quote:

Let's kill this thread! Thanks to all, good and bad, Craig

quote:

Thank You Sir. I think out of respect this request should be honored and we should move along to other subjects. JMO.

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
I have not weighed in on this crap as it has gone along, and the chickens have pecked and drawn blood, but I have followed it. I consider Craig Boddington one of the greatest advocates for hunting and Africa that there ever was, and one of the greatest outdoor writers of our time. He is the real deal, whether on camera or in real life. A class act for sure! A great majority of us follow him, appreciate him and are grateful(hopefully) that he still wants to hang around here on AR.

quote:

Originally posted by Use Enough Gun:
I have not weighed in on this crap as it has gone along, and the chickens have pecked and drawn blood, but I have followed it. I consider Craig Boddington one of the greatest advocates for hunting and Africa that there ever was, and one of the greatest outdoor writers of our time. He is the real deal, whether on camera or in real life. A class act for sure! A great majority of us follow him, appreciate him and are grateful(hopefully) that he still wants to hang around here on AR.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
It seems the consensus opinion here is that CB is a great guy, true patriot, and could not have possibly committed any of these alleged acts. I am not going to say that any of you are wrong. Why? Because I do not know the man. Granted I have read a lot of his work and liked most of it. I have seen him on TV and liked most of it. I have a few of his DVD's and liked most of them. Does that make me qualified to formulate an opinion on the man? In my mind, it absolutely does not. None of these positive things makes me know the REAL man.

How are these opinions of the posters here formed? How many of you REALLY know him? I don't mean that he shook your hand at SCI or something like that. I don't mean do you like his TV show or his writing. How many of you really know him?

Has a single person here attempted to do any investigation to see if these allegations might be true? I am willing to bet not.

CB may be a great guy, true patriot, etc, etc. However, it seems to me that many here are saying that as a result of hero worship and not the facts. And some of you wonder how Obama got elected...........

quote:

We are actually quite shallow.

quote:

...we can see the same thing in reverse in the case of Mark Sullivan.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
It seems the consensus opinion here is that CB is a great guy, true patriot, and could not have possibly committed any of these alleged acts. I am not going to say that any of you are wrong. Why? Because I do not know the man. Granted I have read a lot of his work and liked most of it. I have seen him on TV and liked most of it. I have a few of his DVD's and liked most of them. Does that make me qualified to formulate an opinion on the man? In my mind, it absolutely does not. None of these positive things makes me know the REAL man.

How are these opinions of the posters here formed? How many of you REALLY know him? I don't mean that he shook your hand at SCI or something like that. I don't mean do you like his TV show or his writing. How many of you really know him?

Has a single person here attempted to do any investigation to see if these allegations might be true? I am willing to bet not.

CB may be a great guy, true patriot, etc, etc. However, it seems to me that many here are saying that as a result of hero worship and not the facts. And some of you wonder how Obama got elected...........

+1, and curiously we can see the same thing in reverse in the case of Mark Sullivan. Folks that do not know him are prepared to judge him negatively on the basis of a few hunting DVDs without knowing the true measure of the man. We are actually quite shallow.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Well ladies and gentlemen, I have to say that this is about the biggest exhibition of ass kissing I have seen in a while. I have known a lot more than I have publicized. I was never going to post the following. I quite frankly got sickened by the ass kissing going on here. It is absolutely shocking to me.

The following are e mails related to this matter. I have removed the names of 2 people. I will let them decide if they want to comment further.

You make up your mind.

Begin forwarded message:

From: xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Fwd: Illegal Banteng hunts
Date: January 30, 2013 1:03:05 AM CST
To: xxxxxxxxxx



Sent from my iPhone

Begin forwarded message:

From: Jailee Wilson <Jailee.Wilson@nt.gov.au>
Date: 29 January 2013 8:14:35 PM PST
To:xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Illegal Banteng hunts

Thanks xxxxx I have down loaded 4 banteng photos from Greg’s web site and two clearly show him in the pictures. I already have Norm Fisher’s contact details so I can email him. Let me know if you can get any other information.

Many thanks

Jailee Wilson I Executive Officer
Parks and Wildlife Commission
2nd Floor Goyder Bldg, Palmerston, PO Box 496 Palmerston NT 0831
t...(08) 8999 4431 I f...(08) 8999 4558 I e… jailee.wilson@nt.gov.au
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


From: xxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, 30 January 2013 12:42 PM
To: Jailee Wilson; Garret Smith
Subject: Re: Illegal Banteng hunts

Norm fisher was the pilot( there were 2 helicopters) he was told that they had permits and that solomons agreement had been executed. Greg penicot arranged the hunts and he is in the photos, I have not seen the video yet but xxxxxxxxx saw it and he could possibly shed more light on that. They flew from swim creek which is we're the photo was taken and is obvious in the photo, cobourg is the only viable option if flying from there. I will get as much information as I can, Greg penicot had photos of at least 4 banteng in his booth all were taken last year as he has never worked with any of the previous operators in the park. I will send over the emails as soon as I get them.

Sent from my iPhone

On 29/01/2013, at 6:55 PM, Jailee Wilson <Jailee.Wilson@nt.gov.au> wrote:

Hi xxxxx

I would certainly keep the name of the source confidential and I can also when I bring this to the Board’s attention advise that some information has been provided by “a source that wishes to remain anonymous” so if you could provide the name of the pilot and contact details then PWCNT can start making investigations and depending on what information comes to light will determine whether any legal action can be taken.

I am not sure how we can find out who is doing up certificates for the animals to be exported – as above if we get enough information this could be asked of who arranged the hunt but we will just have to wait to see.

Regarding the video does it actually show the persons who arranged the hunt or just the clients and can you see any land marks etc that clearly show it is in the Park? If it doesn’t then I don’t see there would be much gain in trying to get a copy of this for the Board however if you can get your hands on a copy please send through anyways.

Many thanks


Jailee Wilson I Executive Officer
Parks and Wildlife Commission
2nd Floor Goyder Bldg, Palmerston, PO Box 496 Palmerston NT 0831
t...(08) 8999 4431 I f...(08) 8999 4558 I e… jailee.wilson@nt.gov.au
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


From: xxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, 30 January 2013 12:40 AM
To: Jailee Wilson; Garret Smith; barbara@huntingreport.com
Subject: Re: Illegal Banteng hunts

I can provide the name and contacts for the pilot but I kneed to know it would be confidential, obviously there are family members of Solomon's on the board that oils cause problems for me. Email address for boddington shouldn't be a problem but I doubt they would cooperate as they are liable for prosecution under the LaCie act here in the USA for breaches of another countries animal bylaws.
This has been going on for along time and needs some attention, it costs me a fortune and a lot of head aches going back and forth to get a legal concession operating outside the park and I am the first to be blamed when helicopters are involved etc. I will try my best to to get the video. I have talked to Solomon and he put the blame straight onto penicot saying he went up there without telling him and only found out after he came back, I think he would do the same if he was confronted by parks and wildlife or the police.
The other thing is the animals had to be exported with either a fake certificate of origin or fake deceleration so this is a breach aswell
both in Australia and the USA and this can be easily tracked down.
Please let me know and I will provide the information ASAP.
Sent from my iPhone

On 28/01/2013, at 8:23 PM, Jailee Wilson <Jailee.Wilson@nt.gov.au> wrote:

Hi xxxxxx

Thanks for this. Unfortunately I will need hard evidence before any legal action can be considered therefore I need the name of the helicopter pilot and contact details to get documentation that supports the information you have provided below such as flights paths and who he was contracted by etc. Do you also have contact details for the Boddington / Hagens as I would also like to contact them to gain statements.

cheers

Jailee Wilson I Executive Officer
Parks and Wildlife Commission
2nd Floor Goyder Bldg, Palmerston, PO Box 496 Palmerston NT 0831
t...(08) 8999 4431 I f...(08) 8999 4558 I e… jailee.wilson@nt.gov.au
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


From: xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2013 2:43 AM
To: garrett.smith@nlc.org.au; Jailee Wilson; barbara@huntreports.com
Subject: Illegal Banteng hunts


These hunt were done using helicopters to access the park, the hunt were filmed and have been played at the Houston show where xxxxxxx saw them and notified me, I know that Greg Penicott and Solomon Cooper have an agreement in principle under Australian Muran Banteng Hunting but I also know it has not yet been executed and certainly was not even close at the time of the hunts that were in August 2012. As you can see from xxxxx email there were rumours of Boddington coming to Australia early in 2012 so it likely that this hunt was booked at the SCI or Dallas Safari Club in Jan/Feb that year. There was information on Hunt Reports.com and acurate reloading about the banteng situation and accredited operators and it was certainly no secret was licensed at the time to harvest Banteng in the Park.

Banteng do exist outside the national park but do not roam further than the Murgenella region. The area they exist outside the park is under Section 19 Land Use Agreement to either myself or Peter Loreman(tropical Hunting Safaris) and neither of do business or had permits issued for Greg Pennicot, Craig or Donna Boddington or Mike or Susan Hagen. Kevin Gleeson(KGsafaris@bigpond.com) does own a private herd of banteng at Mary River but as far as im aware does not deal with Greg Penicot(this can be easily confirmed by emailing Kevin) and the topography in the photograph matches the that of the National Park rather than inland area of Mary River Station were Kevin Gleeson operates.

I have talked and got confirmation from the helicopter pilot that these hunts were conducted inside the Park but he was told that Permits had been issued and the Area was under contract to Solomon and Greg. Additionally he told me that Donna Boddington took 1 banteng and a Male client took the the other.

This hunt breaches bi-laws in the park, the clients are also breaching the Lacie Act in the USA and will also breach fish and game laws on the import of Cites Appendices 2 into the USA with either a fraudulent certificate of origin or fraudulent declaration on the species of animals.


Correspondence from xxxxxxxx

Bottom line is xxxxx it has to be stopped, if possible. In the least it brings the industry into disrepute (like it needs that!). I have attached the photos I have from Facebook. I am pretty sure that someone sent the kill shots to the head ranger guy as a heads-up some time ago but I don't know if Parks pursued it. I should have asked you about it back then but I forgot.

Oh I know Craig pretty well (he hunted in Australia half a dozen or more times) but he certainly knew about all the funny business that goes on with the banteng and I was keeping him up to date at times about what was happening with the various applications we had sent to the Board over the years. If he had any questions or concerns he only had to ask myself or xxxxxxx and he would have got the truth. I heard he was coming to Australia early last year and I asked him and he denied it... not that I would have cared if he hunted legitimately with you or anyone else. He cant say he wasn't warned...

I think it would only take a message from 'somebody' to the Hunting Report for it all to potentially unravel. They know how to get the answers....

Very nasty business.

xxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Mon 14/01/2013 10:41 AM
To: xxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Hey

Ive got to the bottom of this, they were hunting the park, they used
the choppers for access and then walked, no executed contract 100%
illegal. Craig didnt shoot an animal just his wife and a client did
also. Obviously they have breached firearms act, the import of the
animals will be illegal, and they are in Breach of the Lacie act here
in the USA.I am still considiering the path i take on this, obviously
for us it would be good to have an operator prosocuted for this type
of thing but the implications for craig is the downside. How well do
you know him?

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
God holds Marines in higher esteem. They keep heaven stoked with fresh souls....

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by shootaway:
Being a Marine does not make one a good person the same way that being a priest does not necessarily make someone a good person.[/QUOTE

Dumbass! You have got to be the most moronic poster AR has ever had!

I would take ANY Marine I have ever met over a whole boatload of "yous"!


.

quote:

Originally posted by mdstewart:

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Well ladies and gentlemen, I have to say that this is about the biggest exhibition of ass kissing I have seen in a while. I have known a lot more than I have publicized. I was never going to post the following. I quite frankly got sickened by the ass kissing going on here. It is absolutely shocking to me.

The following are e mails related to this matter. I have removed the names of 2 people. I will let them decide if they want to comment further.

You make up your mind.

Begin forwarded message:

From: xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Fwd: Illegal Banteng hunts
Date: January 30, 2013 1:03:05 AM CST
To: xxxxxxxxxx



Sent from my iPhone

Begin forwarded message:

From: Jailee Wilson <Jailee.Wilson@nt.gov.au>
Date: 29 January 2013 8:14:35 PM PST
To:xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Illegal Banteng hunts

Thanks xxxxx I have down loaded 4 banteng photos from Greg’s web site and two clearly show him in the pictures. I already have Norm Fisher’s contact details so I can email him. Let me know if you can get any other information.

Many thanks

Jailee Wilson I Executive Officer
Parks and Wildlife Commission
2nd Floor Goyder Bldg, Palmerston, PO Box 496 Palmerston NT 0831
t...(08) 8999 4431 I f...(08) 8999 4558 I e… jailee.wilson@nt.gov.au
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


From: xxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, 30 January 2013 12:42 PM
To: Jailee Wilson; Garret Smith
Subject: Re: Illegal Banteng hunts

Norm fisher was the pilot( there were 2 helicopters) he was told that they had permits and that solomons agreement had been executed. Greg penicot arranged the hunts and he is in the photos, I have not seen the video yet but xxxxxxxxx saw it and he could possibly shed more light on that. They flew from swim creek which is we're the photo was taken and is obvious in the photo, cobourg is the only viable option if flying from there. I will get as much information as I can, Greg penicot had photos of at least 4 banteng in his booth all were taken last year as he has never worked with any of the previous operators in the park. I will send over the emails as soon as I get them.

Sent from my iPhone

On 29/01/2013, at 6:55 PM, Jailee Wilson <Jailee.Wilson@nt.gov.au> wrote:

Hi xxxxx

I would certainly keep the name of the source confidential and I can also when I bring this to the Board’s attention advise that some information has been provided by “a source that wishes to remain anonymous” so if you could provide the name of the pilot and contact details then PWCNT can start making investigations and depending on what information comes to light will determine whether any legal action can be taken.

I am not sure how we can find out who is doing up certificates for the animals to be exported – as above if we get enough information this could be asked of who arranged the hunt but we will just have to wait to see.

Regarding the video does it actually show the persons who arranged the hunt or just the clients and can you see any land marks etc that clearly show it is in the Park? If it doesn’t then I don’t see there would be much gain in trying to get a copy of this for the Board however if you can get your hands on a copy please send through anyways.

Many thanks


Jailee Wilson I Executive Officer
Parks and Wildlife Commission
2nd Floor Goyder Bldg, Palmerston, PO Box 496 Palmerston NT 0831
t...(08) 8999 4431 I f...(08) 8999 4558 I e… jailee.wilson@nt.gov.au
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


From: xxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Wednesday, 30 January 2013 12:40 AM
To: Jailee Wilson; Garret Smith; barbara@huntingreport.com
Subject: Re: Illegal Banteng hunts

I can provide the name and contacts for the pilot but I kneed to know it would be confidential, obviously there are family members of Solomon's on the board that oils cause problems for me. Email address for boddington shouldn't be a problem but I doubt they would cooperate as they are liable for prosecution under the LaCie act here in the USA for breaches of another countries animal bylaws.
This has been going on for along time and needs some attention, it costs me a fortune and a lot of head aches going back and forth to get a legal concession operating outside the park and I am the first to be blamed when helicopters are involved etc. I will try my best to to get the video. I have talked to Solomon and he put the blame straight onto penicot saying he went up there without telling him and only found out after he came back, I think he would do the same if he was confronted by parks and wildlife or the police.
The other thing is the animals had to be exported with either a fake certificate of origin or fake deceleration so this is a breach aswell
both in Australia and the USA and this can be easily tracked down.
Please let me know and I will provide the information ASAP.
Sent from my iPhone

On 28/01/2013, at 8:23 PM, Jailee Wilson <Jailee.Wilson@nt.gov.au> wrote:

Hi xxxxxx

Thanks for this. Unfortunately I will need hard evidence before any legal action can be considered therefore I need the name of the helicopter pilot and contact details to get documentation that supports the information you have provided below such as flights paths and who he was contracted by etc. Do you also have contact details for the Boddington / Hagens as I would also like to contact them to gain statements.

cheers

Jailee Wilson I Executive Officer
Parks and Wildlife Commission
2nd Floor Goyder Bldg, Palmerston, PO Box 496 Palmerston NT 0831
t...(08) 8999 4431 I f...(08) 8999 4558 I e… jailee.wilson@nt.gov.au
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.


From: xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, 26 January 2013 2:43 AM
To: garrett.smith@nlc.org.au; Jailee Wilson; barbara@huntreports.com
Subject: Illegal Banteng hunts


These hunt were done using helicopters to access the park, the hunt were filmed and have been played at the Houston show where xxxxxxx saw them and notified me, I know that Greg Penicott and Solomon Cooper have an agreement in principle under Australian Muran Banteng Hunting but I also know it has not yet been executed and certainly was not even close at the time of the hunts that were in August 2012. As you can see from xxxxx email there were rumours of Boddington coming to Australia early in 2012 so it likely that this hunt was booked at the SCI or Dallas Safari Club in Jan/Feb that year. There was information on Hunt Reports.com and acurate reloading about the banteng situation and accredited operators and it was certainly no secret was licensed at the time to harvest Banteng in the Park.

Banteng do exist outside the national park but do not roam further than the Murgenella region. The area they exist outside the park is under Section 19 Land Use Agreement to either myself or Peter Loreman(tropical Hunting Safaris) and neither of do business or had permits issued for Greg Pennicot, Craig or Donna Boddington or Mike or Susan Hagen. Kevin Gleeson(KGsafaris@bigpond.com) does own a private herd of banteng at Mary River but as far as im aware does not deal with Greg Penicot(this can be easily confirmed by emailing Kevin) and the topography in the photograph matches the that of the National Park rather than inland area of Mary River Station were Kevin Gleeson operates.

I have talked and got confirmation from the helicopter pilot that these hunts were conducted inside the Park but he was told that Permits had been issued and the Area was under contract to Solomon and Greg. Additionally he told me that Donna Boddington took 1 banteng and a Male client took the the other.

This hunt breaches bi-laws in the park, the clients are also breaching the Lacie Act in the USA and will also breach fish and game laws on the import of Cites Appendices 2 into the USA with either a fraudulent certificate of origin or fraudulent declaration on the species of animals.


Correspondence from xxxxxxxx

Bottom line is xxxxx it has to be stopped, if possible. In the least it brings the industry into disrepute (like it needs that!). I have attached the photos I have from Facebook. I am pretty sure that someone sent the kill shots to the head ranger guy as a heads-up some time ago but I don't know if Parks pursued it. I should have asked you about it back then but I forgot.

Oh I know Craig pretty well (he hunted in Australia half a dozen or more times) but he certainly knew about all the funny business that goes on with the banteng and I was keeping him up to date at times about what was happening with the various applications we had sent to the Board over the years. If he had any questions or concerns he only had to ask myself or xxxxxxx and he would have got the truth. I heard he was coming to Australia early last year and I asked him and he denied it... not that I would have cared if he hunted legitimately with you or anyone else. He cant say he wasn't warned...

I think it would only take a message from 'somebody' to the Hunting Report for it all to potentially unravel. They know how to get the answers....

Very nasty business.

xxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: xxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Mon 14/01/2013 10:41 AM
To: xxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Hey

Ive got to the bottom of this, they were hunting the park, they used
the choppers for access and then walked, no executed contract 100%
illegal. Craig didnt shoot an animal just his wife and a client did
also. Obviously they have breached firearms act, the import of the
animals will be illegal, and they are in Breach of the Lacie act here
in the USA.I am still considiering the path i take on this, obviously
for us it would be good to have an operator prosocuted for this type
of thing but the implications for craig is the downside. How well do
you know him?

You better hope these to be the true facts, or else find a good attorney. I see a libel suit on it's way. I'd think I would have verified these with CB through a PM before publishing this for the world to see. Not sure this was a smart move. Good luck.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
I understand there quite a few legal battles going right now.

From our point of view as hunters, the sooner the truth comes out the better, and put all this to rest.

quote:

Exactly....any personal hate or Hero worship of Boddington, is inconsequential.sensible mature people rely on the findings of impartial investigation.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
We have had examples in the past of similar, illegal activities, that have been undertaken by certain members of the hunting community.

Take the example of Arnold Payne and his 50 inch buffalo.

Even SCI saw his activities and banned him.

Should we keep quiet when we think we see something nasty going on in our group, and hope no one will notice?

Or should we at least try to get to the facts?

As with every argument, even the accused can come out with flying colors once it is proven that whatever they have been accused of is not true.

The accuser is then looses credibility.

quote:

Originally posted by mdstewart:
I find it inappropriate and borderline illegal to post such accusations if done so irresponsibly. I think Larry really stepped in it here. A sit-back-and-wait approach might have been a wise decision.

quote:

Originally posted by Trax:


I dont believe larry is accusing or vindicating anyone of anything.
He is simply sharing some email correspondence that he is privi to.

No one here on AR is obligated or required to make their mind up about Boddington, simply based on those provided transcripts.
Any person who attempts to draw any strong conclusion from those transcripts [one way or the other]
ie; as to whether any illegal hunting took place, is not an intelligent person.

]