.

RIP:

quote:

No importance so far for: Twist Rate.

May be it is less important than we assumed before.
But we have to take into account the lenght of the bullet. A .475 500 grs needs far less twist than a .375 350 grs copper bullet.
The .460 Weatherby reportedly failed often because its twist of 1:16.

And the modern flat and disk nosed bullets may really need less twist, especially if forming a sharp edged meplat as the CPS.

does this mean a 500gr. 458 win mag @ 2100 fps with flat nosed bullets with a longer twist will do the same? oh the horror but i'd rather have that 470 n.e.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
does this mean a 500gr. 458 win mag @ 2100 fps with flat nosed bullets with a longer twist will do the same?

boom stick,
a .458 normally has a twist 1:14, what is sufficient for usual shots. The Wea was an unlucky exception. If someone builds a custom rifle, a twist of 1:12 is recommended.

Hey Ray you can't hang the elephants upside down it changes the consistency of the organs and you'll get erroneous results.

Good work Ron. I'm just biding my time waiting for the 2500 fps test. Keep up the good work.
Take good care,
Dave

RIP your an army contractor at Ft. Campbell huh. I was stationed there at Ft. Campbell in the 101st from April 2001 to the end of 2003. Actually spent most of 2003 with them in Iraq.
I was just on Ft. Campbell on saturday.

Anyone tell me how to private message someone on here?

quote:

Originally posted by Jarrod:
Anyone tell me how to private message someone on here?

Click on their name on the left side of one of their posts. Then click "invite X to a private topic." Let me know if you have problems.

quote:

Originally posted by Jarrod:
RIP your an army contractor at Ft. Campbell huh. I was stationed there at Ft. Campbell in the 101st from April 2001 to the end of 2003. Actually spent most of 2003 with them in Iraq.
I was just on Ft. Campbell on saturday.

Anyone tell me how to private message someone on here?

Yep, and I was actually born at Fort Campbell, KY more than 50 years ago ... back when the old hospital was a ramshackle collection of wooden buildings and a few brick ones, on the Kentucky side. They say that the current JAG building is located where the old hospital was. Maybe they converted a couple of the old brick buildings, or built some new ones, and bulldozed the rest?

Babies born at the current hospital get Tennessee birth certificates.

Being at Fort Campbell is like coming home.

Thanks for your service Jarrod. My military service was during peace time, and pretty Mickey Mouse mostly. Now I am fat and old and gray, and over the hill. Just daydreaming about hunting down Osama and the Beheaders.

It is truly bitter sweet to be among the men (and their loving families) coming back, and those about to go to Iraq and Afghanistan.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
RIP:

Lest ol man Ray's simulator pass gas i'm cutting and running as GS would say.

I'm due for a "sheep shagging"

In the morn it's up before sparrows, a 8 hour drive on the great north road, then east by float plane to some spot on a map in no mans land where if my achilles tendons allow ( or my coronaries or both ????? ) I shall participate in a " sheep shagging"

I have chosen my weapons, a 61 year old Brno in 7X64 loaded with Norma's MRP and some of those Rhinos out of the good RSA.

We'll see you here in 10 days time, much slimmer fitter and hopefully with a good set of horns

Alf

Good Luck Alf! Dall or Stone ... either will do with any full curl in God's country up there. Not Baaaaaaad at all. Heavenly.

quote:

Originally posted by 470 Mbogo:
Hey Ray you can't hang the elephants upside down it changes the consistency of the organs and you'll get erroneous results.

Good work Ron. I'm just biding my time waiting for the 2500 fps test. Keep up the good work.
Take good care,
Dave

Dave,
It's coming. The .470 NE-type loads in the .470 Mbogo will be very pleasant, and the the comparison to mid-range Mbogo power at 2500 fps will be interesting for sure. How about 2700 fps ? No problem with the North Fork FPS or CPU.

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
does this mean a 500gr. 458 win mag @ 2100 fps with flat nosed bullets with a longer twist will do the same? oh the horror but i'd rather have that 470 n.e.

You got a point there. Finally, with a North Fork FPS, the .458 Win Mag may reign supreme yet!!!

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
does this mean a 500gr. 458 win mag @ 2100 fps with flat nosed bullets with a longer twist will do the same? oh the horror but i'd rather have that 470 n.e.

You got a point there. Finally, with a North Fork FPS, the .458 Win Mag may reign supreme yet!!!

its worth a try

Ok 470 by the trunk it is, but first I must extract the tusks with my trusty pocket knife and they tend to resent that, so I hammer them with my baseball bat into submission...Makes my horse nervous to watch for some reason...

Alf,
"Shagging sheep"? man, your perverted I thought only bask sheepherders did that!!

RIP,
Have you done any 45/70 tests yet?

Ray,..
here's a funny, me correcting spelling.. it's basque .. but there's laws in my ancestrial homeland (scotland) of "bothering the sheep"

jeffe

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
RIP,
Have you done any 45/70 tests yet?

Rusty,
That is way down on the priority list. What I have seen so far with rifle bullets in Flat Nose solid configuration is that velocities from 2000 to 2700 fps produce the same penetration, with sectional density around 0.3 or slightly more, and penetration may fall off with lower sectional density at higher velocity.

So far the higher velocity only produces more splash and pulverization of the first few boards, equivalent to better wounding and quicker killing.

The bobble between 10 or 11 for scoring the .470 Capstick and the .470 NE was produced by the variance or randomness of the last two compartments after keyholing and a misreading of the boards.

.470 NE 2100fps
.470 Capstick 2300 fps
.470 Mbogo 2500 fps

All produce good 10 compartment penetration.
In compartment 10 they are beginning to yaw and may randomly go through the 10th board sideways or base or nose first, making it difficult to read sometimes, so the impression of an 11 with the 470 NE was a fluke of maybe base of bullet going through the 10th board with nose trailing. Repetition and watching the boards revealed this.

Higher velocity only produces more trauma and equal penetration to some point.

The ,45/70 should be classed with bigbore handguns as a stunt weapon, or a minimalist piece for those wanting a lighter weight, handier or lower recoiling rifle.

But I think the latter shooters would be better served by a 9.3x62, .375 H&H, 10.75x68, or .404 Jeffery at 2125 fps with 380 grain .423 North Fork FPS, SPS, or CPU.

.450/400 double with FN or FP would also be a light weight and handy piece for good penetration.

The wounding power will not be there for any of the low recoil rounds, so no free lunches.

Youse guys need to build more Iron Buffalo and prove me right or wrong with MORE DATA. I can't do it all.