My plan A when I decided to go for a Dall ram, was to put in for the draw only areas TOK and 14C.
I didn't get drawn and went with plan B and booked with an outfitter who had an exclusive federal area in the ANWR,
located in the Brooks Range.

Larry,
Congrats on taking 3 of the 4 wild sheep.
I have no desire to offend and, admittedly, have no knowledge of sheep hunting in Alaska.

I got hooked on sheep hunting in Canada starting in 1980 and have been on 3 Dall hunts and 1 Stone hunt. All very successful.

The place to go is with Arctic Red Outfitters in NWT. You'll never see another hunter. Period.

As usual, just my 2 cents.
Zeke

Here is the info for Matt Synder and his mom and step dad. http://tokmanagementarea.com/

Just an FYI, the TMA sheep numbers are down drastically in the past two year. The weather has really taken a toll on all classifications of sheep. Lambs have been hit pretty hard. We are in the process of discussing a decrease in permit #'s, but are going to wait until we can gather all the data before making a decision. If we have another tough winter/spring, it won't be good. There are places that lost between 40 and 50% of sheep. The big May snow we had in areas really hurt after a winter with mid winter rain and then a winter that wouldn't end. Sheep numbers are down, just a fact.

just my two cents.

for the last two years in the area that surrounding Whitehorse we had rain and freezing rain in the fall and in the spring so of course it affects the lams but not only them ...

the other stuff you have to be aware is on the outfitter area this is not private nor for Yukon nor the NWT there will be hunters non residents only with the outfit you booked but the residents are present and there is more and more going after sheep. there is more areas where the draw is the rule so there are more encounters going in the place where the outfitters are and no drawing up to now ... it s unique in NA that most of the sheep are taken now by non residents and there is more and more locals un happy about that ... it happens two times this year that we met non residents with GO that were not aware that locals can still hunt and without a guide (of course the GO knew lol). better to know that being sorry ....

Sounds like the die off is a real concern.

I had an Alaskan guide recommend that I go to Canada to hunt sheep due to the die off.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Sounds like the die off is a real concern.

I had an Alaskan guide recommend that I go to Canada to hunt sheep due to the die off.

Larry,

we had the same problems as they have. the hunting pressure is in some places less maybe but still ... for Dall there are still good places to go for but you have to do a lot of homeworks and dont take for granted reports made by some that dont pay their hunts .... and what is good one year maybe not good the next one ...

in Canada there is a lot of new outfitters just started this year and we re talking about sheep hunting, will you go there just because a TV show say so with no other backgrounds even if the territory is good and the outfitters had good experience in the past as a guide in different places ...

i repeat it do your homework, contact local biologists and speak with the outfitters and past clients then you ll start to have an idea but i wont guarantee a sheep of course ...

Larry
I would forget Alaska and head to NWT like others have suggested. Call Jim or Clay Lancaster at Nahanni Butte Outfitters. You will get a GOOD sheep. Take a look at Clay Lancasters facebook page and you can see some of the big sheep they got last year. I have hunted with them twice and I couldn't be happier with the results.
Good luck

Well it's true ther has been some loss of yews and lambs in the past few years.
I just talked with one of the game biologist in McGrath. He confirmed that report the official analysis is the ram population did not change much. Since rams need to be full curl taking 7 to 8 years to develope the big effect is down the road in 5 to 6 years. Their harvest estimate for 2014 sheep on the west slope indicates about the same as the past 2 to 3 years. Their last game survey was this past spring.
So don't give up on Alaska just yet, by that time most areas will be a draw anyways.
It would be nice to hunt Yukon and NWT but most guys can't foot the 20 to 25 K
Just my 2 cents
I am glad I have harvested mine a few years ago.
Larry looking forward to seeing you in sheep camp.
Larry

My plan is to put in for TOK and 14C (with Lance) and then look to NWT or the Yukon as a backup probably with one of these outfits

Arctic Red River
nahanni Butte
Bonnet Plume
McKenzie Mountain

Is it the use of helicopters that make the
hunts in the Yukon and NWT so much more expensive?

I personally didn't want a helicopter involved in my sheep hunt, that's why I went with one of the few outfitters that are licensed to hunt in the ANWR on the north slope.

I met a guy at the sheep show that guided NWT that also used to guide in the Yukon. And he explained that the price does vary in how you want to hunt sheep there whether by Helicopter, airplane, horseback,or the ole' hard earned way of hiking in (depending on Area). Either way, your still paying more than U.S. Prices. In fact, you could almost do two sheep hunts in AK for the price of one in the NWT.
I don't care for the helicopter method myself, that's way too easy. If I'm not able to climb the mountain to some degree to pursue my ram, then I have no business hunting them.

Dog Man, you made a good choice, ANWR is a great area, theres still alot of rams....did the die off affect sheep hunting this past season ?, YES...but so did the weather during the opener for many hunters. However,there's still good ones in there, your outfitter (I assume) along with yourself will probably have to work your butts off to get on some good ones.
I have two sheep on the wall, that come out of ANWR a 37" and a 36" both are special to me as one was taken while I hunted with my 10 year old son, and the other was with Brett, whom at the time took his first very own dall ram, special to me because I got to be a part of it. The Brooks is a special place, to be on top of the world in some remote country, where you have the opportunity at also Grizzly, caribou, and wolf, and a chance to view musk ox in their natural environment makes it all worth it.
Good luck to you and I can't wait to hear about it when you do the hunt report...take a lot of pics.

quote:

Originally posted by Dog Man:
Is it the use of helicopters that make the
hunts in the Yukon and NWT so much more expensive?

I personally didn't want a helicopter involved in my sheep hunt, that's why I went with one of the few outfitters that are licensed to hunt in the ANWR on the north slope.

Some outfitters do use helicopters in the NWT but definitely not all. There are still some great old fashioned sheep hunts on horseback or by backpack in the NWT. I think prices are higher because of the remote nature of most operations and the cost of keeping camps serviced, the low hunter numbers and the high quality of sheep and high success rates. Helicopter hunts are not permitted in the Yukon.

Let me ask a stupid question. Perhaps I am missing something here.

What is the difference between flying in on a Super Cub versus flying in on a helicopter?

Not to be sarcastic....a big difference, ones fixed wing the other is rotory...

Most supercubs will land on an airstrip or river bed somewhat close where some effort is still needed to climb a mountain, where as a helicopter can land just about on any flat small surface high atop the mountain. Or for that matter hover to spot a ram, and land nearby , only to pursue it the next day from high above.
Yes perhaps, some can land a supercub on on about 25 feet of flat surface due to their STOL capability and experience, but the conditions have to be perfect, the plane have not much load, etc etc...basically you almost have endless possibillities with a helicopter rather limited with a cub.

Larry
Three main differences
A helicopter could land almost anyplace without a runway
Next they are illegal in Alaska
Next they are not hampered as much with wind and rain
Larry

Larry
Also a helicopter is about $1500 to $2000 per hour
Forgot that point
Larry

Last time I checked prices for Alaska vs NWT I think Alaska was around $14k for the hunt I wanted. Nahanni Butte in NWT is $19.5 and that includes the helicopter. What is really expensive on a sheep hunt is going twice and not seeing legal sheep.

You could easily spend well into the low to mid 20K for a dall hunt in the NWT, some outfits offer the Helicopter for $3500 more. The price goes up a little every year, everyone knows that. they go up here in AK too, but I still see some dall hunts offered at $11000- 12000 with smaller outfits that can afford to do just a few a year. There's alot of other additional charges to hunting Canada, my buddy from Wyoming took a took a B&C stone in was sharged $5K for kill fee, so if you choose to hunt outside the U.S. be sure and make the outfitter tell you everything so you don't get slapped with surprizes in the end.

Somebody chime in
I have hunted a bunch in the past 52 years but seems like the demand on hunting has changed.
What makes hunting ALSAKA different than any other big game state? What I am referring to is harvests.
For example most states record a per cent of harvest to license holders and not any state I have seen comes anywhere close to 100% sucess in their harvest reports.
So is it damming of an area or outfitter or guide if he meets the average harvest? Or is the thinking now if I pay big bucks I MUST be rewarded with a harvest? Gosh guys in Africa after many types of big game are unsuccessful some time 2 or 3 trips. It's hunting.
I know Larry has been on a couple unsuccessful hunts no harvest and I think bad weather on some and it hurts when you go home empty handed. I have and plenty of you guys have.
I am only saying I hope we don't get to running areas and outfitters down if there performance is good or excellent but there is no harvest. I have been on a few high dollar elk hunts and deer hunts that were great hunts but no harvest. We need to think why we are hunting and if the point is 100% harvest you need to be thinking game farms. Like South Africa.
Not trying to beat anybody up but how many think the expectations of the hunt now are raised to a level that may not be able to be maintained by any outfitter.
Thanks guys
See you in Dallas
Larry

One other thing
Most outfitter won't really tell you on sheep hunts how many hunters actually bag their hunt. Some just can't do the hunt it's tough in some cases. I have seen in the past 3 years in sheep camp at least 2 in each season that just give up or quit walking or stay in the tent. That goes against the outfitters sucess ratio. I have seen it happen.
Oh well this is basically for all the sheep outfitters in Alaska not just our camp.
Byes
Larry

quote:

Originally posted by AKsheephunter:
You could easily spend well into the low to mid 20K for a dall hunt in the NWT, some outfits offer the Helicopter for $3500 more. The price goes up a little every year, everyone knows that. they go up here in AK too, but I still see some dall hunts offered at $11000- 12000 with smaller outfits that can afford to do just a few a year. There's alot of other additional charges to hunting Canada, my buddy from Wyoming took a took a B&C stone in was sharged $5K for kill fee, so if you choose to hunt outside the U.S. be sure and make the outfitter tell you everything so you don't get slapped with surprizes in the end.

If you shop around or get yourself on cancellation lists it's not uncommon to do an NWT hunt for the same price as Alaska or even less and even at full price you are still under $20k for the majority of them.

quote:

Originally posted by AKsheephunter:

I don't care for the helicopter method myself, that's way too easy. If I'm not able to climb the mountain to some degree to pursue my ram, then I have no business hunting them.

Dog Man, you made a good choice, ANWR is a great area, theres still alot of rams....did the die off affect sheep hunting this past season ?, YES...but so did the weather during the opener for many hunters. However,there's still good ones in there, your outfitter (I assume) along with yourself will probably have to work your butts off to get on some good ones.
I have two sheep on the wall, that come out of ANWR a 37" and a 36" both are special to me as one was taken while I hunted with my 10 year old son, and the other was with Brett, whom at the time took his first very own dall ram, special to me because I got to be a part of it. The Brooks is a special place, to be on top of the world in some remote country, where you have the opportunity at also Grizzly, caribou, and wolf, and a chance to view musk ox in their natural environment makes it all worth it.
Good luck to you and I can't wait to hear about it when you do the hunt report...take a lot of pics.

Chuck,
I hunted and posted my report on the same page as yours and Brett's hunt back in August 2011.

Dog man,

Yes I remember now You hunted with Glacier Mountain Outfitters, and took a beauty of a ram !!!
So your headin' back up again, sweet. I'll be looking forward on reading about your hunt and seeing the pics.

Chuck

Gentlemen:

I have decided to go to the NWT for a variety of reasons. Thanks for all your help.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Gentlemen:

I have decided to go to the NWT for a variety of reasons. Thanks for all your help.

good luck and hope your hunt will be the one you re looking for.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Gentlemen:

I have decided to go to the NWT for a variety of reasons. Thanks for all your help.

Good luck to you as well Larry,although a ways away, Can't wait to hear about your hunt and see the pics as you complete a great milestone in your sheep hunting adventures.

Chuck

Hi Larry

I was always interested in trying a sheep hunt, up till the time I had booked my Dull hunt all I was interested in was Africa and Double Rifles,

Being a South African I was very cock sure of if its not from Africa its not a real hunt,

I did my home work and spoke to many of my clients that are sheep hunters and came to the conclusion that if I was to be trying this sheep hunting thing, I must at least put my self in an area that I would have a shooting change,

I booked with Stan Stevens in the NWT for Dall Moose and caribou,

I went to SCI bought all the bloody mountain hunting gear, felt like a real tool as I knew I was getting my self into something I new nothing about,

to make a long story short, I went to the NWT, I convinced 2 of my SA hunting friends to join in and after 2 weeks in the mountains we all harvested fantastic rams, we each shot moose over 60" and had fun hunting caribou in the valleys as well,

Stan is a great outfitter and has great guides working for him, he looks after his area well and does not over shoot his quota,

If I were you look at one of the NWT Outfitters,

I am hooked on sheep hunting now and look forward to my Stone hunt in BC in 2015,

Larry,
I enjoy watching you on a couple of Aaron Neilsons videos shooting elephant. Larry take it from me a 15 year long alaskan who has harvested numerous fall rams. look up majestic mountain outfitters in the wrangles...

alaska range you have companies like R&R that fly all over looking for sheep then they hunt.

Talkeetna Mountains are just about hunted out.

Chugach range is draw

Tok and Delta are both draw and produce good sheep

Brooks are expensive to get to and sustained a major winter kill last year.

Kenai Mountains.....umm don't even waste your time

ttyl John

Thanks John.

I have booked in the NWT with Arctic Red River Outfitters.

I did meet some Alaskans at SCI that I really liked. I had a long talk with them. I might go with them before I go to the NWT. I wish I could remember the name. I have their papers in my bag.

Larry,

Arctic Red are very good and NWT is pure wilderness ! A memory for life

The Governor's Permit winner hunted with Dan Montgomery in unit 13D last year and took a 42 1/2" X 37" that scored 169 1/2.

I have hunted Sheep in unit 14C with Dan Montgomery 3 times and spent more days in the field hunting sheep with him than any other customer he has had to date.

I just drew my fourth Sheep tag and expect to go once again with Dan in August. If you have any questions about his operation or unit 14C, you are welcome to PM me.

What 14C tag do you have? .....Wifey drew 14C again this year, I'm playing sherpa again.

quote:

Originally posted by AKsheephunter:
What 14C tag do you have? .....Wifey drew 14C again this year, I'm playing sherpa again.

Unit 13D DS 265 outside the Park, Tazlina.

Good luck to your team. Post some photos upon your return.

Any new Clothing come out lately you would recommend? I have not went for sheep since 2009. I am sure new things have come out since then.

quote:

Originally posted by Cold Zero:


Any new Clothing come out lately you would recommend? I have not went for sheep since 2009. I am sure new things have come out since then.

Check out Kuiu, same guy who made Sitka sold to Gore and started Kuiu. I have both Sitka Gear and Kuiu, Kuiu is better IMO. Functionality it's close, but the Kuiu is better quality and cheaper because they don't sell through retailers.

Greg

quote:

Originally posted by Greg Brownlee:

quote:

Originally posted by Cold Zero:


Any new Clothing come out lately you would recommend? I have not went for sheep since 2009. I am sure new things have come out since then.

Check out Kuiu, same guy who made Sitka sold to Gore and started Kuiu. I have both Sitka Gear and Kuiu, Kuiu is better IMO. Functionality it's close, but the Kuiu is better quality and cheaper because they don't sell through retailers.

Greg

That plus all underlayers Merino Wool

So Larry are your claws doing as us and making climbing in the mountains before even the snow is gone lol ...
Phil

14C or Tok with Lance Kronberger, or Tok or Delta with Matt Snyder. I hunted the Talkeetnas in 2005 with Troy Kitchel and had success, but I'm not sure how the population there is these days. Not sure about the Wrangells or Alaska Range either. The Brooks had major winter kill last year. I'd call Deltana as they're probably in the Brooks.

If I went to NWT, I'd pick, in no particular order Arctic Red River, Nahanni Butte or Bonnet Plume.

I leave in late August for Arctic Red River.

Have fun. I came to the same conclusion as you. It is more expensive, but the animals are there.

I learned that you get what you pay for and to go where "they" are.

I also agree on the use of planes and helicopters - flying is flying no matter the method. Same as grand transport - truck. ATV or horses - transport is transport.

If you think using planes or choppers is wrong, then you may want to walk from Anchorage to your hunting camp. How do you think the outfitters get material transported? They often use the flight time to scout as well.

Three of us went to the NWT in 08 and all three shot sheep. They weren't monsters but decent dalls.
We went on a horseback hunt. I doubt that I walked two miles on that hunt and it was eight days. Also we shot mountain caribou for an extra trophy fee.