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So I'm an expat (15 years now) - can't say that I miss South African politics - can't say I miss the the crime - can't say I miss murder and Car jackings - can't say I miss sleeping with guns on my dressing table - can't say I miss load shedding - can't say I miss the ANC - can't say I miss xenophobia, can't say I miss SABC TV - m net or Springbok Radio...... What I do miss are the people - and their incredible sense of humor  | |||
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WOW - when I started this thread it was for the purpose of illustrating just one additional reason to possibly curtail my "Africa Hunting Adventures" out of many other factors. It has produced a really good insight into RSA and what's going on there on a daily basis, and that is good. Thanks for all who have shed some additional light onto the subject. I stand by my belief that Africa Hunting has now reached the point of not being #1 on my priority list anymore, due to ALL the reasons mentioned in putting together and making it worthwhile now. RSA is still a good destination for most folks and in no way did I mean to infer otherwise. Have a great day out there. Larry Sellers SCI(International)Life Member R8 Blaser Sabatti "trash" Double Shooter | |||
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Just as tourists to the US should not be wondering around or through the wrong neighborhoods of New York , Dallas or a Dozen other American cities. | |||
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Jan Dumon, you saying that the farmer that gets murdered in bed or the teenager shopping in a mall and caught in the crossfire of an armed robbery is in 'a wrong neighbourhood'? Tell that crap to some other fool, please ! Truth is more people are killed, robbed, raped etc in the better areas ..... | |||
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The blood of the white South African is on your hands April 24, 2015 This is an open letter to the media houses and reporters of the world such as BBC and CNN and also the United Nations and various governments around the world, the blood of the white South African is on your hands! By refusing to report and take action against the brutal farm murders, rape and torture of white South Africans you have become an accessory to the fact! What will you tell your children, what will you tell your parents, brothers, sisters, grand parents and friends when they ask? Will you just simply say sorry or its not my problem, maybe you will hang your head in shame, while another child and his/her parents are raped, tortured and murdered because you did nothing! Let us imagine for a minute that these barbaric actions are happening to you and your family and friends, while your president sings song of killing you, what will you say or do, will it become headline news, will mass action be taken? 2500 people died in 911, the American government sent 250,000 troops to Iraq and Afghanistan as a measure of revenge! Xenophobic attacks takes place in South Africa, 10 foreigners die and the world goes crazy, CNN and BBC and RT International have none stop reports, various governments strongly condemn these attacks. Almost 70.000 white South Africans have been murdered under the most vicious circumstances since 1994, where bodies are even mutilated and yet you are silent? The Blood of the white South African is upon you, you are accessories to the fact, may God have mercy upon your soul! Its is said it is more evil for a good person to do nothing, than it is for a bad person to do evil! By Mike Pericic Source South Africa Today – South Africa News What’s Popular Now | |||
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Well said Opus1! I wish add "a little enlightenment" and thus I do hope that this posting actually becomes a "thread hijacking!" In the first instance, I will only deal with the original thread's theme: RSA is in turmoil due to xenophobia. Q1: First question that a complete novice "first travel to Africa ever" should ponder about is: How should I, and should I NOT, act and do to be safe or at least a little safer from harm by xenophobic mobs? A1: The easy reply is "Avoid xenophobic mobs". How? By choosing a hunting outfitter who knows his own country, and telling him very clearly that you do NOT wish to see any angry mob, be it a xenophobic or service delivery protesting mob. Make sure that, if your hunting outfitter is essentially a game farmer living in a remote rural area - and there is absolutely nothing wrong with such a choice - he does indeed know the area around the airport from which he is to pick you up very well. He should know where there are many foreigners living among the locals. He should know the roads to take - depending on time of the day and rush hour traffic - to safely and easily get around potential trouble spots. I have lived and/or worked in Johannesburg and surrounding town for many many years, and I know with great confidence that I will not endanger a client in any way en route to or from O R Tambo. I'm just one of a large number of experienced hunting outfitters, who knows the area really very well! There are very few hunting outfitters who live in remote rural settings who know Jo'burg [and in my case Bloemfontein too] and the airport area really well. Some will know just the easiest route in and out, and may not even be aware that they are driving just one street block away from a potential trouble spot! I'll freely admit that I fall into this last category for fetching clients from Durban's new airport: Know how to get there and back, but have no clear picture of where the potential xenophobic hot-spots are along the route. Don't let me pick you up at Durban - rather get 500nitro for that task! Q2: What should I do if I have to overnight near any airport before being picked up by my hunting outfitter or PH? A2: Nothing! You need to get your biological clock adjusted in any case! Get an early night in one of the airport hotels, or by prior arrangement with a well recommended hubnter-friendly guesthouse. There are many, Afton being a good example for safe overnight stay near Jo'burg. I'm sure each major city has similar places - ask your hunting outfitter for his recommendation. Q3. If, for some reason beyond my control, I find myself without a trusted and knowledgeable guide, what should I avoid? A3: Any place that even remotely looks like a less than top-class neighborhood. In particular avoidance of "Spaza Shops" which is the type of establishment at which a vast majority of the foreigners against who the xenophobic attacks are directed live and do business. It is these shops that are looted! [I will look and edit this post to show a few photos of such Spaza Shops.] Sure, you as a very first timer in Africa may not note the difference between a Spaza Shop run by a local South African, and a Nigerian one - so just avoid all such places. Would some other local hunting outfitters expand on the advice here to help our common clients avoid trouble? Andrew McLaren Professional Hunter and Hunting Outfitter since 1974. http://www.mclarensafaris.com The home page to go to for custom planning of ethical and affordable hunting of plains game in South Africa! Enquire about any South African hunting directly from andrew@mclarensafaris.com After a few years of participation on forums, I have learned that: One can cure: Lack of knowledge – by instruction. Lack of skills – by practice. Lack of experience – by time doing it. One cannot cure: Stupidity – nothing helps! Anti hunting sentiments – nothing helps! Put-‘n-Take Outfitters – money rules! My very long ago ancestors needed and loved to eat meat. Today I still hunt! | |||
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Larry - The liberals and the liberal media in the US and UK do not want to be reminded that they are directly responsible for fanning the Anti Apartheid flame that has lead to the mass murder of whites and blacks alike. Apartheid was not a wonderful thing, but was the only thing keeping the savages at bay. Abruptly ending Apartheid was a colossal mistake and most anyone with a smattering of common sense knew it. SA could have easily opened the doors to blacks truly intent on becoming productive citizens while keeping the rest out of society. But because of international pressure, the gates were flung wide open and the savages and parasites took over. It is truly tragic what has happened as a result for black and white alike. So many have needlessly died while the US and the UK have looked the other way. The blood that has been spilled since 1994 is on their hands. ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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I seriously doubt that the above claim you are making is statistically true. The people in the poor neighborhoods have it really bad. We don't realize it because it because we don't go there , don't live there and those attacks hardly make the headline news unless its xenophobic and on mass as is the case right now. The media loves a bloody story. That said , offcourse there are attacks in the good areas , we all know that . But you make it sound like its doomsday out there. That's not on. I enjoy living in South Africa , my area in any case , and I don't feel threatened. But I guess I cant talk for Port Elizabeth or your neighborhood. That's wrong of me , I apologize. To each his own. I'm going outside now , without a fire arm , to get some sweet fresh air and ponder on my Buffalo hunt that starts tomorrow. Cheers | |||
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I agree 100%. | |||
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Gents: I must agree strongly with Larry S. in that Africa is no longer a priority. But safety is not the only issue. I feel safe in Zim where ever I go, including my am and pm walks around Harare and Bulawayo and the smaller communities. SA is a different story. I get creeped out in the airports with the number of low life who ask to carry by bags and for me to come with them for a "deal" they will sell me around the corner of the parking garage. I would not go anywhere in the city. While it is safe in most farms and ranches, the fact is many are killed my the militant blacks in random violence. I also acknowledge many are killed in Los Angeles every month, or Chicago, etc., but I don't go there either and if I was it would be to areas I know are safe. But, as mentioned, violence is not the only reason I stay home. I've made enough trips there (14+) that is it no longer an adventure. I dread the long flight. The requirements to fly with rifles, get in and out of the US, get in and out of one or more African countries is certainly possible by jumping through all the hoops and crossing every t and dotting every i (and in the correct color or ink) but if an error is made I do fear the consequences of a confiscated gun or missing my flight. Or a gov't official that is clueless. Theft of a nice rifle in the US or in Africa and at the airports is a major concern. For every hand that comes out asking for money I wonder that if I don't give or give enough will my rifle disappear from the locked storage or between the police and the air plane. I'm tired of adult men begging, "more, more." And then there is the African scams to separate Americans from their money, pre determined tip amounts, faulty taxidermy paid in advance, high freight rates and even higher if one has an elephant or lion, scams at the airport to take one's ticket or boarding pass in SA, and, on my last hunt to SA, a well known poster here bought some animals to make a profit in the markup and when the hunt was so poor and in a small area I passed on shooting anything, the game plan changed and I lost 1000$ (due to currency exchange rates I was told) and it took a a couple of months to get my refund as the hunter had already spent my money.(When he offered me a hunt in central Africa at a good price I passed immediately). Added to the above is the lessening trophy quality, sometimes crowded camps, countless locals who what a tip for doing nothing, and exceptional trophy quality in SA on canned ranches and guaranteed trophy quality from plains game to pre measured rhinos, etc.. One of the most prolific posters here and a well known PH charged me for an airport pickup at 500$, gave me his word it was an error it was not in the contract, it was the brochure, and everyone paid this amount. Well, I found out later, it was not in the brochure, and no one paid the amount (this was in the '90s when airport transfers were part of the hunt). So, he made his 500$ and missed my next 13 hunts. I, too, like Larry, may make more trips but it is not a priority. I've found my .600 Wilkes makes an ideal plains game rifle! But for me it is more enjoyable to buy and shoot doubles as a definite quality investment rather than the crap shoot of many Africa hunts. Just my two cents. Cal _______________________________ Cal Pappas, Willow, Alaska www.CalPappas.com www.CalPappas.blogspot.com 1994 Zimbabwe 1997 Zimbabwe 1998 Zimbabwe 1999 Zimbabwe 1999 Namibia, Botswana, Zambia--vacation 2000 Australia 2002 South Africa 2003 South Africa 2003 Zimbabwe 2005 South Africa 2005 Zimbabwe 2006 Tanzania 2006 Zimbabwe--vacation 2007 Zimbabwe--vacation 2008 Zimbabwe 2012 Australia 2013 South Africa 2013 Zimbabwe 2013 Australia 2016 Zimbabwe 2017 Zimbabwe 2018 South Africa 2018 Zimbabwe--vacation 2019 South Africa 2019 Botswana 2019 Zimbabwe vacation 2021 South Africa 2021 South Africa (2nd hunt a month later) ______________________________ | |||
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Opus1, that will be applicable to all African countries and most 3rd world countries. Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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I call BS on those statistics. http://m.news24.com/news24/MyN...-or-fiction-20130520 | |||
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LAL, this is the last I will say on this matter, if RSA is such a bad place feel free to leave, NO one is forcing you to live here, and regarding the wrong neighbourhood thing, most of the school shootings university shootings cinema shootings IN THE USA were also in good neighbourhoods I rest my case... I am going to have a drink now with my Clients that just finished A great safari GOOD NIGHT. Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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+ 1 Very true ! | |||
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+1 more...maybe Mike Jines will see that I am not the only one that sees these facts. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Saeed, I actually have a traveling friend who I traveled Europe with in school, that has an almost exact story from Northern Ireland in 2004, Belfast to be exact. Except he was dead drunk, but the cops that picked him up didn't care, they were way more concerned with getting him back to his hostel safely. | |||
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It is offensive when you refer to black people as savages and parasites. You have a sickness, worse than cancer. It is called racism. There is no cure. Take you and your friends that agree with you to another forum where you can entertain each other with your BS | |||
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I love South Africa, of course. But it surely is a different part of the world security wise ... Long ago, on my first safari in 1977 someone sadly told my wife that I would be killed on my trip ... several trips later over the years I remember staying in a high end hotel in Johannesburg .. everyone warned me not to be out after dark. And that I would be killed.. Interesting ... I didn't take any chances ... On another hunting trip in the Free State ... when the South Africans had put their shotguns away and were about to drive home to assorted cities .. they seemed to all strap on handguns ... Sigh ... it all breaks my savage heart ... I have never gone to Africa (14 or 15 safaris) to visit cities or towns .. I went to hunt and see the wild game and wild places ... So sad that the wonderful folks that I hunted with have that ongoing concern ... | |||
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The white murder number is no where near 70K since 1994. The total murder number in South Africa is near 350K since 1994. http://africacheck.org/reports...g-killed-like-flies/ Some of there stats are extrapolation But I bet white south african murder rate as a % is below black by a significant %. No where near 70K whites have been killed in South Africa by murder. From the Africacheck.org report: White death in a time of democracy “Whites are far less likely to be murdered than their black or coloured counterparts,” Lizette Lancaster, who manages the Institute for Security Studies crime and justice hub, told Africa Check. This is supported by an analysis of a national sample of 1378 murder dockets conducted by police in 2009. In 86.9% of the cases, the victims were Africans. Whites accounted for 1.8% of the cases (although whites make up 8.85% of the population). According to Lancaster official police statistics show that between April 1994 and March 2012 a total of 361 015 people were murdered in South Africa. Applying the 1.8% figure, it would mean that roughly 6,498 whites have been murdered since April 1994. Even if there were some variation on the 1.8% figure, the number of white murder victims would still fail to come anywhere close to filling a soccer stadium. The fact is that whites are less likely to be murdered than any other race in South Africa. The current murder rate of white South Africans is also equivalent to, or lower than, murder rates for whites recorded between 1979 and 1991. According to the 2011/12 SAPS annual report, Lancaster said,“only about 16% of murders occurred during the commission of another crime, mainly aggravated robbery. About 65% of murders started off as assaults due to interpersonal arguments and fuelled by alcohol and/or drugs, result[ing] in a murder”. The vast majority of murders are, she said,“social fabric crimes often perpetrated by friends or loved ones”. The 2012 Victims of Crime Survey confirmed this assertion, stating that 16.1% of victims were “murdered by unknown people from outside their residential area” with an additional 10.9% of “murders … committed by known perpetrators outside [the victims’] residential area”, and the balance of homicides committed by community members, spouses and friends or acquaintances. Even if the proportion of “outsider” crime was doubled for white homicide victims, this would still fall drastically short of the “77.3%” of white murders that Hofmeyr appears to claim are at the hands of black perpetrators. ________________________________________________ I don't like extrapolation but I bet 70K whites in a population of 4.5 mil. were not killed. That would be just under 2% of white population !!! Mike | |||
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Thanks Cal for expanding and expounding on my original thoughts and perceptions on this. Larry Sellers SCI(International)Life Member R8 Blaser Sabatti "trash" Double Shooter
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Expat, thanks for your insightful comments. Unfortunately you couldn't be further from the truth. I have quite a few black friends in SA and Namibia. They themselves refer to the animals killing each other as savages and far, far worse. But I will take into account your comments will all the consideration that they deserve. It's something like this  and a lot like this  with a little of this  ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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Sir, there are savages of all races, nationalities, and religions. Yes,there are most certainly savages in the RSA. There are savages here. You are the one who thought the comment applied to all blacks. I never did. | |||
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 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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+1 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ J. Lane Easter, DVM A born Texan has instilled in his system a mind-set of no retreat or no surrender. I wish everyone the world over had the dominating spirit that motivates Texans.– Billy Clayton, Speaker of the Texas House No state commands such fierce pride and loyalty. Lesser mortals are pitied for their misfortune in not being born in Texas.— Queen Elizabeth II on her visit to Texas in May, 1991. | |||
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Yep - just look at Baltimore, MD at this very moment!!! | |||
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Maybe opus can explain who or what Apartheid kept at bay. Who are the "savages" he refers to? In what way was ending Apartheid a mistake? Who "took over" and what did they "take over"? Who are "they" | |||
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It is called the modern trend. Lower everyone to the level of the lowest denominator. Sadly, this is a sickness that is going around the world right now. A violent criminals gets a suspended sentence, bankers who steal millions, get a warning, an individual who has been working hard all his life, and does not pay $10,000 tax is sent to jail for a couple of years!!  | |||
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"They" are currently burning and looting and killing in Baltimore MD. There is a common theme it seems. And it is spreading
White Mountains Arizona | |||
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Yep and by design in this country. The Administration has been fanning the flames of wealth and class disparity and a race war is exactly what they want. Seems to be a global theme with the Progressives. ___________________ Just Remember, We ALL Told You So. | |||
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If you want to bring the liberal/progressives out of the woodwork, post a response such as this on your local newspaper's website and see how it works for you. Most of my money I spent on hunting and fishing. The rest I just wasted | |||
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Thank you for the kind words gentleman. If we had to leave Texas would indeed be my first chioce! | |||
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http://m.timeslive.co.za/local/?articleId=14645973 | |||
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Thanks EXPAT. You seem very up to date !! | |||
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They are already out of the woodwork as far as I can tell
White Mountains Arizona | |||
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Unfortunately that is exactly what is happening ,worldwide, Saeed Hunting is not a matter of life or death....It's much more important | |||
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I got the following message from a Zimbo I know who now resides in the RSA: Never. These people have in 22 years taken this country into the third world! With less service delivery, more murder, white genocide & the crushing of industry, agric, currency & infrastructure, with NOTHING BUT help, aid, assistance, no war on, no sanctions. Goddamn thieving, lying, murdering corrupt vertical termites. Yup, sounds real good over there. | |||
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MR Shores,It SOUNDS A lot better than 99% of all African Countries the middle east and lots of other places in the world, can we now please stop this about our country, there are problems in most counties ... hell you guys should know that very well... Once again if anybody that lives here does not feel save and don't want to live here the world is a big place! O one more thing with all of this so called unrest and xenophobia only 7 illegals died. Hell more people die every morning talking on there cell phones in traffic in any big City. Once again book with a reputable outfitter check references and area being hunted. " I still have to see my first hunting concession or ranch in A township or slump or down town Johannesburg were most of this has taken place" Lets be more positive about the future of this country please! I will remain proudly South African! Phillip du Plessis www.intrepidsafaris.com info@intrepidsafaris.co.za +27 83 633 5197 US cell 817 793 5168 | |||
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+1
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Our politicians and bureaucrats really frown upon petty thievery. If however, you happen to steal very large sums, and are a political donor to the select party, well... now they recognize you as an equal and to be accorded all the privileges of the elite class. | |||
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