The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting European Big Game Hunting We have not talked about Wisent in a while, anyone shot one of late?Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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I was watching some of my older hunting DVDs and they shot a Wisent in the Ukraine with a Mauser 66 (I think in 9.3x64, what else would you use?). Made me think we hadn't talked about it on AR in a while in this (my favorite forum). | ||
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One morning I shot an elephant in my pajamas. How he got into my pajamas I'll never know. - Groucho Marx | |||
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During early October 2006 I was in the Bialowieza state forest, north-east of Poland, for a stag stalk. The last afternoon, from a high seat, I could see 2 wisents getting out of the forest and grazing in the clearing. They slowly got closer, no more than 60/70 meters, so I could admire them during 15/20 minutes, until the complete darkness; an unforgettable sight indeed! My guide didn't speak any English, so, as a joke, I mimed the action to shoot. He replied by joining the hands and wrists, like a handcuffed man  . If I recall correctly, once in a while the authorities allow the locals (not the foreigners) to kill a wisent. In that area they are no more than 300 and aren't in good health, due to a serious consanguinity. | |||
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What is a wisent? Is it like a Wasn't that woz? FB | |||
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European version of a Bison. Just a few left - in places like Belarus and Ukraine. Numbers have increased, though, so there is limited hunting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisent - mike ********************* The rifle is a noble weapon... It entices its bearer into primeval forests, into mountains and deserts untenanted by man. - Horace Kephart | |||
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The European Bison must have been pretty rare for centuries. If I recall, most Europeans (particularly the British) had their first introduction to the Bison in early America. So, my assumption is that outside of the dense forests of Eastern Europe, the bison (or wisent) was virtually unknown. | |||
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Is it the same species as the american bison or is it a different animal? Rgds, K | |||
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http://www.sfsu.edu/~geog/bhol...6projects/bison.html Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they are not out to get you.... | |||
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Same family (Bison) different species: Bison Bonasus (European Wisent) vs. Bison Bison (American Bison). For a taxonomic equivalent think of the family of deer (Cervus - or more correctly, Cervidae) and the multitudes of species belonging to this family (e.g. Cervus Elaphus vs. Cervus Dama vs. Cervus Capreolus). I would not be the least surprised if both species of the Bison family have common (Asian?) ancestors. Quite a few of the American ungulates (e.g. wapiti) originally migrated into the American Continent when the Bering Strait was a land bridge. - mike ********************* The rifle is a noble weapon... It entices its bearer into primeval forests, into mountains and deserts untenanted by man. - Horace Kephart | |||
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I don't know the exact order of descent, but the yak, various buffalos, etc. are the modern Asian descendants. I think it is safe to say that they all came from common ancestors. The various classifications of animals we have been working with were based on years of taxonimic reseach, not genes. Now that more and more animal genomes are being unraveled, some of the old ways of thinking of animal families are changing. By the way, many taxonomists divide the American bison population into two subspecies: The common plains bison which roamed from Mexico to Canada, mostly on the grassy plains; and the wood bison, which made its home in dense forests at the northern extreme of the bison's range. Wood Buffalo park in northern Alberta is the location of a native herd of these "wood bison", and I believe that the herd is geneoligically pure, meaning there have been no other bison transplanted into the region. The wood bison is believed to be slightly larger on average than its plains counterpart and may have some other distiguishing characteristics I'm not aware of. Also, I believe the European Bison (wisent) is somewhat smaller on average than its new world counterpart. Is this accurate, or does anyone know? | |||
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The Wisent is a new-world old world animal. Meaning that it was around during the pleistocene and originated in North America like the horse did, but like the Russian Snow Sheep, and Maral Wapiti(elk) of Asia walked back across and stayed on the Eurasian continent. There were 3 or 4 bison in Eurasia, and 3 or 4 in North America. Only 3 survive today. The Gaur or Asian bison is not related as closley. | |||
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I have american bison on the farm, and I have also visited a farm for Wisent in Slovakia, to me they look quite different. The Wisent longer legs and different shaped horns. Coat colour also different. The penned ones in Slovakia were incredibly aggressive, with heavy duty fencing. My own ones are not particularly aggressive, and roam the hills quite peacefully. Damn good to eat. ...."At some point in every man's life he should own a Sako rifle and a John Deere tractor....it just doesn't get any better...." | |||
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See Simon Schama's Landscape and Memory for a history of the wisent in Europe (and a great read on the mythos of the forest and how we relate to it). A great read by a brilliant man. http://www.amazon.com/Landscap...id=1235930813&sr=8-1 | |||
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I have seen them in the flesh in Spain at a zoo, and at a zoo in Winnipeg (I think, that was it been to lots of zoos). Anyway like TrackersNZ said they are different looking from Plains bison and totally different to Woods Bison. The wisent bulls look like a huge version of a yak with shorter hair and turned up horns, and throw a little wildebeast into the mix. They are more athletic looking than plains bison, but I think that is a fairly stupid thing to say as plains bison can weigh as much as 2800 pounds and are the fastest and most athletic bovids on the planet. | |||
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That would be a matter of opinion or conjecture. Steve "He wins the most, who honour saves. Success is not the test." Ryan "Those who vote decide nothing. Those who count the vote decide everything." Stalin Tanzania 06 Argentina08 Argentina Australia06 Argentina 07 Namibia Arnhemland10 Belize2011 Moz04 Moz 09 | |||
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Steve, Are you telling me that a Bos Caffer is faster than a Bison? A bison is made to run, it is what Expert Wildlife Biologist and Boone and Crockett noteworthy Doctor Valerius Geist calls a "curser". (an animal that survives by primarily running). Having grizzly bears, cave bears, cave lions, saber toothed cats, timber wolves, and dire wolves chasing after you running works. Not that bison are without courage, I have been around them my whole life and they don't have many fears. Cape buffalo survive by running, but those big horns were genetically designed to fight. They have horns that evolved from fighting lions. The horns on a bison were designed to not get in the way when you and your 800 buddies are hauling ass across the prairie or steppe (in the case of the woods bison). A cape buffalo is a small prize fighter, a bison is a giant runner. | |||
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It always comes down to a "whose got the biggest?" question! Well if we are measuring our bovids can I put the aurochs in to the mix? OK so its extinct, but it existed in Poland until 1627 but had died out in Britain during the Bronze Age. This massive, mostly black, ancestor of domestic cattle stood about 2 metres at the shoulder and was known throughout the ancient and medieval world for its ferocity. That a Top Trump of a cow if ever there was one!  I was in Bialowieza last spring to meet with National Park Officers there, but did not have time to visit their menagerie or go far into the forest reserve to see the bison. That's definitely reason for a return trip, but with the camera rather than the rifle. I believe that they can be hunted in Belarus. However, this is a species with a massively restricted range and huge challenges to its conservation - I hope that sustainable hunting can be part of its conservation in the future. | |||
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while in poland boar stalking, earlier this year i took a morning off from hunting in the Bialowieza state forest especialy to visit the area where the Bison hung out i was lucky, and so was the dog i think..   we also got up close and personal, about 30 yards     size of the hoof  they were pretty big beasts even my hunting guide stay behind me,he said they were like steam trains and did not think twice about breaking through the thick cover all i had to do was run faster than him i even managed to get up close and personal to this little beauty about 15-20 yards  cheers Rich | |||
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Nice photos, looks like two cows. The cows loook more like plains bison than the bulls do. The bulls look pretty different for sure. | |||
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one have a broken horn I see!!! love the untipical ones. can't understand the sex of these bison... there are both male and female? D.V.M. | |||
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Has anyone hunted these recently? At one point Diana was booking in a particular area and, if one didn't care about shooting a "big" trophy, it could be done for around 4000 Euro. I looked into it but Diana wasn't too responsive to me getting "on the list" (it had to be booked a year in advance) and I wasn't too keen on paying 4000 Euro a year in advance for something that MIGHT happen. Anyone have any contacts? | |||
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Talk to Tad Puckett in Colorado, do a search for Tad and white buffalo and it should get you his phone number. He sold all his Wisent to a rancher in New Mexico. They are the only huntable ones in the world right now, unless you have an in for one in the Ukraine. The problem with Wisent is that the gene pool is so limited, and they are so inbred they have hard to raise. Even the wild ones in Poland are of a very limited gene resource. I think it would behoove producers and zoos to outcross to bison and then breed for the wisent phenotype instead of producing retarded animals. | |||
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I know a guy who can organize such a hunt. He told me 4weeks ago that he has 2licence for wisent for this year. His name is Igor Kancev info@extrem-tours.de caracal | |||
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I just contacted the outfitter and I appreciate the information Caracal....but.... I found out there is a 15,000 Euro trophy fee on a gold medal bull. Now, I hate "sliding scales" generally but fortunately don't care much about horn size. Still, the cheapest trophy fee was of course for "no medal" and it was still 6000 Euros on top of a 1600 Euro hunt fee for only four days of hunting.  So, Wisent run about $10,000 USD at a minimum in Belarus it seems. I remember just two or three years back, one could do an all in cow/no-medal hunt for around 4000 Euros in Poland (Borki?). I think they are going to have a tough time selling these this year at $10K....call me crazy. | |||
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Hello I didn't say it would ne cheap, but this is the price you have to pay for a wisent. Remember there are only a few licence available all over europe. By the way wisent is not known for exciting hunts. For 4000€ igor can organise a bear or something like that. caracal | |||
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Just received a call this morning from a outfitter that I use frequently offering me a cancelled hunt with trophy in central Europe asking £1500 all inclusive. Stalking on foot. I only had a few hours to decide and I turned it down in the end. I think I rather spend the money on a cape instead. never seen one I am told the person who booked the hunt was charged 5000 euro including trophy for a bull however he broke his ankle this morning. I cannot envisage this thing charging at all. Shot a Bison in Alberta last year and it was just standing there waving at me.......... NO nothing replaces the rush of a cape....... | |||
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BAH! I don't suppose you know if this hunt is still available or exactly where it is? I'm assuming the trophy is a no medal bull or a cow? Depending on the area, you may have just passed on a real bargain. | |||
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I have just PM you the number to call I hope it is not too late. Good shooting | |||
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Dennis! We have three licece for wisent for this year. The hunting area "Osipovitschi". This area - state forest hunting area. There are gold-medals bulls for 10000€.... Best hunting! Igor | |||
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Hello profihunter I have been offered 02 wisents as well this year but did not commit Have you any footage other than the size and Rarerity it's not really a dangerous game hence should not command that kind of trophy fees I certainly have not come across any body Who recommend this as a hunt Came across an Italian hunter who hunted one in Poland 10 years ago and he does not recommend it at all Please enlighten us with more information | |||
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Hi londonhunter! I agree, the hunt on wisent is not so sporty. Only, unfortunately, the costs for the trophy are so extremely high, because the wisent do not seem in the free nature everywhere. There are only the wisents in Poland, Belarus and in the Ukraine. The number of the free licences is low. For example, in Belarus only 5-7 licences per year. | |||
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13000 euros for a gold medal in Belarus mario | |||
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If we speak about the price, the prices are not same in all hunting areas. In Nation Parks the prices are higher than in private areas or in the areas of the forest ministry. For example: National Park "Pripajtskij" - the golden bulle - 20000€. | |||
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I shot a bull in february 2003 in a forest aera north of Brest/Belarus, near the national park of Bielowiza/Poland. A gold medal, about 4000 Euros, not more. Not very exciting hunt, half a hour driving with a car , 20mn walking in the snow and one shot of my 460WM ! | |||
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Thats exactly how I visualise a wisent hunt will be after speaking to various people who either have been or have a tag to hunt it. I know its a bit off topic here, has anybody on this forum shot a Cape ? Please share your experience with us. I know there are so many threads about this so "Cape charge" on the African forum. Have you experienced it ? Is hunting a cape as you have expected? I wonder if chasing a wounded wisent in a dark and wet Belarus forest will be adrenaline filled ? | |||
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I have experience with buffalo hunting. The wisent is a buffalo , a dangerous big game, no question ! But dont forget , this animal was nearly extinct there are a century ago and was farming in a first time ! No comparison with a cape buffalo in S-E Africa ! The next point are the forest, big and deep in East Europe thats right, but explored and widely knows in all edges by the forest officers. Trophy hunting is not very difficult in this aeras and very good guiding is tradition !The wisent was a game for the Tsar and the nobility, and later for high officers of the Soviet Union ! Altogether a lot of difference with Africa. | |||
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In Belowegja Nationla Park, today - 20000€. You have hunted wisent just right time in Beloweja. Today, one gets for 4,000 € only one cow. | |||
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I like the big bodies wild cattle. I've hunted few Cape Buffaloes in Zim, Savannah Buffalo in Cameroun, Water Buffalo in the Philippines, Musk Ox in Greenland, Bison in Alberta. For my experience ther'is a big differences between the african buffaloes and the other species. The africans are really wild, sometimes more that an antelope and are quite difficult to hunt. The others are maybe difficult for the environment where the lives but not wild as a deer or a buck. You can get close and shoot easily with an open sight rifle. I never hunted the wisent but I think is a wonderful animal good for an old hunter... One day I will get one for complete my oxen collection. mario | |||
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So Mario you have shot many species of buffalos Have you experience any charges ? | |||
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  I can offer hunting with 100 % guarantee of a result . If the hunter doesn't see the wizent ,I pay all expenses of the hunter Lodge:    | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Hunting European Big Game Hunting We have not talked about Wisent in a while, anyone shot one of late?
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