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This is a cautionary note for those that are contemplating an elephant hunt with HuntAfrica Namibia. Perhaps it is a great company and this was the only issue they have ever had; however, this did happen to me and it hurts bitterly. I have very recently filed a complete report and documentation with the THE HUNTING REPORT but the succinct details of my experience follow: I had made it perfectly clear when I booked the hunt for June 15 through June 30, 2016, that I had previously taken an elephant with 53/43 pounds of ivory and was looking for something substantially larger. I wanted a 70 pound of ivory elephant, but would accept a 65/65 (both sides relatively equal) elephant. I brought pictures and dimensions of my 54/43 elephant ivory to camp and reviewed them with my PH prior to the hunt. I also made it perfectly clear that if we could not find an elephant that met my criteria, I was perfectly happy to return home without taking an elephant. I relied on the judgement of the PH, Koos Pienaar, to guide me and direct the hunt in that manner. The elephant that I ended up taking was 56/47 which was, in essence, no better than the one I had previously taken, and so I ended up taking an unsatisfactory elephant that cost me more than $35,000 in trophy fees. There was no reason to take that elephant. We had plenty of hunting time left to continue our search. Unfortunately, and the height of stupidity on my part, I paid the entire trophy fee of $35,3334 at the time of booking because I was told it was “Company Policy” to do this. As a result I had no negotiating leverage and am out that amount of money for taking an unsatisfactory elephant! Dumb me! This, then, is a failed elephant hunt for which I am the sole financially harmed party. To continue the story: I knew there was some question about the tusk weight after the shot, but had no idea how far off the mark it would be. After I returned home, I receive the following communication from HuntAfrica: From: Huntafrica Namibia [mailto:info@huntafrica.com.na] Sent: 10 July 2016 02:42 PM To: 'Roger Kolassa' Cc: 'dave@safari1.com' Subject: RE: Phone Call Hi Roger, Good to hear from you ! – and that you had safe travels ! Everything was ok at your hotel and the taxi to the Airport ? (Did you follow-up with Gracies - and Louise about your problems?) Firstly we would like to thank you for hunting with us. We really enjoyed your company in camp and also when visiting our plains game and farm area on your way back. We weighed you tusks this morning – they look beautifull . We will take a photo and send it on mail. ,too. Weight 56lbs and 47lbs - what is very different – the nerves was very thick - they look much bigger than what they weigh Thanks a lot also for the tips to everyone – it is highly appreciated! Kind regards My response, after much back and forth discussion, was to issue a demand letter that, in part, contained the following: “By this email I am formally requesting the refund of the the elephant trophy fee of $35,334.00 remitted to you prior the beginning of my elephant hunt on 6/15/2016. There have been many communications during the last month concerning the the events that have led to this request. These communications involved your company; the booking agent, Safari Outfitters; and I. Now these discussions seemed to have reached a stalemate. In order to move forward I have been informed that I must not only specify how HuntAfrica’s performance fell short of what could reasonably be expected, but also what would be an acceptable remedy. That is the reason for this communication.” I will say that throughout this process Dave Hagstrom of Safari Outfitters, the booking agent, has gone way beyond what would be expected in trying to resolve this issue. Here is an example of his efforts: From Dave Hagstrom: Hi Roger, Sent an email to HuntAfrica this morning suggesting that if they are not inclined to refund the amount of the trophy fee, perhaps offer a free return hunt for the outfitting expenses. However there would still be the trophy fee and any government fees to pay. I suggested the hunt go as long as it takes up to 14 days but ending after an appropriate bull is shot whenever that is. I told them this is not going to go away and it will do damage to both of us if something satisfactory is not done. Like you, I doubt they will refund the $35,000 + trophy fee amount but I'm seeing what they can do for a return hunt. I will also drasticly cut my personal commission if they do this. In the meantime I guess we will wait and see how they respond to your email and mine. Safe journey...... Best, Dave Dave Hagstrom Safari Outfitters, LLC <dave@safari1.com> To Roger Kolassa Sep 15 at 6:41 AM Hey Roger, Christine from Huntafrica says this morning, they will offer you a 25% discount on the daily rates for their 2018 price which is $89,400 (which of course includes the trophy fee in this particular price). I'm not certain what only their daily rates are but will find out. They are fully aware of what you are looking for in tusk size. The hunt should you choose it will be in April of 2018 as they are sold out for 2017. Talk to you soon! Dave My response: > On Thu, 15 Sep 2016 22:46:12 +0000 (UTC), Roger Kolassa > wrote: >> Hi Dave, >> What a disappointing offer! We waited all of this time for this? I > can'd >> decide whether this is simply an attempt to start negotiations or > whether >> this is just an attempt to say " We realize Roger was disappointed so > we >> offered to have him return at a reduced rate but he declined the > offer". I don't know where the $89,400 comes > from >> since my total cost the first time around was about $79,000. If you look at > 25% >> of the daily rate cost for my 2016 hunt it was about $38,000 and 25% of that > is >> about $9,500 against a price increase of $10,000 so this is in no way a >> serious offer. On top of that, based on your concerns from last time >> around April is not a prime time! >> I'm sure that Huntafrica is a quality outfit but even the best brain >> surgeons have malpractice insurance. Unfortunately Hunafrica is self >> insured and is not inclined to admit the occasional mistake. >> I happened to be in the wrong place in the wrong time! >> Roger > On Friday, September 16, 2016 8:57 PM, "dave@safari1.com" wrote: > > Hi Roger, > > > I thought more would be forthcoming in the offer and maybe they want to > negotiate some, I'm not sure. At first glance I thought well, maybe that > is > not too bad but when looking closer and comparing the 2016 and 2019 > prices > I could see that it was not so much that way. What I can do is let them > know that you/we are disappointed in this offer and see what they do with > that on the table. I'm not sure if they would go any further but can see > what they say....if I had to guess, I'd say the chance is not strong but > I > could be completely off on that assessment. What does that sound like to > you? > > The $89,400 is their 2019 price and I had seen that earlier on. They do > shoot elephant in April however based on what they say April is not THE > best time but apparently book clients then. They say this is the date > they > have open and that could be the reason why it is still open. Yes we seem to be getting to know each other and.....I always pay attention to what a client says and wants. I also end up being friends with some clients like you and I. My response to Dave: Please let Huntafrica know that I am quite disappointed, not only in the > financial part of the offer but on the April date. I can see no harm in > informing them of that, but, like you, I'm not hopeful as to where this > is headed. C'mon, do they really expect me to commit such a large > expenditure on a problematical date? I'd like to think that when I book a > hunt, the outfitter and I are on the same team. I'm not getting that > sense here. > > Roger > Dave’s response to me: I'll email Huntafrica today and let you know their response. As you've seen they are not always readily available due to their location. Back soon, Dave MY NOTE: DAVE WAS INFORMED BY HUNTAFRICA THAT THERE WAS NOTHING MORE THAT THEY CAN DO! | ||
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They made you shoot an elephant that had big nerve cavities? Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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I think a change in hobbies would be a solid plan. Hot Rods maybe. In Hot Rodding, you can look through a catalogue and pick out exactly what it is you want. You lay your money down and you get exactly what it was in the catalogue. Seems a bit petty that you were only concerned with the weight. Sorry, just my .02c Steve Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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You had to pay almost 100 000 to shoot a 40-50 pounder.At least you shot an ele.I hope the trophy fee was refundable in case you did not shoot.This hunt is not for me thanks.I would never pay more than 25 000 to hunt a bull ele today and that would be after doing plenty of research and trusting no one.The future of the safari business especially for ele is uncertain and shaft jobs are highly likely today,IMO.Hunting addiction can make you blind. | |||
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Can you post photos of the two [old and new] elephants? | |||
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"Elephant hunt gone wrong!" Perhaps this should read "Trophy collection gone wrong!"? | |||
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I have mixed feelings here. Seems to be pretty demanding and difficult. It is awfully difficult to judge that precisely. I say that and I have done a hell of a lot of elephant hunting. In the last few years a hundred pounder was taken in Zim. The PH almost passed as he didn't think it was big enough . PH's hate demands like this. They probably should have told you so. | |||
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I know nothing about elephant hunting, except that I did buy my Blaser 500 NE (after buying a K-gun in 500/416) specifically to hunt elephant. I never went on the hunt and almost certainly never will. I understand that it is hunting and not killing, but it is too expensive for my blood. Peter. Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright, that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong; | |||
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Sounds like an expensive hunt that you could have gotten cheaper elsewhere but with that said, you are the guy that pulled the trigger! One side was only 9 pounds less than what you requested and the other a bit less...are you really that pissed-off over a few pounds? What do you have to prove? You killed 2 Bull Elephants...most people would love to be able to say that. Be thankful, enjoy looking at your ivory, and stop being a baby. You sound silly. | |||
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+1. Perhaps he should hunt at the Hotel DelRay in SAN Jose, CR. Then he would exactly what he pays for... The expectation here boggles the mind. It's hunting, not shooting. Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… | |||
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My last client wanted a 40 inch Sable and had to settle for 48. As a PH I have on occasion made a call that did not quite suit the hunters expectations. For me it cannot interfere with the whole experience and the privilege of hunting Africa's wild beasts. To be hunting elephant in wild lands should be enough compensation. If not then you do have the opportunity to sell over a 100lbs of ivory and take advantage of the operators and agents kind offer. ROYAL KAFUE LTD Email - kafueroyal@gmail.com Tel/Whatsapp (00260) 975315144 Instagram - kafueroyal | |||
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Before I would get too upset on either side, I would want to know what the external dimensions on both bulls were before casting stones. Yes, nerve size is variable, but if the new bull is the same external dimensions as the first or smaller, it should have been turned down...or the client told it was about the same size. I would think the desired 70# bull would be notably larger than this. If the client said 70# and is willing to walk away without one, it isn't his fault he did what the PH recommended. As has been said before, we really are not getting everything here...the fact the outfitter was willing to offer anything on a trophy size dispute says something is going on here. $35K sounds like a pretty heavy trophy fee for a 50 pound bull. | |||
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You gave tips to everyone, I would assume that included the PH, so you were happy and satisfied with the hunt until, after you had gotten home, you were told the weights. Then all of a sudden it's a terrible hunt, "A hunt gone wrong". The PH missed your "goal" by 9 pounds and you are upset. IMO you are putting WAY to much importance on the weights instead of the hunt. | |||
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The so called nerve can certainly have an effect on the weight as can the the length of tusk inside the gum. Both have a direct impact on weight. | |||
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And people are wondering why agents have 11 page contracts | |||
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Do you accept to pay 100 000 for something and when you open the package you find that there is nothing in their but a message that reads hunting is not guaranteed? It is very difficult to protect yourself. | |||
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Was it in your agreement that if the weight did not match what was estimated by the PH you would get a refund? If not, you really have no ground to stand on. I know some PHs who would have refused to hunt with you knowing your requirements. | |||
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What I think is very unusual that you paid the trophy fee upfront, I have never heard of that before and would not do it myself. Nevertheless if you had a good experience and hunt I would not be to disappointed about the final weight of the tusks. | |||
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What a NIGHTMARE of a client!! Whiny little bitch is a fair assessment of your character. | |||
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I believe one sees things differently if they have a lot of money and it comes easy compared to someone who hasn't and it is difficult to replace.That said, even if you paid all the money in the world,if you are talking 70lbs the only way to be sure of shooting one is if someone chained it someplace. | |||
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Honestly, it's a bad case of "Buyers Remorse" I can understand not being happy after laying down a huge sum of money (obviously too much) On one hand.....he was clear on his expectations On the other hand...he made the final decision to shoot Also, we ALL know tusk weight can be variable and so is trophy judgement in the field. It seems clear he wasn't so unhappy until being ultimately informed of the weight and left happy ( or reasonably happy ) The other truth is....he is likely more upset with his own self than anyone else because he knows he was ultimately responsible... Buyers Remorse!!! It's a bitch... 90% of us would tend to agree that one shouldn't let such immaterial aspects of a hunt become material and ruin your experience | |||
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Some folks would bitch if you hung them with a new rope. "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Thought that was the Blue Marlin?  Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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Unless you were directly lied to or intentionally misled, I am struggling to understand the issue. I went cougar hunting a few years ago, wanted to two cats. Got none, but not due to the outfitter. Weather and lack of encountering a male got us. Tough luck, move on. No big deal. Sheep hunters as a rule run about 50% on guided sheep hunts - those are $20k to $60k. It happens, so unless you were lied to, or intentionally misled - you pulled the trigger. AND - you did get to hunt a nice bull and you shot a nice bull.... If the size is not big enough, get some replicas made..... | |||
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Andrew, Why can't PHs just deliver what the client orders? Did you at least saw off the extra 8"? "If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump | |||
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Maybe he hasn't responded since the OP because he's out in the streets protesting Trump's election. Geeze.  | |||
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Aw, come on Steve, you know the Blue Marlin is the name of the bar inside the DelRay. Or so I have been told....  Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend… | |||
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I would have thought for someone who is intent on taking trophies bigger or better than those already banked, or wanting one of a certain size or weight specification, they should be sufficiently knowledgeable themselves to judge trophies of the species they are hunting. If not then just what is the point of holding out for a bigger or better trophy other than bragging rights i.e. if they cannot judge the size of their own trophies before taking them, then it all obviously just comes down to the numbers game whether for bragging rights or a trophy book entry rather than the thrill of the hunt and the visual beauty of the trophy. Even the old professional elephant hunters relayed stories of taking animals with good length and thickness of tusks only to be disappointed to find because of the tusk nerve size the actual ivory weighed way less than they expected. Off course these professionals were shooting for maximum saleable weight and would have been the most experienced judges of elephants than anyone alive today. | |||
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He should have contacted the SCI Specialists, who specialize in "made to order trophies". The ones who buy captured animals and make them available to the idiots of Wall Street to fly over and shoot them. So they can gloat in the glory of being in one of those sick "circles"  Going out to hunt, and enjoy the whole experience, does not seem to be one of his priorities . The SCI holy grail of MINE IS BIGGER THAN YOURS seems to his too! | |||
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My guess is that the OP is getting a reaction here he was not expecting. | |||
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Hi Jerry, I actually have never been there and didn't realize that. (Blue Marlin) I was just at Crocodile Bay last week. The fishing was absolutely dreadful. Had German as a Captain too. 6-7 Roosters, 3 Jacks a Pompano and one needle fish by the rock. Went offshore one day. Had 3 sails in the gear but they wouldn't take a bait. Brazil in 3 weeks  Really sad they are going to develop that resort. Formerly "Nganga" | |||
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I actually did some research on this, and the only ones I could find partaking in this sick venture were over overwhelmingly Wall Street self glorifying idiots. Who know nothing about hunting, except to have their names in some silly book! I would be happy to add any information you might have of anyone else that you know of. | |||
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I don't have any information on anyone else Saeed...just breaking your balls a bit | |||
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I hunted with Koos a two years ago and I'm here to tell you that he and his operation is first class. I was on a two weeks ele hunt and would liked too have a 70 pounder myself. We approached several bulls that he waved off in the 50 pound range. Bulls here can be in the Angolan highands in a matter of hours if the rains hit there to improve their forage. Meaning that you will have to Hunt long and hard unless you are very lucky. Bottom line we approached a nice Over 60 pounder on day 10 or 11 and it was my call to Pull the trigger. Result was a 61and 53 outstanding bull. I saw the broken tusk and didn't feel it detracted whatsoever. No sir if you hunted with Koos you should have had an appears that you had a successful hunt with a stand up guy and a great trophy. You went hunting man not shooting. You sound like the Hillary supporters who want a do over. | |||
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Geez, should I feel bad/cheated about my 50 pounders? Dave | |||
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You should have Since you were set on a specific tusk weight and prior to (foolishly) paying it in advance, you should have written the tusk weight into your contract (minus whatever you'd allow for variance) and insisted on some sort of escrow in the event of misfeasance or malfeasance on the part of the operator. Clawing money back from an overseas hunt operator is difficult if not impossible, and some of them count on that to pad their bank accounts. Elephant tusks are teeth; they have nerves, and NO ONE can predict how large the cavities will be. It's a guess as to how far into the skull the tusks extend, as well. You set your minimum at 70lbs., then agreed to 65lbs. per side. At that point, they figured you'd take anything reasonably close. What did the PH estimate the tusks to weigh prior to your shooting the elephant? George P.S. I would not accept an offer of free daily rate in a future year as you are very likely to be screwed again (or feel that way).  | |||
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Yup | |||
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I don't believe you need a contract(even if you had one it would not work) just an honest operator and PH.They can tell you what you can expect given your abilities and offer a plan should things fail.I am sure the outfitter knew what you expected(given the price you paid) but failed to deliver and I believe that it was not their first time in doing so.Also,if an outfitter was honest they would list all hunt results in their photo gallery even the ones that failed.This would provide a future customer with a good sense of what they can expect but instead only the successful hunts are showed. | |||
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