There is nothing worse than a client arriving in camp with a shopping list that has to be fullfilled!

Everything by the inch.

The enjoyment of being out in the wild takes a back seat.

Is the solution to pay for a full bag safari go there and shoot only a buff, hippo and croc and then say no big deal the food was good, nice to be in the wild with great company...then return home.

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Is the solution to pay for a full bag safari go there and shoot only a buff, hippo and croc and then say no big deal the food was good, nice to be in the wild with great company...then return home.

Come on out with the rest of the story George, there has to be more.

With George, who knows?? It seems from his post that the only hunt worth taking is one where you shoot everything on a shopping list.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Before shooting the animal, make sure the PH understands that if the animal does not meet the size you want, there will be no charge

Gulp.

I remember a couple of years back a noted PH here had his client shoot a 39.5 inch Sable when the client had specifically asked for over 40. The subsequent bitching and sulking totally ruined the remainder of the hunt. I saw the trophy and it was a beautiful heavy horned specimen that looked 40 to me.

This is so unfortunate and I feel bad for hunters that fall into the inches trap. Hunters can be there own worst enemies. Obviously in Andrew's story the client discounted all the wonderful parts of the rest of his safari and chose to be upset about this one very minor mistake ruining the whole experience. I hunt for inches but it has never effected my enjoyment of the whole experience of safari. I shot a 42" Cape kudu on my last safari that the PH had told me was way bigger. It was a huge kudu but he didn't have the headgear. The PH not knowing me didn't quite know what to say when the tape only stretched to 42". Up until that point the PH had been dead on in his trophy assessment, we had had a great time with him and continued to have a great time with him through the end of our safari. I could have chosen to ruin that by bitching about the kudu but it wasn't worth it. I also got to bring up the 42" kudu throughout the safari in a humorous way which just made the safari that much more fun. Ya gotta roll with it or be upset. You can choose one or the other.

Mark

quote:

Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Before shooting the animal, make sure the PH understands that if the animal does not meet the size you want, there will be no charge

Gulp.

I remember a couple of years back a noted PH here had his client shoot a 39.5 inch Sable when the client had specifically asked for over 40. The subsequent bitching and sulking totally ruined the remainder of the hunt. I saw the trophy and it was a beautiful heavy horned specimen that looked 40 to me.

This is so unfortunate and I feel bad for hunters that fall into the inches trap. Hunters can be there own worst enemies. Obviously in Andrew's story the client discounted all the wonderful parts of the rest of his safari and chose to be upset about this one very minor mistake ruining the whole experience. I hunt for inches but it has never effected my enjoyment of the whole experience of safari. I shot a 42" Cape kudu on my last safari that the PH had told me was way bigger. It was a huge kudu but he didn't have the headgear. The PH not knowing me didn't quite know what to say when the tape only stretched to 42". Up until that point the PH had been dead on in his trophy assessment, we had had a great time with him and continued to have a great time with him through the end of our safari. I could have chosen to ruin that by bitching about the kudu but it wasn't worth it. I also got to bring up the 42" kudu throughout the safari in a humorous way which just made the safari that much more fun. Ya gotta roll with it or be upset. You can choose one or the other.

Mark

Mark,

Some years back when I was guiding Peter Flack he had always wanted a good Chobe Bushbuck which I put him onto. Turned out to be a runt which I apologised profusely for and offered to pay. He shrugged his shoulders and said something along the lines that it was a pretty little animal and took a full mount and we moved on.

He always requests representative animals and was delighted to take very good trophies of his priority species. He had done enough hunting to take the rough with the smooth and we toasted the dainty Lesser Kafue Bushbuck later that evening.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
There is nothing worse than a client arriving in camp with a shopping list that has to be fullfilled!

Everything by the inch.

The enjoyment of being out in the wild takes a back seat.

I hunt for fun. This is starting to sound like work.

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
With George, who knows?? It seems from his post that the only hunt worth taking is one where you shoot everything on a shopping list.

A good hunt would be one that costs say 15000 all inclusive and you shoot a couple 38 hard boss buff and get a zebra and impala, or 25000 all inclusive and get a 40lbs exportable bull ele(not 80000).The best hunt would be one that didn't require that you bend over and take it...It is not easy to find a good hunt.It helps if the outfitters were honest and showed all past hunts on their web site hunting gallery not just the successful hunts.That way their hunt offers would be non BS.

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
With George, who knows?? It seems from his post that the only hunt worth taking is one where you shoot everything on a shopping list.

A good hunt would be one that costs say 15000 all inclusive and you shoot a couple 38 hard boss buff and get a zebra and impala, or 25000 all inclusive and get a 40lbs exportable bull ele(not 80000).The best hunt would be one that didn't require that you bend over and take it...It is not easy to find a good hunt.It helps if the outfitters were honest and showed all past hunts on their web site hunting gallery not just the successful hunts.That way their hunt offers would be non BS.

Hi George. When you find a place where you can hunt 2 x 38" hard bossed bulls + a few plainsgame for 15000 all inclusive with a reputable outfitter please let me know as I know a number of people who'd happily do that hunt. Thanks in advance. Cheers

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Is the solution to pay for a full bag safari go there and shoot only a buff, hippo and croc and then say no big deal the food was good, nice to be in the wild with great company...then return home.

I thought the attraction of hunting the "big wild areas" was that nothing is guaranteed. On the other hand hunting the conservancies is too easy. Once you find your dream hunting place then just stick to it.

quote:

Originally posted by Thierry Labat:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Is the solution to pay for a full bag safari go there and shoot only a buff, hippo and croc and then say no big deal the food was good, nice to be in the wild with great company...then return home.

I thought the attraction of hunting the "big wild areas" was that nothing is guaranteed. On the other hand hunting the conservancies is too easy. Once you find your dream hunting place then just stick to it.

If you are talking about hunting big wild areas 60 years ago then I agree.However if you are talking about these areas as they are today along with todays prices then I disagree.

quote:

Originally posted by Thierry Labat:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
Is the solution to pay for a full bag safari go there and shoot only a buff, hippo and croc and then say no big deal the food was good, nice to be in the wild with great company...then return home.

I thought the attraction of hunting the "big wild areas" was that nothing is guaranteed. On the other hand hunting the conservancies is too easy. Once you find your dream hunting place then just stick to it.

Still quite possible but trophy Elephant options are now difficult . Thankfully I don't need the Trophy..

60 years ago they often shot underage lion just to get one, and female leopard were often taken.

Admittedly it's hard to pay close to 6 figures and see lion, and have the ph say too young or I am not sure, we will have to let him go... or spend 3 weeks and not see a legal bull elephant, but enough folks are willing to do so that prices are unlikely to fall.

Some of the uncertainty is government mandated. I am less than 50% on big cats, yet still had a good time each time out.

Elephant is even less for a trophy bull...

I was just sitting here thinking about the couple of dozen elephant the I have shot. The first one that always come to mind was a tuskless cow whose teeth were so worn down that Don Heath estmited she was born at the beginning of WWII. She lived her whole life in the Zambezi Valley and may have run into Ian Nations and possibly Pondoro. I wonder how many calves she produced during those 70 + years and what all she had seen and experienced. She may eve have been one of the infamous Zambezi Lady's. I was humbled by her. I was also glad that I was able to give her a quick death since her teeth were worn down to the gum line and she was staring to starve to death. A fitting end for a grand old lady. Also, she died doing her job, defending her herd! She comes before my largest bull in my mind.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by Thierry Labat:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
With George, who knows?? It seems from his post that the only hunt worth taking is one where you shoot everything on a shopping list.

A good hunt would be one that costs say 15000 all inclusive and you shoot a couple 38 hard boss buff and get a zebra and impala, or 25000 all inclusive and get a 40lbs exportable bull ele(not 80000).The best hunt would be one that didn't require that you bend over and take it...It is not easy to find a good hunt.It helps if the outfitters were honest and showed all past hunts on their web site hunting gallery not just the successful hunts.That way their hunt offers would be non BS.

Hi George. When you find a place where you can hunt 2 x 38" hard bossed bulls + a few plainsgame for 15000 all inclusive with a reputable outfitter please let me know as I know a number of people who'd happily do that hunt. Thanks in advance. Cheers

Thierry, you must learn to just ignore George. He lives in a fantasy world and listens to voices in his head for advice-which apparently tell him to shoot buffalo cows and post a video here bragging about it.....

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:

quote:

Originally posted by Thierry Labat:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:

quote:

Originally posted by jdollar:
With George, who knows?? It seems from his post that the only hunt worth taking is one where you shoot everything on a shopping list.

A good hunt would be one that costs say 15000 all inclusive and you shoot a couple 38 hard boss buff and get a zebra and impala, or 25000 all inclusive and get a 40lbs exportable bull ele(not 80000).The best hunt would be one that didn't require that you bend over and take it...It is not easy to find a good hunt.It helps if the outfitters were honest and showed all past hunts on their web site hunting gallery not just the successful hunts.That way their hunt offers would be non BS.

Hi George. When you find a place where you can hunt 2 x 38" hard bossed bulls + a few plainsgame for 15000 all inclusive with a reputable outfitter please let me know as I know a number of people who'd happily do that hunt. Thanks in advance. Cheers

Thierry, you must learn to just ignore George. He lives in a fantasy world and listens to voices in his head for advice-which apparently tell him to shoot buffalo cows and post a video here bragging about it.....

You are many outfitters favorite client.You pay tons of money for nothing, let them shoot your animals and call you a fool and laugh at you behind your back(and in your face),leave a monster tip, rifle and your wife.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
60 years ago they often shot underage lion just to get one, and female leopard were often taken.

Admittedly it's hard to pay close to 6 figures and see lion, and have the ph say too young or I am not sure, we will have to let him go... or spend 3 weeks and not see a legal bull elephant, but enough folks are willing to do so that prices are unlikely to fall.

Some of the uncertainty is government mandated. I am less than 50% on big cats, yet still had a good time each time out.

Elephant is even less for a trophy bull...

I have no problem with people paying something they agree to pay for a hunt.The issue I have is with the success rate being clouded or covered up or the actual situation in game availability.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
60 years ago they often shot underage lion just to get one, and female leopard were often taken.

Admittedly it's hard to pay close to 6 figures and see lion, and have the ph say too young or I am not sure, we will have to let him go... or spend 3 weeks and not see a legal bull elephant, but enough folks are willing to do so that prices are unlikely to fall.

Some of the uncertainty is government mandated. I am less than 50% on big cats, yet still had a good time each time out.

Elephant is even less for a trophy bull...

We are seeing more operators and PHs offer the two tier pricing for expensive game which is an attractive and fair option. Basically you pay for success.

quote:

You are many outfitters favorite client.You pay tons of money for nothing, let them shoot your animals and call you a fool and laugh at you behind your back(and in your face),leave a monster tip, rifle and your wife.

George you have been reading too much Capstick.

Andrew, you cant fix stupid

Firstly, you dwell too much on the trophy size and not the quality of the hunt. You are there for the wrong reasons .Ultimately it is you who made the final decision to kill it when you pulled the trigger.

quote:

Originally posted by fairgame:

quote:

Before shooting the animal, make sure the PH understands that if the animal does not meet the size you want, there will be no charge

Gulp.

I remember a couple of years back a noted PH here had his client shoot a 39.5 inch Sable when the client had specifically asked for over 40. The subsequent bitching and sulking totally ruined the remainder of the hunt. I saw the trophy and it was a beautiful heavy horned specimen that looked 40 to me.

I cannot imagine letting a half inch of horn ruin a hunt, especially one in Africa. I have never been a tape measure guy, and I have very little taxidermy work. The hunt is more about shooting the right animal in the right manner, and sometimes not shooting at all. For me the joy of the hunt is not so much pulling the trigger, but just enjoying the entire hunt. The sights and sounds of the environment,...getting in close to animals....burning up shoe leather tracking,...I love it. The older I get, the more I appreciate the simpler things. For example, one of the things I love about the Caprivi are the Fish Eagles. While tracking elephant or buffalo, you can always hear them in the background.

About 3 or 4 yeas ago, I went to an industry lunch and one of guys had just returned from his first elephant hunt. He was a little irritated about shooting a 47 pound elephant. He wanted wanted a 50 pounder and he spent the first 5 minutes bitching about the weight of his ivory. After that he talked about the hunt for the next hour pretty much non-stop, like a little excited kid. He got his iPad out to show everyone his pictures from the hunt. At the end of the lunch, he started bitching about the ivory again. Everyone at the table shut him down, because it was painfully obvious he had a great hunt. He eventually figured that out, and 6 month later booked another elephant hunt with the same PH. Sadly the penny never drops for some guys.

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:
I was just sitting here thinking about the couple of dozen elephant the I have shot. The first one that always come to mind was a tuskless cow whose teeth were so worn down that Don Heath estmited she was born at the beginning of WWII. She lived her whole life in the Zambezi Valley and may have run into Ian Nations and possibly Pondoro. I wonder how many calves she produced during those 70 + years and what all she had seen and experienced. She may eve have been one of the infamous Zambezi Lady's. I was humbled by her. I was also glad that I was able to give her a quick death since her teeth were worn down to the gum line and she was staring to starve to death. A fitting end for a grand old lady. Also, she died doing her job, defending her herd! She comes before my largest bull in my mind.

465H&H

That almost brought a tear to my eye...