around 20" the 375 Rugers I've had 20" . Most of the H+H's I've had. were 24" Basically they. al get the same velocity . 458Win guided with an H+H with an 18" barrel. He said he liked it. Shorter than 22"barreled rifles are a lot funner to pack around. The 93x62 mauser is a nice rifle but sometimes you need to be able to taKe a 300 yard shot . The 375 Ruger works perfact for that with the 270 gr. Bullet . And the 270 is greaT for close range on big animals also .

quote:

Originally posted by Gojoe:
I'm on my way to the smith after lunch, 22 inches it may well be.

Now if I go with 20/22 inches. Is there a better powder choice than the IMR 4064 I've been using? I'm about to reorder some powder at the gun shop. Now, with a new barrel lenth would be the time to change. Not that 4064 would go to waste.

I'm back from the smith. It was his feeling that the job was not in his or my best interest?? I'll be using someone else from now on. He's a good guy but very particular about what he takes on. He would rather build from scratch than make alterations. I've seen his builds, they are beautiful and very fuctional.
That fine with me, If I ever want a rifle built I'll have him do it. As for now I need to contact the other guy I've used in the past.

who's your guy, gojoe?

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
who's your guy, gojoe?

It matters not.

Barel length....very interesting! In my custom end of the business. longer barrels win out overwhelmingly. This has not always been the case, but guys are finding out what their grandfathers knew. On moving targets, longer barrels make a smoother swing and the noise is that much further away.

Just recently completed a 7x57 with a 26" barrel. The owner chrono'd barrel length differences and found the 26" tube showed a remarkable edge in velocity compared to say...22"

I know the 7x57 is not considered a DGR,but my point is that don't overrate the "advantages" of a stubby barrel

"Gunsmiths have longer barrels"

quote:

Originally posted by Gojoe:

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
who's your guy, gojoe?

It matters not.

How friendly. Enjoy your nice long winter, chum.

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:

quote:

Originally posted by Gojoe:

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
who's your guy, gojoe?

It matters not.

How friendly. Enjoy your nice long winter, chum.

I have no disire to send any bussiness his way he does fine without me. I also have no disire to drive any away. Nor will I step on him for the jobs he does or does not want to take in an open forum to stangers.

If that bothers you, I can live with that.

Simply trying to have some conversation with someone nearby. I have enough friends so no, it doesn't bother me but as a word of advice new guy: a little friendliness and courtesy goes a long way around here.

My 376 Steyr is a 19' bbl. It seems to work well. I'd have no trouble with a 20 or 22. My 450 Dakota has a 20". The first PH I ever hunted with had a custom 458 Lott with a 1" diameter 20" bbl. It worked wonderfully well off hand.

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
Simply trying to have some conversation with someone nearby. I have enough friends so no, it doesn't bother me but as a word of advice new guy: a little friendliness and courtesy goes a long way around here.

Thats fine , but the subject matter was best discussed in a IM and it was a thread drift.
So let's start again, Hello how are you?

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Duc:
My 376 Steyr is a 19' bbl. It seems to work well. I'd have no trouble with a 20 or 22. My 450 Dakota has a 20". The first PH I ever hunted with had a custom 458 Lott with a 1" diameter 20" bbl. It worked wonderfully well off hand.

Did you find there to be a big differance in muzzle blast whit the shorter barrel?