I'm one of the RH guys kicked to the curb earlier I see now that RH guys may be able to participate again

Tomorrow AM I'm going over to the shop of my long time friend and hunting partner of over two decades. He's a big player Guild member and long time FFL. I'll run the Peter/Denmark deal by him and see what he says. As far as my thinking goes:

The official US importer only involves the purchasing of firearms directly from the Zastava factory to be imported directly into the United States. These are then sold to the market through this US importer.

Peter is talking about something different. Peter is doing the same thing at his location as the US importer is doing in Florida. The guns go to Peter from Zastava and they are Peter's to sell. The US importer has neither a say in this nor any rights to Peter's dealings. I will find out tommorrow, but you will need an FFL in your home state to receive a gun from the US Importer out of FLA in the original deal. So more than likely, every last one of you will need to use a different FFL for that part of the deal. So it should not be that big of a deal to have this same FFL receive a firearm directly from Peter/Denmark. If this is the case, you may not need a separate FFL/Importer to receive a crate full of guns.

I'll find out tomorrow the requirments for an individual FFL holder to receive a gun from Peter, but if it ends up that some form of special FFL/Importer is required to receive the full crate of rifles at one time, I'll ask about the fees involved.

If my thinking is correct on this subject, it may end up an easier process if your own personal chosen FFL can receive one or two rifles from Peter directly without kicking-in all the mess involved in having one guy receive 30+ guns, and then still having to ship the guns to your personal FFLs.

Later :_

I found this with a quick search:

A licensed dealer may make an occasional importation of a firearm for a non-licensee or for the licensee’s personal use (not for resale). The licensee must first submit an ATF Form 6, Part I to ATF for approval. The licensee may then present the approved Form 6 and completed ATF Form 6A to U.S. Customs and Border Protection.

I'll ask tomorrow.

later

thank you, Gary. Looking forward to your response.

I was correct.

Bottom line, either deal, everyone will need their own home state FFL person to receive the firearm for transfer, so you are going to need to find an FFL and you will end up paying the taxes to that FFL holder.

Reference Peter's deal, any FFL can import a firearm from Peter, you do not need an importer such as USSG in FLA. You will be purchasing the firearm from Peter and he will send it with his export license. Your home state FFL who is receiving the firearm will use a Form 6 Part 1 to request permission from the ATF to import the rifle. The ATF will give permission and then a Form 6A is used for the home state FFL to receive the firearm. Every FFL holder is allowed to do this "occasional importation" without the requirments to be licensed as an importer.

He showed me his books going back for 10 years, the process appears to average about 2 months from the time you send the ATF Form 6 Part 1 until you have the 6A to receive the firearm. The firearm is delivered directly to the FFL. On his paperwork, he showed no additional fees other than the standard taxes. There were only the two pages of additonal paperwork over and above a normal transfer. Both of the forms were very simple.

He gave me permission to use him if I should decide to make such an import purchase at no cost, other than I pay for the firearm.

To add insult to injury, he went into his safe and showed me one of his very first rifle builds from when he was a young man back in the 50s. It was an FN Mauser built in a pre-war pattern like Peter was talking about. The rifle still looked great, and for a brief moment I thought he was going to give it to me as a gift. But he laughed and said that was his first rifle so he's going to keep it.

later

very informative, Gary. Thanks!

I'd be curious to hear where the group stands on this issue?

I haven't been paying attention to this thread and just read the part about Peter ordering guns, then exporting them to the US. It is true that individual dealers may occasionally import guns using a form 6. I've done it, but when I did it, from England, the gun was shipped via Royal mail and was placed into the USPS in this country. My total shipping cost was 30 pounds. Now I think practically all gun imports are shipped by air. I wonder what the shipping cost would be per gun to do the shipping to several FFL holders today. I think it would be considerably less expensive in shipping to have all guns shipped to one location in the US and have them shipped to FFL holders from there. I know of two importers who might handle a shipment of all the guns, and the guns could be placed in an airfreight container by Peter and shipped to Dulles or BWI airport where the importer would pick them up and deal with customs.

I would like one of the LH 7X57s with the Rigby style stock if this can be pulled off.

quote:

Originally posted by Vol717:
I haven't been paying attention to this thread and just read the part about Peter ordering guns, then exporting them to the US. It is true that individual dealers may occasionally import guns using a form 6. I've done it, but when I did it, from England, the gun was shipped via Royal mail and was placed into the USPS in this country. My total shipping cost was 30 pounds. Now I think practically all gun imports are shipped by air. I wonder what the shipping cost would be per gun to do the shipping to several FFL holders today. I think it would be considerably less expensive in shipping to have all guns shipped to one location in the US and have them shipped to FFL holders from there. I know of two importers who might handle a shipment of all the guns, and the guns could be placed in an airfreight container by Peter and shipped to Dulles or BWI airport where the importer would pick them up and deal with customs.

I would like one of the LH 7X57s with the Rigby style stock if this can be pulled off.

While this would be nice to get a third party importer to handle it, what would be the charge for importing and shipping the guns to seperate FFL's? If this can be done without to much expense it would be great.

The advantage to the original plan is that the costs and importing paperwork is done and we know all the costs.

I'm in for whatever the group wants to do, I just want to get one.

Any updates?

Decided to scratch my itch with one of the LH SS MRC that the fella had for sale in Abilene.
(.35 Whelen)

gentlemen,

i have no updates as i stepped back two weeks ago (see above post) to let the group decided how it would proceed. At that time, I suggested we wait until this Friday to make a decision. Some folks spoke up and some remained quiet. I took silence to mean acquiescence.

Frankly, since Peter showed up this cart went off the rails. Peter, if you read this, please note you approached the group and made and offer which attracted attention. In fact, some liked your offering. Where exactly have you gone to?

I still think we could make a decision by this week but again it's a group thing. So, let's hear from the group.

Jeff

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
gentlemen,

i have no updates as i stepped back two weeks ago (see above post) to let the group decided how it would proceed. At that time, I suggested we wait until this Friday to make a decision. Some folks spoke up and some remained quiet. I took silence to mean acquiescence.

Frankly, since Peter showed up this cart went off the rails. Peter, if you read this, please note you approached the group and made and offer which attracted attention. In fact, some liked your offering. Where exactly have you gone to?

I still think we could make a decision by this week but again it's a group thing. So, let's hear from the group.

Jeff

Jeff, as much as I'd like a higher quality gun it would make for a lot more work on the individual buyers and their FFLs to do it.

I think that in the group buy if we go with the intial arrangement it would simplify everything and get it going. My big fear is that any more delay will see people dropping off the list and getting below the 30 gun minimum.

Jeff,

I'm still in per my last PM.

Mart

I am still in for a 375 (original deal)

No offense meant to Peter but it does seem the most realistic transaction is the original one. Having said that I would propose that all originally interested carry thru with the group purchase arrainged by Jeff.

I am standing by awaiting directions on where and when to send what kind of money.

Jeff,

To clarify, no right-handed rifles were allowed to be involved in your original offer, correct? If not, then that automatically eliminates me, unfortunately. If righties can participate, please let me know.

The Higher end rifles are offered in both right and left handed

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
gentlemen,

i have no updates as i stepped back two weeks ago (see above post) to let the group decided how it would proceed. At that time, I suggested we wait until this Friday to make a decision. Some folks spoke up and some remained quiet. I took silence to mean acquiescence.

Frankly, since Peter showed up this cart went off the rails. Peter, if you read this, please note you approached the group and made and offer which attracted attention. In fact, some liked your offering. Where exactly have you gone to?

I still think we could make a decision by this week but again it's a group thing. So, let's hear from the group.

Jeff

My preference would be to go through the US importer as in your original proposal. I don't have high hopes of convincing someone locally to jump through all those hoops for one or two guns.

quote:

Originally posted by Express_Rifles:
The Higher end rifles are offered in both right and left handed

Right, this is my understanding.

However, in Jeff's original proposal (not Peter's), only LH rifles could be ordered per the U.S. importer. What I am interested in knowing is whether RH rifles are available now through Jeff's offer.

I am still in for one LH. I definitely like the idea of better finish and American style stock, if all else is equal. Having spent most of my life working on international deals, I have confidence that Peter should be able to deliver to the US. Agreed, though, that shipping costs need to be compared and we should try to keep it fairly simple, because cross-border deals break down otherwise. My vote is to let some experienced persons decide for all of us what the deal is to be, rather than dither around waiting for everyone to build a consensus. The either you're in or out. Jeff and Peter are doing a favor here. It's not like shopping at Cabela's. <g>

Is this deal alive or dead? I had not ommitted either way. While I like our LH CZ .375's, they are too heavy to make one into a .300 H&H. We could use a left hand Mod 70 STW, but would kinda like to use a Mauser. If Peter's deal were to fly on either suggestion he made, I would use Champlin to bring it in. They have done such for me before.

I have informed EAA that we have reached concensus and have the necessary 30 rifles to fulfill the order and am awaiting his response with details.

quote:

Originally posted by jsl3170:
I have informed EAA that we have reached concensus and have the necessary 30 rifles to fulfill the order and am awaiting his response with details.

Thanks again for all the work Jeff.

I would love to be able to take my 458 as a back up gun to Zim in June.

I take it the original deal is what is going to happen, which is the standard Zastava left hand Mauser for about $600?

EAA is doign the importing but then we would still need to get a local FFL dealer to order this from EAA, is that correct?

Do I still need to PM someone to get in on this?

I sure appreicate the work involved in getting this deal going and keeping it alive through the twists and turns, but I don't want to miss out from an oversight on my part.

Jeff

I am still in for three. I guess at this stage we need a recount based on the original plan?

UPDATE:

I have contacted the US Importer twice this week letting him know we're good and am still awaiting a response. Will try again tomorrow.

Jeff

UPDATE:

Gentlemen,

The US Importer has responded to me and while he has not answered my questions in total he has asked for an updated count. I have only taken into account definitive interest and that alone leaves us now a little shy of the number. But here it is as it stands. I have emailed prospective interest parties for confirmation of interest as well.

Vol717 (1) 7x57

Chopperguy (2) 9.3

Mart (1) 7x57 (1) 9.3

Roscoe (1) 458

470Evans (1) 375 (1) 9.3

505ED (1) 9.3 (1) 375 (1) 458

Elkins45 (1) 7x57

Double D (1) 7x57 (1) 375 (1) 458

Duggaboye (1) 7x57 (2) 375

Max(hms) (2) 375

Scott King (1) 7x57 (1) 375

KKAlaska (1) 7x57

Joe Miller (1) 375 (1) 458

Fjold (1) 458

pksman (1) 375

Let's get everyone to take a look and see what this looks like and hopefully the undecideds will commit and we can get the number to proceed.

Jeff

ps I'll continue to post updates as I receive them.

quote:

KKAlaska (1) 7x57

LH 7 X 57 around $600 (Credit Card payment)

UPDATE

Gentlemen,

Thank you for your interest. I received an email this morning from the US Importer who indicated he will no longer guarantee a delivery date for the rifles and, at this time, is cutting off communications concerning this transaction. He offered no further comment and asked not to be contacted again.

I let him know I will be contacting Zastava directly to share my thoughts concerning this matter as well given many people are interested to bring previously unsolicited business to Zastava.

I suppose given the tone of the Importer's past emails and his untimeliness in replies and his general demeanor this was a risk and yet I continued in an effort to give us Lefties the opportunity to own a LH Mauser actioned rifle at a seemingly reasonable price.

I am truly sorry for any inconvenience this has caused any of you. While I am no longer hopeful for a positive outcome to this situation I will, nevertheless, petition Zastava for the creation of a second US Importer status for their LH products here in the US. In the interest of seeing this through I will post those results when I receive them from Zastava. I can say, though, I have never dealt with such a poor businessman as the guy at EAA.

Jeff

Jeff,

Oh well, it just wasn’t meant to be – at least not this time.

I want to sincerely thank you for your efforts in this, whatever the outcome it certainly was not through lack of persistence on your part.

Jim

That sucks!!! I kind of thought this would happen. I had hopes though!

Ed

Jeff,
Thank you for all the efforts.
Dan

How doggone funny!

Jeff, it was very generous of you to spearhead this effort. Thank you very much and ofcourse If you think I'd be able to assist you in anything Dillingham or Bristol Bay please don't hesitate to ask.

It seems odd to me that the importer isn't interested in making money.

Jeff, I can only echo Scott's comments. I really do appreciate the work you put into this project. I am still hopeful that another importer will be found. Thanks again.

Mart

What a shame. Thank you for all your efforts and please do let us know what comes from your communication with Zasava.

I wonder if a retailer like Cabelas or Gander Mountain would be interested in bring a batch of lefties into the country?

Thanks to all for their efforts.

quote:

asked not to be contacted again.

That there is a classic line for a man who sells items to the retail market.

quote:

Originally posted by J_Zola:

quote:

asked not to be contacted again.

That there is a classic line for a man who sells items to the retail market.

Perhaps he should try a career in the fast food industry.

Unbelievable for a business to be so stupidly run. It does jibe with my previous experiences dealing with EAA on this same subject two years ago, though.


Do we/can we talk to Peterdk about getting in on his deal with Zastava?

You would think that a company that made money on importing guns would not give a rats ass on what side the bolt handle was on as long as there was a market for them once imported.

jsl3170

Thank you for your time and effort.