Deleted. I am told they are going to work on it.
.

Has your deposit been returned?

Truly Larry, that is a crying shame. I am so sorry for Mary Lynn. They just went on my Black List.

You've got to be shitting me Larry!

No client booking should ever be treated that way whether returning or not......... bloody bad form.

Are they askng you to change dates, or to get lost?

In either case, extremely unprofessional....as well as unappreciative.

That's really poor treatment..even of it was your first time and never spent a dime there before you still deserve better than that!

Too many places in Africa that run a clean ship to deal with that BS...scratch that place off the list

Who is running Sango these days? Same people?

Most of my hunts are done on a handshake and you as Gentleman do not deserve to be treated like that.

If you would like I could suggest a few fine hunting destinations and camps here in Zambia which would be ideally suited for your wife.

Pardon my ignorance but who should we avoid?

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
It is not the PH nor the booking agent. It is the management of Sango, Dave Goosen. I am told that he is the one.

Yes, some alternative dates were offered. My life is hectic. There are certain times of the year that I work seven days a week for weeks on end. The alternative dates simply did not work . This is why i booked the dates early and did not book my traditional July Argentina duck hunt.

There are a few operations in Sango. Do you mean this one?

http://www.sango-wildlife.com/staff.php Operated by David and Cheryl Goosen

Pity. I do believe that there is often something to the old saying familiarity breeds contempt . . . contempt may be too strong a term, complacency might be more apt. Stated another way, I definitely get the sense that some outfitters are so keen to get the next client they take for granted existing clients. Hope you get it sorted Larry.

The proper thing would have been for a discussion to see if you would be flexible rather than just a cancelation. At least make an attempt to work it out.

Sad to hear.

Look at Zambia Larry, especially if you have never been.

An email to the owner(s) about the GM from everyone here on AR may wake things up a bit.
Address?
Cal
PS. This may happen more than we know. About 10 years ago a Zim PH booked a fellow Alaska hunter on a hippo and croc hunt. The PH dropped him as he had a chance for a more expensive hunt that could only be done on the same dates (elephant and buffalo). While the AK gent was refuned for the hunt, he still had to contend with non refundable air tickets and other reservations, time off work, etc.

Greed is a very bad disease.There is so much in the world today.Trophy fees doubling, daily rates skyrocketing etc...I won't get into it.

Just to be clear...with regards to your original question. NO client should be treated that way regardless of prior business.

Not trying to cast stones, but was maybe the booking agent at fault? Hadn't they dealt with Sango before?

If you go to the website you can book rooms online and they take credit cards...

Larry:
You are a gentleman of honor. Stay the course as you see fit.
Cal

They are off my list.

Very bad style. I would not go there and I am sure your wife would enjoy other high grade camps e.g. Zambia also. Thank you for drawing the attention to it.

Larry that is a shit sandwich of a deal no one should be treated that way

Without more information from Sango and this outfitter, from what I have read here so far, I too would never book with them, or advise any of my safari hunting friends to either.

I have only been on 7 safaris in Africa, but I can tell you that Andrew Baldry has been the most honorable man I have met and dealt with so far. Because of things like this that Larry is going through, I asked for a contract with Andrew on my first safari with him and he said he only did business on a handshake. I was initially very hesitant to conduct business this way, but decided to trust in his AR reputation that I read on this forum. I'm glad I did. He promised me a Leopard hunt if Zambia would OK them in 2014. Zambia did not, but I went anyway to hunt other Zambian game I wanted. Andrew had other lucrative offers for his first Leopard license in 2015 when Zambia opened Leopard hunting. Instead of taking those offers, he emailed me and told me he finally had my Leopard license ready for my 2015 hunt. Andrew found me a fabulous cat. That is an honorable man.

Once again Andrew, thank you.

Larry, I'm sorry this has happened to you. If you decide to go to Zambia instead, I can highly recommend Andrew Baldry and his Royal Kafue.

Good luck with this dishonorable outfitter. I wish for you a good resolution (if it can be done). You certainly deserve it from your past business with them.

Sorry to read this Larry. I guess they felt that 17 supersedes two. IMHO, that's a big mistake on their part. One should never break a contract, but if unforeseen circumstances create such a break, then everything within their control should be done to right the problem. Obviously they think otherwise. There are numerous destinations to replace Sango, and some are upscale. I'm sure there are a few that would meet your wife's approval, but damn those who scorn a woman.

Well, I see both sides of this. A group of 17 is hard to pass up, in an industry that claims thin margins. And, as much as we make these "leave as friends" relationships, these are business dealings, and it is bad to mix business with friends usually.

If they have not gone out of their way to accommodate you in some way on other dates, or another location in the SAVE, then poor form on them.

OTOH, the two previous hunts at Sango were with a different operator, so loyalty should not apply here. Under new management so to speak.

Still, terrible to treat a potential client like this in a customer service industry, especially an industry so small, and with so many interconnected networks. Treating Larry poorly, might do more future damage, than the group of 17 will return now.

Either way a shit show for sure.

Larry
I am not sure if Mozambique would work. But take a look at Kambako.
It is a first class spot.
The hunting is first class as is the lodge and camp.They even have a infinity pool in the main lodge.

Glad to hear they are working to accommodate you and your bride. Hope you both can make the trip.

Well, as I said earlier, "without more informtion from Sango"...

Sounds like perhaps there is more info coming from them.

Hope this gets resolved satisfactorily for Larry and his wife.

Just for the sake of specific info...what would be some other lodges that equal or exceed Sango around Africa?

quote:

Originally posted by Heym 450/400:
Just for the sake of specific info...what would be some other lodges that equal or exceed Sango around Africa?

That would be a 5 star lodge with a very high chance getting the big four in a normal 3 week safari, hard to find that these days. Like Bubye its a fenced conservancy (at least most parts). Hammond, Humani, ARDA, Mokore, Sango etc are all within the SVC but Sangos camp seems just most upscaled at least from photos.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Deleted. I am told they are going to work on it.
.

I have no idea what the original post was.

But I am assuming it was a change of an agreed on date for the safari.

If I was in your place, I would tell them to go fly a bloody kite!

In today's market, one can book almost any convenient date if he looks hard enough.

The big question is, why treat a client, any client, like this.

Makes me so happy dealing with one family since 1982.

quote:

Originally posted by A.Dahlgren:

quote:

Originally posted by Heym 450/400:
Just for the sake of specific info...what would be some other lodges that equal or exceed Sango around Africa?

That would be a 5 star lodge with a very high chance getting the big four in a normal 3 week safari, hard to find that these days. Like Bubye its a fenced conservancy (at least most parts). Hammond, Humani, ARDA, Mokore, Sango etc are all within the SVC but Sangos camp seems just most upscaled at least from photos.

Interesting to note they do not even hint on hunting on their website?

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Deleted. I am told they are going to work on it.
.

Larry,

Did they decide to "work on it" before or after your post here &/or Facebook?

Bigger question, would they be so accommodating had you not gone public?

Let's put it this way . There has been a huge uproar created in Zim over this. I have a lot of friends in Zim. Some of those asked that it be worked on privately. If anyone really wants to give me any grief, I will post the e mail chain in chronological order and let everyone make up their own mind.

quote:

Interesting to note they do not even hint on hunting on their website?

Agreed Andrew. My feeling is that they like the hunters money, but like to pretend its not part of their conservation program.

quote:

Originally posted by TGDjr:
Well, I see both sides of this. A group of 17 is hard to pass up, in an industry that claims thin margins. And, as much as we make these "leave as friends" relationships, these are business dealings, and it is bad to mix business with friends usually.

Its not hard to pass up the group. You do the right thing. Period. Regardless who the client is. If you don't , then what you're saying is " I'm for sale , my word is no good "

Larry,what kind of trip will you have when people around you there will despise you for bringing this issue out? That is what I dislike about giving deposits especially large ones.You send a deposit to book a hunt then the outfitter changes things on you-what is on quota, area,shoots everything before you get there...

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Larry,what kind of trip will you have when people around you there will despise you for bringing this issue out? That is what I dislike about giving deposits especially large ones.You send a deposit to book a hunt then the outfitter changes things on you-what is on quota, area,shoots everything before you get there...

To be fair shootaway Zimbabwe has experienced a lot of problems of late and the hunting operators are simply trying to make a plan to accommodate you and others.

If your priority animals are not available or you feel short changed then simply take it up with the operator or make reference to the contract.

A formal complaint on AR also seems to work well.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Larry,what kind of trip will you have when people around you there will despise you for bringing this issue out? That is what I dislike about giving deposits especially large ones.You send a deposit to book a hunt then the outfitter changes things on you-what is on quota, area,shoots everything before you get there...

To be fair shootaway Zimbabwe has experienced a lot of problems of late and the hunting operators are simply trying to make a plan to accommodate you and others.

If your priority animals are not available or you feel short changed then simply take it up with the operator or make reference to the contract.

A formal complaint on AR also seems to work well.

We all experience problems not just Zimbabwe.
From what was stated in the original post,is that the client was upset because the date he booked for him and his wife was given to someone else because their hunting party was much larger (17).

I would hate to have to hunt an area that had just been hunted by a party of 17. Might be a bit disturbed or in some cases shot out, don't you think?