Guys,
Does anyone have any dimensional information on the 458Sabi and 458Majoor? I presume they are African designed as a picture is shown in Pierre van der Walt's book. Interested in finding out some of their history.
Cheers...
Con

Con,

Here are two web links that discuss the two cartridges; the 458 Majoor is discussed in the second paragraph under Characteristics.

458 Sabi:
http://www.sabirifles.co.za/458sabi.htm

458 Majoor:
http://www.safariactionshooting.com/?page_id=192

Jim

Kinda off topic but why would anyone chose the 458 Sabi over the 500 Jeffery?

The 338 lapua necked up to 458 and trimmed to 2.5" 2.54" or 2.65" is way better imho... no rebate on a more common case, easy to form and I have the dummies already

458-338 lapua 2.5", 2.65" and 458-404 2.65"

Thanks capoward. Boomstick, like the 458AccRel, both of these cartridges and the 458African Express have been an attempt to put a 458Lott equivalent into a standard length action. Expensive brass though to be modifying.
Cheers...
Con

quote:

Originally posted by Con:
Thanks capoward. Boomstick, like the 458AccRel, both of these cartridges and the 458African Express have been an attempt to put a 458Lott equivalent into a standard length action. Expensive brass though to be modifying.
Cheers...
Con

<ringing a bell>
I did the 416-458-470 AR to be
standard length action
cheap brass
power equals to the incumbant at the caliber, or, easily said, as I believe the lott answer is NOT the answer to the 458 winmag
parameters for considering them a success
416 -2400fps 400gr
458 -2200fps 500gr
470 -2200fps 500gr bullet
<nominal 500 AR was to be a 535 at 2300/570 at 2100>
basically you can beat all those by 200fps, if you like.

I didn't use 404 brass, though that can be made FROM rum brass, as it was 4X the cost ..

jeffe

More off topic but the AR carts are AWESOME!

The AR carts are the best thing going in terms of reproducing longer magnum performance in a std action.

I only brought up the 458-338 lapua cuzz the trying to exceed the Lott performaqnce on an expensive much larger case. the rigby case is cheaper and does not have the feeding smithing issues. I think hornady/Ruger should adopt the 458 AR

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
More off topic but the AR carts are AWESOME!

The 458AccRel is awesome, definately a commercially viable cartridge in my opinion. Would finish of Hornady's 375Ruger and 416Ruger just nicely ... whatcha reckon jeffe??? The 470AR is truely unique, just not as many cheap pills ... the 416AR is just too sandwiched in my opinion.

Jeffe, did you know of the 458African Express when fiddling with the AR series? That wildcat seems closest to the 458AR and mention is mad ethat 375RUM brass can be substituted in.
Cheers...
Con

Con
the only round i somewhat knew about was the 416 howell .. Ken and I talked afterwards, and he liked my case better, (no really) as i used cheap brass and didn't care about the short neck/knew it was a myth..

i didnt find out about the african express untill last year. Saeed sent me a great book (thanks1!!!) that had it listed. That didn't give me any hope that it would be adopted, as it had been out a bit..

But, i near that a source is making rum brass IN HOUSE these days, and I wouldn't at all be surprised if they might think about a real big bore on them...

The 470, well, there's a couple good sources for bullets here, from cast to pistol, to barnes, to even DGX hornady coming out any day now. I can't wait to try all the dgx in the ARs soon. I think the DGX is Hornady's best attempt todate to make a great hunting bullet...

Speaking of which, I just think that the flatnosed RN soft will be excellent, especially since the contruction is purportedly between too soft and too hard ...

I'll see in on our next piggie hunt...


Guys, remember, Hornady is making dies for the 40 something ARs, and the 416 ruger is already out there, theres slim hope for anything under .458.. but it would be amazing to see the 458 made production.. and the 470... and then the 500....

Honestly, that there's so many of these guys already running around in the field, and taking game, i am humbled by the popularity... the 458 is certainly popular, and will "DO IT" ...

Con, you, Joe, and Paz know that the 458 certainly cuts the mustard, and is humanly shootable ...

the 500, as ya'll will soon know, does all that and then some...

the 470 - what can i say, other than its the coolest round TO ME, that I have ever designed... its the ONLY standard length 470, and it gives up nothing in terms of performance.

Ah, well, its a new year.. I am going to build a double rifle in 45/120 this year, restock the ruger based 500, and hunt/shoot more... I made that decision last year, and kept to it.. shooting and hunting more.., and ridings quads!

jeffe

I must ask Jeffe - why no 423 AR? Was it just too close to the 416?

Boom - I can see a reason for using the 458 over the 500, bullet selection! With the lighter spitzer type bullets, you make a better (but not best) aregument for an all around caliber capable of taking PG as well as DG.

MHS,
fair question ... it would have, then defeated the purpose of having a 3.35" round that shot the THEN expensive .423/424 bullets..

and I am alergic to the 404 for some reason.... even though i am constantly reminding people that the 416 taylor is the match for the 404 jeffery, not the 416 rigby

Makes perfect sense! I may be interested in giving it a go, if (unlikely I hope) our 404-375 doesnt work out since I'll already have the barrel

quote:

Originally posted by Con:
Thanks capoward. Boomstick, like the 458AccRel, both of these cartridges and the 458African Express have been an attempt to put a 458Lott equivalent into a standard length action. Expensive brass though to be modifying.
Cheers...
Con

Con,

One could reasonably (price of cases – at least in the US) make a standard length .458 wildcat to match the case capacity of the .458 Lott using .375 Ruger basic brass. The shoulder would be slightly larger than the 10.75x68 Mauser cartridge’s shoulder so one might want to open the shoulder a few thousands for a bit larger shoulder (would add a bit powder capacity also). But, the .375 Ruger case is best kept to bullet diameters of .435” or less for a better shoulder.

That said, Jeffe’s .458 AR is the best alternative for a standard length .458 cartridge, capacity exceeds the Lott so Lott performance is reached at lower pressure levels or exceeded if that’s your desire.

Jim