First thing I'd like to address is the issue of the neighbors not being properly conditioned to the sound of gunfire! This is entirely YOUR FAULT!
I highly recommend you start the conditioning process as soon as possible. An occasional shot fired will go unnoticed and questions will not be asked.

As for "quiet" shooting, you've been given sound advice. Except for anything involving arrows or bolts. They will work quietly but the animals will run. And if your luck is like mine, it'll wind up in the neighbors front yard. Nate

Not my arrow,
but I'll dispose of the carcass for ya', no charge.


GWB

quote:

John: Thanks for backing up my non-GW bona fides.

Forgive me, I had to ask.

Carpetman1 gave the best answer, and from experience on the othjer side of the law, one shot is really hard to pinpoint. two shots and the average person can figure out where the sound is coming from.

There is another alternative:
Big Bore Air Rifles, 45cal on up to 58 caliber. They have been used for Hog hunting so I know it will take a deer.
The 58 fires a 820 grain bullet at 900 fps.
Very quiet.

Cheers, John

Bill/Oregon I would say the ideal caliber for this operation would be a scoped, silenced .22lr Rifle. Those deer look the same size as a bushbuck and I have killed a few out to 80m with my .22lr. Presicion shooting is what is needed here and you should go for a brain or spine shot which will put the deer down instantly. I also feel you will have more fun with the rimfire than the Hornet due to the many loads available and the shot load works on snakes at close range. Then there are the BB caps, Shorts.... Have fun!

This is where a suppressor would be an ideal fit. 308 with a 170grain bullet over 10.8grains of trailboss powder. Too bad in most states you cannot shoot a native "game" animal with one!

My supressed 308 is more quite than my RWS pellet gun.

Ed

Having had a lot of experience with hunting deer with the 222 and other 22 hotshots..I would suggest you use the .222 Rem and 60 gr. hornadys. Load it to anything between 2000 FPS and 2800 FPS for head shots and less noise..about 3000 FPS for body shots..

All my kids, and grandkids killed their first 4 or 5 deer with that combo and I have shot many deer and coyote with that 3000 FPS load.

For head shots at 50 yards a good accurate 22 L.R. can't be beat, but guess its not legal in your part of the USA, but does your law stipulate velocity or bullet weight, in which case you may be able to load a 45 gr. varmint bullet down to 1500 FPS and get the same results as a 22 L.R. and have happy neighbors and game wardens hugging each other! good luck!

Atkinson may be on to something.
You could take a page from Teancum's book, and go with a 40gr BT.
Trailboss has very low muzzle pressures, so it produces less noise.

Something around 6 or 7 grains should do the trick with a minimum of noise:

Cartridge : .222 Rem.
Bullet : .224, 40, Nosler BalTip 39510
Useable Case Capaci: 24.266 grain H2O = 1.576 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.130 inch = 54.10 mm
Barrel Length : 18.0 inch = 457.2 mm
Powder : IMR TrailBoss

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.632% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-26.3 74 5.60 1784 283 17421 1834 100.0 1.257
-23.7 77 5.80 1818 294 18363 1890 100.0 1.230
-21.1 80 6.00 1851 304 19324 1946 100.0 1.204
-18.4 82 6.20 1883 315 20304 2001 100.0 1.180
-15.8 85 6.40 1915 326 21304 2056 100.0 1.158
-13.2 88 6.60 1946 336 22324 2110 100.0 1.136
-10.5 90 6.80 1977 347 23363 2165 100.0 1.116
-07.9 93 7.00 2007 358 24423 2218 100.0 1.097
-05.3 95 7.20 2037 368 25503 2272 100.0 1.079
-02.6 98 7.40 2066 379 26604 2325 100.0 1.061
+00.0 101 7.60 2095 390 27725 2378 100.0 1.044
+02.6 103 7.80 2123 400 28868 2430 100.0 1.028
+05.3 106 8.00 2151 411 30032 2482 100.0 1.013
+07.9 109 8.20 2178 421 31217 2534 100.0 0.998
+10.5 111 8.40 2205 432 32424 2585 100.0 0.984
+13.2 114 8.60 2232 443 33654 2636 100.0 0.970

Results caused by ± 3% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 3% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 101 7.60 2098 391 28252 2374 100.0 1.039
Data for burning rate decreased by 3% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 101 7.60 2091 388 27171 2383 100.0 1.050



The 2.2k muzzle psi listed for 7 grains of trail boss is about 1/4 what you would expect for a standard full power .222 load.

.22 hornet will do the job easily. Pick a time, such as middle of the day when the neighbors are likely to be at work or sitting inside watching the TV. If on the unlikely chance someone happens to ask, tell them your truck backfired.

I'd think a mild cast bullet load in the 25-20 would be just the ticket. Not much louder than a 22 LR, but a 75 or 86 grain cast at 1500 or so would more than do the job. I use 75s at about 2000 fps in mine for small game and some coyote, they don't lack for penetration abilities.

quote:

Originally posted by lal:
Bill/Oregon I would say the ideal caliber for this operation would be a scoped, silenced .22lr Rifle. Those deer look the same size as a bushbuck and I have killed a few out to 80m with my .22lr. Presicion shooting is what is needed here and you should go for a brain or spine shot which will put the deer down instantly. I also feel you will have more fun with the rimfire than the Hornet due to the many loads available and the shot load works on snakes at close range. Then there are the BB caps, Shorts.... Have fun!

I have a box of Aguila Sniper Sub Sonics in .22lr with a 60g bullet and wondered if you have ever used them or had experience with them?

I've heard that they are a real penetrating son of a gun and have been used in some Sniping applications. Also found out that they were penetrating more than anticipated when they were meant for crowd control and ended up killing some folks.

I remember a long time ago about a guy who invented a muzzle brake that acts like a dog whistle that turns the gasses into a noise the human ear can't hear. That or use a long barrel and a subsonic load. The 358 Gremlin shooting 300 grain woodleighs at subsonic speed would be awesome.

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:

quote:

Originally posted by lal:
Bill/Oregon I would say the ideal caliber for this operation would be a scoped, silenced .22lr Rifle. Those deer look the same size as a bushbuck and I have killed a few out to 80m with my .22lr. Presicion shooting is what is needed here and you should go for a brain or spine shot which will put the deer down instantly. I also feel you will have more fun with the rimfire than the Hornet due to the many loads available and the shot load works on snakes at close range. Then there are the BB caps, Shorts.... Have fun!

I have a box of Aguila Sniper Sub Sonics in .22lr with a 60g bullet and wondered if you have ever used them or had experience with them?

I've heard that they are a real penetrating son of a gun and have been used in some Sniping applications. Also found out that they were penetrating more than anticipated when they were meant for crowd control and ended up killing some folks.

Teancum, I hope get the 'reply with quote' right? I have never used the Aguilla rounds but I believe some people have accuracy issues with them, the bullet not being stabilised. I use the now discontinued Swartklip High Velocity Hollow Point, I think 38gr. My supplies are low and I will be experimenting with S&B HV HP and Eley Tenex as soon as I can get away from work. I have killed many duiker and grysbok over the years with STD velocity Shorts when I could find them. Feel free to PM me for more info.

quote:

I have a box of Aguila Sniper Sub Sonics in .22lr with a 60g bullet and wondered if you have ever used them or had experience with them?

I've heard that they are a real penetrating son of a gun and have been used in some Sniping applications. Also found out that they were penetrating more than anticipated when they were meant for crowd control and ended up killing some folks.

I put a fast twist barrel on a 10/22 to shoot these. They were very accurate inside 25 yards, but even with the fast twist barrel accuracy at 50 yards was abysmal. Not good enough for head shots on critters. I found that odd and then never really pursued the project. I expect that they would thump something pretty good. I've got a place where I can take close in shots with them, so I might try it on a hog or coon.

LWD

you could look into the 25 Copperhead (I've no experience with them). I'd recommend a 300 Whisper. I have a friend with one in a TC handgun. Awesome and mild mannered and you could make it whisper if supressors are legal where you are...

Put both windows down in your PU and use the cab of your PU for a silencer...Such as this comes from a mispent cowboy youth in the Texas Big Bend country just after the great depression! My dad fed his family on deer meat as did eveyone else in those days..The kids did most of the hunting, the land was all privately owned, cattle were bring 11 cents a lb. and you didn't eat them yourself...

I remember the day dad came home and said your hunting days are over these deer are bringing $50.00 from hunters in Dallas and Houston..It took me a year to develope a taste for that greasy beef! The upside is we kids made big money guiding and packing out deer for those hunters at $2.00 per day, and that was big time money for us. Our hunters were Italian doctors and they had a big camp on the ranch and they really fed us good and we got to drink a hell of a lot of wine..

Ray: I'd pay good money for a book of your misspent youth memoirs ...

If you use your truck for a silencer, put some ear plugs in. I did it in my truck with a 454 handgun and thought my ears would never stop ringing. Really stupid on my part.

Cheers, John

Have you contacted your neighbors and discussed the problem with them? I can understand if you are having to deal with the "Don't kill Bambi" types and are unreasonable to deal with. I would try to come to an understanding with them. They may be contemplating the same thing and are afraid they might offend you. If they know a shot is coming it may be a non issue since they know what it was for.

My best friend's dad did this with a woodpecker that was driving him nuts tearing up their siding. He warned the neighbors if he got a chance to shoot it he would. He shot it with a 12 gauge early one morning and no one complained. I think he did more damage to the house than the woodpecker. It was funny as hell.

.300 Whisper, 210 grain subsonic Sierra with a suppressor. No-one will ever know! We're getting turnaround times right now of 22 weeks from the Feds for suppressor stamps, so not exactly the quick way to do it. The round really isn't that loud without a suppressor so you could go that route. You'll need an 8 twist barrel though. Totally fun!

A long barrel 44mag 45 colt with about 7 grs red dot and a 250 gr cast bullet is fairly quite.

If one puts a bloop tube on bringing the barrel to 36 inchs or so it really cut the noise down and is completely legal

Start running the lawn mower or a loud generator in the evenings at the corner of your house. Deer will ignore or get used to it. Will cloud the sound of a shot well, but not a 223. Neighbors would not notice a 25-20 or 38. I would use a 38 with semi wad cutters at 50 yds or less.

I would contact the writers of Roadrunner Cartoon and see what Acme product they would recommend

I used to shoot problem opossums in my back yard with a rifle shooting .22 CB caps. They were so quiet I could hear the bullet hit. Not good for deer though!

Without a suppressor you are facing a real challenge. Subsonic loads are the norm for 45acp, 45 Colt, and even the old 45-70-500 blackpowder cartridge. Yet, even without a supersonic crack the blast from those cartridges is pretty loud. Alternatively, if you use a small bore cartridge (less blast) and load it down to shoot subsonic then the little bullets won't have very much oomph when they hit your deer.

Along the line of your problem, I want a rifle for my youngest son to shoot that won't destroy his hearing. So I recently purchased a .223 mini-mauser to use for his "discreet" game getter. Now, I am trying to decide whether to have it rebored to 6x45mm (6mm-223) or to have it rebarreled to .300 Blackout (7.62x35mm). Either way, I will be adding a suppressor.

Grenadier--if .22 centerfires legal your state, let your boy try it as .223 if you have never seen it done it will probably favorably surprise you.

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
Grenadier--if .22 centerfires legal your state, let your boy try it as .223 if you have never seen it done it will probably favorably surprise you.

22 centerfire is not legal for deer here. We have a 6mm minimum.

Grenadier what state? Could be one of those where .25ACP legal and .223 not lol

Common sense dictates that 6x45mm and .300 Blackout are two of the reasonable minimums for deer.

How about a metrogun?

http://www.metrogun.com/

You could use buckshot or slugs

Call out the National Guard tell them you have terrorists in your apples.

That Metrogun thing is nuts!

That Metro-gun this is wild, only 72db. thats not noticable at all. Even the price is right.

I've got to get one, just to have.

Cheers, John

if an airrifle is legal, the crossman rogue is the ticket.. its loud for a airgun, but not 22h loud...

but, if you rEALLY wanted to build a gun, a fast twist 223 barrel in a hornet would be cool...

hey.. what about trailboss in a 45/70 HR? 800fps with a rem 405?

I am thinking a .223 with a 40 grain NBT and about 11-12 grains of Blue Dot. Pretty quiet and would do the job at 50 yards or so. It's what I would do with what I have available. That should still have that 40 going around 2600-2700.

I built a 300 WTF for use on the side of my 80 acres property that has neighbors. Using 220 gr SMKs subsonics and titanium SAS Arbiter 30 cal can it sounds like a nail gun.

Form 4 turnarounds through the BATFE are very long at the moment ... 4 to 5 months, so this approach takes some planning.

I put together a 25/223 with a homeless , ugly [but accurate] 1-12 barrel made by ????? on a beater Rem 600 action. I chambered with a piloted 223 reamer and used a neck/throat for the rest. Dies were from Dastardly Dave at CH4D. It shoots the 87 gr bullets at 2600 FPS VERY accurately and it kills the little Blacktail easily. Never tried a bear but??? Who knows? If the shot was 100 or less and and a well built 75-87 gr bullet is used--well placed it should [?] do the job. Noise is not too bad- seems like a little less than a 223. This might be the thing for you.
Aloha, Mark

I just put this together for a similar purpose. 357 Handi, barrel 16.1" and 1/2x28 threads for a 9mm can. Real quiet with anything subsonic. I am stocking up on 180 and heavier bullets. I think it will be more effective than any 22 or 25 at subsonic speeds and bullets will actually expand as well.

If going the supressed route give some good thought to the AR platform with say a Gemtec and the 70gr TSX. Pretty humane for the deer as that bullet can do the job.

Or give a 25WSSM a try. I've had excelelnt success with 25WSSM on deer and the noise is not much if anything above the 223 AR.

Good luck!