there is the 475 kodiak which is a 475 bottle neck 500 linebaugh... but what about a 1.285" length version to get full linebaugh power in a smaller frame keeping the rugers oal.

http://www.singleactions.com/475Kodiak.pdf

the problem i see with the 480 ruger is it is in the same league (almost) with the casull...the 475 linebaugh is a big step ahead of the casull but putting that power in a ruger is the idea. heavy bullets is what you want or else you would stick with the casull

Boomy, the .480 Ruger isn't lacking in the power department -- perhaps that is inconsistent with the fact that I am converting mine to a .475 Linebaugh, but since the early '90s I've wanted one, and well, we all know what it's like when you just gotta have something (particularly a firearm!). The .480 still has nearly everything the Linebaugh does. As Paul H. said, you can load 'em long..... The SRH doesn't suffer from a short cylinder, either.

I'm shooting 400 grain bullets in the .454, so what's this about not being able to shoot heavy bullets?

Boomy, if I still lived in California (I'm an actual native), I would let you shoot the Casull and the Linebaugh when it gets done.

With a 410 grain Hard cast at 1200 + fps the 480 is definately a step above the 454.( larger diameter bullet ='s larger would channel.The 480 is in the same league as the 475 in on game performance any extra fps the 475 has over the 480 is inconsiquintal in the field. The 50 cal necked down to 475 would limit the chamber presure,because of thiner chamber walls. ( the 500 Linebaudh operates at lower psi than the 480 and 475)...........

Boomy, you're looking to fix a problem that doesn't exist. You need to try some of these calibers on game and see how well they work with heavy hardcasts.......

this is the 420 grainer from bear tooth bullets with two canalures. from my understanding the freedom arms oal is shorter and uses the top canalure. what is the max oal of the rugers???

so you are saying the ruger loaded to the bottom canalure would regain the 475 l oal?

I stopped reloading 16 years ago and have yet to start up again. I am forced to use factory loads at this stage. When the Ruger was a .480, I used Buffalo Bore's 410 grain 1200 fps loads. The cylinder's length is the same as the Casull which if I can recall, is the same OAL as the .475. I shoot the .454 loaded with long 400 grain bullets in the SRH and it looks like there's room for more! LOL! In fact, here's a picture to put it into perspective. The three rounds to the right (from rt to lft) are a .475 L, .480, and .454.



Jack Huntington will ream the chambers of your .480 to allow you to fire .475s if you want to go that route -- the chambers are long enough. Can you take a .480 and load it long? Paul H. I believe said you can. I haven't done it, so I can't say for certain. But, Boomy, you need to try one out loaded with 410s and you will see how well the darn thing penetrates!
Really there was no reason for me to go with the Linebaugh conversion aside from the fact that I want one and I'm a bit of a glutton for punishment!

I load my 475 to 480 levels thus relatively low pressures and need no more, 400 grs at 1200 fps and this Ruger Bisley will last forever. I load almost all my sixguns (32', 357's, 41's, 44's 45's and 475's) with the heavier bullets to 1200 fps or so and just move up in bore size if more effect is desired.

so these loaded to the rear canalure will give the same oal as that casull...lower the preasure or linebaugh performance.

so what we reeely need is a 460 grainer with a longer nose to shoot at 1200

quote:

so what we reeely need is a 460 grainer with a longer nose to shoot at 1200

A while ago Phil Shoemaker wrote an article about hunting the American Cape Buffalo (Bison) Phil used a 458 Win Mag loaded with Northfork 450 grain softs.I believe that he shot his animal 3 times with no exits.The 420 grain 475's that I have seen used on these animals DID EXIT.
Why do we need a bigger bullet?

If you need a heavier bullet, go to a larger caliber.

I just looked in Quickload at the 475 and 480.
It lists the 475 with a COAL of 1.75" and the 480 at 1.65".
the 475 case capacity is 50gns and with a 400gn Lee seated to 1.75" the useable case capacity is 25.574gns H2O.

the 480's case capacity is 46gns and with a 400gn Lee seted to 1.75" the useable case capacity is 26.737gns H2O.

So theoretically the 480 loaded to the same length as the 475 should have more velocity potential at the same pressure.
Plus if you wanted to shoot more reasonable loads, the 480's smaller case capacity should do better with lighter powder charges.

What is the max length for the SRH?

awesome info!

here is a thread on the same discussion...

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/...=940106121#940106121


from 475/480
The max OAL is 1.775".In the SRH you have more options on OAL because the SRH cylinder is so long, which gives you more powder room.I read(John Linebaugh) that as you approach MAX with X heavy bullets pressure raise very quickly ,has to do with the room the powder has to work in 480 case compared to 475 L case.
Sean

from paul h..
Anyhow, using the SAAMI 475 spec, you have a 1.4" case, and bullets .37" from meplat to canalure for 1.77". Taking the 1.285" ruger case, and a custom .51" crimp to nose mountain mold makes for a 1.795" COL, only .005" shy of the original linebaugh.

but back to my original post...a 500 linebaugh now necked and trimmed to the 480 ruger length would give what advantage? heavier bullets or lower preasure. is it worth it? probably not but a neet idea...

it seems the answer is solved with paul h's custom bullet.

I must reiterate, Boomy, there is no problem here that needs solving. I know that you like to tinker and that you have a boundless amount of energy, but I would encourage you to get one of these big revolvers and go shoot some game with it. I only wish that you were closer geographically as I would invite you to come shoot and take some game with handguns. The .480 Ruger is a fine cartridge the way it sits -- sure it's fun experimenting, and I don't want to sound discouraging, but again, try it out and see for yourself, the .480 may not need a heavier bullet to penetrate game end to end that a 410 - 425 grainer.........

yes i agree...a custom long nose isthe way to go and the ruger is more flexible. it would be cool to do a heavier bullet imho but th 420's @ 1300 is a you would need.

There was some talk awhile back in the Cast Boolit forum about useing Heavier bullets, 500gn in 475 Linebaugh. The problem is that the powder space is reduced a great deal. Looking at Quickload it looked like the pressures would sky rocket past a certain point looking for only 50-100fps more.
I have a 500gn mold for my 470NE and may try some in the BFR, but I will go slow with powder increases.
The 475 Linebaugh BFR can hold a cartridge 1.846", so you can get a 1.8" round with some wiggle room.
The BFR is pretty heave so it dampens the recoil some. When I first shot my buddies Ruger Bisley 5.5" 475, I shot 10 rounds and was done for the day. It was controllable and easy to hit 2 liter bottles at 100yds. He was loading a 395gn to 1450fps I believe.

From what I've heard, the Ruger Super Redhawk in 480 can turn in some great accuracy. With a longer bullet nose it looks like you can exceed the Linebaugh. The big rounds are fun to shoot, but I don't want to shoot the max loads all the time. Just remember what happened to John Taffin's wrist. The xray showed his wrist bones were all moved around from the heavy recoil. There was a time that all he could shoot was a 22 or 9mm.
Power is great, but moderation is probably the better choice.

quote:

Originally posted by MS Hitman:
If you need a heavier bullet, go to a larger caliber.

Absolutely!

Why settle for a 460gr bullet at 1200fps when you can load a 700grainer at the same speed.
Granted I don't get that speed with this little guy, but any of his four bigger brothers can do it. I've also got the 6 1/2", 7 1/2", 8 3/8" and 10 1/2" models.

I can still remember loading a 300gr Barnes bullet in my New Model Super Blackhawk back in the early 80's and it was designed for the .444Marlin. I gave up trying to push a cartridge beyond it's limits years ago and just decided it's best to step up when you can.

i love those 700 grainers...ever tried the 1000?

if the gun fails you could throw the ammo and turn a bear

As far as I know the largest slug that will fit in the S&W 500 is 725gr and John Ross cast them. Unless you can find a material more dense than lead that's the limit and they are flush with the face of the cylinder.

Here's what these look like from the front and IIRC they are loaded to 2.340"

damn that looks like fun!

Very nice looking gun. I've got the 4" with the comp. How does your shorty shoot with the plain barrel?
Boom Stick, I think if I handed you a 4 bore pistol loaded with a half pound slug you'd say, "What, light loads? Where's the full pounders?"

That's a 500 S&W case for comparison.

Here's my 500gn bullet for the 470 with the 475 and 480 cases on the BFR.

I have a 2 cavity mold from Mountain molds that drops a 70% and 90% nose. I had it made with a .4" nose length with the thought of shooting them in the 475, but I think they are too long. I guess I will have to try it sometime though. Just by chance, the 480 case could be crimped in the top lube groove and fit the cylinder.

lar45...i have to post that for safari kid...he wuld love it for shure...

great post. thank you.

I ran the 500gn bullet through Quickload. There's no garuntee that any of this is accurate though. I won't list any powder charges.
With my favorite pistol powder I put in a loaded length of 1.8" and 105% load density for the 475 and 480 cases and a 6.5" barrel. It showed 1098 fps from the 475 case and 1142 from the 480. The 475 case had a pressure of 36.7ksi. I changed the loaded length to 1.7" and the pressure went to 80ksi.
Next I went for a max of 50ksi pressure and used faster powders. The 480 case showed about 60-80fps faster with the larger useable case capacity.
One load showed 1110fps at 50ksi. I tried bumping the velocity up to 1250fps and the pressure went over 80ksi.
Again, I don't know if this would parallel anything in the real world.
The bottom line is a 500gn bullet in the 475 Linebaugh or 480 is probably not a very good idea.
FWIW

soo 500 no goood 460?

Boom,

Shortening the 500 Linebaugh to 480 length, and then getting custom long nose molds achieves what?

The 500 S&W has already messed up the mold issue as now there are .500" and .510" molds.

As much as I like the 500 Linebaugh, I'd say the 500 S&W makes more sense as it has become the more standard 50 cal revolver round.

no the initial idea was to neck 500 to 470 at ruger length...

can you post a pic of your custom 470 bullet with the longer nose?

thanks!

Prediction from Quickload, not actual load data.
480 Ruger 7.5" barrel with 460gn cast bullet 1.035" long and loaded to 1.79"
Win 296 100% load 22.3gn 1191fps @ 32ksi
105% compressed 23.4gn 1260fps @ 38.5ksi
110% compressed 24.6gn 1336fps @ 47.3ksi. If you could get it compressed that much.
**Not actual load data**
with 2400 powder 460gn cast loaded to 1.79"
100% load density 19.5gn 1255fps @ 47.5ksi
This would be a max load if everything worked the way that Quickload calculated it.
Now if you seated the bullet deaper to 1.65" the pressure goes up to 111,000 psi!
If anyone wants to try loading extra heavy bullets you should start low and work up slowly. If the velocity starts going up faster than you thought or it was for the past few .5gn increments, then the pressure is probably going up even faster.

A 500gn bullet with 2400 could probably go 1140fps safely, but the pressure could get way out of hand looking for just a little more velocity.

The 480 loaded long in the SRH cylinder should be able to push a 400gn cast to 1350+ easily and safely.

I belive that it was John Linebaugh that wrote about extensive testing of 296 with one of the ammo manufacturers(Hornady maybe? damn CRS)
Anyway, he said that the pressure and velocity both went up fairly evenly(linear) with the increase in powder charge. This held up to around 50-60,000 psi (60ksi). So if you're checking your loads over a chronograph, and you should, if the velocity starts jumping more than the last few powder increments, it's probably a good indicator that the pressure is over max and you're in the danger zone.

This is worth exactly what you paid for it.
None of the above is load data, just theoreticle museings.

pushing 460's @ 1250 at acceptable preasures is great imho that is an almost .3 s.d. in a non deforming bullet...damn that would brain a bear and keep on going.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
pushing 460's @ 1250 at acceptable preasures is great imho that is an almost .3 s.d. in a non deforming bullet...damn that would brain a bear and keep on going.

[Quote]
"damm that wouldbrain a bear and keep on going"
[quote]


They already do!!!!

I've been watching this with a bit of amusement as some would try to make a 475 Linebaugh out of the 480 Ruger with a Ruger "6-shot" cylinder. This is not the platform to perform miraculous feats with a handgun. Consider the thin-ness of the cylinder wall between the cylyinder stop notch and look at how much wiggle room you have as to safety. The only platform from which a good conversion would be absolutely safe and not wreck your gun is a "5-shot" cylinder or a single shot. Otherwise, as someone has already posted, get a bigger caliber if you want more power. The 475 Linebaugh stands on it's own as to durability and power enough for those who are don't need a 5# gun. A 480 in a 5-shot platform will also stand on it's own with slightly less power than it's big brother the 475 Linebaugh. It you gotta, get a bigger gun.

I can't advise re-chambering a 480 SRH to 475 L, as they 475 L does opperate at higher pressures.

That said, Ruger uses a super alloy in the 454 and 480 cylinders, and I know of at least one 480 that has been re-chambered, and run at full patch 475L levels.

It's hard to believe such a thin cylinder would hold up to those loads, but I've yet to hear of a Ruger SRH 454 or 480 cylinder letting go, and there are numbnuts that really push stuff that it certainly would have happened by now.

Again, I would never advise to bore a 480 SRH to 475L, but I'd also never call the 480 SRH a weak gun due to the 6 shooter cylinder.

For boom, 275 "Keith", 310 LFN, 400 Lee, 400 XLFN, 460 WFN.

Let me again say that reaming the .480 cylinder is an option -- would I do it? Not only no, but hell no. The SRH cylinder is purportedly made from some super-strong alloy as Paul has pointed out (I too have read this somewhere and it wasn't on the internet!). Anyhow, a too believe that the 5-shot cylinder is the way to go. Do you need super heavy bullets? I think the .480 with 410s was plenty stout and penetrated like hell. I am doing a .475 because I want one and that is the only reason.

Paul H

I totally agree. I bet the only thing holding some of these guys back is the recoil of the upper limit loads. We haven't yet heard of a 480 cylinder letting in a SRH but it won't be too soon that we will hear of it.


Whitworth

I think a 5-shot SRH would be nice but a pricey option. Huntington does good work. Lots of smiths absolutely refuse to manufacture a new double action cylinder because of it's time consuming machining and total cost(man-hours and machine-hours.) In your case, please post a pic or two when the conversion is done and is in your hands.

That's why it ain't cheap!

I bought the SRH new some 5 or 6 years ago (when they just came out), and I think I paid $600.00 for it. Add $1000.00 and you have a $1600.00 investment. Not too bad when you think about it. What does a Freedom cost nowadays?

Back to the recoil issue, my .480 loaded with Buff Bore 410 grain loads was stout, but it more or less just torqued in your hand -- still not at all unpleasant. But the Casull on the same platform.......ouch.

I will certainly post as soon as I get my mitts on it!

You can still get an FA 83 in a 475 for about $1700-$1800 if you reeaallly look hard.

So, the cost is about the same! So, it's not an unreasonable alternative!

I watched my buddy push long loaded 400's 1350 from his 480. I could tell by the way the gun was moving that the recoil was greatly enhanced.

The stoutest load I ran in my 480 was when I was working up loads with the 460 gr bullet. Since there was no data, I extrapolated my 400 gr loads and worked up. The 1050 fps loads were fine, 1100 fps had slightly sticky extraction, abut what the factory 325's felt like, and the 1150 fps loads required a good push in the extractor to remove Those were the hottest loads I ever ran, and I've since moved back to loads that always drop right out, hence lower pressure than factory loads in my gun.

The 460 @ 1150 fps load had some recoil

As much as I've been curious to see how fast I could push the long loaded 400 gr bullet, I've just stuck with my 1200 fps load, as it is scary accurate. That and I see no reason to use a load that will beat the hell out of my hand, but likely have no advantage in killing power. I see an iron sighted sixgun as a 50-75 yd weapon in my hands.

Paul, Have the reverse taper removed and the cylinder chamber burnished properly and the cases with factory loads will no longer stick...........

quote:

Originally posted by Paul H:
The stoutest load I ran in my 480 was when I was working up loads with the 460 gr bullet. Since there was no data, I extrapolated my 400 gr loads and worked up. The 1050 fps loads were fine, 1100 fps had slightly sticky extraction, abut what the factory 325's felt like, and the 1150 fps loads required a good push in the extractor to remove Those were the hottest loads I ever ran, and I've since moved back to loads that always drop right out, hence lower pressure than factory loads in my gun.

With that, if you loaded them long to fill the cylinder, then the Quickload predictions were off on the dangerous side of things.
what ever load or gun a person has, you still have to be able to handle and shoot it accurately and reliably.

In my 45-70 BFR I pushed 405's to 1750fps. They were not fun to shoot and the gun almost got away from me.(they were accurate though, 1.5" at 50yds) I would not want to use that load to hunt something that might bite back.
John Linebaugh had it right with his 3 Ps Power, Practicle and Packable.(I think that was it, damn CRS).
With my 454 loads, I stopped with a 320 at 1350fps because that's where the accuracy seemed the best and it was still a pleasant load to shoot.
Last fall I did see a FA 555 in 50AE going for around $1300 on Gunbroker.