quote:

Originally posted by adrook:
....

Since that time he and I have researched PHC's background and have received confirmation from PHAZ that he was never a member nor was he ever issued a professional hunter's license in the country of Zambia, ...

Perhaps you could tell us how long PHAZ has existed? Could you also tell us the name of the Agency that required licensed PH's in Zambia in the late 60's?

Shakari once said that PHC did indeed hold various PH licences at different times in his life. Thats good enough for me on that front.

PHC was a WRITER and a pretty good one -not great but good. He got a lot of people interested in hunting Africa and he´s entertained even more.

Writers take certain freedoms ie make things up. It´s part of writing fiction.

Now let it rest.

Just think Saeed if it weren't for PHC you may have never hunted in Africa and not joined SCI (got to bring that to the table) and had nothing to complain about. Pauly, now Steve is the end all on Africa.

I never met the guy, but I do know a few (not many) PHs with impeccable reputations who tell me they shared camps with him when he was in the business.........

Also don't forget the fact that there's such a thing as cover hunting which is perfectly acceptable in many parts of Africa and is practiced even now by many PHs, including many well known ones and I'd guess it must have been even more common then.

Whether he did or whether he didn't isn't particularly relevent either way. Read his books carefully and you'll see he freely admits a lot of of the content happened to other people. Even more to the point, he was a very entertaining writer who did a lot for African hunters, African hunting and the African hunting industry and I for one, love his books.

Liar or not, he lit the fire that burns in many of our guts.

When I was little, PHC books were the only ones about African hunting I could get my hands and the only ones I knew existed.

Without PHC I doubt that I would have ever went on safari

weather or not he lied is not an issue to me. I enjoy his books and will continue to.
I dont understand why people are worry about weather or not he did lie????

TO PHC: Much of AR would not have been possible without you. For many of us, AR friendships, PH/client friendships, hunts in Africa, lifetime memories, great trophies and our own stories, etc., etc., etc.,(including Saeed's annual hunting stories and pictures, as evidenced by the introductory picture of Walter and his giant cape buffalo on this forum), would not have been possible without your stories, whether true or not. RIP. And, THANK YOU!

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
TO PHC: Much of AR would not have been possible without you. For many of us, AR friendships, PH/client friendships, hunts in Africa, lifetime memories, great trophies and our own stories, etc., etc., etc.,(including the introductory picture of Walter and his giant cape buffalo on this forum), would not have been possible without your stories, whether true or not. RIP. And, THANK YOU!

100%

Dave

The battle of the realists and the romantics continues!

Realists want the truth at any cost.

Romantics prefer to believe in heros.

I am a romantic, no question. No place for realists in Africa!

Dave

quote:

Posted 08 February 2009 10:42 Hide Post
I'm new here but I can't resist. Let's assume PHC was full of it. Now what? Should I burn his books? Confused

Nope - I'm new here too so you can send them along to me since I am ignorant and don't know any better

When I read some of this, the people who write the posts remind me of the trash in our midst that deface old grave yards, and kick over head stones of the departed! Sick individulas who respect nothing, but their own image in a mirror!

IMO this world has become a very angry, me, and screw everyone else, world that is somehow more of a worry than global warming, and world recession. I think we could use some more dreamers like Peter Capstick, who hurt nobody I know! R.I.P. PHC

Don't burn!
He was a great man.

David Hulme

A quote from Death in the long grass:

I was on a twenty one day safari with two Italian clients, hunting from a base camp called Nyampala, an Awiza tribal area located at the juncture of the Munyamadzi and Luangwa rivers. It was near midnight on a cool winters night night in July, and I was asleep in one of the grass and pole huts we preffered to canvas tents because of the better ventalation when the weather warmed up later in the season.

My passion for the long grass of Zambia and all its lore drove me to my research. I have hunted Zambia quite often and know many of its characters both old school and some of the best young ones. The thread Adrook started was simply a statemet of the facts. Not disparaging not grave pissing simply staing the outcome of research. Andy has felt the same sting of the Luangwa valley as have I

That said,he may have held licenses in Bots, Zim
RSA, moz.don't know didn't look there. Just Zambia. If you have not walked in the soft Zambian soil and smelled the distinct earthy smell of your shirt being laundered in the Luangwa river water, you may not care of the outcome as did I. My feet may have shared his same footsteps, I've been to Peter Hankins gravesite at Chanjuzi and felt the chill of the light breeze under those sausage tree's. If PHC took literary license, I will accept that.
Chipolopolo

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
When I read some of this the people who write the posts remind me of the trash in our midst that deface old grave yards, and kick over head stone of the departed! Sick individulas who respect nothing, but their own image in a mirror! IMO this world has become a very angry, me, and screw everyone else, world that is somehow more of a worry than global warming, and world recession.

exactly

quote:

Originally posted by chipolopolo:
A quote from Death in the long grass:

I was on a twenty one day safari with two Italian clients, hunting from a base camp called Nyampala, an Awiza tribal area located at the juncture of the Munyamadzi and Luangwa rivers. It was near midnight on a cool winters night night in July, and I was asleep in one of the grass and pole huts we preffered to canvas tents because of the better ventalation when the weather warmed up later in the season.

My passion for the long grass of Zambia and all its lore drove me to my research. I have hunted Zambia quite often and know many of its characters both old school and some of the best young ones. The thread Adrook started was simply a statemet of the facts. Not disparaging not grave pissing simply staing the outcome of research. Andy has felt the same sting of the Luangwa valley as have I

That said,he may have held licenses in Bots, Zim
RSA, moz.don't know didn't look there. Just Zambia. If you have not walked in the soft Zambian soil and smelled the distinct earthy smell of your shirt being laundered in the Luangwa river water, you may not care of the outcome as did I. My feet may have shared his same footsteps, I've been to Peter Hankins gravesite at Chanjuzi and felt the chill of the light breeze under those sausage tree's. If PHC took literary license, I will accept that.
Chipolopolo

Exactly

Would someone please tell me if he has got a PH in the happy Hunting Grounds?

If so I would like to share a campfire with him when I get there and hear a few more lies

You PHC bashers need to get a life. There is a lot more honor and satisfaction to be derived from a life spent being positive than hammering on defenseless deceased people.

BFD
If if wasn't for reading his books I would never have gotten the bug to go to Africa.

If you can't posthumously respect the man for his contributions and talent then what about his widow Fiona and his children. Maybe they deserve the courtesy of not having their late father/husband denegrated for the sake of a "thread"??
Fiona has been extremely generous with DSC and has my utmost respect! Pure class.

Regards,
SV

quote:

Originally posted by chipolopolo:
A quote from Death in the long grass:

I was on a twenty one day safari with two Italian clients, hunting from a base camp called Nyampala, an Awiza tribal area located at the juncture of the Munyamadzi and Luangwa rivers. It was near midnight on a cool winters night night in July, and I was asleep in one of the grass and pole huts we preffered to canvas tents because of the better ventalation when the weather warmed up later in the season.

My passion for the long grass of Zambia and all its lore drove me to my research. I have hunted Zambia quite often and know many of its characters both old school and some of the best young ones. The thread Adrook started was simply a statemet of the facts. Not disparaging not grave pissing simply staing the outcome of research. Andy has felt the same sting of the Luangwa valley as have I

That said,he may have held licenses in Bots, Zim
RSA, moz.don't know didn't look there. Just Zambia. If you have not walked in the soft Zambian soil and smelled the distinct earthy smell of your shirt being laundered in the Luangwa river water, you may not care of the outcome as did I. My feet may have shared his same footsteps, I've been to Peter Hankins gravesite at Chanjuzi and felt the chill of the light breeze under those sausage tree's. If PHC took literary license, I will accept that.
Chipolopolo

Who cares rather he had a licence or not. Who gives a rat's a%%.
How many people have been to Africa because of PHC. How many people on this board alone get interested in African hunting because of PHC? How much has he single handedly done for African hunting and conservation? Even if a lot of it was done indirectly. How many made their first African hunt because of PHC? and for some how many made their second hunt, third hunt, fourth hunt, etc. etc.? As a result of the people that hunted Africa because of PHC how many millions if not billions of dollars did that bring to the safari industry and other industries? How many people has that money provided jobs for? how much has that money done for conversation? How much has that money helped gun manufactures? ammuntion companies? custom gun makers? the ones that make the boots? the ones that make the safari clothes? optics makers? how many bought airline tickets because of it? motels, hotels etc. between here and there. How many jobs has all that helped provide? It could go on.
Also as use enough gun said above
" how many ar friendships, lifetime memories, great trophies, stories etc. etc. etc. "
The man is dead so therefore he has already been judged by the ULTIMATE JUDGE and his opinion is the only one that matters.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Would someone please tell me if he has got a PH in the happy Hunting Grounds?

If so I would like to share a campfire with him when I get there and hear a few more lies

I appreciate this board. Have learned a lot etc. Have read several of your posts. However I hope I am misintreperting this post.

I can see how my post could be misunderstood

I have enjoyed all of Capsticks books, lies or no lies. And I would like to hear more from him in the Happy Hunting Grounds.

Do you see what I mean now?

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I can see how my post could be misunderstood

I have enjoyed all of Capsticks books, lies or no lies. And I would like to hear more from him in the Happy Hunting Grounds.

Do you see what I mean now?

I see what you mean. I think I just misintreperted your first post as degrading. Got you now though.

So basically it would be great to share a campfire with him for the stories, but hes still a liar. You will never win at this place.

I can't wait to see the threads on Hemmingway, Ruark and the rest!
Oh and don't forget TR, do you suppose he lied about all the animals he missed?

quote:

Originally posted by chipolopolo:
A quote from Death in the long grass:

[QUOTE]By PHC: Death In The Long Grass

I was on a twenty one day safari with two Italian clients, hunting from a base camp called Nyampala, an Awiza tribal area located at the juncture of the Munyamadzi and Luangwa rivers. It was near midnight on a cool winters night night in July, and I was asleep in one of the grass and pole huts we preffered to canvas tents because of the better ventalation when the weather warmed up later in the season.

quote:

By Chipolopolo:
My passion for the long grass of Zambia and all its lore drove me to my research. I have hunted Zambia quite often and know many of its characters both old school and some of the best young ones. The thread Adrook started was simply a statemet of the facts. Not disparaging not grave pissing simply staing the outcome of research. Andy has felt the same sting of the Luangwa valley as have I

That said,he may have held licenses in Bots, Zim
RSA, moz.don't know didn't look there. Just Zambia. If you have not walked in the soft Zambian soil and smelled the distinct earthy smell of your shirt being laundered in the Luangwa river water, you may not care of the outcome as did I. My feet may have shared his same footsteps, I've been to Peter Hankins gravesite at Chanjuzi and felt the chill of the light breeze under those sausage tree's. If PHC took literary license, I will accept that.
Chipolopolo

I too, have hunted this area, and like you, I love that valley. The quote you posted above is like a pleasent memory of my own introduction to the Luangwa Valley, and it's smell, and songs of the hyena, and the lion in the night, along with the grunt of the ever present Hippo pods in the river!

The thread posted by Adrook, is what he found, but that doesn't make it FACT! I'm not sure anyone at PHAZ was even born when Capstick was hunting there, and for that matter if the PHAZ even existed then. You must remember there was a rageing bush war in that area, not to mention the African country's not so fine record keeping! You guys must know that information from any African government department is questionable at best, if it is older than last week! I'm not saying he wasn't an apprentice, or opperating under some type of understudy in Zambia. However to state flatley he never hunted there professionally, is a bit much IMO!
He was hunting there, according to older PHs, and one PH who was just a boy in 1960. The only thing they said about him was he was often pissed! (drunk) That fact is not something anyone who knew Peter would deny. That however, could be said of Ruark, and Hemingway as well!

I know for a fact that George Hoffman worked in Tanzania out of the same camp with Peter, and Gordon Cundill confirmed many of the so-called lies from Peter's books to have been true, and that he hunted Botswana. The walls of Peter's Zambia home is still standing in the confluance of the Munyamdzi, and the Luangwa rivers. The walls still showing bullet holes in the walls from the bush war days of what was then North Rhodesia. The whole government changed after that war, and North Rhodesia
became Zambia. This was all after PHC was there. Records, what records?

All I'm saying is according to the well respected people who knew him well, do not agree that he was a fraud, and one who collaborated with Peter on two or three of his books says the people who spread all this crap are simply envious of his success, nothing more! PHC commeted one un-forgivable sin! He wrote books that made him famous, and made him a lot of money, while many others are still unknown by but a few clients years later!

It is no mystery that Peter was probably a far better writer than he was a PH, by his own admission, but I could say that about many PHs today, and they are not even good writers! Take one example for instance, Bunny's self grandizing claims of his success with all the wives of clients on safari!What tripe! NOW there's one you should be doubting. His crap is nothing but high school locker room bragging IMO! I've always found that the guys who claim to be doing so well with the ladies, are usually the ones who are liveing in a fantasy world.

I think all authors take letterary licence in their writing, yet Peter seems to be the only one crusified for it. That is fostered by other PHs simply because he was an American who dared to break into the old bloaks club and become a house hold figure to a lot of folks interested in hunting Africa.

Blacktailer,
I think fundamentally we all agree on PHC's contibution. Ruark's writings were different to me in that he, as I arrived in Africa as a newborn, learned f&&cked up missed, began to accept the days, learned of Mother Africa's deadly unforgivness and unwavering generousity. And in the end we all became uncontrollably addicted. This to me explains the emotion on this subject. It all means different things to all involved, but in the end we will all be judged by the same. Africa (to me) to me is not the buffalo, the lion or the leopard but the quality of the memories banked over a mans lifetime. In the end thats all you take with you regardless.
Chipolopolo

I've just finished reading "Death in the Silent Places". How much of that would anyone consider to be fiction? My thoughts were that it was well written accounts of individuels who lived their lives taking on maneaters and making their mark in history. Only in the last chapter does "PHC" talk about his attempt at spearing a buff hich he claims he did, but did have a back-up with a .458Win who put two shots into him dropping him before he trampled PHC to death. Sounded possible. It would take a bit more imagination than I have to even begin to tell storys as his without at least living it for a while. I have just started "Last Horizons", does anyone doubt his association with Winchester? His books have made for entertaining reading and a bit of an escape for me, fact or fiction. How much of an effect does an editor have on the writings- just another thought. Rodney.

quote:

I too, have hunted this area, and like you, I love that valley. The quote you posted above is like a pleasent memory of my own introduction to the Luangwa Valley, and it's smell, and songs of the hyena, and the lion in the night, along with the grunt of the ever present Hippo pods in the river!

Mac, Well said.

quote:

Originally posted by Rodney H.{500Jeffery}:
I've just finished reading "Death in the Silent Places". How much of that would anyone consider to be fiction? My thoughts were that it was well written accounts of individuels who lived their lives taking on maneaters and making their mark in history. Only in the last chapter does "PHC" talk about his attempt at spearing a buff hich he claims he did, but did have a back-up with a .458Win who put two shots into him dropping him before he trampled PHC to death. Sounded possible. It would take a bit more imagination than I have to even begin to tell storys as his without at least living it for a while. I have just started "Last Horizons", does anyone doubt his association with Winchester? His books have made for entertaining reading and a bit of an escape for me, fact or fiction. How much of an effect does an editor have on the writings- just another thought. Rodney.

Read Death in the Long Grass, Death in the Dark Continent, and Safari. They are more the works in question.

I'll give you a real life example. I was told personally by an old-time Zambian PH who did know PHC well that the episode in Death in the Long Grass that PHC relates about cropping buffalo with Bob Langevelt didn't take place as PHC claimed. It wasn't PHC doing the cropping with Langevelt it was instead this PH. He told me that Capstick was along with them but he never left the cruiser and didn't even have a rifle. He told me that PHC was more like a reporter researching a story than a hunter.

I enjoy his writings as much as anyone and own many of his books but I don't understand this hero worship and the viciousness of the attacks whenever someone brings up what we all know to be true, that the emperor has no clothes.

quote:

Originally posted by adrook:
I'll give you a real life example. I was told personally by an old-time Zambian PH who did know PHC well that the episode in Death in the Long Grass that PHC relates about cropping buffalo with Bob Langevelt didn't take place as PHC claimed.

That's a real life example all right,

. . . of hero worship, adrook.

Do you have any more rumors you'd like to pass along from guys you look up to, that "prove" Capstick was the liar?

I have no problem believing Capstick exaggerated and took poetic license. I'd have an easier time calling him an out-and-out liar if the people named in his books, who actually did exist, were making the accusations.

Instead of the anonymous third parties who crawl out of the woodwork and claim to have been the real heroes.

But you go ahead and believe those unverified claims, it that's what makes you happy, you realist you.

quote:

Originally posted by China Fleet Sailor:

quote:

Originally posted by adrook:
I'll give you a real life example. I was told personally by an old-time Zambian PH who did know PHC well that the episode in Death in the Long Grass that PHC relates about cropping buffalo with Bob Langevelt didn't take place as PHC claimed.

That's a real life example all right,

. . . of hero worship, adrook.

Do you have any more rumors you'd like to pass along from guys you look up to, that "prove" Capstick was the liar?

I have no problem believing Capstick exaggerated and took poetic license. I'd have an easier time calling him an out-and-out liar if the people named in his books, who actually did exist, were making the accusations.

Instead of the anonymous third parties who crawl out of the woodwork and claim to have been the real heroes.

But you go ahead and believe those unverified claims, it that's what makes you happy, you realist you.

quote:

Originally posted by Pauly3511:

quote:

Originally posted by China Fleet Sailor:

quote:

Originally posted by adrook:
I'll give you a real life example. I was told personally by an old-time Zambian PH who did know PHC well that the episode in Death in the Long Grass that PHC relates about cropping buffalo with Bob Langevelt didn't take place as PHC claimed.

That's a real life example all right,

. . . of hero worship, adrook.

Do you have any more rumors you'd like to pass along from guys you look up to, that "prove" Capstick was the liar?

I have no problem believing Capstick exaggerated and took poetic license. I'd have an easier time calling him an out-and-out liar if the people named in his books, who actually did exist, were making the accusations.

Instead of the anonymous third parties who crawl out of the woodwork and claim to have been the real heroes.

But you go ahead and believe those unverified claims, it that's what makes you happy, you realist you.

+1

quote:

I'll give you a real life example. I was told personally by an old-time Zambian PH who did know PHC well that the episode in Death in the Long Grass that PHC relates about cropping buffalo with Bob Langevelt didn't take place as PHC claimed. It wasn't PHC doing the cropping with Langevelt it was instead this PH. He told me that Capstick was along with them but he never left the cruiser and didn't even have a rifle. He told me that PHC was more like a reporter researching a story than a hunter.

Oh OK that settles it! You know a guy who knows a guy. End of story, must be true.
I was once told "Believe half of what you see and none of what you hear" Sounds like it applies here.
BTW, I heard a similar story about Craig Boddington. I'll give you my address if you want to send me all of his books and videos.

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
When I read some of this, the people who write the posts remind me of the trash in our midst that deface old grave yards, and kick over head stones of the departed! Sick individulas who respect nothing, but their own image in a mirror!

IMO this world has become a very angry, me, and screw everyone else, world that is somehow more of a worry than global warming, and world recession. I think we could use some more dreamers like Peter Capstick, who hurt nobody I know! R.I.P. PHC

What are your thoughts on Ruark Remembered? This gave an excellent view of the whole man flaws and all. Should it have been sensored and had all his character flaws removed? Would we understand Ruark without this information.

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:

quote:

I'll give you a real life example. I was told personally by an old-time Zambian PH who did know PHC well that the episode in Death in the Long Grass that PHC relates about cropping buffalo with Bob Langevelt didn't take place as PHC claimed. It wasn't PHC doing the cropping with Langevelt it was instead this PH. He told me that Capstick was along with them but he never left the cruiser and didn't even have a rifle. He told me that PHC was more like a reporter researching a story than a hunter.

Oh OK that settles it! You know a guy who knows a guy. End of story, must be true.
I was once told "Believe half of what you see and none of what you hear" Sounds like it applies here.

I'll not name any names as he wishes to remain anonymous but the man I'm referring to has been a PH for about as long as I've been alive and is a legend in the industry and he's not the only PH to have related such stories to me.

Obviously PHC did a lot for the industry and helped to put a lot of money in a lot of people's pockets so they are understandably loathe to admit publicly what they will readily state privately.

Be that as it may it doesn't change the fact that PHAZ confirmed he never held a licence in Zambia. That doesn't speak for other countries where he may or may not have hunted such as Bots, Zim, Moz, etc. Everyone who thinks that we are full of shit go to Zambia and hunt the areas which he claimed to have hunted and talk to the people who knew him and still remember him hanging around there with his notebook. You may gain a different perspective on the man.

quote:

Originally posted by adrook:
I'll not name any names as he wishes to remain anonymous but the man I'm referring to has been a PH for about as long as I've been alive and is a legend in the industry and he's not the only PH to have related such stories to me.

Obviously PHC did a lot for the industry and helped to put a lot of money in a lot of people's pockets so they are understandably loathe to admit publicly what they will readily state privately.

Be that as it may it doesn't change the fact that PHAZ confirmed he never held a licence in Zambia. That doesn't speak for other countries where he may or may not have hunted such as Bots, Zim, Moz, etc. Everyone who thinks that we are full of shit go to Zambia and hunt the areas which he claimed to have hunted and talk to the people who knew him and still remember him hanging around there with his notebook. You may gain a different perspective on the man.

I really doubt you understand what my perspective is on PHC, or his critics.

Let me try to flesh it out a little for you.

If you write books, you set yourself up as a target. As illustrated by the petty jealousies PHC's books seem to have aroused. If his anonymous critics want me to take them seriously, then they can show the same cajones PHC did by writing a freakin' book under their real name. If it's any good, I'll read it. And I'd be interested to see how they handle all the critics who crawl out of the woodwork to snipe at them.

But until they do that, then it's just so much gossip on the internet.

When it comes to PHC's standards of honesty, as far as I'm concerned, he didn't lie about anything important. I mean, elephants are dangerous, aren't they? And P.J. Pretorious really did play a pivotal role in sinking the Konigsberg, right?

As far as the other details go, who gives a rat's ass if he overinflated his cape-buffalo-spearing adventures? It isn't like other hunters and fishermen are world-renowned for their rigorous standards of honesty when telling stories about themselves.

And what does it say about your source's level of integrity? That he'd rather engage in rumor mongering and behind the scenes character assassination, but won't go public about PHC because those books he wrote put money in his pocket?

Not much.

Speak up if you've got something to say. Unless of course your silence was bought and paid for. And if you're bought and paid for, then show a little integrity and shut-up and stay that way.

Don't try to have it both ways.

At the end of the day it is only a fraud if someone illegally took your money and or soul.

Capstick like Obama are BOTH VERY GOOD SALEMEN and if you bought their wares that is your fault not the one selling the product.

We all have our own minds and if we get caught hook line and sinker we need to blame ourselves not those maybe conning us.

Or if we prefer not to blame ourselves then we can always go back on the old solution which is to (blame our parents) whom told us all those wonderful FAIRT TALES and taught us at a young age to enjoy the fantasy world, the same when reading a capstick book we want to be entertained and at times will believe and enjoy the stretching of the truth, it is inherant in human nature and these well heeled salesmen know the failings of the human mind and can xploit it to their advantage.

Cheers, Peter