I wonder why the bow hunter did not stop the charge?

Wayne was always wanting to try his arrows on one of our 18 foot Lake Chamo Croc's. He was going to use a line like bow fishing. It would take a really strong line to haul in a one ton croc. I didn't see any line attached to the hippo arrow

Rich Elliott

I have zero problem saying that I was pulling for the hippo. Seriously. The longer I stay in the game, especially hunting and filming the dangerous stuff, the more I move away from the bow for dangerous game. Can it be effective ? Of course. But too many times ego is the thing driving the whole deal, and this is a PERFECT example of that in action. If you can't stop the charge with your weapon, then you may not be hunting with the right weapon. If the rifle had not been present ( and used well ) this guy would have gotten exactly what he had coming.
Before I get slapped around for being "anti bow'' let me say I have been shooting bows, and rifles, all my life. But guys, this stuff just happens way too much on the big dangerous game, and I see more than my share of it over there.
I really felt bad for the bull, and I am sure the hunter went home with a great ''I took this hippo with my bow " story.

I have to agree with Dave. I am also an avid bowhunter, but when it comes to DG I believe there's a reason God created big caliber rifles.

There's no question you can kill a buffalo, elephant, etc. with a bow. There's also no question you can't STOP one with a bow. And then it's no longer a bow kill and what was the point.

You know! I don't claim to be an expert on anything but going after a hippo with a bow in a boat? That just can't be the right way to do it. The hippo knows your coming..........

What was the PH thinking? I'm sure it was his idea or at least approved by him.

Mark

Note the name of the company imvolved. It's the same one that featured in that fiasco where the very confused idiot shot a very confused lion with a bow.

Shakari,

I noticed that as well. In fact, I didn't finish watching when I saw who made the damn thing.

No wonder that hunters like me who loves bow hunting get a bad reputation....

That PH needs a serious talk to for allowing a hunt or rather this circus.

Any hippo with an arrow up his nose is going to turn you into hippo poop.

quote:

I wonder why the bow hunter did not stop the charge?

+1
Seloushunter

I sure as hell would not have gotten in that boat without checking if my life insurance was paid up in full.

There are just as many screw-ups holding rifles as there are holding bows. We all have witnessed video of poorly shot animals that had to be finished off by the PH who is backing up a client.

Again, I must state that in my humble opinion it is not the fault of the bow, but the fault of the PH and the bow operator. The two hunters put themselves in a bad position and what happened after that was no surprise.

Had the hunter delivered the first arrow in the boiler room this could have played out much differently. Had he gut shot the hippo with a fifle and then pursued it with a boat it might have turned out just as ugly.

Bad form on part of hunter and PH is the way I see it.

I would never do something so stupid and mean. The right tool for the right job.

Isn't Wayne "Dead Eye" Lau a poster here? I would like to here the defense side of this one.

Do not see how anyone could be against hunters like us/him. You tube will be the death of hunting.

I think a bow, crossbow and arrows are not far from the power to stop the onslaught of one of these huge animals. Hunting with bow and arrow only, without the support of a hunter armed with a rifle is an appropriate recklessness.

Oscar.
PD: I can see that this is not the case, since the boat is a hunter with a rifle.

One could make a blind at an exit point on a river or mudhole, sneak in and right just before evening, if and when a hippo leaves the water, from 20 yards or so, put an arrow through both lungs. The arrow should be at least 900 grains and the bow 90#'s plus. Probably (and I emphasize the "probably") the hippo would never know where the arrow came from and would return to the water to die in a few minutes.

That would be bowhunting. A good P.H. would be ready to immediately end the deal if the arrow didn't get full penetration, was not properly placed, etc. The bowhunter shouldn't second guess the decision that the P.H. would have to instantly make to shoot if he suspected danger or a lost animal.

Shooting a bull from a boat is an invitation to disaster as was proven by the video. Why the hell would anyone be proud enough of that fubar p.o.s. to promulgate their idiocy.

JudgeG is spot on. This is not about the question of hunting hippo with a bow or not. If done correctly as Judge pointed out it is entirely feaseable and ethical. This is simply a matter of a PH not doing it the "right way" and creating a situation that should never happen. The bow hunter (don't know who it is), but probably isn't all that experienced or he wouldn't go along with this type of exercise. That's why it is absolutely neccessary that any DG hunt is done with a very knowledgable(bow and arrow) PH and an equally competent bow hunter.

So, don't blame the weapon of choice, blame the people involved, simple as that.

Larry Sellers
SCI Life Member

quote:

Originally posted by JudgeG:
One could make a blind at an exit point on a river or mudhole, sneak in and right just before evening, if and when a hippo leaves the water, from 20 yards or so, put an arrow through both lungs. The arrow should be at least 900 grains and the bow 90#'s plus. Probably (and I emphasize the "probably") the hippo would never know where the arrow came from and would return to the water to die in a few minutes.

That would be bowhunting. A good P.H. would be ready to immediately end the deal if the arrow didn't get full penetration, was not properly placed, etc. The bowhunter shouldn't second guess the decision that the P.H. would have to instantly make to shoot if he suspected danger or a lost animal....................
.

JudgeG,
We have that exact scenario planned for a hippo hunt in our Dati area the last of this month. I'll let the forum know how it plays out. Hopefully there will be pictures.
Rich Elliott

[QUOTE]Originally posted by eyedoc:...........Had he gut shot the hippo with a rifle and then pursued it with a boat it might have turned out just as ugly./QUOTE]


eyedoc,
I've been there and "ugly" it is!
Rich Elliott

quote:

Originally posted by Rich Elliott:

quote:

Originally posted by JudgeG:
One could make a blind at an exit point on a river or mudhole, sneak in and right just before evening, if and when a hippo leaves the water, from 20 yards or so, put an arrow through both lungs. The arrow should be at least 900 grains and the bow 90#'s plus. Probably (and I emphasize the "probably") the hippo would never know where the arrow came from and would return to the water to die in a few minutes.

That would be bowhunting. A good P.H. would be ready to immediately end the deal if the arrow didn't get full penetration, was not properly placed, etc. The bowhunter shouldn't second guess the decision that the P.H. would have to instantly make to shoot if he suspected danger or a lost animal....................
.

JudgeG,
We have that exact scenario planned for a hippo hunt in our Dati area the last of this month. I'll let the forum know how it plays out. Hopefully there will be pictures.
Rich Elliott

Rich,

What is your setup that you are going to use on the Hippo?

Good hunting hope the plan comes together and you get the shot.

quote:

What is your setup that you are going to use on the Hippo?

It's not me. It's a bow hunting client. A rather famous one but we'll skip over that for now. He uses PSE X Force Bows. I don't know the pull weight but I'm betting it's 90#. He has Radial Weave Black Mamba 400 arrows (probaly weighted). I have no idea which broadhead he plans to use. The same set up will be used for Nile Buffalo.

Rich Elliott

Correct me if I am wrong but did I witness: 5 shots from a boat within 30yrds?

1. The bowhunter hit the hippo in the guts the first shot?

2. Then the second shot was a broadside clean miss? The arrow hit the water in front of the hippo.

3. The hippo charged and the PH shot the hippo in the head?

4. Then the bowhunter shot the hippo in the nose?

5. The PH finished the hippo with a second head shot at the boat?


It would be impressive if they just tried to ram the hippo to death with the boat. That would be cool to watch. I bet the hippo would win this battle.

That is well beyond the pale. Anyone who understands what killing animals is about has to look at this stunt and wonder WTF WTF WTF!!! Why didn't they just paddle up and slap the hippo on the ass and ask him to commit suicide? That just buggers my imagination.

That little boat was full--Archer, 2 riflemen, cameraman, and motor-operator.
The arrow thru the nose had a hell of a lot of penetration--but even if it had reached the brain, it would have been unlikely to stop the charge.

quote:

Originally posted by daleW:
It would be impressive if they just tried to ram the hippo to death with the boat.

That's funny!

Dave Fulson, why are you always copying what I would have said had I read the thread before you?



I have to agree many times over.

Pay the animal the respect it deserves and kill it with the appropriate tools. Even DaleW's idea, while quite funny, would have been more effective.

Arrrggghhh....

Prepare to repel borders mateys...

Dale,

What up in dental land?

Jeff

quote:

Originally posted by eyedoc:
There are just as many screw-ups holding rifles as there are holding bows. We all have witnessed video of poorly shot animals that had to be finished off by the PH who is backing up a client.

Again, I must state that in my humble opinion it is not the fault of the bow, but the fault of the PH and the bow operator. The two hunters put themselves in a bad position and what happened after that was no surprise.

Had the hunter delivered the first arrow in the boiler room this could have played out much differently. Had he gut shot the hippo with a fifle and then pursued it with a boat it might have turned out just as ugly.

Bad form on part of hunter and PH is the way I see it.

You are right, of course.

But, a rifle hunter would at least have had the ability to stop a charge should it have occurred.

With a bow hunter, regardless of his first shot, if a charge occurrs, the likelyhood of him stopping it is ver slim.

Hence the argument against people trying this sort of thing with a bow.

Come on lads, this vid is begging for some quotes. My contributions follow.

"Damn! I knew I should have brought my full-auto bow!"

"Maaaark! Maaaark! Hurry, pleaaaase! The hippo has decided which way he will die and I don't like it one bit!"

"Funny, I don't recall your saying the trophy fee on hippo was five million dollars..."

"The perfect shot was wrong! I shot it in the left nostril and it didn't fall over stone dead!"

"That's right son. There I was, facing down a hippo charge. My PH and the crew, damn their eyes, left me there to stand it alone. At 2 paces, I shot him dead with a perfectly placed arrow. The shot you heard? What shot? Off to bed with you. It's past your bedtime, young man!"

I origionally saw the video on the a PH school's website, i wrote a mail to the owner regarding the video and his response is below, the video was the same just edited differently. I think this serves perfectly what constitutes as a stunt with a bow and arrow - could of ended up with a couple of people being chomped in half????

I agree with JudgeG, that would of been a better way to do it, one wonders how this method was dreamed up, or should i say under what circumstances? Whiskey, pot, one too many asprins, hell maybe even some meth?

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Hi Aubrey

Thank you for your mail, I apologise for the delayed rely, I am busy with a course and only see my mails when I get home now and then.

Your comments regarding the hippo footage are quite right. You are fortunately the first comment I get about the "arrow". I was hoping that if I kept quite no one would notice. I am of the personal opinion that shooting of pachyderms with bow and arrow should not be allowed, I am not conviced that any of these can be taken cleanly with one arrow with any degree of certainty. Dont get me wrong, I am also a keen bow hunter, I just think that it should be used within its limitations. I have got no negative response yet, if I do I will consider removing it.

Thank you for your interest and comments

Best regards
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

I saw the video playing non stop at Renno in their booth. I mean non stop. Always had a crowd of gawkers . Look , bad things happen to rifle hunters too (remember Buzz's client shooting the ele bull to bits a while back? ) but this was just a damn stunt from a client too lazy to wait in a proper set up, a PH that did not call bullshit on the proposal, and a animal that literally had no choice but to make a stand as best it could. Listen, I produce hunting films for a living, but I promise you some of the things I have filmed over the years never made it past the editing process as it was , in our opinion, not a kill, circumstance, or combination of the two we wanted the public to see. Truth is, its not always clean, no matter how hard you try. But just cause you filmed it, does not make it mandatory that you air it. Especially on the damn You Tube !! We have got our hands full without having to justify this sort of stupidity.

Dave,
Couldn't agree with you more. What in the world are these folks thinking when they post this crap? Good for the sport? Good for business? Why? This video has no good purpose that I can see.

I've taken a couple of Hippo with brain shots and there is no "cleaner" kill than a Hippo brained while in the water - he just quietly sinks beneath the surface; no fuss, no bother. Miss the brain however, and it gets ugly in a hurry.

Wow, that was very close.

quote:

Originally posted by SG Olds: You tube will be the death of hunting.

+1

We were hunting in the Selous a few years ago, following a herd of buffalo.

We came across a large hippo bull, which was standing looking at us from about 50 yards away across a wet patch of land. All around us was very thick reeds.

We stopped and looked at each other, and at one point we thought he would charge us.

In fact, some of my friends with us kept saying "come on hippo, have a go" wishing him to charge.

I kept saying "Don't listen to them boy, you won't stand a chance. Just keep to yourself. I would rather go shoot a buffalo and leave you in peace"

Luckily, he did not come for us.

It would have been great as a video, but would have been like shooting a fish in a barrel.

quote:

You tube will be the death of hunting

Yes, it probably will. And why some dumbasses cannot see this is beyond me. It may be funny or exciting to you, but to most people who do not hunt and never will, it is an indefensible act. Sharing such videos amongst hunting people is one thing, as I have elucidated before, but there is no benefit to having this shown all across the world and likely to be used as ammo against you. Don;t bitch when hunting is outlawed in response to this sort of thing; the fault will, in part, rest squarely on the shoulders of those mindless, selfish idiots who let their dick-measuring exploits find their way on to the public airwaves.

I have nothing against bow hunters, but I dont think bow hunting for such large game should be allowed. A true sportsman should use the biggest gun he can handle and kill the animal as neatly as he can. Of course screw ups happen all the time, but this can be quickly rectified with a rifle...hopefully!

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Fulson:
I have zero problem saying that I was pulling for the hippo. Seriously. The longer I stay in the game, especially hunting and filming the dangerous stuff, the more I move away from the bow for dangerous game. Can it be effective ? Of course. But too many times ego is the thing driving the whole deal, and this is a PERFECT example of that in action. If you can't stop the charge with your weapon, then you may not be hunting with the right weapon. If the rifle had not been present ( and used well ) this guy would have gotten exactly what he had coming.
Before I get slapped around for being "anti bow'' let me say I have been shooting bows, and rifles, all my life. But guys, this stuff just happens way too much on the big dangerous game, and I see more than my share of it over there.
I really felt bad for the bull, and I am sure the hunter went home with a great ''I took this hippo with my bow " story.

Bravo Dave,
I use to hunt exclusively with a long bow for 18 years and took many big game species so I'm not bias in any way. Well, maybe a little, bows now days are just bowguns, long story cut short but when I lost a grizzly bear because of my ego I finally woke up. MAKE A CLEAN KILL with the most appropiate weapon for the type of animal your hunting and a bow does not work on big dangerous game especially when it is charging.

wow. someone already said they thought the guy with the bow is a member here. i'd love to hear him on this one.

-agree with you Dave that the video sequence should have never been made public. It was poor execution, extremely poor first shot which triggered the debacle from thereon. It is not something the outfitter should have been playing non-stop at his booth. It portrays hunting in a very poor light. If the bowhunter would have placed a fatal first arrow, yes I say air it. I'm not against anyone with a bow or gun posing a challenge to himself, and if successful, there's nothing wrong with publicizing or touting it.

This stunt should be removed from YouTube. Don't go to Africa to try shots you've never executed. Practice them before you leave. I'll bet that guy never practiced such a shot from a boat, which is fairly easy to simulate.

When you consider what causes an animnal to charge a hunter (in most cases), is there really any honor in a client bragging that the animal charged him?

Moja

quote:

Originally posted by BaxterB:

quote:

You tube will be the death of hunting

Yes, it probably will. And why some dumbasses cannot see this is beyond me. It may be funny or exciting to you, but to most people who do not hunt and never will, it is an indefensible act. Sharing such videos amongst hunting people is one thing, as I have elucidated before, but there is no benefit to having this shown all across the world and likely to be used as ammo against you. Don;t bitch when hunting is outlawed in response to this sort of thing; the fault will, in part, rest squarely on the shoulders of those mindless, selfish idiots who let their dick-measuring exploits find their way on to the public airwaves.

+3 on the you tube comments. It never ceases to amaze me what is on there...and then too, sometimes I am sure it is the anti's that put it there, since it serves their purpose far greater than ours. They must snicker to themselves every time someone puts this kind of crap on the ol' intraweb.